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Old 06-15-2009, 01:01 PM   #21 (permalink)
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Default Re: Born again I400

Having thought a lot about this topic the last year or so. I do like it, mostly.

What is the thought behind having two rifle hunts? And only the four day hunt? The average days hunted is lower than four days, but that is under the current plan- a hunt in the full rut. Pushing the rifle later can make it harder to be successful. Why not give them 9 full days, and only offer one rifle hunt?
Also could you explain the argument for splitting up the units into subunits? I'm not sure where I stand on that. Is this to spread out the pressure?

If I400 were to pass- it would as a whole, still favor the majority of Utah's hunters, the rifle hunters.
I strongly agree that it would benefit EVERY hunter if we use archers as tools to manage animals.
I like the idea of only being able to choose an I400 tag or LE tag, not both. It would undoubtably pull some hunters out of the LE pool. Freeing up more tags for the rifle only crowd.
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Old 06-15-2009, 01:28 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Default Re: Born again I400

well I guess im my thought have changed on these. I just say put the archery hunt in the rut and put the rilfe hunters after the rut and leave the rest alone.
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Old 06-15-2009, 01:55 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Default Re: Born again I400

Not really too sure on the sub units either it makes things too complicated. I don't mind the one 9 day hunt, but the reasoning behind 2 would be to allow more hunters out at a time.

The archery tags and perks are pretty key to this plan, that and getting the rifle hunt out of the rut. This would worsen my odds but as a whole improve the overall "butt plug".

One hang up with this plan was the ellimination of spike tags. I will explain when I get more time. It is needed in the first couple of years but there will be a point when there is no reason you could not have them. This is my opinion, Pro sees this different.
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Old 06-15-2009, 02:43 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Default Re: Born again I400

I like i400 for the most part. Anything that adds more bull elk tags and reduces spike tags I'm for.
The one thing I don't like is adding the preferance point system for the I400 tags. I firmly beleive it is time to put all bull elk tags in the same bonus point drawing pool (same for buck deer tags). If you hunt bull elk you burn your points 1st, 2nd, 3rd. 4th choice Any bull, spike, LE, I400 if you draw a tag you burn your points. This will pull the "butt plug" of the bonus point pool.
I remember a nicely worded argument for not having the preferance point pool for the I400 tags from one of the threads a year or so ago that convinced me it would be better to have all the tags in the same drawing. I will see if I can find it and copy it over here.

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Old 06-15-2009, 02:54 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Default Re: Born again I400

Hogan-
Correct me if I am wrong- but this plan is being pushed through mainly by bowhunters right? Think of our track record with the board?

I think that to get this through the system and passed, there is no way it will fly with a four day hunt for the rifle hunters. To think I only had four days to go in and get an animal down is pretty daunting, no matter the unit. Too many things can affect the hunt, mainly weather, family matters, jobs, ect. I understand the logic behind it, but the goal is to get it passed. In my eyes, the meat of I400 is to get the rifle out of the rut?
If it were up to me, there would be only a handful of rifle tags during the rut for the entire state- but we all know that will never happen.

Also my input is to lump all elk points in the same jar. No matter if its a spike, I400, or LE. We need to let our kids/future generations have a prayer in the system somewhere.

Please keep us posted on anything that deals with I400. The idea behind it NEEDS to happen!
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Old 06-15-2009, 03:51 PM   #26 (permalink)
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Default Re: Born again I400

Right now I see your hunting time line as your weak link. It needs to be fixed.
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Old 06-15-2009, 06:03 PM   #27 (permalink)
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Default Re: Born again I400

I like the whole point system into one pool, I would settle for that. And yes the plan does need polishing, that is what we are doing. Work it out. Thanks for all the comments and discussion.
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Old 06-15-2009, 07:56 PM   #28 (permalink)
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Default Re: Born again I400

I would support that plan, except for the 2 four day rifle hunts. I'm a bowhunter by heart so the 4 or 9 day hunt doesn't mean anything to me but I think you will get alot more rifle hunters onboard with the 9 day hunt.
Most of all we need to get the 100% success rate rifle guys out of the rut. After all it is a "HUNT" not a shoot. Guys, use your skills and go find a bull. You don't need to call one right to your 4 wheeler to kill it with a rifle!!!!!
I think the other states management plans and success rates should be mentioned when this is presented before the boards. Maybe if numbers are shown they will get the idea that this state does not need to have every unit managed for record book bulls, and let a few of the average elk chasers go have fun with a limited tag every 5-7 yeards. Once in a lifetime is not good enough!!!
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Old 06-15-2009, 09:40 PM   #29 (permalink)
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Default Re: Born again I400

Just a thought for you I400 boys.........

For this to even have a slight chance at best, You guys will have to have someone
involved in the elk commitee that will be redoing the new 5 year EMP in the next
couple of months.

If you wait to present this to the RACs in November,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,WELL,to late,
Not much of a chance to change the elk plan again until 2015.
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Old 06-15-2009, 10:25 PM   #30 (permalink)
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Default Re: Born again I400

We do not want to change the elk plan, we want 3 or 4 units, not statewide, our plan meets all criteria of the current EMP.
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