# Reloading small quantities



## Elkoholic8 (Jan 15, 2008)

I am slowly getting into reloading, and I was wondering if you guys know of any small quantity boxes of bullets you can get to try different loads without buying them 50 or 100 at a time. It seems like there was a post about this a while back, did anyone ever start a thread about getting rid of left over bullets from a load experiment?

I am currently looking to develop a good accurate load for my .300win, my son's 7mm-08, and possibly a .243win.

This past season we used the 140gr Partition and IMR4350 in the -08 which was acceptable.
I had mixed results with my buddies 180gr Accubond in the .300 (RL22??, but I think he had them loaded to a maximum charge for max velocity). My gun shot fair (at best) groups and I'm not really satisfied with that load so I am using factory Remington bullets for my cow elk hunt this year. Next year I hope to have this problem solved, and a good accurate load developed.
Any suggestions on what powders or bullets to try for that .300? It will be used mainly on elk, but possibly a mule deer as well.


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

We discussed this over on my other website HuntingNut years back, to get groups of people to divide up a box into smaller lots. It worked for like 1 month then everyone ended up needing more and more bullets to dial in those handloads.

I've been selling partial boxes of bullets that my gun hates to other people with guns that love'em. You just find a good website with alot of handloaders and you can usually sell off extra stock pretty easily.


-DallanC


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## sagebrush (Sep 8, 2007)

Rl 22 is temp sensitive it good idea to work up loads in mild temps. Not sure on ur load for the 300 but i use 73.5 and seat the bullet out farther than the recommend 3.340 length. Using nosler accoubond bullets hornady are seated at spec.


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## Al Hansen (Sep 7, 2007)

Sometimes guys will offer up a couple of bullets to those working up a load. I've got a few different .243's I could part with.


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## Wind In His Hair (Dec 31, 2009)

http://www.bulletsamples.com/

http://www.brownells.com/search/index.htm?k=bullet+sample&ksubmit=y

I was at Scheel's the other day and noticed they carried the sample packs as well. Hope this helps.


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## Critter (Mar 20, 2010)

That has always been a major gripe of mine when I started to reload. You needed to buy a pound of powder and 50 or 100 bullets to figure out that you don't like either one and they try to sell what was left of your supply at a gun show or give them to a friend to try out. 

I did learn to just use what I didn't like for plinking or rabbit hunting even with my high power rifles. That usually got rid of my extra supply quite quickly.


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## MKP (Mar 7, 2010)

Wind In His Hair said:


> http://www.bulletsamples.com/
> 
> http://www.brownells.com/search/index.htm?k=bullet+sample&ksubmit=y
> 
> I was at Scheel's the other day and noticed they carried the sample packs as well. Hope this helps.


That was what what I was going to say, Scheel's has the 12packs of bullets from Nosler and Barns, at least that's the ones I can remember, in the most common calibers.


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## Squigie (Aug 4, 2012)

sagebrush said:


> Rl 22 is temp sensitive it good idea to work up loads in mild temps. Not sure on ur load for the 300 but i use 73.5 and seat the bullet out farther than the recommend 3.340 length. Using nosler accoubond bullets hornady are seated at spec.


I always hear people saying, and see people writing, that the Reloader powders are temp sensitive; but my own experience has been the complete opposite.

I am ridiculously anal about my hunting loads, even more so than my target loads. Developing a new hunting load is a one to two year process for me.
I usually load up 3-5 powders under the same bullet, during the winter, and test in cold weather. I fine tune the load for each powder, and test _again_ in cold weather. Then I wait. I test in the Spring, and again at the peak of summer (100+ F). 
The data I get from the 70-90 degree temperature difference really accentuates any temperature sensitivity in powders. (If the data is somewhat ambiguous, I'll retest in the fall, winter, spring and summer, again - hence the possible extra year.)

Contrary to what nearly every gun writer and the majority of reloaders claim, I have always found RL-7, RL-15, RL-19, and RL-22 to be very stable across my 70-90 F spread (RL-17 is unique - produced at a different plant). And, contrary to what most gun writers and Ramshot claim, I have found their powders to be _incredibly_ temperature sensitive. Ramshot Hunter and Big Game are amazingly clean and consistent at 40 to 60 F, but performance degrades, substantially, above or below that range.

Whether my test scenarios are unique, or the powder companies are just spreading BS, I don't know. But, I no longer take _anyone_ else's word on a powder's temperature sensitivity. 

If anyone is wondering WHY I started doing that....
It's because I don't have a single rifle that is 100% dedicated to a specific purpose. They all have their intended purpose, but I try to rotate everything through the different hunting seasons. For me, that means the load needs to perform the same for everything from Pronghorn (and prairie dogs) in 90+ degree weather, to Elk in 30-45 degree weather, to Coyotes in the dead of winter. So, I think it's worth it. But... I admit that most people are not as anal or patient as I am.


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

I'm glad someone else brought that up, I agree. I've shot over a cronograph with strings of loads that continually heat up the chamber well beyond any normal seasonal temperature swing and not seen too much of a difference in velocity or pressure signs. Think about it, if powders were that sensitive there would be DRAMATIC failures out there for people that shoot several rounds in quick succession heating up the to blistering temperatures, baking each subsequent cartridge to hotter and hotter temperature levels.


-DallanC


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## sagebrush (Sep 8, 2007)

When the op stated that the loads were unceptable with rl22 i was giving my take on it. As for my loads i do find some difference when shooting in warmer temperature verus cooler temperature.
I have seen my groups get slightly bigger when its warm. As in 1/2" up to 1 1/2". unexceptable to some and not to others.


If he is looking for different bullets then maybe he should work with the loads a little more seating depth can change the outcome to his liking. Or change powders, 0r his stock is not up to par. glass bed the stock with pillars and free float the barrel, there are many things one can do.


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## BPturkeys (Sep 13, 2007)

I personally don't think you can work up a load or give a bullet a fair trial with just a dozen or so different loads. I suggest you choose a bullet from one of the major makers...always pick the bullet weight that is about in the middle of the available weights...and try to find which powder works best. You will never come up with a good load as long as you change more than one variable at a time. It is possible that you will never make certain bullets shot though your rifle perfectly, but, if you are using a good bullet made for the your intended purpose, by tinkering with different powders, powder charges, seating depths, and you pay particular attention to details and CONSISTENCY in production, you will develop a suitable hunting load.
PS..I have always found the IMR powers easier to develope good loads...my favorite for most modern hunting loads...IMR4350.


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## Huge29 (Sep 17, 2007)

Elkoholic8 said:


> I am currently looking to develop a good accurate load for my .300win, my son's 7mm-08, and possibly a .243win.


I am pretty new to this also, but have worked up a pretty decent size collection already and would be willing to trade some or sell you some partial boxes. I am in Davis County also. I have the following:
308:
Barnes TTSX 150 (limited quantities)
Hornady SST 150
Nosler Partition 150
Nosler Ballistic Tip 150
Nosler Accubond 150

6mm:
Barnes TTSX 80
Sierra Blitzking
Zmax 58 gr
Hornady AMax 105

7mm:
Barnes TTSX 140
Hornady SST 154


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## Bo0YaA (Sep 29, 2008)

I'm with BP on this one, I say pick a bullet and powder and find a load. There are so many variables using just one bullet and one powder, let alone multiple bullets and multiple powders. I have all the major calibers that fall under the .30 cal umbrella as well as my .243 and I have found an accurate load (sub moa) for all of them using IMR-4350. In fact of all the loads I have put together over the years 95% of them regardless of caliber have been one of two powders. IMR-4350 for heavier bullets and IMR-3031 for my lighter bullets. 

My 300 Win loves the 165gr Speer Hot-Cor over 73gr IRM 4350 @ a COAL of 3.340". With that load I was able to put 4 out of 5 in darn near the same hole @100 yards. Probably could have done all 5 but I got overly excited at the thought of doing so lol.


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## gwailow (Jan 20, 2008)

Here's the answer to your prayers....
http://bulletproofsamples.com/


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## Springville Shooter (Oct 15, 2010)

Try IMR 7828 for the 300. I have had very good luck with it and the RL-22, RL-25 powders. I used to have alot more problems working up loads back when I just loaded for any old rifle. Now that I am very fussy about how my rifles are built, I find that I can throw just about any combo together and have it shoot reasonably well. I believe that it is a huge misconception that handloading will routinely get you from 2-3 MOA down to 1/2 MOA. I know there are exceptions, but in general, accurate rifles simply shoot accurately. I have a Cooper model 22 in 243 that will shoot anything you put in it under an inch. My new method is to tune the rifle first, then work on the load.--------SS


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## sagebrush (Sep 8, 2007)

Springville Shooter said:


> Try IMR 7828 for the 300. I have had very good luck with it and the RL-22, RL-25 powders. I used to have alot more problems working up loads back when I just loaded for any old rifle. Now that I am very fussy about how my rifles are built, I find that I can throw just about any combo together and have it shoot reasonably well. I believe that it is a huge misconception that handloading will routinely get you from 2-3 MOA down to 1/2 MOA. I know there are exceptions, but in general, accurate rifles simply shoot accurately. I have a Cooper model 22 in 243 that will shoot anything you put in it under an inch. My new method is to tune the rifle first, then work on the load.--------SS


I have to agree here with this. been there done that. work on the rifle first


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

sagebrush said:


> When the op stated that the loads were unceptable with rl22 i was giving my take on it. As for my loads i do find some difference when shooting in warmer temperature verus cooler temperature.


Ah sorry, don't construe my comment as an attack by any means. I do think there is some variance due to temperature, but its never been enough for me to switch to the "extreme" style powders. You seem to have some great loads so stick with'em! 

-DallanC


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## Squigie (Aug 4, 2012)

sagebrush said:


> When the op stated that the loads were unceptable with rl22 i was giving my take on it. As for my loads i do find some difference when shooting in warmer temperature verus cooler temperature.
> I have seen my groups get slightly bigger when its warm. As in 1/2" up to 1 1/2". unexceptable to some and not to others.


Understood. 

I was just using your post as an opportunity to do the same - share my experience with temperature sensitivity.

-
I think the biggest problem with that RL-22 load is that it was only tested as a max load. It's likely that a lower powder charge would have provided different results.

And, I agree with the 'make sure the rifle is right' and 'just pick a bullet' comments.
There's no point in wasting ammunition and energy if the rifle itself has issues. 
And, trying to compare performance of multiple bullets and multiple powders, in tiny little test lots (10-15) is a waste of time. You don't get enough data with test lots that small. It causes people to read too much into the tiny amount of data available, and form unjustified conclusions. 
When being minimalistic in testing loads, keep the Texas Sharpshooter Fallacy in the back of your mind. As long as you're thinking about it, you shouldn't become a victim.
[youtube:2k4hmoyk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=InHv7U_fp1g[/youtube:2k4hmoyk]
(There should be an embedded YouTube video above this sentence. I can't see it, but I'm assuming it's the web browser I'm using. If it's not there, let me know.)


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## sagebrush (Sep 8, 2007)

I have a rem 700 that use to have the Tupperware stock. I probably fought with that gun for two years. Trying to get a load for it. Sometimes it would shoot sub moa then the next group would be off the left and spread out up to 3". Finally asked a gun smith for his thoughts. Was told to replace the stock low and behold just like magic things started to look better. Then a new scope was in order and a new barrel. Yes look at your equipment then your loads


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## Elkoholic8 (Jan 15, 2008)

The gun is a new Browning X-bolt, wood stock with a Nikon Monarch scope using the Browning 2 piece mounts. I have not checked to see if the barrel is free floating, but I assume that the gun is in good shape and has no issues with the stock rubbing. I'll check though.

I think the biggest issue I had with testing my buddies loads, was I only had 10 rounds, and I didn't have alot of time to spend at the range. I had sighted the gun in with factory Remington Corelokts, got good groups, and then tried the handloads. They were off from the factory loads (which isn't a big deal), but the group size was larger. That's what I didn't like about them. 

Durring the elk hunt I chatted with my buddy about his loads, and that's when I learned that he just picked the fastest load in the book and loaded them up. After watching him shoot, his gun is less accurate than mine, but he's ok with it. This is what brought me to my original question of what powder to use and such. 
These bullets were 180gr Accubonds, but I think this year I am goin to work up a load using the 180gr Hornady interlocks. From what I have read they are just as good of bullet as anything else, they will kill anything if placed in the right spot, and they are cheaper to shoot.


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