# What say ye spike hunters!



## ridgetop (Sep 13, 2007)

What's your thoughts about shooting this bad boy on a spike unit?


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## colorcountrygunner (Oct 6, 2009)

No branches above the ear, so it's a spike right? Too bad his left side doesn't match the right. That's a pretty bull.


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## ns450f (Aug 28, 2018)

I must not understand the law because I thought if it had anymore than a single beam on either side it would be illegal. Now I am very curious.


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## Critter (Mar 20, 2010)

ns450f said:


> I must not understand the law because I thought if it had anymore than a single beam on either side it would be illegal. Now I am very curious.


Get the field rules book out. It is a legal spike.


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## sheepassassin (Mar 23, 2018)

I’ve got one identical to him hitting a spring and salt on the Nebo. I won’t hesitate at all on shooting him if he wanders into range


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## Vanilla (Dec 11, 2009)

Absolutely a legal spike under Utah law. But man, I’d have to get a REALLY good look at that thing I’m the field to confirm that. It’s not always as clear from even 100 yards through glass as it is in a trail cam pic.


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## KineKilla (Jan 28, 2011)

Ka-Boom! One dead “spike” and a great euro mount for my man cave.


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## johnnycake (Jul 19, 2011)

That there be a unicorn! Chootem!


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## Kevin D (Sep 15, 2007)

I was hunting with a kid 2-3 years ago when a similarly configured bull fed out. We watched it for about 30 minutes and even though technically it met the legal definition of a spike I wasn't real comfortable shooting it. I told him I was going to go peak into another draw and had just settled in when I heard him open up. He killed the **** thing and I ended up spending the rest of the evening helping him pack it out. 

Again, a legal bull, but I suggested the kid keep the antlers covered on the way home regardless cuz you just know anyone that sees branched antlers sticking above the bed of your truck coming down off a spike unit is going to call the F & G.


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## High Desert Elk (Aug 21, 2012)

I've always wanted to shoot a spike like that during the general archery on the SJ unit...


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## taxidermist (Sep 11, 2007)

I don't think its a "legal" spike. The broke off left side has the brows. That's three not one. what's the difference between this bull and a 2X2 bull? I look at it as a 3X6 Bull.


Now, if he was packing a "club antler" on the left side...……..He!! ya, I'd be "chootin it".


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## sheepassassin (Mar 23, 2018)

taxidermist said:


> I don't think its a "legal" spike. The broke off left side has the brows. That's three not one. what's the difference between this bull and a 2X2 bull? I look at it as a 3X6 Bull.
> 
> Now, if he was packing a "club antler" on the left side...&#8230;&#8230;..He!! ya, I'd be "chootin it".


Every 2x2 I've ever seen branches above the ear tip. This one doesn't. That's the difference


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## prumpf (Apr 8, 2016)

Good thing he has his ear up 😂


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## taxidermist (Sep 11, 2007)

sheepassassin said:


> Every 2x2 I've ever seen branches above the ear tip. This one doesn't. That's the difference


So, if that's the case (branched antler above the ears) a 6X6 that has one side that has grown BELOW the ears is a legal bull to shoot on a spike bull unit?

I wouldn't want to get into a litigation battle over that!

I look at this way...&#8230; If you want to kill a branched antler bull why purchase a "spike tag"?? If I'm hunting with a spike tag in my pocket I'm not looking for spike X 6 or whatever. I'm intending to shoot a spike.

As far as a Bull that doesn't have any eye guards, I feel it should be legal to kill in a spike unit. Like a 2x2. I think the DWR has implemented the 2x2 rule just to gain more revenue.


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## Packout (Nov 20, 2007)

It currently looks legal on a spike unit. Kind of goes against the spirit of the rule though as it is a broken bull. Every year we have the opportunity to shoot a mature bull that is broken-off on one side just above his 1 or 2 (which means he forks below the tip of the ear). We choose not to shoot as it isn't what the rule is intended for, but it is a personal choice. 
Now, deformed bulls are a different story... 

.


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## Vanilla (Dec 11, 2009)

Taxidermist, you’ve got to look at the legal definition of a spike in Utah law. If a bull has no branching above the ear on at least 1 side, it’s a spike. 

Packout is correct that this bull goes against “the spirit of the law,” and everyone has to decide for themselves what that means for them. But there is nothing to litigate on this. This bull meets Utah’s definition of a legal spike.


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## taxidermist (Sep 11, 2007)

Vanilla said:


> Taxidermist, you've got to look at the legal definition of a spike in Utah law. If a bull has no branching above the ear on at least 1 side, it's a spike.
> 
> Packout is correct that this bull goes against "the spirit of the law," and everyone has to decide for themselves what that means for them. But there is nothing to litigate on this. This bull meets Utah's definition of a legal spike.


A few years back the regulations called a spike bull a yearling. Why the change to "Spike Units" ?

I'm with you and packout that the bull in question is a mature bull. Its hard enough to look over a spike bull to make sure it isn't branched at 200 plus yards before the entire pumpkin patch starts shooting at it. I'd hate to spend the time making sure the broken bull didn't fork above the ears.

A few years back a big bull was running around the hills that had a club on one side. He was a 7X spike. Talked to a few hunters that were after this bull and had passed on a legal spike bulls. Crazy IMO!

I'm with ya on the "spirit of the law" !! I know I wouldn't be shooting it.


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## High Desert Elk (Aug 21, 2012)

The change from yearling (typical spike) to what it is now is all about keeping the genetics up and the "freaks" out.

Can't be a trophy quality state if you have a bunch of drop antler bulls running around.


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## taxidermist (Sep 11, 2007)

High Desert Elk said:


> The change from yearling (typical spike) to what it is now is all about keeping the genetics up and the "freaks" out.
> 
> Can't be a trophy quality state if you have a bunch of drop antler bulls running around.


Trophy IMO is a loosely used word. What constitutes a "trophy"? I know the term "Trophy" animal, fish, etc.

Take the term "trophy wife" for example. Those of us that have a wife, isn't she a trophy in our eyes, or did we settle for the "subordinate" wife. It rubs me raw sometimes when I hear the word trophy connected with a big game animal. I personally like "book quality" animal over the other word.

Before retiring, I mounted many critters that would make the books, and others that made the hunter happy as he!!.

Whatever term one uses we all know what they are talking about I guess.

This season, if I don't find the "book quality" deer I'm after I guess I'll settle for a "participation trophy" deer.


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## High Desert Elk (Aug 21, 2012)

The term "trophy" I used would be one that qualifys for hero pics with one hunter and 19 helpers...


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## elkfromabove (Apr 20, 2008)

I've got a spike tag this year and that's a spike regardless of how it came about!

The spike hunts are used to manage the "trophy" units for book scorers or wallhangers, and whether there are so many they break antlers or too many freaks with clubs is immaterial, some have to go. He's one of them!


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## 7mm Reloaded (Aug 25, 2015)

ridgetop said:


> What's your thoughts about shooting this bad boy on a spike unit?


 Saw a girl on the Manti kill a 1x6 once but the problem I see with this one "if its legal" is some spike hunter might try to shoot the horn off right where this one is broken and claim they saw it like this one through the scope. wdyt?


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## Raptorman (Aug 18, 2009)

sheepassassin said:


> Every 2x2 I've ever seen branches above the ear tip. This one doesn't. That's the difference


Here is my 2x2, but he would be a legal spike. He was in an Any Bull unit.


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## taxidermist (Sep 11, 2007)

Raptorman said:


> Here is my 2x2, but he would be a legal spike. He was in an Any Bull unit.


Now I think that's some cool looking head gear.


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## BPturkeys (Sep 13, 2007)

This is a really dumb way to define a spike. Oh course I can't think of any perfect way. I know this would never happen , but what is keeping the unscrupulous hunter from just shooting off one of the antlers and taking any bull home. 
Maybe wording something like "naturally occurring antler formation" or "in the case where one antler is broken..." or " with either antler having more than two points"...??


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## RandomElk16 (Sep 17, 2013)

BPturkeys said:


> what is keeping the unscrupulous hunter from just shooting off one of the antlers


The fact most of them are awful shots.


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## maverick9465 (Nov 21, 2016)

Critter said:


> Get the field rules book out. It is a legal spike.


Just checked the regs and don't see anything in there about a situation like this.

IMO, I don't think this is a spike.


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## johnnycake (Jul 19, 2011)

maverick9465 said:


> Just checked the regs and don't see anything in there about a situation like this.
> 
> IMO, I don't think this is a spike.


Check out page 22.



> A "spike bull" means a bull elk which has at least
> one antler beam with no branching above the ears.
> Branched means a projection on an antler longer than
> one inch, measured from its base to its tip (R657-5-
> 2(2)(r).


the brows on the busted side of this bull do not "branch[] above the ears" so he is a spike. No, there isn't a picture of this exact configuration on page 23, but there doesn't need to be either. Those are not the only ways a bull is legally a spike, but rather are the most common ways a bull is a legal spike.


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## Critter (Mar 20, 2010)

maverick9465 said:


> Just checked the regs and don't see anything in there about a situation like this.
> 
> IMO, I don't think this is a spike.


Looks like they moved it. There used to be a definition in the elk section of the Field Reg Book. Now you need to go to the definitions at the end of the book on page 64.

Spike bull means a bull elk which has at least
one antler beam with no branching above the
ears. Branched means a projection on an antler
longer than one inch, measured from its base
to its tip.


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## johnnycake (Jul 19, 2011)

Critter said:


> Looks like they moved it. There used to be a definition in the elk section of the Field Reg Book. Now you need to go to the definitions at the end of the book on page 64.
> 
> Spike bull means a bull elk which has at least
> one antler beam with no branching above the
> ...


That definition is also on page 22.


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## MadHunter (Nov 17, 2009)

RandomElk16 said:


> The fact most of them are awful shots.


This was my immediate reaction to reading the post.

By definition this guy is a spike. However if we want to get into semantics the DWR is defining a SPIKE; which really means 1 point. If we want to be literal and true to the spirit of the law then we should be calling these hunts CULL hunts not spike hunts. Anyone thought of using the term UNDESIRABLE?


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## Critter (Mar 20, 2010)

What about that 4x4 undesirable bull elk?


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## Critter (Mar 20, 2010)

johnnycake said:


> That definition is also on page 22.


I looked at that page for 5 minutes and never saw it, I read everything on it except for that. :shock:


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## MadHunter (Nov 17, 2009)

Critter said:


> What about that 4x4 undesirable bull elk?


Just a thought... How crappy is his left antler?


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