# Checking In- Employment



## caddis8

One of the things that has been touched on that I have thought a lot about is what is the economic impact so far? 

Has anyone lost job? Has anyone had hours reduced? Holding steady but won't for long? SBA loans needed? 

Figured we need to try to take care of and support our own if possible.


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## Vanilla

I'm luckily in a position right now that working from home, at least for the next few months if needed, is both possible and fruitful. 

If the economy tanks totally and it lasts for a long time, my prospects become more bleak than they do in the immediate.


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## gander311

So far, so good here. 

Commissions are way down, but the salary takes care of the bills, so we're good for now. Time will tell, but we are fortunate and it could be a lot worse.


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## PBH

I'm fortunate enough to work for a manufacturer that the DoD depends on. We aren't closing down, unless all of our operators end up sick at the same time...


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## johnrr65

Vanilla said:


> I'm luckily in a position right now that working from home, at least for the next few months if needed, is both possible and fruitful.
> 
> If the economy tanks totally and it lasts for a long time, my prospects become more bleak than they do in the immediate.


+1


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## CPAjeff

I've been working from home for the past two weeks - I work for a government entity now, so I believe we are save.

However, a good friend of mine was laid off last Friday - it makes my heart hurt to think of him and his family being impacted by all of this.


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## middlefork

Retired, but living comfortable on SS for now. No need to get into retirement savings.

Extended family, all have been so far deemed "essential" so they are hanging in there. And all are currently healthy.


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## derekp1999

I work from home regardless. I'm a consultant in the medical device field currently with a large device manufacturer based out of the Midwest. We have accelerated, not slowed down.


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## johnnycake

I'm grateful to be able to work from home, and to be staying very busy with work. The past few weeks have actually been my busiest this year so far.


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## caddis8

So far so good for me. I already work remotely. We've noticed a temporary slowdown, but anticipate it to crazy busy.

I'm in home health services (coding and OASIS). Our take for home health is it will dip initially with vulnerable seniors refusing care for fear of contamination, and then accellerate significantly. Elective surgeries such as hip and knee replacements are all on hold. They're not cancelled, just postponed. If you need a hip, you need a hip. 

Home is the best place for these folks to recover to make room for others in need. So it's going to get crazy.

CMS did some actual good things in the CARE act to remove bottlenecks for the industry, so it's going to go nuts.


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## brisket

I survived the first round of layoffs and furloughs, but I'm bracing for round 2. I've heard rumblings it might be coming soon. I've gone into ultra-frugal mode trying to save as much as possible. Probably have to forgo the Colorado draw.

Most of our business is in the full lock down states and it's killing us. If the lock downs aren't lifted soon, it's not looking good. I'm fortunate to be able to work remotely, so still employed, for now, but hoping for better days ahead.


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## Hunttilidrop

So far so good here as well. Glad to hear everyone so far has been relatively unaffected. And some more busy than usual. I really feel for the restruant industry and shopping malls. Weird to see all those parking lots empty the last few weeks. I’m in construction (Masonry) and busy as always. My wife is an insurance agent and doing fine working from home. Dads a trucker, so he’s good. Mom is good (paralegal). And the brothers are doing just fine so far as well. So my family has been pretty much unaffected so far. Maybe except 3A with his underlying health issues (asma) and being overweight. Putting him into some serious quarantine.🤣


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## bowgy

I had a family member fired due to the virus.

For me I am in a critical infrastructure industry, (communications technology), I was even sent a letter to carry with me stating such, and quoting the laws pertaining to it, mainly to carry when I have to go into hospitals to work on their communications equipment.


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## Clarq

I'm grateful to be working in the field of critical infrastructure. We're as busy as ever. We might get hurt in the long term if the economy is damaged to the point where the pace of construction slows, but we won't feel much of a hit for another year at least.

About 90% of the office is working remotely. I still head to the office each day to help support the remote workers. It's not hard to maintain social distance with 4 of us there instead of 40.

It's not much, but I could spare few antelope or sheep roasts to someone in need. I'm in Provo.


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## hondodawg

Took a paid COLA at a 33% cut in hours. That’s saves me from commuting to Denver and paying for room and food. Wife was saved on 1st round of layoffs but was cut 20% in pay. Will know by September if I won’t be furloughed. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Packout

My business has seen a hit. My wife manages a 6,000 member youth soccer league- so I don't see that happening this Spring. We will be ok, but it will hurt. 

Too bad the stimulus doesn't apply to self-owned, no employee businesses. I have friends that will net $50,000-150,000 from the stimulus as their work hasn't slowed and now the gov't is covering their payroll, rent, utilities. Debt which will be forgiven at the end of the time period.


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## caddis8

Packout said:


> My business has seen a hit. My wife manages a 6,000 member youth soccer league- so I don't see that happening this Spring. We will be ok, but it will hurt.
> 
> Too bad the stimulus doesn't apply to self-owned, no employee businesses. I have friends that will net $50,000-150,000 from the stimulus as their work hasn't slowed and now the gov't is covering their payroll, rent, utilities. Debt which will be forgiven at the end of the time period.


I think it does partially, actually. Better check again. As long as it is used for operating expenses, it should be covered.

We applied and will use that as operating capital for a while and pay from it, and boost pay where needed if it dips too much. We pay piece rate, so not much salary, but I want to make sure we're taking care of our people at the same time. It's close to $200,000 we'll get and we'll hold onto it as needed for rainy days if things don't come back as anticiapted.

If it killed 10% of the baby boomers, it would hurt my business significantly. 72 million baby boomers.


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## Critter

I'm one of the lucky ones. Social Security keeps coming in along with my annuities every month. 

However I did take a hit in my portfolio where my annuities are at.


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## 3arabians

Hunttilidrop said:


> Maybe except 3A with his underlying health issues (asma) and being overweight. Putting him into some serious quarantine.&#129315;


LOL hohoho and hahaha bro. It's asthma not asma btw. "Overweight" ouch man! Luckily you have a job that keeps you fit whether you like it or not but you have a point. I am up a solid 4 lbs since my isolation started 3 1/2 weeks ago. What can I say, beer is so much more convenient to drink these days. My transition from coffee to beer helps me understand the time of day better although beer time seems to get earlier and earlier in the day as my isolation continues.

I am fortunate to work in the transportation industry which is defined as critical infrastructure. I moved to teleworking full time week ago so things are good here for now.


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## brisket

Critter said:


> I'm one of the lucky ones. Social Security keeps coming in along with my annuities every month.
> 
> However I did take a hit in my portfolio where my annuities are at.


When the first stimulus package doesn't work and they pass another, then another, inflation will be high and that Social Security check won't buy much anymore.


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## Critter

If it comes to that all of us will have a lot more to worry about 

Sent from my SM-J737V using Tapatalk


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## brisket

Critter said:


> If it comes to that all of us will have a lot more to worry about
> 
> Sent from my SM-J737V using Tapatalk


Very true.


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## High Desert Elk

In a "critical" industry and classified by my outfit as a category II employee (work from home but be available as needed), a step above an operator or mechanic which are category I and have physical responsibility to make things run (in my opinion, the real money-makers). Lights go out and medical equipment is useless without the product we make. So far, everything is OK. However, when executives have too much spare time on their hands, no good can come of it.

It appears that the economic situation is taxing on a lot of people's minds these days, more so than the run of the mill 5 or 6% unemployment and low wages with a mediocre GDP. This virus, for whatever reason (and reasons I suppose I must not fully understand), has really had a strange affect on the economy as a whole. People are actually terrified of the virus to the point it actually starts to get into your head.

If the current situation for whatever reason becomes a quasi status quo, it will not matter how many people die from this virus. The country as a whole from an overall sense of wellbeing will be lost.

I suppose it's more important now than ever to believe in something bigger than we are and have faith that things will be better in short order, not necessarily limited to waiting for the "experts" to develop a vaccine...


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## backcountry

My wife's company seems to be managing well enough for the time being. They are offering incentives for those able to work and actually hiring a few people. 

But they rely on referrals and many of those companies are temporarily shutting their doors. Only time will tell but it's a tough business to weather the potential of this going on for a year or more.

Fingers crossed for everyone.


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## 2full

My business has been nutso, panic crazy. 
Means lots of hours for me............but I'm salary. :shock:

The rest of the family is in critical medical fields for the most part. 

I do feel very bad for the service industry. 
Many will lose pay checks , but maybe as bad or worse, they lose health insurance.


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## High Desert Elk

There are so many underlying effects this whole debacle is creating on everyone and the reason the present situation cannot continue as it is.

Health insurence is a major one. My wife is a school teacher and consequently off until next fall. We are on the school's insurance but can switch to mine easy enough. Being in a state that resides at the bottom of the barrel for both economic well being and education, state budget cuts are coming. I fear she may not be given a contract next year because of it, but then that creates a whole new problem of overcrowding classrooms.


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## riptheirlips

My job is fishing and providing food for the family. Seems Gov Herbert is trying to put me out of work though


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## PBH

High Desert Elk said:


> My wife is a school teacher and consequently off until next fall.


Why? School is still in session. Teachers are still teaching and students are still taking courses via online methods.


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## Packout

PBH said:


> Why? School is still in session. Teachers are still teaching and students are still taking courses via online methods.


Pretty sure he is from NM. They canceled school for the rest of the year, but the teachers are still being paid.


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## BigT

I've been working from home for almost 4 weeks now. I love it, and hate it. I am in a position that it doesn't really matter where I work. And I work for a global corporation that hasn't laid off anyone of yet. They've closed many facilities, but it's temporarily. 

I've got an area of the United States I cover which requires a lot of travel. Luckily, I'd already done a lot of it before things were suspended in March. 

I do feel for those with struggling small businesses, and those who are looking for work due to this crisis. On the flip side, the local soda shops are making a killing right now where I live... Long lines at the soda shops!


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## DallanC

****it... just got this in an email:



> Other measures designed to help us reduce expenses will vary by geography and will be based on our ability to execute quickly.
> •	In the U.S., we will implement a COVID-19 Temporary Leave standard requiring all U.S. salaried employees and certain hourly employees to use half of their allotted annual vacation hours - or the equivalent in unpaid leave - by June 30, 2020.


Thats going to torpedo fall hunting plans. Blows burning vacation time when there is nothing to do.

-DallanC


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## caddis8

DallanC said:


> ****it... just got this in an email:
> 
> Thats going to torpedo fall hunting plans. Blows burning vacation time when there is nothing to do.
> 
> -DallanC


So if I'm reading that correctly, you get to take unpaid vacation up to half of what you get by June 30?

I'm guessing that you've been around for a while so the vacation time is likely significant.

My former coworkers at Cabela's/Bass Pro had a massive layoff last week on Thursday and then Friday those remainig got a 7-15% pay cut with the reasoning being they would get stimulus money to compensate. The letter was horrible.

Tough deal for a lot of folks in a lot of industries.


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## backcountry

caddis8 said:


> My former coworkers at Cabela's/Bass Pro had a massive layoff last week on Thursday and then Friday those remainig got a 7-15% pay cut with the reasoning being they would get stimulus money to compensate. The letter was horrible.


Holy crap, did they actually state that in the letter? That's cold blooded. I get the rational behind pay cuts even if I don't necessarily agree with it. But that's a bold move against employee morale to state such a thing in a letter. Not to mention as a massive retailer they must know it defeats the purpose of the stimulus.

Sorry to hear about all that for your friends.


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## DallanC

caddis8 said:


> So if I'm reading that correctly, you get to take unpaid vacation up to half of what you get by June 30?
> 
> I'm guessing that you've been around for a while so the vacation time is likely significant.


Yea I have alot of time so it is significant. As for the details, I dunno. They are going to send out another email this afternoon detailing it.



> My former coworkers at Cabela's/Bass Pro had a massive layoff last week on Thursday and then Friday those remainig got a 7-15% pay cut with the reasoning being they would get stimulus money to compensate. The letter was horrible.
> 
> Tough deal for a lot of folks in a lot of industries.


Dang, thats terrible.

-DallanC


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## caddis8

I could write a book on the misteps that whole thing took. Told we were losing our jobs at the Christmas party. Paraded out a kid with cerebral palsy and said he's happy, so you can be happy. Then told us we were getting canned. 

I was thinking to myself. "I'm watching Michael Scott right now." That was the owner of the company that did that. However, i have to at least hand him the fact that he delivered the message in person, albeit in horrible taste. 

Here's the letter. It was sent to me. It's been on FB and LinkedIn. The customer fallout would be worse than employee fallout. Leadership is taking 20% paycut, big whoop. Tone deaf- which was why I was happy to part ways, voluntarily with severance. I feel bad for the folks who upended their lives (many moved from Sidney to Springfield leaving houses unsold).


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## brisket

DallanC said:


> ****it... just got this in an email:
> 
> Thats going to torpedo fall hunting plans. Blows burning vacation time when there is nothing to do.
> 
> -DallanC


That sucks.


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## Critter

I once told a upper supervisor in the company that I worked for that I would take my time off non paid if I could get it when I wanted it. He about fainted. I told him that my vacation is that important to me. 

I know of a number of jobs where if a person wants time off he just quits his job and goes. Granted he has to find a new job when he comes back but you have to have your priorities.


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## DallanC

Critter said:


> I once told a upper supervisor in the company that I worked for that I would take my time off non paid if I could get it when I wanted it. He about fainted. I told him that my vacation is that important to me.
> 
> I know of a number of jobs where if a person wants time off he just quits his job and goes. Granted he has to find a new job when he comes back but you have to have your priorities.


I've flat out told many managers over my career I was taking vacation time on XYZ Dates (for hunting trips) no mater what. This of course was well in advance of the date, by usually 3 or 4 months. When they pushed back i told them if they couldn't support me after all I'd done for them, I'd find somewhere else to work once I returned from my trip.

One project we'd done 16 months of OT (Salary so unpaid), 6 days a week. Me and my immediate supervisor got in a shouting match over it, with the president of the entire company on the other side of room divider in a management meeting. I'm more than sure they heard me. My supervisor said loudly, "the president can hear you in the next room!" I shouted back "i dont know that i even care anymore" and walked out.

They let me go on my vacation.

-DallanC


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## johnnycake

Packout said:


> My business has seen a hit. My wife manages a 6,000 member youth soccer league- so I don't see that happening this Spring. We will be ok, but it will hurt.
> 
> Too bad the stimulus doesn't apply to self-owned, no employee businesses. I have friends that will net $50,000-150,000 from the stimulus as their work hasn't slowed and now the gov't is covering their payroll, rent, utilities. Debt which will be forgiven at the end of the time period.


Packout, self employed/independent contractors can apply for the PPP loan, but not until 4/10. Reach out to your lender to see if they will be participating in PPP for independent contractors/self employed.

Right now you can also apply for the Economic Injury Disaster Loan (max $2M could be approved, at 3.75% interest and potentially extended maturity) and request the advance up to $10k--and if the advance is approved that amount is forgiven and does not need to be repaid.


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## caddis8

DallanC said:


> I've flat out told many managers over my career I was taking vacation time on XYZ Dates (for hunting trips) no mater what. This of course was well in advance of the date, by usually 3 or 4 months. When they pushed back i told them if they couldn't support me after all I'd done for them, I'd find somewhere else to work once I returned from my trip.
> 
> One project we'd done 16 months of OT (Salary so unpaid), 6 days a week. Me and my immediate supervisor got in a shouting match over it, with the president of the entire company on the other side of room divider in a management meeting. I'm more than sure they heard me. My supervisor said loudly, "the president can hear you in the next room!" I shouted back "i dont know that i even care anymore" and walked out.
> 
> They let me go on my vacation.
> 
> -DallanC


I was lucky enough to work in an industry that I never had to worry about vacation for hunting/fishing/outdoor exploits. I was able to do some for work purposes that wasn't even vacation. The trouble is, I was usually too busy at work helping other people enjoy the outdoors that I didn't get that much time to do it myself, especially during hunting season.

I never got told "no, you can't go hunting." I was able to leave work early a lot to go. One of the perks of the business. and working for some of the best people around who would give their shirt off their back to help.

But it was still a job.


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## RandomElk16

Packout said:


> My business has seen a hit. My wife manages a 6,000 member youth soccer league- so I don't see that happening this Spring. We will be ok, but it will hurt.
> 
> Too bad the stimulus doesn't apply to self-owned, no employee businesses. I have friends that will net $50,000-150,000 from the stimulus as their work hasn't slowed and now the gov't is covering their payroll, rent, utilities. Debt which will be forgiven at the end of the time period.


Hopefully I can get some decent critters this year to help you get some funds back.

I work in "critical infrastructure" sales to enterprise companies. We have been wildly busy since most of them for years ignored being equipped to work from home.

I am curious how this will impact long term. People whose companies told them working from home, even part time, wasn't possible. People that had 1-2+ hour commutes (each way) that may no longer want to do that.... It will be interesting to see how companies shift after this.

I personally have been a big advocate of work from home and intend on letting my folks do so at least 1-2 days a week once "normal" comes back.


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## Packout

johnnycake said:


> Packout, self employed/independent contractors can apply for the PPP loan, but not until 4/10. Reach out to your lender to see if they will be participating in PPP for independent contractors/self employed.
> 
> Right now you can also apply for the Economic Injury Disaster Loan (max $2M could be approved, at 3.75% interest and potentially extended maturity) and request the advance up to $10k--and if the advance is approved that amount is forgiven and does not need to be repaid.


Interesting. I will have to look into it and see what the qualifications are. Thanks.


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## caddis8

https://irp-cdn.multiscreensite.com...ss Owner’s Guide to the CARES Act [final].pdf

This has been a pretty good resource to look.


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## turkinator

I'm an inpatient pharmacist and my wife is a CPA and works from home so we are fortunate to both still be working. It is a little nerve racking to be working so close to the front lines, but I am happy to be working and helping those who are sick get better. 

Packout, I spoke with my wife and she said the same thing johnnycake did. You should definitely apply for the EIDL. If you need any help let me know and I'll see if my wife could help you out.


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## High Desert Elk

PBH said:


> Why? School is still in session. Teachers are still teaching and students are still taking courses via online methods.





Packout said:


> Pretty sure he is from NM. They canceled school for the rest of the year, but the teachers are still being paid.


Yes. You have to understand 1) how dumb NM is when it comes to politics and 2) the state is ran by democrat liberals.

To illustrate the wealth of brainpower in the Roundhouse, the very industries that contribute 40% of the state's annual revenue for budget are the same industries political leadership is trying to quash and blackball through legislation.

My wife teaches an elective subject (for now) so not sure how "important" a school district ran by ...... will view it.


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## CrayDad

I've also been working remotely the last number of years. Thank goodness there hasn't been as much impact in our industry.


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## Kwalk3

I've worked remotely for several years, so the work situation hasn't really changed. There's a lot of uncertainty right now, and business has taken a hit to be sure. Starting to see a few positive signs, and have actually been able to be proactive with sales this week instead of just putting out fires. Here's to hoping that there are better days ahead for everyone.


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## BRL1

PBH said:


> I'm fortunate enough to work for a manufacturer that the DoD depends on. We aren't closing down, unless all of our operators end up sick at the same time...


Same here but did get a schedule change from 9/80 to 3 12. The 4 days a week off are nice if I had the ambition to do the yard work I have been putting off for years.


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## waspocrew

Doing plenty of remote patient visits right now, but our hospital is planning for the surge here in Cleveland within a few weeks. Really good chance I’ll be pulled to help on the inpatient floors. No ICU for me luckily.


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## guner

Work for the Federal government. Luckily I work at the VA and no signs of any layoffs, getting prepared for the “surge” they are bracing for, then all hands on deck. They are retraining doctors and nurses who haven’t really worked with emergency type patients in years. All have to be certified on Ventilator etc. Mandatory reassignment of duty station if directed.


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## Dexter

Work for the federal government, no work for us to do, but we still need to be there because we are mission essential. Just glad to still have a job for now. Sorry to hear about the folks that are stuggling with work, I do hope that things will be ok for you all. Wife works for compensation insurance company, so far they are ok but with businesses shutting down I do worry about her job. I also have a son stuck out in Argentina, the borders are closed and quarantined to the property and cannot leave. The virus has taken a family member of mine in Oklahoma. He was in perfect health with no underlying issues, unfortunately being only 70 yrs old it took his life in only 10 days. He was tested negative a few days into the sickness and sent home, after a week of struggling he was taken back to hospital and was admitted to ICU immediately. Retested and came back positive(don't completely trust the test). He died 4 days later. He passed away yesterday early morning in the ICU. Thank you to all of the medical members out there trying to fight the pandemic. May God be with all of you and your families. 🙏


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## SX3

Sorry to hear.


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## backcountry

Sorry to hear about your relative. I hope your family is able to support each other from a distance.

I hope your son remains safe in Argentina.


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## RandomElk16

Learned this week that "The Miller family of companies" made a "small" layoff as they called it, and ~1,000 individuals lost their jobs. 

Sad times. I wish all of them the best.


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## Dexter

Thank you for the kind words


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## ridgetop

Our company is mainly doing new home construction and it's only slowed a little so far but I can see it starting to slow a little more as I'm hearing buyers are starting to back out of their contracts or delaying their closing dates because of finances. 


2008-2010 was much worse for us. We went from 45-50 employees, down to 4. Luckily I was one of those final four but I did have to take an 18 percent pay cut.


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## caddis8

I just got word that we put in our application through America First Credit Union on 4/3 the first day we could, and was just informed that on 4/7 funds were gone and we didn't get any funding.

That seems very goofy. Anyone having issues?

This will be a temporary slowdown in wages as we were using that for operating capital. Typically we're paid 1 month after services provided.


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## muleydeermaniac

I am luckily in an industry that is deemed necessary so my hours actually increased. Not that it matters for me, I'm salary. We are actually bringing in temps to fill positions right now.


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## Packout

caddis8 said:


> I just got word that we put in our application through America First Credit Union on 4/3 the first day we could, and was just informed that on 4/7 funds were gone and we didn't get any funding.
> 
> That seems very goofy. Anyone having issues?
> 
> This will be a temporary slowdown in wages as we were using that for operating capital. Typically we're paid 1 month after services provided.


It appears that 1.5 million applicants were successful in obtaining a loan from the $350 billion. For an average of around $230,000 per applicant. I'd wager the majority of businesses didn't have the ability to even apply in a timely manner- and they are the ones that needed it the most.

I know two people that were successful. One got around $1 million and another received around $80,000. Both have businesses in industries that are busier now than they were before the virus.


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## johnnycake

I helped around 15 businesses get PPP applications submitted to their banks in the first two days the program was open and they all got their funding done. But I know of several others who were not ready to go at the starting bell and waited until the following Monday or Tuesday that have not received their funding. 

The EIDL program and advance is worse. I do not know of any applicant that actually received funding through that program.


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## Catherder

johnnycake said:


> I helped around 15 businesses get PPP applications submitted to their banks in the first two days the program was open and they all got their funding done. But I know of several others who were not ready to go at the starting bell and waited until the following Monday or Tuesday that have not received their funding.
> 
> The EIDL program and advance is worse. I do not know of any applicant that actually received funding through that program.


We got ours approved last week and just heard again from our bank today that we are good to go. Fortunately, we are still doing OK as a business, but it is nice to have a back up plan.

We haven't received or heard anything about the EIDL advance either. We'll probably see that the same time I see my stimulus check. (August?)


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## Vanilla

Packout said:


> I know two people that were successful. One got around $1 million and another received around $80,000. Both have businesses in industries that are busier now than they were before the virus.


I'm not sure how I feel about this...


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## Vanilla

Catherder said:


> We'll probably see that the same time I see my stimulus check. (August?)


I've already received mine. It showed as pending last night in the bank account, but is now official.


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## Catherder

Vanilla said:


> I'm not sure how I feel about this...


The thing to keep in mind is that the Governor ,in his pressers, was telling/pleading/encouraging the business owners of the state to apply for these programs ASAP regardless of whether they were severely affected or not. In our case, there has been a mild net effect but we are still chugging along.

With that kind of encouragement, I can't fault any well run business for applying.


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## Vanilla

Catherder said:


> With that kind of encouragement, I can't fault any well run business for applying.


I am not going to fault anyone for taking advantage of a program that is available to them either. I understand applying, especially not knowing what the future holds. I just have mixed feelings about seeing a thriving company getting "free" handouts from the government when there are companies completely shut down not able to get it now.

We knew that was coming. It's not a surprise. It just sucks to see.


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## johnnycake

Catherder said:


> The thing to keep in mind is that the Governor ,in his pressers, was telling/pleading/encouraging the business owners of the state to apply for these programs ASAP regardless of whether they were severely affected or not. In our case, there has been a mild net effect but were are still chugging along.
> 
> With that kind of encouragement, I can't fault any well run business for applying.


It wasn't just governors, the SBA itself was broadly encouraging any businesses that fit the eligibility criteria to apply. And I think that was the right approach too. The whole ounce of prevention versus a pound of cure mindset


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## caddis8

We're temporarily down. $180k and submitted the day it was available. If the bank didn't push through, then I'm not really happy with the bank. 

Very frustrating. We're not going under, but I'd like to pay our people either for what they did or the average pay, whatever is greater.

We're down about 30%. I watch it like a hawk. However, we can't get the bank to answer the phone. How was that handled and how did our application get pushed through? I'm looking at operating capital. If our clients are slow to pay, then it can hurt our cash flow, and that will have negative effects.


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## Catherder

Vanilla said:


> I've already received mine. It showed as pending last night in the bank account, but is now official.


I'm a poor schlub that has to write a check to the IRS every year at tax time. They don't have any direct deposit info for me. :sad:


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## CPAjeff

Catherder said:


> I'm a poor schlub that has to write a check to the IRS every year at tax time. They don't have any direct deposit info for me. :sad:


You know you won't qualify due to income limits anyway . . . 

People fret over accounting and law fees, but won't think twice about dropping $2k on vet fees to get the underwear out of Fido's stomach.


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## Catherder

CPAjeff said:


> You know you won't qualify due to income limits anyway . . .


I wish that were the case. Sad to say, I comfortably qualify. :sad:

While the hours are long, the compensation often is not.


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## Clarq

Catherder said:


> We'll probably see that the same time I see my stimulus check. (August?)


I hear the Trump supporters are getting them first. :mrgreen:

TOTP


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## middlefork

I can't verify that but mine came today.


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## Packout

Vanilla said:


> I am not going to fault anyone for taking advantage of a program that is available to them either. I understand applying, especially not knowing what the future holds. I just have mixed feelings about seeing a thriving company getting "free" handouts from the government when there are companies completely shut down not able to get it now.
> 
> We knew that was coming. It's not a surprise. It just sucks to see.


This ^^^^^^^^ I don't fault them either. However, it does feel wrong to watch a guy worth over $20 million get a free million and someone who spends $50k a year on hunting get a free $80k, while my neighbor is on the verge of declaring bankruptcy and could have used less than $4k a month to stay afloat and keep 3 people employed.

I tend to be a free market, capitalism type of person and what has happened is far from that.


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## Catherder

Packout said:


> This ^^^^^^^^ I don't fault them either. However, it does feel wrong to watch a guy worth over $20 million get a free million and someone who spends $50k a year on hunting get a free $80k, while my neighbor is on the verge of declaring bankruptcy and could have used less than $4k a month to stay afloat and keep 3 people employed.
> 
> I tend to be a free market, capitalism type of person and what has happened is far from that.


Yes, I would agree with this. I've heard talk that additional funding will eventually be available. It seems to me that a program that targets helping the smaller businesses would be advisable so they don't have to compete with the bigger guys for funding.

The problem is that the fallout from the virus hit everyone so fast that in their haste to get aid out, the rushed system design had flaws. The flaws are showing up now.


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## backcountry

Sorry to hear about those on the forum needing funds that have already been depleted. The spirit of the law seems to have been ignored in many cases. Not new but still disheartening. 

We got our stimulus checks earlier this week. We are hoping to support some local businesses with the money but it's logistically difficult when you are self-quarantined. We'll get creative and figure it out though.


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## Critter

backcountry said:


> We got our stimulus checks earlier this week. We are hoping to support some local businesses with the money but it's logistically difficult when you are self-quarantined. We'll get creative and figure it out though.


I highly doubt that you are actually "quarantined" but asked to stay at home.

A true quarantine you would be stuck right where you are located. No going out for groceries or other necessaries. Last I herd you can go shopping and actually do other things.

Even here in Colorado where we are considered a "hot spot" we can still go shopping and do other things. A few towns have enacted the mask laws where you need to cover your mouth and nose when out in public but we are still just under a "stay at home" type of order. The only time a actual quarantine would come into play would be if you tested positive for the virus then you are asked to self quarantine for 14 days.


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## brisket

Well, I survived round 2 of layoffs today but took a 20% salary reduction. :shock: We lost some great people today. 

It doesn't have to be this way. #EndTheLockdowns


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## backcountry

Critter said:


> backcountry said:
> 
> 
> 
> We got our stimulus checks earlier this week. We are hoping to support some local businesses with the money but it's logistically difficult when you are self-quarantined. We'll get creative and figure it out though.
> 
> 
> 
> I highly doubt that you are actually "quarantined" but asked to stay at home.
> 
> A true quarantine you would be stuck right where you are located. No going out for groceries or other necessaries. Last I herd you can go shopping and actually do other things.
> 
> Even here in Colorado where we are considered a "hot spot" we can still go shopping and do other things. A few towns have enacted the mask laws where you need to cover your mouth and nose when out in public but we are still just under a "stay at home" type of order. The only time a actual quarantine would come into play would be if you tested positive for the virus then you are asked to self quarantine for 14 days.
Click to expand...

We are self-quarantined. MIL is extremely high risk and already on a non-invasive ventilator. We haven't done grocery shopping in 3 weeks as friends have volunteered to do so. Haven't been in a store of any sort for equally as long.

Never said it was mandated. We chose to stay ahead of our states directives. We don't have known contact or symptoms but we are definitely more constrained than the "stay home" requests and even orders, hence my use of the phrase.

As related to my comment....that is why we might have difficulty spending our stimulus. We aren't even asking people go places just for us; we don't want to cause extra contact for anyone. There are more contactless shopping options for curbside pickup but with the resurgent caseload in Utah the last few days we are still hesitant.


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## Critter

backcountry said:


> As related to my comment....that is why we might have difficulty spending our stimulus. We aren't even asking people go places just for us; we don't want to cause extra contact for anyone. There are more contactless shopping options for curbside pickup but with the resurgent caseload in Utah the last few days we are still hesitant.


Amazon, Cabela's, Bass Pro, Natchez Shooters Supply, Midway, the list goes on and on. I am also sure that there are those for your wife, I'm just not versed in those online stores other than a few jewelry ones.


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## backcountry

Critter said:


> backcountry said:
> 
> 
> 
> As related to my comment....that is why we might have difficulty spending our stimulus. We aren't even asking people go places just for us; we don't want to cause extra contact for anyone. There are more contactless shopping options for curbside pickup but with the resurgent caseload in Utah the last few days we are still hesitant.
> 
> 
> 
> Amazon, Cabela's, Bass Pro, Natchez Shooters Supply, Midway, the list goes on and on. I am also sure that there are those for your wife, I'm just not versed in those online stores other than a few jewelry ones.
Click to expand...

Back to first comment....I want to support local. I don't have a problem with most of those companies but in a time like this my money generates more benefit locally than with massive chains. Some of it will ultimately be funneled through those but prefer it not to be the bulk of it.

We have a landscape project in mind that would fit the bill. Just going to have to be creative.


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## Critter

I have my kitchen tore apart right now. 

I am trying to make do with materials that I have on hand but once a week I'll put my mask on and head to the hardware store. 

I'll have 90% of it finished and then wait until I can hit the local paint store for the finishing touch.


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## DallanC

Critter said:


> I have my kitchen tore apart right now.


For me its bathrooms. We had a water leak in one I'm in the middle of drying out and fixing, the other bathroom we don't use alot is now getting full use. It didn't have a vent so its now getting super saturated from showers so I just added a vent fan and run the vent line through a joist, and all the way to the foundation.

Its all wired and working, I just I gotta drill a 4.5" hole through my brick to complete that PITA project (the brick coring bit arrived last night from amazon so I'm going to drill it later today).

-DallanC


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## ridgetop

DallanC said:


> For me its bathrooms. We had a water leak in one I'm in the middle of drying out and fixing, the other bathroom we don't use alot is now getting full use. It didn't have a vent so its now getting super saturated from showers so I just added a vent fan and run the vent line through a joist, and all the way to the foundation.
> 
> Its all wired and working, I just I gotta drill a 4.5" hole through my brick to complete that PITA project (the brick coring bit arrived last night from amazon so I'm going to drill it later today).
> 
> -DallanC


 I'm not sure what kind of bit you got but I just usually use a 1/4" masonry bit and drill several holes all the way around the circumference. Then with a chisel and hammer, break out the brick inside the drilled holes.


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## DallanC

ridgetop said:


> I'm not sure what kind of bit you got but I just usually use a 1/4" masonry bit and drill several holes all the way around the circumference. Then with a chisel and hammer, break out the brick inside the drilled holes.


The coring bit went about 3/8" of an inch before I gave up. I had a hose trickling water on it and tried to not get too high of rotations, still didnt work out all that well. I did drill 1/4" holes in around the circumference and then chiseled it out. Vent is done and the whole fan project works nicely. Mirror doesn't even get steam on it after a shower.

Going to do the other shower next, that one will have to vent up and out of the roof.

-DallanC


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## ridgetop

DallanC said:


> The coring bit went about 3/8" of an inch before I gave up. I had a hose trickling water on it and tried to not get too high of rotations, still didnt work out all that well. I did drill 1/4" holes in around the circumference and then chiseled it out. Vent is done and the whole fan project works nicely. Mirror doesn't even get steam on it after a shower.
> 
> Going to do the other shower next, that one will have to vent up and out of the roof.
> 
> -DallanC


No way to vent it into the soffit?


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## 2full

I haven't seen a refund on taxes for years. 
I get penalized for planning ahead and paying everything off, and working my butt off and making decent money. 
I have to pay for all the "entitlements". Even if they have a better phone than me, and a bigger TV than me, and usually drive a better car/truck than me. 

So........ I'll wait until they issue the paper checks to get my stimulus money. 
I need it to pay the 4K I owe in federal taxes. 

We have been so crazy that I almost wish they would shut us down so I could get some time off. 
:mrgreen:


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## DallanC

ridgetop said:


> No way to vent it into the soffit?


Everything I've read is that is a big No-No, and against code. Your soffit has its own vents to vent the attic, and moisture from a bathroom vent gets sucked right back up into the attic. This bathroom was in a basement so it was easiest to vent it next to the dryer next to the hose spigot low and on the side of the house. /shrug

The upstairs bathroom will vent up through ceiling, through attic and out the roof near the utility vent piping.

-DallanC


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## ridgetop

DallanC said:


> Everything I've read is that is a big No-No, and against code. Your soffit has its own vents to vent the attic, and moisture from a bathroom vent gets sucked right back up into the attic. This bathroom was in a basement so it was easiest to vent it next to the dryer next to the hose spigot low and on the side of the house. /shrug
> 
> The upstairs bathroom will vent up through ceiling, through attic and out the roof near the utility vent piping.
> 
> -DallanC


To meet code, all you need to do is attach the vent tubing to a vented cap cut into the soffit. This is the type we use, they come in white or brown.
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Speedi-Products-4-in-White-Micro-Louver-Eave-Vent-EX-EVML-04/202907379
The idea of moisture from a bathroom exhaust fan being sucked into the attic is a real stretch of the imagination. If that was truly the case, then it would be a huge problem during our inversions, when all that moist fog would be sucked up into every ones attics. 
One thing that could happen if you vent up out the roof is the piping could collect condensation and the water would run back down towards the fan motor and/or collect in the pipes low spot, depending how steep the angle was while being vented out the roof.
Just my thoughts.


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## Vanilla

Three thoughts cross my mind when I read discussions like this. 

1- I have no idea what you guys are talking about!
2- I really wish I was a handy man and knew what you guys were talking about.
3- I'm kind of glad I don't know what you guys are talking about, because if I knew how to do some of this stuff I would get myself way too deep into projects! 

Carry on...


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## CrayDad

Somehow I got volunteered into backyard digging projects for new trees, shrubbery, etc...


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## RandomElk16

I am putting two gates on the side of my house where my RV pad is - and before doing it myself thought I should see if someone on here needed work. I could to vinyl or a tube framed metal. Approximate opening is about 11.5 feet. 

I also need some dirt leveled/removed in the backyard. Planning on renting a skid and doing that but again - if someone needs work let me know. 



I know those industries have been busy, but I would rather check here first. I am in the Ogden area.


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## caddis8

We're now 8 weeks in with this mess. 

How is everyone doing? Still employed? Need help?


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## brisket

caddis8 said:


> We're now 8 weeks in with this mess.
> 
> How is everyone doing? Still employed? Need help?


I'm thankful to still be employed after 2 rounds of layoffs and a significant pay cut. I'm not enjoying the salary loss, but I'll take that over loosing my job. The uncertainty of a looming job loss in a market like this is maddening.


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## hondodawg

Still employed, but not working. Pay is reduced by 33%. Wife is working still, beat the first round of layoffs and received a 25% pay cut. Just refi the 1st and 2nd. In anticipation of massive layoffs come Oct 1st

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Ray

I’ve been very fortunate, aside from working from home, it’s been business as usual. Last month was actually my best month ever.


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## Vanilla

Technically I’m a state employee. Every state agency has been asked to present a new budget to the legislature for 2020-21 fiscal year beginning in July as they will go into special session next month to reallocate the state budget due to the pandemic and resulting economic downturn after the legislative session. 

Every agency has to present a reduced budget at 2% down, 5% down, and 10% down from what was approved in March. I’m hopeful that even at 10% it would not result in a RIF for me this year. But there will be many across the state that are not so lucky if they cut it back 10% across the board. And even if 2020-21 is “safe” for me, government budgets are usually behind when it comes to recessions, and even if we see positive economic growth for the rest of 2020 from here on out, the next couple years in government could be rough. 

Fingers crossed and hopeful for the best! Trying to prepare for the worst, just in case.


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## RandomElk16

Saw retail dropped by almost 17% from March to April. JC Penney added to the list of bankruptcy's. 


I am very fortunate to work in the industry I do and have been able to bring on 23 people since March. Including 10 this month, who are all incredibly talented and all lost/were losing employment because of this. The amount of talent that is out there right now brings to light the economic impact to me. These types of people are usually very difficult/competitive to get.


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## JackDuncan

Hi everybody. In fact, I am here quite rarely and I have little time and I am in a very hopeless situation. The fact is that I opened a construction business with my brother and we have been successfully working for more than two weeks, and during this time we have received excellent profits. The problem is that we have a lot of orders and we need a manager to sort orders and communicate with customers ... This is a real tragedy because there are no qualified employees on the market. We pay good money and work only officially through a contract. We are even ready to show you Employment contract samples. You can find them at tracktime24.com and check for authenticity. I look forward to any suggestions!


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## bowgy

JackDuncan said:


> I really need good paid job) my wife is pregnant and I want to buy everything needed for baby before the labours


Some of these first posts are really great;-)


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## backcountry

Indeed. The machine learning on this one just has us placed in the UK I guess. 

I'd want to make sure I had a job before the labours kicked in as well though.

I think maybe we should all start posting in old English just to throw it off more simply for the entertainment value.


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## Vanilla

backcountry said:


> Indeed. The machine learning on this one just has us placed in the UK I guess.
> 
> I'd want to make sure I had a job before the labours kicked in as well though.
> 
> I think maybe we should all start posting in old English just to throw it off more simply for the entertainment value.


Entertainment is bloody right!


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## elkunited

Still employed doing health insurance. We are all working from home. Not the world's best pay, but we're even hiring if someone is looking for work. $16 hour base plus commission. Yeah it kinda sucks, but beats unemployment.


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## hondodawg

No word yet for me. But latest memo has the words “right sizing”, “unsustainable”. We all know what that means. Our competitor who has the exact business model announced 20-30% layoffs yesterday. I’m sure we’re not far behind. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Underwood1988

JBurgessXXX said:


> Yes, dude, my father lost his job and in times of crisis he is trying to do everything to find a new job and it's very difficult. He even created a linked profile for himself and started promoting his account to become more popular and appear more often in search results. Thus, the chance of getting a job offer is much higher. Many will say that it is not worth buy linkedin followers, but if you find a good service for a gradual and high-quality promotion, then this is a very cool way. So I think that sooner or later he will find a job.


 Why didn't anyone tell me about this some months ago?!


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## Ray

Underwood1988 said:


> JBurgessXXX said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, dude, my father lost his job and in times of crisis he is trying to do everything to find a new job and it's very difficult. He even created a linked profile for himself and started promoting his account to become more popular and appear more often in search results. Thus, the chance of getting a job offer is much higher. Many will say that it is not worth buy linkedin followers, but if you find a good service for a gradual and high-quality promotion, then this is a very cool way. So I think that sooner or later he will find a job.
> 
> 
> 
> Why didn't anyone tell me about this some months ago?!
Click to expand...

Because we don't like you


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## Critter

Spammers are talking to each other now


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## backcountry

Call John Connor. It's time.


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## Ray

backcountry said:


> Call John Connor. It's time.


&#128514;&#128076;


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## DallanC

Critter said:


> Spammers are talking to each other now


Making a complete Tangent: You might be interested in the Bot-Wars that go on on the Wikipedia website. Bots crawl the site, making changes, updates ect to content. Occasionally one bot changes another bots changes. Which causes the original bot to change back... which gets changed again.

Its a fascinating study of AI learning to watch these bots war with each other.

The attributes to be petty and thickheaded certainly arent limited to humans lol

theguardian.com/technology/2017/feb/23/wikipedia-bot-editing-war-study
https://diff.wikimedia.org/2017/08/30/wikipedia-bot-pocalypse/

-DallanC


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## Dunkem

We have more spam and crap everyday, it is getting old.-O,--O,--O,-


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