# 6.0 HELP



## DevilDog09 (Oct 4, 2016)

So i started a thread about a wreck I was in a couple of weeks ago with my 6.0. I got the truck back from the autobody shop today. 1st - Batteries were dead. Had to jump in three times. 2nd - When i put the truck in Drive and hold the break, white smoke comes pouring out!!! The truck was at the auto body shop for about two weeks just sitting. 3rd - Its riding really rough in idle and drive in general now, and as i was taking it to Larry H. Milley in Sandy to get a diagnostic it completely just died. I tried giving it some gas, but the engine wasn't reving up at all, no rpms (had the peddle to the floor, and nothing) Battery was completely dead, not even enough juice for hazards. Sorry if you were east bound on 9000 s right before redwood road around 4:30...that was me blocking traffic. I sat there for 30 minutes before someone offered to help and tow me out of the road, but dont get me started on that. It was front end damage, they replaced the trans cooler. Truck was running smooth and awesome before, now this. So im already in a fight with Progressive to get them to fix this. Any ideas what it could be? Any way the wreck could have caused it? Fuel lines frozen? EGR?


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

White smoke = water ... which usually means cracked head or blown head gasket. Probably a stupid question... but was your antifreeze at the proper ratio? I mean with the cold weather nothing froze and broke?


-DallanC


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## DevilDog09 (Oct 4, 2016)

Dont tell me that DallanC. Yea antifreeze ratio is good. Still looks good, not leaking or anything. I had the tow truck drop it off at Larry H Miller tonight, they are gonna check it out. Head gasket issue wouldnt come from a wreck could it?


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

No the wreck wouldn't cause head gasket issues. But if they removed the radiator while fixing the front end, and some numbskull stuck normal water in it... or dilluted antifreeze it could cause problems. The engines I've seen with cracked head gaskets smoke like the old time steam engines. It would be noticable you are loosing coolant too (radiator would show being low quickly). It can only take a quarter inch crack in the right place to leak coolant into the cylinder (where it burns and turns to steam then flows out your tailpipe).

A good mechanic would do a "cylinder leak down" test, like a compression test but you hook the compressor up to the hose running into the sparkplug hole, then listen for air in the intake (from bad valve), exhaust (bad exhaust valve), oil pan (bad rings) or radiator (bad head gasket).

Hmmm all this talk of engines makes me want to rebuild another chevy small block. 

Honestly at this point just wait and see what the dealer says.


-DallanC


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## CAExpat (Oct 27, 2013)

Let's not get ahead of ourselves here just yet. Granted I don't own a 6.0, I would go back to the original problem of batteries being dead. Yes white smoke CAN mean water thus pointing to a head gasket, however it more often is a symptom of raw/un-burnt fuel.

My first point of inspection would be to load test (replace) the batteries and then test the FICM. Bad batteries can take it out causing all sorts of issues. If the batteries are replaced and the FICM checks out, then start looking at other areas.


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## DevilDog09 (Oct 4, 2016)

DallanC said:


> No the wreck wouldn't cause head gasket issues. But if they removed the radiator while fixing the front end, and some numbskull stuck normal water in it... or dilluted antifreeze it could cause problems. The engines I've seen with cracked head gaskets smoke like the old time steam engines. It would be noticable you are loosing coolant too (radiator would show being low quickly). It can only take a quarter inch crack in the right place to leak coolant into the cylinder (where it burns and turns to steam then flows out your tailpipe).
> 
> A good mechanic would do a "cylinder leak down" test, like a compression test but you hook the compressor up to the hose running into the sparkplug hole, then listen for air in the intake (from bad valve), exhaust (bad exhaust valve), oil pan (bad rings) or radiator (bad head gasket).
> 
> ...


So no leaking coolant, or signs of coolant bubbling out. Infact coolant level was still topped off. Does that rule out a blown head gasket?


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## DevilDog09 (Oct 4, 2016)

CAExpat said:


> Let's not get ahead of ourselves here just yet. Granted I don't own a 6.0, I would go back to the original problem of batteries being dead. Yes white smoke CAN mean water thus pointing to a head gasket, however it more often is a symptom of raw/un-burnt fuel.
> 
> My first point of inspection would be to load test (replace) the batteries and then test the FICM. Bad batteries can take it out causing all sorts of issues. If the batteries are replaced and the FICM checks out, then start looking at other areas.


Would a dying battery cause white smoke to come billowing out? Thats what the autobody tech said was the problem. FICM is brand new


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## CAExpat (Oct 27, 2013)

FICM being brand new could be negated by poor batteries, if operated at insufficient voltage it can kill them. Poor voltage can certainly cause those symptoms due to improper fuel delivery, injector duration etc. The FICM is a great design conceptually but if all things are not in alignment it can cause absurdity.


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## Critter (Mar 20, 2010)

Normally white smoke out of a diesels tailpipe is unburnt fuel. Did you happen to get a whiff of it to see what it smelled like? 

As far as anything else I would be just guessing since I have never worked on a 6.0 but if you would like I could recommend a couple of good forums where the members know their stuff.


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## Critter (Mar 20, 2010)

Here is a post from a truck forum conserning white smoke out of the tailpipe. The person that posted it is a Ford mechanic but it is hard to diaginose on the computer, but it might give you a idea. The original poster had just replace the engine and was getting white smoke and a rough idle problem.

If the engine is idling rough I would start there. The white smoke could be the result of a bad misfire due to a base engine issue, faulty injector over fueling and yes, even a bad EGR cooler. I would start by determining the rough running concern and as mentioned, remove the EGR valve to inspect it. I have seen quite a few re-manufactured injector failures. Was this a FORD reman engine?


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## DevilDog09 (Oct 4, 2016)

You guys are awesome thank you for all the help. Ive been talking with some guys on a powerstroke forum. They think that since the batteries are low that its causing the FICM to malfunction.


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## DevilDog09 (Oct 4, 2016)

Critter said:


> Normally white smoke out of a diesels tailpipe is unburnt fuel. Did you happen to get a whiff of it to see what it smelled like?
> 
> As far as anything else I would be just guessing since I have never worked on a 6.0 but if you would like I could recommend a couple of good forums where the members know their stuff.


I didnt get to smell it, I knew I should have taken a whiff. I just joined the powerstroke forum for some input. Thanks for the help Critter!


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## DevilDog09 (Oct 4, 2016)

DallanC said:


> No the wreck wouldn't cause head gasket issues. But if they removed the radiator while fixing the front end, and some numbskull stuck normal water in it... or dilluted antifreeze it could cause problems. The engines I've seen with cracked head gaskets smoke like the old time steam engines. It would be noticable you are loosing coolant too (radiator would show being low quickly). It can only take a quarter inch crack in the right place to leak coolant into the cylinder (where it burns and turns to steam then flows out your tailpipe).
> 
> A good mechanic would do a "cylinder leak down" test, like a compression test but you hook the compressor up to the hose running into the sparkplug hole, then listen for air in the intake (from bad valve), exhaust (bad exhaust valve), oil pan (bad rings) or radiator (bad head gasket).
> 
> ...


haha Im with you, accept all this talk is making me want to go back to the good old F150 with the 5.4 Triton. Thank you for the ideas DallanC, i will definitely bring that up with the mechanic tomorrow.


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## hazmat (Apr 23, 2009)

Bad ficm module


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## hazmat (Apr 23, 2009)

Easy fix


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

DevilDog09 said:


> So no leaking coolant, or signs of coolant bubbling out. Infact coolant level was still topped off. Does that rule out a blown head gasket?


Yes. It was a longshot idea... but not beyond the realm of possibility. Other people here seem to have better ideas on diesels and smoke (I owned a 6.2 diesel for a few years... it smoked like a chimney when cold, but never white smoke /shrug).

-DallanC


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## DevilDog09 (Oct 4, 2016)

Just got the truck back from the dealer. Diagnosis said "fuel injectors 2, 4, 6, and 8 were dropping off causing engine to die". Grand total $2079.84. So thats the diesel techs diagnosis over there at Larry H Miller Ford in Sandy. There are no codes being thrown however...is that odd? I threw in two new batteries and the truck fired up pretty rough however. Died on me once within a 8 mile drive like it was out of gas, but then fired back up and got her home. Im still fighting with Progressive to pay for the repairs but they are claiming its unrelated to the collision. Truck ran like a dream before the wreck, now runs like crap....only thing that changed between December 3 when it happened and now is collision. Logic tells me that it is related or just the worst timing depending on which side you are on. This sound like the right diagnosis?


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## BG1 (Feb 15, 2013)

Problem is that blue oval. Just sayin.
Sorry for your troubles. I hate those kind of vehicle problems. Even Chevys have occasional frustrations.


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## taxidermist (Sep 11, 2007)

Sorry to hear about your issues with your truck D.D. !! I don't want to be sounding mean, or condescending but, I owned a 6.0 ONCE. Never again either. I have owned Cummins trucks prior to the 6.0 and never a problem, and power. I dumped over 4 G's into that truck and it was still a POS. Took a HUGE loss getting rid of it, but my headache was gone. I'm running a 12V. Cummins now and love it. 

This could be a blessing in disguise ???? I wish you the best, and the lest expensive rout to getting you back on the road !!


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## CAExpat (Oct 27, 2013)

It's odd that half the injectors would drop without a code, or any other symptom, granted they can just one morning decide to be fubar. Dealerships are not the best when it comes to thorough diagnosis, i'd call around for a second (or third) opinion before handing over the money and getting the truck back with the same issues. Ask the dealer "tech" what the FICM voltage was at key-on, start, and operation? If he/she doesn't know, have the truck towed to either Gillet, RKL, Industrial, ANYBODY else but the dealer. If it truly is an injector issue, you'll want a shop that ALL they do is diesel. Keep us posted. 

Don't stress about it, that's the worst. I've got reciepts for my Dodge totalling $30k by the time injectors, trans, steering, 2 TIPMs, ball joints, and a laundry list of small parts, it's not just Ford.


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## DevilDog09 (Oct 4, 2016)

BG1 said:


> Problem is that blue oval. Just sayin.
> Sorry for your troubles. I hate those kind of vehicle problems. Even Chevys have occasional frustrations.


I was waiting to see how long that took for someone to say that haha


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## DevilDog09 (Oct 4, 2016)

CAExpat said:


> It's odd that half the injectors would drop without a code, or any other symptom, granted they can just one morning decide to be fubar. Dealerships are not the best when it comes to thorough diagnosis, i'd call around for a second (or third) opinion before handing over the money and getting the truck back with the same issues. Ask the dealer "tech" what the FICM voltage was at key-on, start, and operation? If he/she doesn't know, have the truck towed to either Gillet, RKL, Industrial, ANYBODY else but the dealer. If it truly is an injector issue, you'll want a shop that ALL they do is diesel. Keep us posted.
> 
> Don't stress about it, that's the worst. I've got reciepts for my Dodge totalling $30k by the time injectors, trans, steering, 2 TIPMs, ball joints, and a laundry list of small parts, it's not just Ford.


Thanks for the help CAExpat. I did just that. The FICM is reading 15.4 volts both with the key on and operations. Theres a guy that repairs FICMs in Cottowood heights that said he could help me out tonight actually. Crossing my fingers that this is it. Sounds much better than $2k on new injectors


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## hazmat (Apr 23, 2009)

Please do not spend that money at the dealer before that ficm is checked properly 400$ and your problems should be solved with a upgraded bulletproof ficm


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## hazmat (Apr 23, 2009)

CAExpat said:


> It's odd that half the injectors would drop without a code, or any other symptom, granted they can just one morning decide to be fubar. Dealerships are not the best when it comes to thorough diagnosis, i'd call around for a second (or third) opinion before handing over the money and getting the truck back with the same issues. Ask the dealer "tech" what the FICM voltage was at key-on, start, and operation? If he/she doesn't know, have the truck towed to either Gillet, RKL, Industrial, ANYBODY else but the dealer. If it truly is an injector issue, you'll want a shop that ALL they do is diesel. Keep us posted.
> 
> Don't stress about it, that's the worst. I've got reciepts for my Dodge totalling $30k by the time injectors, trans, steering, 2 TIPMs, ball joints, and a laundry list of small parts, it's not just Ford.


That sounds like my Cummins I owned for only 100k miles .transmission junk front end junk interior junk ac vaccum system junk I was broke down way to often for buying a brand new truck


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## CAExpat (Oct 27, 2013)

> That sounds like my Cummins I owned for only 100k miles .transmission junk front end junk interior junk ac vaccum system junk I was broke down way to often for buying a brand new truck


My list was all before 150k miles. I'm at 147k and have a broken blend/recirc door and a crack in the overdrive housing that needs to be addressed this spring. They all have their issues, luckily mine have not been engine related (except the injectors, but again that was Dodge's fault).

I agree with you about the bullet proof FICM. There were a few long nights while my truck was in the shop that I researched the 6.0 like crazy, wanted to pick a sick one up and bullet proof it proper. Their parts are top notch, and they're only a 12 hour drive and $10k to do it all haha


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## hazmat (Apr 23, 2009)

I know first hand a lot of shops have made a boatload of cash off of oversaling the 6.0 problems a 2k delete upgraded ficm run a coolant filter run Rev x to keep your injectors clean and these motors are bulletproof


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## 3arabians (Dec 9, 2014)

You could do what I did and just bulletproof that whole SOB. Ya, it cost me close to 12k but my 6.0 runs like a champ now. 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk


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## DevilDog09 (Oct 4, 2016)

So new FICM in, and still the same issues. White smoke does dissapear when the truck warms up however, but still rough idle and jerking and bucking when in drive. I am taking the truck into Gillette today for another opinion. Ill keep you all posted. Heres my problem now. Progressive is refusing to cover the costs of the mechanical issues. This is where I need some help. If in the end it just happened to be bad timing on my behalf, I will swallow that pill...and bill, but until then, I will keep fighting for any and all possibilities of this accident caused this problem. So here is my current chain of ideas. The truck sat in the auto bodies shop from December 19 to January 5th. Tempts were pretty darn cold. This killed my batteries. The auto body shopped had to jump my batteries, and still the vehicle would not retain a charge. Low batteries caused the FICM not to operate correctly which in turn caused the injectors to fail, which leaves me to where I am now. Does this hold up or have any probability of being possible? Low/dead battery = FICM to malfunction = injectors to fail? Give it to me blunt, I am a jarhead, I got thick skin


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## CAExpat (Oct 27, 2013)

I'm assuming Progressive is the other parties insurance company? Your only chance at coverage is if their adjuster agreed that the mechanical failure of your truck was directly related to the accident of which they're covering damages for. They most likely will not cover it because of what is essentially crap luck. 

There's no way that I can see the collision causing injector failure, unless Gillette can state otherwise and you can provide that to progressive. Even then it's at their discretion, and surprisingly insurance companies don't like to pay out, especially to the other party. If your claim is still open perhaps there's a chance, I could also draw a buffalo tag this year too...


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## hazmat (Apr 23, 2009)

Have you replaced the icp sensor they tend to make those 6.0 buck like a bronco when they are bad. Especially when in drive


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## hazmat (Apr 23, 2009)

If you you tube 6.0 icp sensor it shows you an easy way to test it yourself


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## bowgy (Oct 10, 2007)

When my FICM went bad the first time I repaired it myself, the second time it went bad it was too far gone and I just replaced it. 

It wasn't one of Fords better ideas to put an electronic module at the back of the engine on top of the manifold. Gets hot, cools, gets hot, cools over and over. The solder joints on the capacitors is what goes bad quite often that is what causes it to start and run and then quit, then you can restart it again when it sits a while. At least this is what happened to mine. The first time I just soldered all the cold looking joints and it lasted about 2 years the second time I took it apart the capacitors had slid out of place and I couldn't get it to work by soldering them back into place, probably ruined some but by then the price of the module had dropped enough that I just replaced it. Still running fine and that was a few years ago.


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## Kevin D (Sep 15, 2007)

DevilDog09 said:


> .... Heres my problem now. Progressive is refusing to cover the costs of the mechanical issues. This is where I need some help. If in the end it just happened to be bad timing on my behalf, I will swallow that pill...and bill, but until then, I will keep fighting for any and all possibilities of this accident caused this problem. So here is my current chain of ideas. The truck sat in the auto bodies shop from December 19 to January 5th. Tempts were pretty darn cold. This killed my batteries. The auto body shopped had to jump my batteries, and still the vehicle would not retain a charge. Low batteries caused the FICM not to operate correctly which in turn caused the injectors to fail, which leaves me to where I am now. Does this hold up or have any probability of being possible? Low/dead battery = FICM to malfunction = injectors to fail? Give it to me blunt, I am a jarhead, I got thick skin


Without clear visual evidence of damage to the effected parts, say a cracked or damaged housing caused by the accident, the insurance company won't pay.

Using your argument above that cold temperatures killed the battery leading to the other problems, the insurance company will counter by saying that a competent auto technician would of or should of known to disconnect the negative terminal of the vehicle if it was scheduled to sit idle for an extended period of time in cooler temperatures. Therefore, your beef should be with the auto body shop, not them.

Bottom line, break out your wallet. 

**Disclaimer**

I am not an attorney, though I sometimes pretend to be one on internet forums


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## DevilDog09 (Oct 4, 2016)

hazmat said:


> Have you replaced the icp sensor they tend to make those 6.0 buck like a bronco when they are bad. Especially when in drive


I haven't replaced that yet. Another option for me to go over. I will look into that. Thank you Hazmat


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## DevilDog09 (Oct 4, 2016)

So here is an update. Still having the same problems. I gave her an oil change with Rotella T6, gave a treatment of fuel injector cleaner, and changed both fuel and oil filters. You all may eventually get sick of my out of left field hypotheses, but here is another one. Being that I was in a front end collision and hit the other vehicle going 20-30 mph, could it be possible that it jarred a battery enough to cause a cell in the battery to short out? The battery itself didnt collide with anything, but could the battery have been shaken enough to cause internal damage to the battery? Bad battery = bad ficm = bad injectors....all collision related


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

Stick a $6 harbor freight volt meter on the battery if you think there is a bad cell. Or just stop off at autozone and have them test it for free.


-DallanC


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## CAExpat (Oct 27, 2013)

I thought you replaced the batteries? So you put a new FICM in with batteries that may be bad, possibly taking out another FICM? What voltage did they load test at? Sufficient voltage is critical for operation, you need something like 46 volts for proper FICM function and your old batteries were giving you 15 which may have caused injector issues. Start with the original issue which is the body shop killed your batteries and in turn may have done a lot more. 

Put in NEW batteries (I know, $300) and ensure all your grounds and connections are clean and secure. With new batteries test the voltage at the FICM, the procedure will be in your FSM (assuming you have one) or I'm sure you can google it. Then make your way to injectors. I'm surprised there hasn't been any codes set through all of the rough running. Might be time to invest in SCT if you plan on keeping the truck.


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## hazmat (Apr 23, 2009)

Yes don't put a new ficm in with the same old batteries if they are bad.


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## DevilDog09 (Oct 4, 2016)

Thank you everyone who took the time to help school me up on my 6.0. I really do appreciate it. Just to put you all at ease, no i did not put in a new ficm with bad batteries. I put in two brand new batteries first, then the new ficm. Rest easy. So after proving Progressive wrong at every turn, they just decided to say no to my every fact and started ignoring my calls. I had the makers of Deka, Max Start, and intimidator batteries all email me and agree with me that a jolt or sudden jerk from a vehicle accident, even without physical damage to the battery, can cause the battery to short out and loose power. Progressive decided that their experts knew more about batteries however. So I called up my insurance (GEICO), had an adjuster come out and start a report. Took my truck to G&R Diesel in Draper. The guys in there are awesome, and professional to say the least. Didn't take but two minutes to describe the accident, what happened to the truck etc, for the tech in there to connect the dots and confirm it all for me. End story, GEICO met with G&R Diesel, got the approval and the truck is getting fixed as I type this. so now GEICO will go after Progressive for $$$ and my deductible. That works for me. Lessons learned; always use you own insurance, Progressive is hot garbage, G&R Diesel just got a customer for life, You guys on here are freakin awesome, and its time to go find some perch out at Starvation with the truck this weekend. I really appreciate you alls help!


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## BG1 (Feb 15, 2013)

Way to persue and conquer! I love it when someone wins over an insurance company. Of coarse you could have eliminated all the troubles by purchasing GM,but that's another issue.


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## CAExpat (Oct 27, 2013)

> Of coarse you could have eliminated all the troubles by purchasing GM


Right, because the LB7 and LMM were prodigious examples of greatness. Google duramax broken crank (among other things like glow plugs and injectors) and enjoy a good read.

They all have problems, and the little voice in the back of my head keeps saying nothing built after about 2003 is worth anything anymore. Glad you got it squared away DevilDog! I myself dabbled in the insurance world, still licensed actually, however it's very rare that a company like Geico would pursue a subrogation action a vehicle mechanical issue. That's great and definitely a good sign that there are still companies looking to do right!


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