# food plots



## hunter_orange13 (Oct 11, 2008)

just of odd curiosity, are they legal in utah? i don't have any land, but was curious. if so do any of you use them??? thanks!


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## Treehugnhuntr (Sep 7, 2007)

Yes.


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## Huge29 (Sep 17, 2007)

We have had this discussion before, Tree straightened us out, which is funny since he is not straight himself :mrgreen: j/k!

There are those who will quickly get on here to tell you how unethical they are based on bringing so many deer to a small area and therefore easy passage of diseases to other deer...


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## mack1950 (Sep 11, 2007)

been hunting them for years an years only we dont call em feed plots there alfalfa fields for us locals


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## Huge29 (Sep 17, 2007)

mack1950 said:


> been hunting them for years an years only we dont call em feed plots there alfalfa fields for us locals


Amen! I have planned my hunting around alfalfa fields for the last several years, no dice yet, but decent opportunities. The odd one is a field in the mountains just off of a hwy that has long had all of the alfalfa destroyed years ago by the elk. Yet, the deer still headed down there every night for years, not so much anymore, but worked great for many years like clockwork. If I had land I would plan something around that.


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## hunter_orange13 (Oct 11, 2008)

are they legal on public?


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## deadicatedweim (Dec 18, 2007)

hunter_orange13 said:


> just of odd curiosity, are they legal in utah? i don't have any land, but was curious. if so do any of you use them??? thanks!


Yep you can even bait your deer with a salt lick or apples. You just cant bait upland birds or waterfowl.


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## deadicatedweim (Dec 18, 2007)

hunter_orange13 said:


> just of odd curiosity, are they legal in utah? i don't have any land, but was curious. if so do any of you use them??? thanks!


Yep you can even bait your deer with a salt lick or apples. You just cant bait upland birds or waterfowl.


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## hunter_orange13 (Oct 11, 2008)

so its legal on public??? i wanna try a small one first, and the procolamation says nothing about it really!


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## Mountain Time (Sep 24, 2007)

Are you planning to plant something on National Forest or BLM land? If so, I would say No, you can't plant whatever you want on public ground. The fact that you even ask the question indicates that you know it is something that you would think they would restrict.


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## jdwilcock (Jun 13, 2009)

Is it legal to place your own salt lick on public land in Utah?


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## soules2007 (Oct 29, 2007)

Yeah every time i start a plot everyboby gets all bunched up, DEA gets a phone call, makes the news,ect,ect,ect! Oh sorry diffrent kind of plot.


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## fixed blade XC-3 (Sep 11, 2007)

Let me ask you this fellas. * What part of yes it's legal, are you having a hard time understanding?* :lol:

Tree's pretty much a wildlife biologist, he's also one of the top dogs for the forest service. :mrgreen:


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## bowguyonly (Dec 31, 2018)

Have any laws changed in the past decade regarding this thread?


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## sheepassassin (Mar 23, 2018)

bowguyonly said:


> Have any laws changed in the past decade regarding this thread?


A simple scan through the current rules and regulations on big game in the proclamation would give you that answer...


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## KineKilla (Jan 28, 2011)

-oOo-


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## Vanilla (Dec 11, 2009)

sheepassassin said:


> A simple scan through the current rules and regulations on big game in the proclamation would give you that answer...


Is every rule for hunting and BLM and National Forest regulations contained in the guidebook? (we haven't had proclamations in years...)


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## sheepassassin (Mar 23, 2018)

Vanilla said:


> Is every rule for hunting and BLM and National Forest regulations contained in the guidebook? (we haven't had proclamations in years...)


https://wildlife.utah.gov/utah-big-game-field-regulations.html

We have a guide book full of regulations every year. And yes, if it's illegal they are sure to include it in the book, and will specify if certain lands have further regulations


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## bowguyonly (Dec 31, 2018)

I see nothing regarding food plots nor spreading seed to encourage growth and forage of wild life. Furthermore the gentlemen mentioned above who worked for state agencies mentioned it being legal in a simple "yes" reply. 
considering this I imagine it to be okay and long as I'm not dumping a pile of corn or apples but rather spreading various seed allowing an area to grow and sustain wildlife.


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## Vanilla (Dec 11, 2009)

sheepassassin said:


> https://wildlife.utah.gov/utah-big-game-field-regulations.html
> 
> We have a guide book full of regulations every year.


Well, I at least got you to use the correct terminology. You're welcome. Wouldn't want your buddies to think you are dumb now, would we?


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## sheepassassin (Mar 23, 2018)

bowguyonly said:


> I see nothing regarding food plots nor spreading seed to encourage growth and forage of wild life. Furthermore the gentlemen mentioned above who worked for state agencies mentioned it being legal in a simple "yes" reply.
> considering this I imagine it to be okay and long as I'm not dumping a pile of corn or apples but rather spreading various seed allowing an area to grow and sustain wildlife.


Dump the biggest pile of corn or apples you want. As long as you aren't baiting waterfowl or turkeys it's completely legal


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## ridgetop (Sep 13, 2007)

You spread seed out in a national Forest and you may be facing a big fine.


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## Critter (Mar 20, 2010)

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^This here^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Mule deer don't like food plots like whitetails do, and as ridge said if you get caught doing it on National Forest land and you could be in trouble.


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## sheepassassin (Mar 23, 2018)

Funny how concerned the forest circus is with destruction of the public lands when they are single handedly the biggest culprits when it comes to destroying public lands


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## bowguyonly (Dec 31, 2018)

ridgetop said:


> You spread seed out in a national Forest and you may be facing a big fine.


can you guide me in a direction where people cannot encourage plant growth on a piece of land at 7500 feet?


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## bowguyonly (Dec 31, 2018)

ya know what. nevermind. I feel stupid even bringing this thread to life. I'll contact DWR and ask. I'll follow up


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## bowguyonly (Dec 31, 2018)

DWR says no, it is NOT illegal but to get with the Forest Service to make sure they don't have a problem. 
Guess what? 
The Forest Service has been furloughed due to a lack of government resources. I couldn't speak with anyone. However, the regulations on the website for Northern Utah are more concerned with noxious weeds, camping and campfires, mechanized vehicles and disturbing the natural vegation via wacking out man made trails for mechanized use. 

I will get in touch with them once our politicians on both sides of the aisle check in their ego.


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## taxidermist (Sep 11, 2007)

That's right! The "Tree Cops" aren't working. Now everyone can ride an unlicensed snowmobile all over and not worry about getting a ticket.


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## MadHunter (Nov 17, 2009)

Putting a food plot on BLM or Forrest Service land will probably land you a fine. It's a simple common sense thing; if it's not your land don't put a crop on it. Also, if you do end up putting a food plot on public land you cannot get angry if others hunt the plot.

Seeding Federal is a big deal. Those that haul horses up there are restricted to using certified weed free hay in order to avoid the spread of noxious weeds.


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## StillAboveGround (Aug 20, 2011)

I got the following from the Bowsite forum, but can't find original legal document:


"On National Forest land, it is illegal to introduce seeds, fertilizer, potting soils, chemicals or other substances, and the use of mechanized vehicles that disturb the land, wildlife or natural vegetation, such as tractors, tillers or lawnmowers, is prohibited. Violations are tried in federal court and carry a maximum fine of $5,000 or six months in jail or both. "


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## bowguyonly (Dec 31, 2018)

StillAboveGround said:


> I got the following from the Bowsite forum, but can't find original legal document:
> 
> "On National Forest land, it is illegal to introduce seeds, fertilizer, potting soils, chemicals or other substances, and the use of mechanized vehicles that disturb the land, wildlife or natural vegetation, such as tractors, tillers or lawnmowers, is prohibited. Violations are tried in federal court and carry a maximum fine of $5,000 or six months in jail or both. "


this is from 2005. I understand it. I think it is illegal concerning the Forest Service. Is what it is.


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## ridgetop (Sep 13, 2007)

I wonder if the NF guys go after the pot growers that get caught by the DEA, for spreading noxious weeds.


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## shaner (Nov 30, 2007)

Fyi.
Salt blocks and mineral lick blocks are considered 'other substances'.


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## johnnycake (Jul 19, 2011)

shaner said:


> Fyi.
> Salt blocks and mineral lick blocks are considered 'other substances'.


Care to back that up with a source?


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## MadHunter (Nov 17, 2009)

ridgetop said:


> I wonder if the NF guys go after the pot growers that get caught by the DEA, for spreading noxious weeds.


Those are not noxious weeds they are medicinal substances. :mrgreen:


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## caddis8 (Sep 10, 2007)

Interesting thoughts here. I spoke with a DWR guy a while ago about this sort of thing as I was looking at regulations and store assortments. There wasn't a lot of guidance from the guys at the DWR. It can get sticky with federal/state land and whomever you deal with and interpreting the law especially concerning seeds. If it's an annual, maybe. If it's a perennial (clover, alfalfa, chicory, etc.) that could be tough. There is a noxious weed reference guide that you could watch. If it isn't on that list, you may be ok. 

As far as "other substances." I would absolutely disagree there. 

If the use of corn, apples, and/or bait is legal in the state of Utah, then supplements such as salt and/or mineral usually are under the purview of baiting laws. Utah sells a lot of salt. One of the biggest producers of salt blocks is right down the road anyway. I wouldn't hesitate to put a salt lick out, and then pour something on it to attract critters to it.


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## shaner (Nov 30, 2007)

Only back up is in court the ruling would be by definition. Usually Merriam-Websters would be used and meant to be interpreted by a 'reasonable persons' understanding.
The reason substance is mentioned is because it is a catch-all.


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## sheepassassin (Mar 23, 2018)

shaner said:


> Fyi.
> Salt blocks and mineral lick blocks are considered 'other substances'.


So all the ranchers who run livestock on the FS and BLM lands are in violation, according to you? I highly doubt the FS would allow that to continue year after year if that was the case...


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## johnnycake (Jul 19, 2011)

shaner said:


> Only back up is in court the ruling would be by definition. Usually Merriam-Websters would be used and meant to be interpreted by a 'reasonable persons' understanding.
> The reason substance is mentioned is because it is a catch-all.


Unless you have some precedent to back that up, I'm not buying it as gospel in this case (or generally for that matter).

Courts and administrative agencies look to a lot of sources to define a vague term in a regulation or statute, and while that does from time to time include dictionary definitions, more often than not they look to understand the intent of the legislative/regulatory body that drafted the language by looking at prior drafts, minutes, materials, etc and then try to apply that purpose to the action/language at issue.

Applying it to the alleged NFS language from a post more than a decade ago on another hunting forum, I would wager the analysis of "other substances" would look at the likelihood of that salt block introducing an invasive species, creating an environmental contamination requiring remediation, and the native occurrence of that substance or substantially similar substances. My guess is that analysis would not find a problem with salt blocks, etc. as used by the general public on NFS lands.


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

I'm still wondering what grows at +7000ft elevation you could plant that would attract Mule Deer. They don't seem to eat the same stuff as their cousin whitetails.


-DallanC


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## mycoltbug (Jan 21, 2013)

What if you planted apple seeds that high and never attempted to do anything with it? Might get a few apple trees up there. Seem like deer and elk love them.


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## shaner (Nov 30, 2007)

You all might be right, I dunno.
I only bring it up because the language surprised me also.
I brought it up as a public service to you all to help keep you out of trouble.
It may or may not be an issue but I know one thing for sure, I will be more careful transporting my blocks and will be removing the original packaging and wrapping them in an old t shirt.
I work for a government agency and they used that verbage for a reason......


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## caddis8 (Sep 10, 2007)

DallanC said:


> I'm still wondering what grows at +7000ft elevation you could plant that would attract Mule Deer. They don't seem to eat the same stuff as their cousin whitetails.
> 
> -DallanC


Dallan, You may be able to plant some clovers, as those are perennial and have a high protein content. You could look at some brassicas. One that I would look at would be chicory. It is in the dandelion family and is very hearty. Get a big rooty one, not one that has a lot of fingers. I've seen deer that pawed the ground to expose the root after they'd eaten the folliage down and were munching hard on it. alfalfa is always a good option.

One crop that is a little expensive, but pretty entertaining is called fodder beets. They're more well known in Europe and France has been using them quite a bit. They've got a much bigger top than sugar beets, have slightly less sugar, and grow about 1/3 out of the ground. But they grow very large pretty quickly. They do need some water, but that's a very good crop. If you mix it with some brassica and chicory, it could be a very robust crop. Beets won't be as frost hearty, but they're pretty hardy plants.

I was working on a cool season mix that had a mix of chicory, birdsfoot trefoil, some orchard grass, and a couple other plants in there. It looked very good and we had good forage on the test plots. We didn't get to finish that before the buyout and direction/leadership plans. I know I can still get some though from a good friend of mine.

I've got some cool test records. One game outfit for elk in Utah asked me to put together a seed/food plot plan for them. They had access to water, but I got put on parole before we could implement the plan. I've got some great contacts that could give some insight on items that could do well at that altitude.


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## Brookie (Oct 26, 2008)

The FS does make sheep/cattle herders remove their salt. The hay has to be certified. On your own land I don't think it is a problem, NF maybe


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