# Turkey Blues



## Mrad (Mar 25, 2011)

Anyone else thinking about NOT buying a turkey tag this year because in general the last 2 years of turkey hunting in Utah have stunk?

I know several guys (including myself) that might bag it this year in Utah. We might look into heading elsewhere though.


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## shaun larsen (Aug 5, 2011)

what stunk about the hunting? i thought the hunting was actually pretty good after the first few days when everyone gave up! i like the opportunity of being able to go hunting if i want, even tho my hunt wasnt a 100% done deal.


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## BPturkeys (Sep 13, 2007)

Mrad said:


> Anyone else thinking about NOT buying a turkey tag this year because in general the last 2 years of turkey hunting in Utah have stunk?
> 
> I know several guys (including myself) that might bag it this year in Utah. We might look into heading elsewhere though.


Absolutely correct. I advise most hunters head off to other states to do their turkey hunting. Wyo, NE, MT, N. & S. Dakota, he**, just about any place is better than Utah. Nothin worse than getting outsmarted by a bunch of turkeys and I'am a'tellin ya Utah birds are the smartest around.


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## Mrad (Mar 25, 2011)

It's not a matter of being outsmarted it's a matter of most of the places I like to hunt are pretty much turkeyless compared to a few years ago. I've killed several turkeys in Utah and been on several other successful hunts. There just aren't as many birds in most places. Granted there's a few spots doing great, but most of them are private.
Maybe with the mild winter they'll start to make a comeback.


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## gooseblaster (Sep 2, 2009)

2009- tag filled--- old man filled his tag too
2010- tag filled----old man filled his tag too 
2011- tag filled----old man didn't hunt with me
2012- tag will probably be filled

So yes the general turkey kind of stinks. These smart birds aren't that fun to hunt :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:


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## TEX-O-BOB (Sep 12, 2007)

Like the elk in this state, the turkeys are getting smarter and harder to kill. They're still there, you just gotta hunt now. Simply "not seeing as many" isn't any excuse. I hunt one of the most turkey rich states in the nation and sometimes we just dont see em either. Does that mean they all got killed? No. They're there.


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## goofy elk (Dec 16, 2007)

Mrad is right, Lots of public land that used to be good turkey hunting is 
now turkeyless.....And in many cases, the private lands now have more
birds.

I've been watching close to 400 birds over the winter, many of them 
right on the forest service line. Guaranteed, by the time the general
hunt opens, AT LEAST 95% of those birds will be on private lands.....


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## TEX-O-BOB (Sep 12, 2007)

Yep, and we've killed off all the elk too huh Goofy. :roll:


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## JuddCT (Sep 7, 2007)

If you can't see them, they are not there.


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## goofy elk (Dec 16, 2007)

TEX-O-BOB said:


> Yep, and we've killed off all the elk too huh Goofy. :roll:


There's some units there dam there sure working on it...

I'm one of the few that have been on the Wasatch LE entry elk 
hunt EVERY YEAR since 1995.....BIG CHANGES the last 3 years..

Thats right TEX ....I'm not blind....pretty easy to see whats happening.

3,220 cow permits on the Wasatch last fall was a freak'in joke!!!!!


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## JuddCT (Sep 7, 2007)

I'm not finding it hard to find birds on PUBLIC land, there are quite a few. Get away from the opener/weekends and this should increase your chances.



goofy elk said:


> [quote="TEX-O-BOB":f6uwmmqt]Yep, and we've killed off all the elk too huh Goofy. :roll:


There's some units there dam there sure working on it...

I'm one of the few that have been on the Wasatch LE entry elk 
hunt EVERY YEAR since 1995.....BIG CHANGES the last 3 years..

Thats right TEX ....I'm not blind....pretty easy to see whats happening.

3,220 cow permits on the Wasatch last fall was a freak'in joke!!!!![/quote:f6uwmmqt]

Wasn't the entire unit (all three sub units) over objective which is why more antlerless tags were made available?

If my numbers are correct, objective/2010 Winter Population:

*Wasatch Mtns - West: .............2600/3500* - At or Over objective since 2004
*Wasatch Mtns - Currant Creek: ..1200/2250* - At or Over objective since 2005
*Wasatch Mtns - Avintaquin: .......1250/1950* - At or Over objective since 2006
*TOTAL : ..................................5,050/7,700*


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## Mrad (Mar 25, 2011)

What part of the state are you guys finding lots of birds on public?
We usually hunt in the boulder dutton pauns area, and it sucks compared to a few years ago. I know of a few central and northern areas, but most the birds are on private. Hunted oak creek a bunch and it's gone down hill too.

There are hard birds and easy birds to kill in every part of the country. Just depends on how much pressure they get. The difference is that generally turkey populations are a lot higher in other states so a guy has multiple opportunities to harvest.

Well, I hope the state sells lots of turkey tags to make up for the deer tags....


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## goofy elk (Dec 16, 2007)

My wife had the Southern LE turkey tag last spring,
Spent a week on Oak creek,, What once was one of the premium turkey permits
is now a very disapointing unit for sure.....

AND ya Judd, it was over ojective for a few years, Now well see how well hunters
like it when it's under objective........


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## TEX-O-BOB (Sep 12, 2007)

goofy elk said:


> [quote="TEX-O-BOB":y4z8x45v]Yep, and we've killed off all the elk too huh Goofy. :roll:


There's some units there dam there sure working on it...

I'm one of the few that have been on the Wasatch LE entry elk 
hunt EVERY YEAR since 1995.....BIG CHANGES the last 3 years..

Thats right TEX ....I'm not blind....pretty easy to see whats happening.

3,220 cow permits on the Wasatch last fall was a freak'in joke!!!!![/quote:y4z8x45v]

Ya know what Goofy, I've been up there too. Since I was 16. I'm 47 now... and that place is an elk petting zoo. Has been for eighteen years. They NEED to slaughter more elk up there. Ever notice how many deer ya DONT see any more? The elk have eaten and pushed them out of house and home! This state is WAY to stingy with their elk permits. In every unit!

But this thread is about turkeys. Turkeys are like Rats, once they take hold, you cant get rid of em. Ask any farmer. Think an area is under objective, just wait a couple years... The folks of this fine state have been spoiled with minimal tags and tons of turkeys for far too long. The whole LE turkey hunt thing is a complete sham. People are duped into thinking they get some kind of special hunt with an LE tag. All they get is sequestered into a specific area with 200 other people with an entitlement complex all running after the same bunch of turkeys three weekends in a row like a bunch of screaming idiots. The birds get harassed over and over, they get smart, and they get scarce. Then May 1st roles around and the whole debacle starts over again. If we sold tags to everyone that wants to hunt, opened the season on April 15th and kept it open till June 1st you would have a much higher quality rate and better success across the board. But NOOOOO, The only way for SFW to get their greedy money grubbing hands on permits is to turn everything into an LE hunt. SFW, against recommendations from the NWTF, WB, and Biologists is THE reason they haven't gone to a total state wide OTC permit for turkeys. But, like some of my best friends, you've drank the SFW coolaid long ago and think they can do no wrong.


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

goofy elk said:


> Mrad is right, Lots of public land that used to be good turkey hunting is
> now turkeyless.....And in many cases, the private lands now have more
> birds.
> 
> ...


But, the turkeys are STILL around! You and Mrad are implying the turkey populations are down, not moved! And, if they would open the hunt to a two month long OVER THE COUNTER hunt, the hordes wouldn't drop in on the public all at once, reducing the number of turkeys that seek refuge in areas that are harder to access. Strangely, this sounds an awful lot like HUNTING! Go figure.... :shock:


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

goofy elk said:


> My wife had the Southern LE turkey tag last spring,
> Spent a week on Oak creek,, What once was one of the premium turkey permits
> is now a very disapointing unit for sure.....


This is a perfect example of what is jacked up with hunting in Utah today. Not that the hunting is "very disappointing", but that so-called hunters think they are entitled to "premium turkey permits"! 


goofy elk said:


> AND ya Judd, it was over ojective for a few years, Now well see how well hunters like it when it's under objective........


Except it is NOT under objective! It is still OVER objective. I admit to not spending as much time on the Wasatch as much as you have, but when I am there I have very little/no problem locating elk, quality bulls, and very few/no hunters. Of course, I am not near the 'expert' you are.......

And don't bother sending me another PM demanding I refrain from responding to your posts. Either say what you have to say out in the open, stop acting like a jilted teenage girl, or stop posting nonsense!


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## Mrad (Mar 25, 2011)

o-|| Since this turned into an elk post...what do you guys think success rates were like this year on the wasatch cow hunts and can you imagine how many tags will be issued this year due to the lack of 2011 harvest...

I'd hate to be a turkey or a cow in the central region in 2012 :shock:


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

But elsewhere you would like to be a turkey.......?


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## JuddCT (Sep 7, 2007)

Mrad said:


> What part of the state are you guys finding lots of birds on public?
> We usually hunt in the boulder dutton pauns area, and it sucks compared to a few years ago. I know of a few central and northern areas, but most the birds are on private. Hunted oak creek a bunch and it's gone down hill too.
> 
> There are hard birds and easy birds to kill in every part of the country. Just depends on how much pressure they get. The difference is that generally turkey populations are a lot higher in other states so a guy has multiple opportunities to harvest.
> ...


I've hunted the central unit mostly and I see birds all over. Last year I was doing a DH project opening morning of the GS hunt and just driving up the main canyon road I saw three different groups of at least 20 birds each cross the road in front of me. But they are like chukars, you better get to know me real well to find exact spots.


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## JuddCT (Sep 7, 2007)

goofy elk said:


> AND ya Judd, it was over ojective for a few years, Now well see how well hunters
> like it when it's under objective........


Oh, it would suck to have to work a little harder to find some elk. C'mon, it is hunting. If you want a canned 100% hunt go spend the money to do so.


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## Mrad (Mar 25, 2011)

Lol pro that was actually funny.

Well good luck to all you thunder chicken hunters in the know. Wish I was more optimistic about it this year. If I can get some access to some decent ground maybe I'll buy a tag. If not, I think I'll pass this year and go fishing. Got a sweet spot in Montana and Kansas but gas prices don't give me the warm fuzzies.

Or SHED Hunting.


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## guner (Sep 25, 2007)

[attachment=1:7wx7ljdg]Misc, Ice Fishing 004.JPG[/attachment:7wx7ljdg]

[attachment=0:7wx7ljdg]Misc, Ice Fishing 005.JPG[/attachment:7wx7ljdg]

Saw these in Central....... they are along the "Public" :shock: side of the fence, the other side is a farmers field. there is a million acres of public on the one side of the fence and I bet at least SOME toms hold up there


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## TEX-O-BOB (Sep 12, 2007)

> Or SHED Hunting.


Now yer talkin!!! I'll bet Goofy will even go with you. *\-\*


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## hunter_orange13 (Oct 11, 2008)

Goofy:
If the turkeys are going from public private, have you ever thought about getting permission to hunt the private property? You act like it's the end of the world when a bird crosses the fence line. Don't worry, most landowners are going to bite ya!


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## xxxxxxBirdDogger (Mar 7, 2008)

I think the turkey population suffered like everything else last year during the long, hard winter. It's not the Toms laying the eggs so quit acting like hunters are destroying the population. Last time I checked we don't have a hen hunt. :roll:


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## Clarq (Jul 21, 2011)

BirdDogger said:


> I think the turkey population suffered like everything else last year during the long, hard winter. It's not the Toms laying the eggs so quit acting like hunters are destroying the population. Last time I checked we don't have a hen hunt. :roll:


I'd say that's a fairly good guess. I'd also say that hunting does play a role in where the birds go, but not the population. My turkey spot was overhunted last year, and most of the birds were pushed off the property by mid May. We've been patterning them this year, and they're hanging out in different places than usual as well (probably due to the weather). Lots of factors affect where they are, and we simply don't know them all.


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## shaun larsen (Aug 5, 2011)

Mrad said:


> o-|| Since this turned into an elk post...what do you guys think success rates were like this year on the wasatch cow hunts and can you imagine how many tags will be issued this year due to the lack of 2011 harvest...
> 
> I'd hate to be a turkey or a cow in the central region in 2012 :shock:


i know of atleast one cow that died on the wasatch this winter....  and im pretty sure i know of atleast one turkey thats gonna eat the floor this spring also... :O•-:


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## Last Man Standing (Dec 7, 2011)

I did general season turkey in the central region last year. It sucked! BUT, It was totally my fault for not finding a better spot far in advance, not asking private property owner's permission to hunt their land, and picking a place where a bunch of other goons decided to hunt. I actually saw a good bunch of hens and jakes, but no toms. Despite all that, I still had a ton of fun. IMO that's what hunting is, sometimes you come home empty handed and you just gotta take it for whats it worth. I hate to sound cliche here, but they don't call it killin for a reason...


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## 2full (Apr 8, 2010)

I'm watching three flocks of birds for the last month, and Have not even been to the honey hole yet. I "drew the early hunt" this year and am looking forward to it. Have taken good Toms the last 3 years, got my best one ever last year. This year I get it with my bow or go without......I just enjoy being out and about and if I am successful, then great. Have done much better and bigger since I took my hunting that way. Guess I'm just getting old.


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## Goshawk (Sep 7, 2007)

Turkey hunting sucks because the wolves ate 'em all :O•-:


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## 2full (Apr 8, 2010)

Are wolves good to eat ??????
I know they eat well !!!
o-||


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## Mrad (Mar 25, 2011)

Clock is ticking for the early guys. Good luck. Looking forward to seeing some pics. 

Unfortunately I'm still pretty pessimistic and disappointed in the general shape of utah's turkeys, but I know a few will get shot-especially by guys with access to private. I've seen a few birds this spring but not many.

But I can hear the argument now. "Turkey hunting was tough this year because the birds were spread out more than usual." We can count on hearing this.

Seriously though, good luck to those of you headed out in a few weeks. It'll be fun either way.


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## Last Man Standing (Dec 7, 2011)

Mrad said:


> Seriously though, good luck to those of you headed out in a few weeks. It'll be fun either way.


I wish more people had this attitude. It's called hunting instead of killin for a reason. sometimes you fail. When I hear people sit and complain about utah hunting, it sorta reminds me of this youtube clip...




think about it...


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## Moose Hollow (Apr 26, 2008)

TEX-O-BOB said:


> Like the elk in this state, the turkeys are getting smarter and harder to kill. They're still there, you just gotta hunt now. Simply "not seeing as many" isn't any excuse. I hunt one of the most turkey rich states in the nation and sometimes we just dont see em either. Does that mean they all got killed? No. They're there.


+1


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## Finnegan (Sep 7, 2007)

Let a beginner ask a question, here. I've hunted the general for the past 3 years and enjoyed getting out, but never got a shot and I didn't ever see a bird last year. Strange, since I always run into turkeys during the big game hunts and they don't seem to be very illusive.

Well, I drew my first LE tag this year and now I'm finding turkeys with no effort at all. What's got me scratching my head is how easy they are to call in. I even had a tom come in to me yesterday as I was sitting in my truck with the engine running...15 yards away. I was just trying to make him gobble - didn't expect him to come strutting in to me.

And somebody should design a locator call that imitates a truck door shutting...works like a charm.

One man's experience on a given day doesn't mean much, but here's my question: Is the intent of the LE turkey season to make it easy for dummies like me to get a bird? Or am I just seeing the difference that a month makes in turkey behavior?


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## Packout (Nov 20, 2007)

My answer to both questions is yes. They are much more vocal and easy to call in April, which is why it is easier to kill them. It also means we don't let everyone try to kill them until they are educated and less responsive. That said, I am no expert in other states, but I have helped kill a couple dozen on general and ltd hunts here in Utah.


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## ram2h2o (Sep 11, 2007)

As an old time turkey hunter from Mississippi who has hunted turkeys for over 45 years, you don't call in Gobblers unless you are planning to take him. Tom's remember and become call shy or call smart real quick.


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## TEX-O-BOB (Sep 12, 2007)

Oh Finn my precious little turkey newby, You'll be changing your tune about "easy to call in" after the first day of your "LE for dummies" hunt. Turkeys learn really fast when to shut their pie holes and walk the other way when they hear a Premos Box Call. If your out calling to them now just to "make em gobble" your just giving them a head start on their education. It's akin to heading out a week before your LE elk hunt to practice calling in bulls. All you're doing is muffing it up for yourself and everyone else. LE was set up so that a few lucky hunters could go out and then provide the powers that be with bragging rights to a high success rate in an controlled bubble. Hunting has never been about 100% kill success on trophy animals. But the popular control group in this state would like you to believe it is.


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## bwhntr (Sep 12, 2007)

Ummm...what I think Tex is trying to say is, don't call in turkey's you don't intend to kill...rookie mistake.


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## Mojo1 (Sep 8, 2007)

Aww, haven't you guys learned yet?? in Elk season the elk morph into turkeys, during turkey season the turkeys morph into elk, thats why you can't find any...... :shock: :lol:


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## ram2h2o (Sep 11, 2007)

Ditto to what Tex-O-Bob said. After they've been called too by everyone under the sun, they get call shy and become hard to hunt much less hard to get them to gobble.


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## BPturkeys (Sep 13, 2007)

Hell, I love to hear them old Toms gobble. Lots of times I'll give'em a yelp or two just to hear the music. I could really care less if they get a little "call shy" as you boys like to say. If you're not men enough to hunt turkeys that have had a little human contact, sale your **** gun, burn your camo and take up golf. Nobody makes a sound there.


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## bwhntr (Sep 12, 2007)

BPturkeys said:


> Hell, I love to hear them old Toms gobble. Lots of times I'll give'em a yelp or two just to hear the music. I could really care less if they get a little "call shy" as you boys like to say. If you're not men enough to hunt turkeys that have had a little human contact, sale your **** gun, burn your camo and take up golf. Nobody makes a sound there.


Awesome... :mrgreen:


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## ram2h2o (Sep 11, 2007)

I'm not complaining, just makes it easier for me to hunt them call shy Gobblers. I love to hunt smart old Gobblers. Just giving the newbies some advice for first time hunters. I may have to sit for hours and do some soft calling, but it pays off.


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## 2full (Apr 8, 2010)

I don't use the calls to bring 'em in........
I use 'em to locate then go in after 'em.
When you get close, go to a soft hen call.
They gobble to bring the hens to them as much as anything.
It's not always the hen bringing the Tom to them. If the Tom already has hens, you won't 
get him away from them. But, a hot hen will go to him.
Have had alot of fun, and have killed some good Tom's that way.


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## ARROWHNTR (Dec 11, 2008)

I have hunted turkeys in Utah for a long time now, and in my opinion there are just as many if not more birds since the start of the general turkey season than there was prior to that. The one thing that i have noticed is the obvious areas, along the cottonwood river bottoms, that used to hold lots of turkeys only have a few now and other less likely areas that never used to have many now hold tons. The turkeys are there we dont kill the hens in utah, over the counter tags may have put more pressure on the birds and made them more call shy but it hasnt hurt there numbers.

I went out this weekend and saw over 100 birds probobly 20+ toms and tons of jakes and only 4 of them were on private property.


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## Bears Butt (Sep 12, 2007)

I call B.S. Where did you see that many birds?


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## BPturkeys (Sep 13, 2007)

Bears Butt said:


> I call B.S. Where did you see that many birds?


you know that road right between Moroni and Ephraim, well...


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## ARROWHNTR (Dec 11, 2008)

I didnt see any white ones  all the birds i saw where Rio's, Mirriams and Crosses! That should narrow it down to the southern half of the state for ya


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