# Scouting tips



## KineKilla (Jan 28, 2011)

Those of you that scout for game during the summer months...

Are you in your glassing spot before dawn and in the early hours of the morning as well as well before dark/early evening? 

Those are the best times (I’ve found) to be in the field hunting but are they also the best times to be scouting? Is mid day glassing during these warmer months a waste of time and effort?

I’ve done some scouting and I’ve placed some cameras in the past but have only had limited success. My cameras catch all sorts of animals but they scout 24/7.

Just trying to increase my scouting effectiveness and always enjoy seeing animals on the mountain. Any tips or help would be greatly appreciated.


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## 3arabians (Dec 9, 2014)

Short answer - Yes, same concept as the hunt only maybe even more so during the summer because animals move even less during midday because of high temps. I rarely have caught deer or elk on my cameras midday during the summer. Most are at night


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## AF CYN (Mar 19, 2009)

I agree with 3arabians. There are a couple of exceptions--mid day scouting when you're just driving or hiking to get the lay of the land, mid day scouting in areas with tons of bucks (Book Cliffs, Henries), mid day scouting in alpine areas where the deer don't have a lot of places to hide so every patch of shade is a likely spot to hold an animal.


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## Ecpk91 (Jun 13, 2018)

I bow hunt, I place 6-7 cameras during the summer, I have killed a buck and elk for the past 5 years. What I have found successful is I get out and hike through an area that seems good to me, I hike around checking for sign, and water. When I find water I follow it to what looks like an access point. I then try and create a more conducive location for the animals. I also place a trophy rock and buck jam which I have found draws them to the area and keeps them coming back because now I provided a good mineral source close to a water source. My cameras indicate the time of day animals come in so I know what time to be in my tree stand and when I can normally expect animals to come in. The camera also shows the common direction the animals approach from which helps me place my stand in the most strategic place. I don't spot and stalk anymore nor glass for a drive or anything. Once I find a spot I regularly go back keeping the water as pooled as possible for a pond, I also tend the area with fresh trophy rocks and buck jam. I find 3-4 consistent good areas so if one stand doesn't produce I have other options.


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

For me... scouting is worthless. The deer transition right about the time my hunts start, so its more useful to know how they transition, where to find them in general during that time.

What kind of buck is there opening day, well thats the luck of the draw. I dont have any interest in chasing a specific buck. 

Hunting for me lately, its more about fun than inches... and its usually always alot of fun.


-DallanC


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## RoosterKiller (May 27, 2011)

Ecpk91 said:


> I bow hunt, I place 6-7 cameras during the summer, I have killed a buck and elk for the past 5 years. What I have found successful is I get out and hike through an area that seems good to me, I hike around checking for sign, and water. When I find water I follow it to what looks like an access point. I then try and create a more conducive location for the animals. I also place a trophy rock and buck jam which I have found draws them to the area and keeps them coming back because now I provided a good mineral source close to a water source. My cameras indicate the time of day animals come in so I know what time to be in my tree stand and when I can normally expect animals to come in. The camera also shows the common direction the animals approach from which helps me place my stand in the most strategic place. I don't spot and stalk anymore nor glass for a drive or anything. Once I find a spot I regularly go back keeping the water as pooled as possible for a pond, I also tend the area with fresh trophy rocks and buck jam. I find 3-4 consistent good areas so if one stand doesn't produce I have other options.


This is excellent info. I do similar. very little glassing ,more of looking for fresh sign and cameras to track routines.


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## ridgetop (Sep 13, 2007)

To answer the O.P.
There's been many days where I leave the house before 3:00am and return home after midnight.
I find it better to just do an overnighter, either hiking in from the trailhead a couple hours before light or packing in and doing a coyote type backpack type campout. 
I glass the first few hours of the morning and then around midday, I'll check the trail cams, then glass again in the evening.


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## olibooger (Feb 13, 2019)

Generally speaking about when do deer bed and get back up? Does it depend on temperature of day?


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## ridgetop (Sep 13, 2007)

olibooger said:


> Generally speaking about when do deer bed and get back up? Does it depend on temperature of day?


Even in July, I've seen them feed in the shade until 9-10 am and if it's a rainy summer day, they will get up and feed all throughout the day.


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

olibooger said:


> Generally speaking about when do deer bed and get back up? Does it depend on temperature of day?


What time of year. Biiiigggg difference in August heat and Nov cold.

-DallanC


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## KineKilla (Jan 28, 2011)

Thanks for all the replies.

I’m looking in a new to me area this year and will plan to be there earlier. I haven’t yet found water in the area but once I do I’ll watch it closely.

Fortunately I’ll have all the seasons to hunt deer and elk this year so I hope I can find something worth chasing.


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## ridgetop (Sep 13, 2007)

KineKilla said:


> Thanks for all the replies.
> 
> I'm looking in a new to me area this year and will plan to be there earlier. I haven't yet found water in the area but once I do I'll watch it closely.
> 
> Fortunately I'll have all the seasons to hunt deer and elk this year so I hope I can find something worth chasing.


Be patient, sometimes it takes 2 or 3 years to figure an area out.


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## olibooger (Feb 13, 2019)

2 or 3 YEARS? man nobody has time for that. What about the guys that go across the country to hunt? Are they basically s.o.l.? 

I'm a common sense kind of guy and pick up on things extremely quick, obsessively quick actually. 2 or 3 years? Is that geared towards your average Joe schmuck hunter or less than average even? 

I thank God for the talents I've been blessed with. I cant even imagine living life 2 or 3 years to figure things out. Goodness gracious.


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## Critter (Mar 20, 2010)

It does take years to really figure out a area. Those that come cross country will stay in one area if it is productive and they will get to know it just as good as the locals. 

I have hunted the Book Cliffs for years and am still learning different things about that unit

Sometimes you luck into a spot and have no problems. I did that bow hunting years ago and it was a spot that the deer and elk just happened to move through. I'll never let the location of that spot out.


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## ridgetop (Sep 13, 2007)

olibooger said:


> 2 or 3 YEARS? man nobody has time for that. What about the guys that go across the country to hunt? Are they basically s.o.l.?
> 
> I'm a common sense kind of guy and pick up on things extremely quick, obsessively quick actually. 2 or 3 years? Is that geared towards your average Joe schmuck hunter or less than average even?
> 
> I thank God for the talents I've been blessed with. I cant even imagine living life 2 or 3 years to figure things out. Goodness gracious.


I'm not quite sure what to think about your comment. Sarcasm can be a hard thing to read in print. Well, good luck with your instant success.


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## 30-06-hunter (Sep 22, 2013)

I have come to the conclusion that hunting and fishing are a lot like the eating habits of a toddler, what works today is bound to change tomorrow, and if you can figure out what is causing them to change you can sometimes get in front of it and manipulate the change to your benefit.


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## Lone_Hunter (Oct 25, 2017)

It seems to take a few years to figure out how the deer/elk behave in a given area. Where do they run to when the pressure starts? What avenues of approach do they use? Stuff like that. You can't learn that studying maps. You just have to see them do it first hand for a few seasons.


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## KineKilla (Jan 28, 2011)

Left home at 3:30am on Friday and found myself on a ridge doing some glassing at sunrise. Spent a good part of the day glassing and hiking around the area and didn't see a single deer, elk or otherwise (except for the one doe standing by my truck).

I also found myself in a new to me area that was apparently part of one of the big wild fires last summer. This area is so green and appears to be recovering well but again, no luck finding any animals. I did find some water sources that I will be back to put a trail camera on soon.

I've read that these burn areas can be very productive for animals but I have also read that it can take 3-5 years for them to get that way. My thought is that this area may provide great feed but absolutely no shelter. I'm thinking I need to find some standing trees or areas where the burn borders the un-burned.


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## Baron83 (May 24, 2016)

Did you see any tracks or droppings? They might only be using a portion of the burn.


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## KineKilla (Jan 28, 2011)

Everything I found was old. I have no doubt there are critters around just have to keep looking.


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## sheepassassin (Mar 23, 2018)

olibooger said:


> 2 or 3 YEARS? man nobody has time for that. What about the guys that go across the country to hunt? Are they basically s.o.l.?
> 
> I'm a common sense kind of guy and pick up on things extremely quick, obsessively quick actually. 2 or 3 years? Is that geared towards your average Joe schmuck hunter or less than average even?
> 
> I thank God for the talents I've been blessed with. I cant even imagine living life 2 or 3 years to figure things out. Goodness gracious.


Weren't you just asking guys for their opinion on where or how to find deer in an area you don't know? Haha you even sent me PMs asking for my opinion on where the deer would be. Seems like someone with your god given Daniel Boone instincts would automatically know where all the biggest animals of the mountains are located

I've hunted the same place for deer since I was 5 years old. I've been in that country every year since. In 24 years of being through that very familiar ground, I'm still learning new things about it that I didn't previously know. I'm finding things out that my dad hasn't discovered in 55 years of hunting the same ground. To think you know all there is about an area, including the habits of animals (that can change every year) after just a year of hunting there, is hilarious to me. You must be one of them guys that thinks a 'big' deer is something larger than a 2x2.


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## jason21 (Sep 18, 2018)

sheepassassin said:


> Weren't you just asking guys for their opinion on where or how to find deer in an area you don't know? Haha you even sent me PMs asking for my opinion on where the deer would be. Seems like someone with your god given Daniel Boone instincts would automatically know where all the biggest animals of the mountains are located
> 
> I've hunted the same place for deer since I was 5 years old. I've been in that country every year since. In 24 years of being through that very familiar ground, I'm still learning new things about it that I didn't previously know. I'm finding things out that my dad hasn't discovered in 55 years of hunting the same ground. To think you know all there is about an area, including the habits of animals (that can change every year) after just a year of hunting there, is hilarious to me. You must be one of them guys that thinks a 'big' deer is something larger than a 2x2.


Im with sheep. Ive been hunting the same ground for 15 years straight, and i still spend so much time on google earth scouting and finding new areas to go and explore, and when im in the field i find more areas to try out that arent productive, or maybe they are.
Ive found stuff that even my grandpa and dad havent found in their 50 years of hunting that same area. You can truly never know a unit well enough. and it takes years and years and years.
Last year i hunted a new unit sight unseen and let me tell you, it kicks your ass, you spend more time doing non productive stuff than anything productive. This year ill hunt another new unit and im already so stressed about not knowing enough its frustrating. Never once have i thought im going to walk into a new area and bag ANYTHING.youve really gotta work for it.


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## olibooger (Feb 13, 2019)

sheepassassin said:


> olibooger said:
> 
> 
> > 2 or 3 YEARS? man nobody has time for that. What about the guys that go across the country to hunt? Are they basically s.o.l.?
> ...


I had a big old post for your assassin but I'll just keep it short.

You're the reason I continually lose faith in humanity.

A) I never asked you, you offered your help,
1)in youth tags
2)and my area
B) You decided to take a post from BEFORE your offer and blow it up publicly
C) You and I never spoke once about antler points. 2x2, 4x4 etc. But if you must know,
1) 200"+ is big
2) 170" is plenty big for me
3) 150" I'd be floored
D) I'm not hunting for antlers

Good work making yourself look like a dumbass. I never asked you and I also said I would take any help I could get. Your help, get to the top and glass, sucked. But thanks for your offer, then using it to publicly declare I claim to know an area after a year after asking for help.

I agree, itd take a while to fully know a place. 2-3 years to have success, no. Two different things entirely.


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## sheepassassin (Mar 23, 2018)

Oh please don’t hold back, tell me how you really feel. You are the idiot looking in the winter range for deer you’ll be hunting in late summer. I’ve killed a lot of big deer, getting to the top and glassing has worked well for me and many other guys on here who have the big deer game figured out.


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## RandomElk16 (Sep 17, 2013)

Like Sheep said, I have hunted one area my entire life. My father hunted it with his father. Thing is, it's completely different than it was 10 years ago and was different the 10 years before that. As time goes and the deer change, we are forced to change and that leads us to learn new things.

I have also been hunting a different unit for about 6 years now. This weekend I went into a completely new canyon loaded with deer and elk. Probably where I will spend most my time this season. It was the humble reminder of the hidden treasures that exist in each unit. 


You may kill deer or elk the first year. That doesn't mean you figured anything out, and just when you think you have a drought or a massive winter happens. Sheep and Goofy have spent excessive amounts of time on the Nebo.... and guess what? This year is going to cause them to hunt differently.


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## sheepassassin (Mar 23, 2018)

RandomElk16 said:


> You may kill deer or elk the first year. That doesn't mean you figured anything out, and just when you think you have a drought or a massive winter happens. Sheep and Goofy have spent excessive amounts of time on the Nebo.... and guess what? This year is going to cause them to hunt differently.


He's right, two of my 'go to' spots are completely void of all animals this year, and the fire didn't even touch either one of them. It's forced me to look elsewhere and one of the spots I'm investing time in, seems to be the hot ticket this year. Next year could be a different story. Things change yearly, that's half the fun.


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## olibooger (Feb 13, 2019)

Hey there fella, I hiked to the top already. What moron does that and look everywhere else too? Or is that part of getting to know area? Just looking in one spot? I guess I'm clueless. 

I'm not stuck on big deer either fella. But if you are, I'm happy for you.

Unfortunately you're a waste of time and forum space. Best wishes.


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## Jedidiah (Oct 10, 2014)

In before the lock, I think. Guy comes in asking when deer bed down and get back up, an amateur question if I ever heard one, then rudely rejects advice from guys that have been successfully harvesting deer for decades? Head on over to one of the MM sites and annoy them for a while, thanks.


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## olibooger (Feb 13, 2019)

I 100% agree with randomelk. Just because you might kill a deer or elk the first year doesn't mean you have the area figured out. 
Absolutely. 
But, you did have success.

Look, I dont appreciate someone PM offering to help just to be stabbed from behind about a different topic. It shows that persons level of class.
Decades of experience. I would think they would behave differently. You do represent Utah hunters afterall....unfortunately UWN is a global platform.

Bottom line, knowing an area and having success in an area are two different things. Knowing somewhere might raise your odds but doesn't guarantee anything.


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## KineKilla (Jan 28, 2011)

Like so many others we have a serious thread derailment...clean up on aisle...whatever.


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## sheepassassin (Mar 23, 2018)

olibooger said:


> I 100% agree with randomelk. Just because you might kill a deer or elk the first year doesn't mean you have the area figured out.
> Absolutely.
> But, you did have success.
> 
> ...


Woah hold your **** for a minute. I never offered to help you out or encouraged you in the slightest, to ask me for scouting advice or suggestions. The only thing I offered you, was to give you some suggestions on youth hunting opportunities in Utah. You PMd me first, asking about other hunters and where deer are generally located, and I gave you my opinion, which apparently you think was garbage advice. Which is fine, believe what you want. But don't make me the bad guy here. You're the one who started chirping about your common sense and intelligence regarding hunting and hunting areas and how you've mastered an area after only a year or two of hunting there... not me.


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## olibooger (Feb 13, 2019)

"Mastered an area"

Please sir, find where I said that.

Putting words in someone's mouth outside of this forum wont get you very far.

I've met some good guys on here. But it only takes one to wreck it for everyone.

Cleanup suggestion noted. I shouldnt be on forums anyways. Take care everyone 🤙✌


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## jason21 (Sep 18, 2018)

How late will everyone scout up to the season starting? i remember when i was a kid my dad and grandpa always wanted to stay away from the elk hunting areas before season to not disrupt them, but i really enjoy getting out the day before to check everything else and havent seemed to disrupt much, didnt know if anyone else had any strong feelings on that


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## sheepassassin (Mar 23, 2018)

olibooger said:


> "Mastered an area"
> 
> Please sir, find where I said that.
> 
> ...


Again, only one who's making claims that never happened, is you.


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## sheepassassin (Mar 23, 2018)

jason21 said:


> How late will everyone scout up to the season starting? i remember when i was a kid my dad and grandpa always wanted to stay away from the elk hunting areas before season to not disrupt them, but i really enjoy getting out the day before to check everything else and havent seemed to disrupt much, didnt know if anyone else had any strong feelings on that


Personally I don't think it really makes a difference. Opening weekend is such a mess everywhere on public land these days, it's hard to get elk to hit their same summer patterns that they have been on for the first couple days of the hunt. Of course I go opening day, mostly just to get out. I never plan on actually hunting until Monday morning when everyone has gone home. By Wednesday, the elk are usually back to their patterns and will continue to do so, until bulls start traveling to find cows


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## ridgetop (Sep 13, 2007)

jason21 said:


> How late will everyone scout up to the season starting? i remember when i was a kid my dad and grandpa always wanted to stay away from the elk hunting areas before season to not disrupt them, but i really enjoy getting out the day before to check everything else and havent seemed to disrupt much, didnt know if anyone else had any strong feelings on that


 There's been several different seasons that I have found bucks that we've hunted the day and week before the season started.


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## Aznative (May 25, 2018)

Ive always had the mindset in a mew unit to learn the roads, maps, water areas. Maybe set some cameras and check now and then to see if there is activity. If I glass I do it from a road to not disturb the area too much. I guess I was always taught not to disturb the area as much as you have to. However it seems with the amount of campers, hikers, motocross guys other scouters etc etc it really doesnt matter anymore. But if you find a secluded spot id stay away atleast a week or two prior.


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## RandomElk16 (Sep 17, 2013)

Aznative said:


> However it seems with the amount of campers, hikers, motocross guys other scouters etc etc it really doesnt matter anymore.


I read "scouters" as "scooters" - those darn razor scooters are taking over the mountain now too! :shock: :mrgreen:


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## Aznative (May 25, 2018)

RandomElk16 said:


> Aznative said:
> 
> 
> > However it seems with the amount of campers, hikers, motocross guys other scouters etc etc it really doesnt matter anymore.
> ...


Awesome thats funny. Who knows soon they will be on scooters up there.


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## BigT (Mar 11, 2011)

This was quite the interesting read throughout the thread! 

I've found a lot of great success in scouting the early hours in the summers, and then again later in the evening before sunset. I hunt a lot in some burn areas that hold a lot of deer, and a decent number of elk. The hard part about this area is the deer blend in so well to the burn area that they're hard to pick out. Lots of patience! It's interesting because it seems every time I go there, I find myself having to adjust to the landscape and it can take a little time to pick out the deer. But once I've spotted one, they all seem to start coming out. I've also picked deer out in the open bedded down in the middle of the afternoon in July and August but it's not too common. My trail camera's have been hit and miss. I have had some great bucks and bulls come across the camera but I've had more luck getting back into the bucks I've spotted myself and video'd through my PhoneCam set-up. 

As Ridge mentioned, it'll take time to learn the area. I'm still somewhat new into the area I've been hunting (4 years) and am nowhere near learning all there is to learn about the area. I go to southeastern Utah every year with my boys to hunt deer and have done so for the past 15 years and I know the area quite well but still learn something new every year.

Here's a questions for you. I've had a ton of success spotting some great bucks the last two years where I've been hunting. This year I've had very little success getting into the deer I've seen in the past. There are always wild horses running around and I've not noticed them bothering the deer too much, but this year, there are a bunch of cattle in the area. I am assuming they are the cause of the reduced deer. Example, I hung a camera in a place I did last year and got all sorts of bucks and bulls on it. This year I had it out three weeks and got nothing but horses and cows. Kind of frustrating! 

Good luck!


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## Aznative (May 25, 2018)

From my experience cattle wont bother deer too much but elk hate them. And deer cant stand the horses but elk doesnt mind them. Only experience with that is in AZ I hunted a unit cattle in one area and still deer. Wild horses in other area and still elk. But who knows I can be wrong


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## Raptorman (Aug 18, 2009)

I don't think either help, but I have seen them all mixed together over time. I once have Deer, Elk, Cows and horses in the same frame in my spotting scope out in the Bookcliffs. It surprised the heck out of me.


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## RandomElk16 (Sep 17, 2013)

It depends on their exposure. This whole preseason I have been watching elk come in 5 minutes after cattle. Or chasing calves. They may not like them, but they adjust if its normal for the area.

If you are deer hunting, sheep seem to mess a lot of stuff up. I am always aware of where the herders are knowing they could push in on a given day and I have to change my plans.


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## Aznative (May 25, 2018)

RandomElk, you bring up something ive wanted to ask. Ive never hunted in areas where there are so many dang sheep herders. Example the area I want to hunt deer at end of september has sheep within a couple miles right now in Wasatch East. How long do they typically stick to one area? Irritating as heck as being new here several people told me to check this spot out but been worried about the dang sheep. Thanks


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## Aznative (May 25, 2018)

RandomElk, you bring up something ive wanted to ask. Ive never hunted in areas where there are so many dang sheep herders. Example the area I want to hunt deer at end of september has sheep within a couple miles right now in Wasatch East. How long do they typically stick to one area? Irritating as heck as being new here several people told me to check this spot out but been worried about the dang sheep. Thanks


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## KineKilla (Jan 28, 2011)

I’ve seen elk feeding side by side with cattle in the past so I’m thinking those two can co-exist. 

Sheep on the other hand tend to drive everything away. Don’t know if it’s the sheep themselves, the dogs or the herders but something definitely drives the game animals away.


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## utahbigbull (May 9, 2012)

RandomElk16 said:


> It depends on their exposure. This whole preseason I have been watching elk come in 5 minutes after cattle. Or chasing calves. They may not like them, but they adjust if its normal for the area.
> 
> If you are deer hunting, sheep seem to mess a lot of stuff up. I am always aware of where the herders are knowing they could push in on a given day and I have to change my plans.


Goes for elk too... I hate those mountain maggots! That is what I am waiting for is in two weeks to find hundreds of those stinking things to have moved into where my stand is set.


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## utahbigbull (May 9, 2012)

Aznative said:


> RandomElk, you bring up something ive wanted to ask. Ive never hunted in areas where there are so many dang sheep herders. Example the area I want to hunt deer at end of september has sheep within a couple miles right now in Wasatch East. How long do they typically stick to one area? Irritating as heck as being new here several people told me to check this spot out but been worried about the dang sheep. Thanks


Az, as for elk, sheep will push them out but if it is an area where the elk want to be I have seen them come back in within less than a week after the mountain maggots move out.


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## sheepassassin (Mar 23, 2018)

I have hundreds of trail cam photos will deer, elk and cattle all in the same picture. If cattle are a normal occurrence in that area year after year, they don’t bother them at all. Last year I had to wait for a big black cow to clear a cow elk at a spring, before I could shoot.


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## prumpf (Apr 8, 2016)

sheepassassin said:


> I have hundreds of trail cam photos will deer, elk and cattle all in the same picture. If cattle are a normal occurrence in that area year after year, they don't bother them at all. Last year I had to wait for a big black cow to clear a cow elk at a spring, before I could shoot.


I think it depends on the area. The cattle/sheep are going to compete for feed and water. If the sheep pull out all the nice grass the elk like to eat and there is some better feed 2 ridges over chances are that the elk will move.

Now if there is plenty of food, water etc. different story.

Also about the whole 2-3 years thing. I have hunted the same area for 5 years now and still learn a lot-and that knowledge helps me be more efficient and more successful for all kinds of reasons. However you can fill a tag without knowing a unit well, you just have to find the animals.

Knowing a unit well has a lot of advantages and helps you be consistently successful in a more efficient way. IMO


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## BigT (Mar 11, 2011)

Aznative said:


> From my experience cattle wont bother deer too much but elk hate them. And deer cant stand the horses but elk doesnt mind them. Only experience with that is in AZ I hunted a unit cattle in one area and still deer. Wild horses in other area and still elk. But who knows I can be wrong


I am thinking in this particular area, there were not cows the last year or two but I believe there were the prior year to those and the deer sightings were slim in the summer. They picked up a lot in September however.

Last year, my son harvested a beautiful 4-point buck we'd watched and video'd over the summer and into the fall. The deer was feeding very close to some wild horses. I found that rather interesting. I usually don't see the deer too close to them.


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## Jedidiah (Oct 10, 2014)

Deer are ok with cows but not horses, Elk are ok with cows and horses. Deer and elk both completely avoid sheep, after some sheep have been on a watering hole for a couple days you won't see many deer or elk in it for up to a week.


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## Muley_DMD (May 14, 2019)

Newbie scouter here. Aside from time of day and avoiding areas with other livestock, what other things should I take into consideration on my scouting trip. Heading down to the LaSal Mountains this weekend to scout for deer and spikes. 

I've seen deer and elk poo before, but how does that help you know they are in the area if it's old (and I'm not sure how to tell how old)? This is about time they try to rub the velvet off, so how do I determine how old rub marks on a tree are? Search for ponds, creeks, but what do I look for as far as vegetation? 

I understand glassing is a big part of scouting, but would be nice to know that I'm actually glassing into the correct terrain to begin with. Any help is appreciated y'all!


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## Lone_Hunter (Oct 25, 2017)

Aznative said:


> RandomElk, you bring up something ive wanted to ask. Ive never hunted in areas where there are so many dang sheep herders. Example the area I want to hunt deer at end of september has sheep within a couple miles right now in Wasatch East. How long do they typically stick to one area? Irritating as heck as being new here several people told me to check this spot out but been worried about the dang sheep. Thanks


Your going to be hard pressed to find areas that don't have sheep. I've ran into them last year, all over the place. In the Uinta's, in the North manti, in the Central Manti. I don't usually hunt Nebo, but I'll bet they are there too. I do wonder if they are down in fishlake, but it wouldn't surpise me. There is literally no getting away from them around here. Their scat has a distinct smell and will cover entire mountainsides, they trample down everything they don't eat, and where they do eat, there is nothing is left but dirt.

Mountain maggots, range maggots, take your pick, but they are maggots. Their white, and they cover the mountains. I can tell you from experience, that some of them will be moved during the elk rifle hunt. One area I used to hunt, opening weekend might be fine, but the next weekend in the same area, the hills were infested with maggots.

I don't think they round them up completely until the season starts to shift, the fall leaves have dropped, and theirs nothing left to eat. On the bright side, I think they frequent the same areas every year. So if you know where they are, you know where not to go. Pay attention to the tree's, you'll find the sheep herders like to leave their mark. Most of them aren't even American's. Their hired labor from south America i think. The ranchers bring them in cause their good at what they do.

In case I haven't mentioned it - i hate sheep.


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## middlefork (Nov 2, 2008)

Muley_DMD said:


> Newbie scouter here. Aside from time of day and avoiding areas with other livestock, what other things should I take into consideration on my scouting trip. Heading down to the LaSal Mountains this weekend to scout for deer and spikes.
> 
> I've seen deer and elk poo before, but how does that help you know they are in the area if it's old (and I'm not sure how to tell how old)? This is about time they try to rub the velvet off, so how do I determine how old rub marks on a tree are? Search for ponds, creeks, but what do I look for as far as vegetation?
> 
> I understand glassing is a big part of scouting, but would be nice to know that I'm actually glassing into the correct terrain to begin with. Any help is appreciated y'all!


Keep track of the previous weather. Fresh tracks are crisp. Wind, rain and time will make the edges rounded.

Deer and elk poo will be soft if fresh. Don't be afraid to touch 

Elk won't be rubbing until around mid August and deer a bit later. Most rub marks you see now are last year's. Fresh rubs look .......Well fresh.

Would you rather eat fresh salad or wilted dried up salad? Deer and elk are the same. They are looking for the freshest feed available. Generally speaking the south and west slopes are drying out so while not completely ignoring them you may want to concentrate on the east and north slopes for glassing.


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## middlefork (Nov 2, 2008)

Lone_Hunter said:


> Your going to be hard pressed to find areas that don't have sheep. I've ran into them last year, all over the place. In the Uinta's, in the North manti, in the Central Manti. I don't usually hunt Nebo, but I'll bet they are there too. I do wonder if they are down in fishlake, but it wouldn't surpise me. There is literally no getting away from them around here. Their scat has a distinct smell and will cover entire mountainsides, they trample down everything they don't eat, and where they do eat, there is nothing is left but dirt.
> 
> Mountain maggots, range maggots, take your pick, but they are maggots. Their white, and they cover the mountains. I can tell you from experience, that some of them will be moved during the elk rifle hunt. One area I used to hunt, opening weekend might be fine, but the next weekend in the same area, the hills were infested with maggots.
> 
> ...


I don't particularly like them but sheep and herders have been on the mountains since the settlers arrived. Yes most follow the same patterns year to year. Their leases are regulated by the FS /BLM just like cattle.

It has been awhile since I've been on the Manti but back in the day the herders were pretty friendly and actually knew where the elk and deer were hanging. I even had a few offer to pack one out for a few fresh steaks.


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## BigT (Mar 11, 2011)

Muley_DMD said:


> Newbie scouter here. Aside from time of day and avoiding areas with other livestock, what other things should I take into consideration on my scouting trip. Heading down to the LaSal Mountains this weekend to scout for deer and spikes.
> 
> I've seen deer and elk poo before, but how does that help you know they are in the area if it's old (and I'm not sure how to tell how old)? This is about time they try to rub the velvet off, so how do I determine how old rub marks on a tree are? Search for ponds, creeks, but what do I look for as far as vegetation?
> 
> I understand glassing is a big part of scouting, but would be nice to know that I'm actually glassing into the correct terrain to begin with. Any help is appreciated y'all!


The deer won't be rubbing until September with the elk toward the middle of this month. I am assuming you mean the LaSal Mountains by Moab. There is quite a lot of private ground on the northeast side of the range. There's a lot of deer and elk on the mountains but it gets a fair amount of pressure from recreationists, hunters, campers, etc.

There are roads everywhere there so the key is to get off those roads for hunting the unit if you can. Glassing is huge there. Be up early and out til dark to see animals in distant clearings. I've been there when it's hot and I've seen the deer bedded shortly after 7:00 a.m.

Lastly, be on the lookout for bears there. Lots and lots of bears!


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## Lone_Hunter (Oct 25, 2017)

^ What he said about Bears in the La Sals (not to be confused with the "Manti La Sal", or "manti" for short). I was up in the La Sals this last turkey season, and I can vouch for the bears. Didn't get eyes on any, but I definitively saw lots of sign. Lot of bear hunters too. :mrgreen:


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## DevilDog09 (Oct 4, 2016)

Here’s a question. How much will the elk travel to transition from the summer months of the archery opener to the rutting areas? I have the Wasatch elk archery tag. Are they going to be staying out in their summer areas until mid September?


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## Muley_DMD (May 14, 2019)

Good to know about the velvet. Yes, I will be in the LaSal east of Moab. The area I plan to scout out/hunt is around the Medicine Lakes area. Have y'all ever been there? It looked sorta like a good base camp, but it does have some dirt roads around it. 

As for the bears, what you're telling me is I should make sure I bring my bear spray this weekend? :grin: Does the presence of bear mean that deer or elk won't be in that area? Kind of like the sheep situation stated above, do bears coexist with deer and elk?

Thanks for the great tips!


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## ridgetop (Sep 13, 2007)

KineKilla said:


> Those of you that scout for game during the summer months...
> 
> Are you in your glassing spot before dawn and in the early hours of the morning as well as well before dark/early evening?
> 
> ...


Your on the right track.
I would add to take full advantage of the "rainy" summer days. 
Most people don't like to be out in bad weather ( I really hate lighting). I've had too many close calls but I have by far seen more game during or just after a storm.


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## KineKilla (Jan 28, 2011)

Thinking I’ll have to find a different spot or go back to my old one for the opener. Not seeing anything at all in the new area.

I did find a spring that animals have been to recently. Unfortunately the strap for my trail camera broke today so I will not be watching the spring. 

I think the animals are on the other side of the ridge (I don’t think the fire was as bad on that side) and may be moving in to this spring in their travels. The burn damage was total and provides no shelter.

Did find these tracks today in the bottom of the canyon and apparently guzzlers don’t do well in a forest fire...


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## Jedidiah (Oct 10, 2014)

Muley_DMD said:


> Does the presence of bear mean that deer or elk won't be in that area? Kind of like the sheep situation stated above, do bears coexist with deer and elk?


More like the presence of deer and elk means that bear WILL be in that area. It's all relative of course, you're not going to have bears following deer and elk into the foothills near cities but I don't think I've ever hunted away from Salt Lake County and not found bear sign while hunting elk and deer.


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