# I am embarrassed to be a duck hunter...



## toasty (May 15, 2008)

I know this post is preaching the choir and this is not directed at any forum members. I am amazed by this new segment of the hunting community that is selfish, foul, inconsiderate, and seem to have the prevailing attitude of "If I can't have it, neither can you". 

I have lead a sheltered hunting existence, I don't hunt in the northern wmas and in past years I may have 1 or 2 run ins with these hunters, but this year has been awful and I have had at least a dozen encounters this year in spots I have never seen these guys before. These have happened on public and private land, they happened on the youth hunt, opening day and closing day and many days in between. It happens on Saturdays and many days during the week. It happened most during the waterfowl hunt, but also happened on the dove hunt, the pheasant hunt, and the deer hunt. 

The majority of these guys are low to mid 20 year olds and they can not utter a sentence without it being full of profanity even in the presence children. Their solution for things not going there way is to try to bully people out of a spot or be obnoxious and hinder you until you leave. When you try to talk to them with civility, things just escalate quickly and it always end up in them wanting to fight. I will not go into details, however, I have no doubt all would be left scratching their head wondering how could someone act or think this way.

Common decency and respect in the field is now more rare than ever these days. I have often wondered why good guys I know that used to hunt frequently start to hunt less and then stop hunting all together. Having talked to several of them, they go in the field to get away from the crap that they deal with in everyday at their job an lives and when they deal with this crap in the field they just can't see the need to get up early. Writing this will not change anything and will not have any impact, but I have no doubt there are many here that feel the same way. I am just embarrassed to be associated with this segment of hunters.


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## Clarq (Jul 21, 2011)

For the record, I'm 22 years old...

As best I can figure, this season I went elk hunting 4 days (in a very crowded area), deer hunting two days (in a reasonably crowded area), upland bird hunting 2 days, and waterfowl hunting on the GSL WMA's roughly 12-15 days. In all that time, I didn't have a single negative encounter. I was actually pretty impressed with how friendly and considerate everyone was this year. Of course, I saw skybusting, shooting after hours, etc., but never felt like anyone was inconsiderate of my plans.

I have dealt with people like that in the past, however, and it sure is frustrating, especially for me, since I tend to be conflict-averse. If I think someone might have unfriendly intentions I usually just move on.

One approach I have used is just to try to come up with a friendly compromise. Walk up to them, acknowledge that both of you are trying to hunt the same area, and ask them how they think you could both hunt without messing each other up. If they were there first, it might not go so well. If you were there first, though, you might be surprised at how accommodating they will be. They often just move on and give you the space you need. I've done this a few times where I hunt Huns, and it's always worked great. We usually just agree to hunt different parts of the area, but once, I teamed up with another group and we all got shooting. I'm a firm believer that it's easier to get along with other hunting groups if there's some communication.

I agree about the profanity comment. The younger generation has an entirely different attitude about it than my parents' generation. I think in a lot of cases we're a bit self-centered at that age, and forget that our speech may be offensive to others.


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## king eider (Aug 20, 2009)

Hummm...
Been several yrs since I've had any incident like you describe in the public marsh. Actually I've never had anything ugly happen. 

Last altercation I had was on private ground. A guy set up for geese about 20 yards off the road and I parked next to him to hunt 1/2 mile away on public ground. Just had to go through private ground to get where I was going. He wasn't happy after I told him I had permission to walk through. Weird deal.

Guess I hunt a different part of the state...


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## landerman (Nov 8, 2009)

Hunt where the crowds are, be it deer, elk, or waterfowl, and you're bound to cross paths with a few idiots. And idiocy has not age limit, once an idiot always an idiot. 

I hunt wma's along the Wasatch Front twice a week throughout the season and like "king eider" haven't had any negative encounters this past year. But I do try to get away from the crowds. 

What I did see this year were more new hunters in their 20's, which is encouraging considering the reported decline in interest in hunting. And all were courteous and eager to hear any advice I was willing to share from my 50 waterfowl seasons.

Sorry to see my season come to an end on Friday. Already looking forward to next year.


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## J_marx22 (Sep 14, 2015)

You must be running into people in the wrong place at the wrong time. I'm 19 and I know about etiquette in the field and I would never want to mess up someone's hunt who was there before me. I watch my mouth and I like to think I am a very ethical hunter. That was a pretty general statement you made. Not all is lost in the younger generation. I hate to say it but sometimes as a younger hunter it's hard to deal with the stubborn old timers who think that because they've been hunting a spot for such a long time that they own it.


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## hossblur (Jun 15, 2011)

I sit here and think about this season upon reading this. I hunt the wma's, perhaps 50-60 days this year. One night, after work, I wanted to just go check out what birds were in. I ran down to Howards Slough, and walked down the main dike to shotgun alley. When you sit there, your guaranteed your gonna have neighbors 15 yrds off your barrel. Sure enough, I got one, but he was way too old to have youth as an excuse. Im 42 BTW. I want to second the seeing a lot more young guys this year, and, I can't say I had a bad experience with any of them. Ya, they all have tattoos, a lot have gauges, and to a man had FLAT BRIMMED HATS, and most vaped. Maybe because I always walk a ways back in, but the dudes(and a few ladies) i ran on were good dudes, always quick to let me know what they had been seeing, and if I beat them there were purposeful in getting far away. In fact, there were a couple of dudes, that must have worn out Howards, they were there everytime I was(and I get there 3 or 4 days a week), and I always saw them, and they were cool. So, to you flat brimmed, vaping, gauged, tattooed, punks..., I'd say good job this year from me, hope next year that brim gets bent so as to keep the sun out of your eyes.


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## JuniorPre 360 (Feb 22, 2012)

That's Utah marshes for you. I've had that happen just a couple of times this year. And good idea for not mentioning specifics or names. I made that mistake one year and the lynch mob got on and it BLEW UP!!!

Having these constant run ins made me get a little bit of a better motor for my boat, and some gear to take me to where others aren't willing to walk and set up.


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## Dunkem (May 8, 2012)

I stay as far away from other hunters as I can, ethics yes, but mostly I don't want anyone to see what a crappy duck hunter I am. :redface:


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## colorcountrygunner (Oct 6, 2009)

I don't duck hunt, so I really have no idea what goes on in the marshes or how good or bad it may be. Reading through some of these other guys posts kind of makes me wonder if maybe there's something wrong in your approach and it's not completely the wrong of the other guys. I really can't say, though, maybe you have just had really bad luck.


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## toasty (May 15, 2008)

colorcountrygunner said:


> I don't duck hunt, so I really have no idea what goes on in the marshes or how good or bad it may be. Reading through some of these other guys posts kind of makes me wonder if maybe there's something wrong in your approach and it's not completely the wrong of the other guys. I really can't say, though, maybe you have just had really bad luck.


You are probably right, I do have a sign on my head that says please curse in front of my kids and shoot to flare the birds are working our spread. On the back of my head it says make sure I don't get any shooting because if I am getting shooting, I must be stealing "your" birds.


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## Longgun (Sep 7, 2007)

yep, had one run in with a small group like you describe... Initially we talked about hunting together but after one guy in their group said "no we'll just gentleman shoot" (meaning if something started favoring our spread or theirs, the other group would back off and let it happen for that group) worked fine for a few hours until a single goose locked up into our spread and this group fired one shot at nothing just as the single goose was getting into kill range for us then proceeded to skybust at everything.


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## Fowlmouth (Oct 4, 2008)

Here's some of the stupid $hit I had to deal with this season. Several guys that have NO clue what they are doing, but they have a boat and mudmotor so they think they can go explore during the season. I don't have any patience for this stuff and I think I made that clear to them by taking their photo. It's pretty funny when you break out your phone and start snapping pictures, you don't even have to say anything and they leave in a hurry. I never needed anyone to explain to me that you don't drive through someones decoy spread.


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## colorcountrygunner (Oct 6, 2009)

toasty said:


> You are probably right, I do have a sign on my head that says please curse in front of my kids and shoot to flare the birds are working our spread. On the back of my head it says make sure I don't get any shooting because if I am getting shooting, I must be stealing "your" birds.


You aren't bitchy at all. I was definitely wrong. It totally had to be the other guys.


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## LostLouisianian (Oct 11, 2010)

Honestly never had that problem before anywhere I hunted and I've hunted some public places quite a lot in Utah. I have known of a few aholes before to come back to a boat with a mysterious hole in the bottom a time or two


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## BPturkeys (Sep 13, 2007)

I don't think the world is that bad a place. Certainly not much different than it has been for the last 60-70 years that I remember. Let's not become haters because someone else is thoughtless or just plain ignorant.


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## toasty (May 15, 2008)

BPturkeys said:


> I don't think the world is that bad a place. Certainly not much different than it has been for the last 60-70 years that I remember. Let's not become haters because someone else is thoughtless or just plain ignorant.


I can tolerate ignorance and thoughtlessness, it is all part of hunting in Utah. Always has been idiots in the field, and always will be. Were we not not all ignorant hunters at one point. What I am talking about is the blatant attempts to ruin or spoil someones else's hunt. I just do not understand the motivation or satisfaction that comes from that or what do they get out of it.



colorcountrygunner said:


> You aren't bitchy at all. I was definitely wrong. It totally had to be the other guys.


I figured this thread would eventually head this way. Been called a lot worse than bitchy this year.


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## colorcountrygunner (Oct 6, 2009)

toasty said:


> I can tolerate ignorance and thoughtlessness, it is all part of hunting in Utah. Always has been idiots in the field, and always will be. Were we not not all ignorant hunters at one point. What I am talking about is the blatant attempts to ruin or spoil someones else's hunt. I just do not understand the motivation or satisfaction that comes from that or what do they get out of it.
> 
> I figured this thread would eventually head this way. Been called a lot worse than bitchy this year.


I acknowledged that you could just be having bad luck running into so many crappy people, but you still had to pitch a hissy fit. Oh, well. I just know that me and apparently many others don't have nearly so many bad encounters out in the field. I wonder why....


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## LostLouisianian (Oct 11, 2010)

A couple of years ago we had some folks start to set up a little to close to us so I hollered over to them to be careful when my grandson shot because he was young and new to hunting and they were kind of close and might get hit...they decided to move over a little further when I told them that.


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## dkhntrdstn (Sep 7, 2007)

I had to deal with one jackass this year and that was on the youth hunt and they was in there 50 and 60s. drove right through my spread twice and then stole a decoy. If you want to scout wait tell after the youth are done hunting. Not doring there hunt. I would have been my normal self ripping them a new one. But with kids in the boat i keeped it clean and took pic of them.


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## JerryH (Jun 17, 2014)

Having been born and raised here. (as an outsider if you get my drift) I've came to the conclusion a long time ago the it is a Utah thing. Meaning a lot of Utahan's have the attitude of being privileged. A lot native Utahan's in general are not very friendly. You travel out of state or out of country and people seem more friendly than home. In Canada you knock on a door to ask permission to hunt. They want to feed you!

I don't appreciate being called a Utard by anyone. But then I think we've earned that nickname by the way we act and treat people.


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## Cold Water Copper (Oct 10, 2014)

I had an experience this year at Farmington. Guys beat us to ramp, beat us to "My spot". In the dark, I ended up setting up a lot closer that I thought I was to them. We both picked up about the same time and headed in. There were four large guys in that little boat, they started back before I did, but not before I caught up to em. Both of us pointed to the ramp, I didn't realize that I probably swamped their boat as it was WAY overloaded. When they hit the ramp, I immediately called myself out. Nothing was done intentionally on my part, just thinking about nothing while headed in. These guys had every right to use a harsh word or two. Most class I've seen from these guys in a long time. We talked shop for a bit and they even let my two boys hold the only two birds either of us got that day. They fall into this younger generation of hunters, but they were a lot more respectful and considerate than I was that day for sure. I wish I would have caught their names. A good group of guys they were, from a guy that was just a little more preoccupied with himself than others that day.


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## LostLouisianian (Oct 11, 2010)

Deer Horn said:


> LostLouisianian said:
> 
> 
> > Honestly never had that problem before anywhere I hunted and I've hunted some public places quite a lot in Utah. I have known of a few aholes before to come back to a boat with a mysterious hole in the bottom a time or two
> ...


Where did I say I put holes in people's boats? Perhaps you should learn to read before trashing someone's reputation


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## sketch21 (Jul 11, 2013)

LostLouisianian said:


> Where did I say I put holes in people's boats? Perhaps you should learn to read before trashing someone's reputation


A little testy, huh, Lost? Deer Horn called you out for saying something that sounded ridiculous. Own up to it! Or at the very least offer some clarification on your statement. 
I will have to admit, while you may have been joking or telling a story, it didn't sound good.
The last thing we need is more "Aholes" putting holes in peoples boats or in a way destroying gear out of sheer spite or jealousy. No wonder our younger generation gets the brunt of negativity and constant fingers pointed at them. Guess where they learned this BS from? You older guys are looked up to more than you know and when young bucks hear of and witness this crap they think it's OK.

"Reputations are often got without merit and usually lost without deserving"
-Don't recall

Wait a minute... i'm 35, so does that put me in the "old guy" group or "young bucks?"


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## willfish4food (Jul 14, 2009)

I took the liberty of bolding the part that leads me to believe Lost was not the person who put the holes in anyone's boat.



LostLouisianian said:


> *Honestly never had that problem before anywhere I hunted and I've hunted some public places quite a lot in Utah.* I have known of a few aholes before to come back to a boat with a mysterious hole in the bottom a time or two


As to the original topic. I've had A LOT of really positive experiences talking with other people in the woods and on lakes and streams. I've learned a lot, shared a lot, and swapped some stories. I've also had a few experiences where people were less than cordial. But, in the 10 years I lived in Utah and the 20+ years I've been in the outdoors, I've only had ONE experience where I'd consider the other guy an a-hole.

When I'm out and about, I'm out there to have fun. I try to be as courteous and respectful as possible, and I don't let crappy actions of other people ruin my precious time out.


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## LostLouisianian (Oct 11, 2010)

Thanks fish...Reading is FUNdamental. Comprehension not always there....LOL I just love being called out by guys on here with 5 or 6 posts...absolutely made my day...ROFLMAO


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## sketch21 (Jul 11, 2013)

LostLouisianian said:


> Thanks fish...Reading is FUNdamental. Comprehension not always there....LOL I just love being called out by guys on here with 5 or 6 posts...absolutely made my day...ROFLMAO


I didn't realize number of posts was a badge of honor on this forum, Lost. Are we comparing sword's now? Was the best you got for me, number of posts? 
Make a guys day, i'm bored at work.Other than this open forum and the 1000 honkers outside my work window on the golf course i got nothing else waterfowl related to chat about. That is until Saturday, and hoping to have at least one good extended goose hunt. If not I'll have to wait for my annual snow trip.

Wording was the issue, and simply asked to clarify your statement that could easily be interpreted as ambiguous. 
You wouldn't fare well in my boat if can't take a little heat, and slight ribbing.


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## LostLouisianian (Oct 11, 2010)

sketch21 said:


> I didn't realize number of posts was a badge of honor on this forum, Lost. Are we comparing sword's now? Was the best you got for me, number of posts?
> Make a guys day, i'm bored at work.Other than this open forum and the 1000 honkers outside my work window on the golf course i got nothing else waterfowl related to chat about. That is until Saturday, and hoping to have at least one good extended goose hunt. If not I'll have to wait for my annual snow trip.
> 
> Wording was the issue, and simply asked to clarify your statement that could easily be interpreted as ambiguous.
> You wouldn't fare well in my boat if can't take a little heat, and slight ribbing.


I'm sorry if I hurt your feel goods...there all better now? :O_D:


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## Bax* (Dec 14, 2008)

Toasty,

this topic comes up from time to time (and I may have even posted one in the past), and it is sad to hear how common decency isn't so common anymore. In life, on the mountain, along the streams, and in the marsh, respect is dwindling and ethical hunting is becoming endangered.

The problem is large enough that we as sportsmen cannot simply fight back in conventional terms of warfare. We can not fight disrespect with disrespect, but we can not sit idly by and let disrespect breed more disrespect either. The only true solution to the problem is to teach correct principles to anyone we can. Obviously teaching our children is key and will carry far beyond our lifetimes. But I also think that there is an opportunity to try and hunt with friends and share our code of ethics with them (or maybe they share theirs with us).

I am sad to say that I wasn't taught to be the kind of sportsman that we all aspire to be and I had some habits that were less than admirable as a young lad. But I started hunting with Chaser and his dad who are very respectful hunters and their code of ethics wore off on me and I hope those ethics will be instilled in my children and grandchildren for generations to come.

I guess my point is - we must lead by example whether we are hunting, fishing, camping, hiking, or target shooting if we hope to make things better. Each of these activities demand the highest respect for the environment and other enthusiasts.


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## sketch21 (Jul 11, 2013)

LostLouisianian said:


> I'm sorry if I hurt your feel goods...there all better now? :O_D:


It's ok, Lost. Even though you were never able to form a genuine response and evasive at best. I forgive you.
I just call it like i see it, feelings or not. I just want the best for all of us waterfowl hunters here in UT and hope there will still be places to go and ducks to kill when my son is old enough. And it sounds like Bax hit the nail on the head here.
Seems like we are hearing more and more horror stories as our public marshes and opportunities to hunt disappear, along with our lakes and bird numbers.
Starting to see more and more people in spots that we never did before, and less birds to boot.


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## toasty (May 15, 2008)

Bax* said:


> Toasty,
> 
> this topic comes up from time to time (and I may have even posted one in the past), and it is sad to hear how common decency isn't so common anymore. In life, on the mountain, along the streams, and in the marsh, respect is dwindling and ethical hunting is becoming endangered.
> 
> ...


Amen.

I hope I have done a good job teaching my kids ethics, safety, and respect for the animals and other hunters. When they start hunting on their own with their kids and other hunters, I hope they pass what I have taught them. This season ended with several bad encounters, however, I started thinking about some of the good encounters I have had this season with strangers and I have met some really good people. After crossing paths, I always hope people say that about me.


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## paddler (Jul 17, 2009)

This is a good way to think about this and many other issues:


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## ZEKESMAN (Sep 14, 2007)

LostLouisianian said:


> Honestly never had that problem before anywhere I hunted and I've hunted some public places quite a lot in Utah. I have known of a few aholes before to come back to a boat with a mysterious hole in the bottom a time or two


Perhaps this is where they got the idea.


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## Vanilla (Dec 11, 2009)

Cold Water Copper said:


> I had an experience this year at Farmington. Guys beat us to ramp, beat us to "My spot". In the dark, I ended up setting up a lot closer that I thought I was to them. We both picked up about the same time and headed in. There were four large guys in that little boat, they started back before I did, but not before I caught up to em. Both of us pointed to the ramp, I didn't realize that I probably swamped their boat as it was WAY overloaded. When they hit the ramp, I immediately called myself out. Nothing was done intentionally on my part, just thinking about nothing while headed in. These guys had every right to use a harsh word or two. Most class I've seen from these guys in a long time. We talked shop for a bit and they even let my two boys hold the only two birds either of us got that day. They fall into this younger generation of hunters, but they were a lot more respectful and considerate than I was that day for sure. I wish I would have caught their names. A good group of guys they were, from a guy that was just a little more preoccupied with himself than others that day.


This might be my favorite post of the young 2017 year. Personal accountability and admission of a mistake, it's a lost art in today's day and age. Good on ya, CWC. It's refreshing to see someone just admit they screwed up and apologize for it.

On a semi-related topic, I was in a meeting a couple weeks ago that turned into a whole crowd of 45-60 year olds bashing on millennials. I guess these people forgot they were the ones that raised this horrible generation we have coming up? Of course, none of their kids are part of the problem... (I wonder where these younger kids get it from?)


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## LostLouisianian (Oct 11, 2010)

ZEKESMAN said:


> Perhaps this is where they got the idea.


Reading comprehension is a dangerous thing huh


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## utahbigbull (May 9, 2012)

I am sure everyone of us (knowingly or unknowingly) has been on the ignorant plick side of someone else out in the marsh. 

I have turned a corner not knowing someone's spread was right around the corner, but I move on as quickly as possible. Seems most people are that way.

On the other hand, I have seen more and more disrespect. This season I had my son at OB unit 3 when the whole marsh was empty on a week day morning, and I was the first and only boat there. Then a second one came out and set up 200 yards away (all good). But then the third, obviously seeing the 130watt LED's of our boat lights in the pre-morning light decides the only place on that whole pond they can hunt is right between the two of us and all five of them young kids decide to yell, scream, and make a ruckus all morning as they shoot at ducks that are anywhere within the 100 yards to each side or above them peppering us all morning... Had to pack up and leave...

I mean come on now... :-?


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## 1BandMan (Nov 2, 2007)

This is a seriously commercialized sport and one that is getting more and more competitive for sure. I've definitely seen a lot of changes over the years with the worst coming in the last 7 or 8. 
Me, my, kill everything or at least shoot at everything that flies, I'll screw you before you screw me type attitudes seem to prevail. 
I try to hunt places where others do not as much as I can for that reason. Sometimes it pays off and sometimes I don't see a bird, but it's a much more pleasant experience eitherway.


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## rjefre (Sep 8, 2007)

I have been wondering about the incidences of bad behavior that are become more prevalent lately. It may be because it is just so dang CROWDED out there. I keep hearing that hunter numbers are decreasing, yet, in my experience hunting waterfowl (for 43 years here in Utah), I have never see the marshes so crowded. It may be because of the huge losses of wetlands to subdivisions, or it may be because of phragmites destroying the majority of our public GSL wetlands, but either way I think it is safe to say that tempers flare more easily when we are all packed in tight and competing for a limited resource. That being said, I would still rather squeeze in and hunt freely than have the DWR implement California-style blind drawings and special "quality units".
R


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## Fowlmouth (Oct 4, 2008)

Here's my take on it. I have 27 years of waterfowling and I'm not sure it's any more crowded now then it was when I started. The single difference I notice is there are a lot more boats now than there has been. After opening weekend things always settle down and the large crowds disappear. 

The boat ramps seem to be the place where I witness most arguments. Guys are in a big a$$ hurry, some guys can't back a trailer in to save their a$$, others stand around bull$hitting with their buddies while others are trying to load/unload. I have only had one encounter at the boat ramp and it was because a guy was winding up to kick my dog. I asked him nicely not to do it.;-)


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## Jdub654 (Oct 28, 2011)

I think the biggest thing I had learned while hunting was patience with people. It was something my step father and hunting mentor taught me. I can't tell you how many times I may have been wronged in the marsh or on the mountain or I have wronged someone else. I can tell you 9 times out of 10 at the end of the hunt I would make contact with them or they would make contact with me and most of the time it was an honest mistake and they are good people like me. I call them marsh buddies and there has been dozens of times I have seen them in the same spot or marsh again that I thought I was wronged and we've make mutual contact again and they end up hunting with me or I've been invited in their blind, hell I we even cooked bacon together one time.

I guess its all about the approach. If you feel you are being wronged, approach them in a cool, calm manner, understand them and be understood. Most of the time it isn't black or white and you never know if they will turn into valuable friends, marsh buddies or that interaction may just change behavior as a sportsman going forward.


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