# What do you guys think?



## Natural Born Killer (Oct 29, 2015)

American population: 330,483,530
Stimulus bill: $2,000,000,000,000
Dividing the cost by every person in America is $6,051.74.
The government could have given every person over $6,000, but instead will give us $1,200 each (adult) if under a certain income. ($150,000 for couples filing jointly).
Wanna know where the missing 96% of your tax dollars went:
$300,000,000 for Migrant and Refugee Assistance pg 147
$10,000 per person for student loan bailout
$100,000,000 to NASA,
$20,000,000,000 to the Post Office
$300,000,000 to the Endowment for the Arts
$300,000,000 for the Endowment for the Humanities
$15,000,000 for Veterans Employment Training
$435,000,000 for mental health support
$30,000,000,000 for the Department of Education stabilization fund
$200,000,000 to Safe Schools Emergency Response to Violence Program
$300,000,000 to Public Broadcasting / NPR
$500,000,000 to Museums and Libraries
$720,000,000 to Social Security Admin / but they get only 200,000,000 is to help people- the rest is for admin costs
$25,000,000 for Cleaning supplies for the Capitol Building
$7,500,000 to the Smithsonian for additional salaries
$35,000,000 to the JFK Center for performing Arts
$25,000,000 for additional salary for House of Representatives
$3,000,000,000 upgrade to the IT department at the VA
$315,000,000 for State Department Diplomatic Programs
$95,000,000 for the Agency of International Development
$300,000,000 for International Disaster Assistance
$90,000,000 for the Peace Corp pg 148
$13,000,000 to Howard University pg 121
9,000,000 Misc Senate Expenses pg 134
$100,000,000 to Essential Air carriers pg 162 (Not sure how this saves the airlines- because the Airlines are going to need billions in loans to keep them afloat.
$40,000,000,000 goes to the Take Responsibility to Workers and Families Act. Pg 164
$1,000,000,000 Airlines Recycle and Save Program pg 163
$25,000,000 to the FAA for administrative costs pg 165
$492,000,000 to National Railroad Passenger Corporation (Amtrak) pg 167
$526,000,000 Grants to Amtrak to remain available if needed through 2021 pg 168
Hidden on page 174 the Secretary has 7 days to allocate the funds & notify Congress
$25,000,000,000 for Transit Infrastructure pg 169
$3,000,000 Maritime Administration pg 172
$5,000,000 Salaries and Expensive Office of the Inspector General pg 172
$2,500,000 Public and Indian Housing pg 175
$5,000,000 Community Planning and Development pg 175
$2,500,000 Office of Housing
What do you guys think?


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## Critter (Mar 20, 2010)

It's no different than any other spending bill that they pass. 

Very little for the actual purpose of the bill and the other 90% is for all the pork that they can tack on.


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## Vanilla (Dec 11, 2009)

I think every single American will look at this list and find things they are okay with, and things they are not. And every single one of us will have different lists. 

You sure there is $10k for every student loan for bailout? I read there was a forbearance period with no penalty and no interest accrual. I did not see anything saying it was going to forgive any money.


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## backcountry (May 19, 2016)

This seems like a copy and paste job from a chain email or something. Have an actual link?

Agree with Vanilla. I think this is an awkward compromise for a divided nation and government. Some stuff we'll all love and hate. 

Haven't taken the time to read it and trying to ignore the hyper-partisan analysis that seems to be somehow spreading faster than Covid-19.


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## backcountry (May 19, 2016)

The list seems to be amalgamation of some of the various proposals. Some didn't pass the final bill, including the $10k student loan one mentioned.

"In addition to ceasing federal student loan payments and interest, the House bill would have required the Department of Education to make monthly payments for all federal student loan borrowers during the coronavirus national emergency for a minimum of $10,000 per loan. If the total monthly payments did not reach $10,000 by the end of the national emergency, the department would have been required to pay down the remainder toward the borrower's remaining balance, the committee aide told BuzzFeed News. That provision has not passed Congress, though the House could try to pass it later on."

https://www.buzzfeednews.com/articl...us-bill-ends-student-loan-payments-interest-6


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## Vanilla (Dec 11, 2009)

We all have opinions about stimulus packages, what they go to, etc. 

This one passed with overwhelming support, including unanimously in the senate. When was the last time that happened?


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

Natural Born Killer said:


> What do you guys think?


Makes me want to get my precious metals out of the bank and play with them a bit.

-DallanC


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## Critter (Mar 20, 2010)

DallanC said:


> Makes me want to get my precious metals out of the bank and play with them a bit.
> 
> -DallanC


That's where I like dabbling in coins. They look nicer than just a bar or ingot of metal.


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## High Desert Elk (Aug 21, 2012)

Pretty sure the $25 MM for additional salaries for the House of Rep would be on everyone's list.


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## backcountry (May 19, 2016)

High Desert Elk said:


> Pretty sure the $25 MM for additional salaries for the House of Rep would be on everyone's list.


But it's also fake news. I would wager most of the list above is but haven't QCd it completely yet.

"The language in the House bill, under House of Representatives, Salaries and Expenses, allows for $25 million "for necessary expenses of the House of Representatives to prevent, prepare for, and respond to the coronavirus, to be allocated in accordance with a spend plan submitted to the Committee of Appropriations of the House of Representatives."

https://www.wusa9.com/article/news/...bill/507-432ca0de-0406-4340-ad04-bed978e3c339


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## backcountry (May 19, 2016)

Fake news or out of context. Most of the information I keep finding allocates monies for "to prevent, prepare for, and respond to coronavirus". For instance, the money earmarked for "Migrant and Refugee Assistance":



> Migration-Related Provisions Included in CARES:
> • As a general rule, CARES leaves in place the ineligibility of the undocumented and other "non-qualified aliens" for cash assistance, including any cash assistance provided in CARES
> • CARES prohibits anyone in a household from receiving the $1,200-per-adult and $500-per-child cash assistance if the household includes one or more undocumented immigrants. However, CARE covers resident immigrants who filed federal taxes in 2018 or 2019 or before and have a social security number and meet certain IRS residency
> requirements. This can include certain recently arrived refugees, asylees, and Cuban-Haitian Entrants.
> ...


The language specifically counters many of the memes and misinformation campaigns currently going around.

From what I can tell the funds listed by the OP are supplements to existing budgetary items to help cope with the unique threat and logistical demands Covid-19 poses to programs.

I agree with Vanilla that this seems like a rare success for bipartisan legislation to account for a unique event. None of us will agree on it all but that seems to be the nature of compromise.


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## taxidermist (Sep 11, 2007)

I like the Veterans Employment Training! I wish they would quadruple the amount though.


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## goosefreak (Aug 20, 2009)

makes you really raise an eyebrow to the seriousness of this "pandemic"....


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## 2full (Apr 8, 2010)

I'm against it. 

There, I said it. Now u can lambaste me. 
A big waste of money that could be used better than this bill.


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## taxidermist (Sep 11, 2007)

2full said:


> I'm against it.
> 
> There, I said it. Now u can lambaste me.
> A big waste of money that could be used better than this bill.


I think they are sending the checks out way to early. Like folks believe this virus is going to go away in a month or two? I hope so, but I think its walking a fine line until a anti-virus anecdote has been developed.

This is a marathon race, not a sprint.


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## Lone_Hunter (Oct 25, 2017)

Here's what I think the end result is going to be at some point:


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## High Desert Elk (Aug 21, 2012)

taxidermist said:


> I think they are sending the checks out way to early. Like folks believe this virus is going to go away in a month or two? I hope so, but I think its walking a fine line until a anti-virus anecdote has been developed.
> 
> This is a marathon race, not a sprint.


The world, and the US, cannot wait for an vaccination to be ready to start things rolling again.

The virus will be child's play compared to the lack in hygiene and other ailments should everyone just sit around and wait for the magic orange juice to appear.

I agree though, stimulus checks are a one time jolt. What about next month? What about people using them to pay off some bills? That money is not circulating through the economy, it already did when the credit card got ran.


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## RandomElk16 (Sep 17, 2013)

I work for one of the top 50 companies in the US and only have a business degree so take it for what it's worth... but what I believe I know:

No one could successfully write a 2 trillion dollar budget plan in a couple weeks. 


Certainly not congressmen.


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## Bax* (Dec 14, 2008)

Reminder: please don't post political topics unrelated to the outdoors.

That being said, everyone has remained civil (thank you). So I will keep the thread open but please stay respectful and civil.


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## Critter (Mar 20, 2010)

RandomElk16 said:


> I work for one of the top 50 companies in the US and only have a business degree so take it for what it's worth... but what I believe I know:
> 
> No one could successfully write a 2 trillion dollar budget plan in a couple weeks.
> 
> Certainly not congressmen.


Don't you remember what Pelosi said way back when they were going to pass Obama care?

"We have to pass it so that we can find out what's in it"

It is no different than what the Republicans do.


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## RandomElk16 (Sep 17, 2013)

Critter said:


> Don't you remember what Pelosi said way back when they were going to pass Obama care?
> 
> "We have to pass it so that we can find out what's in it"
> 
> It is no different than what the Republicans do.


Nothing about my statement was partisan.

I collectively don't think they are qualified to make a budget. The top CFO's would need a lot of analysis and take longer.

To keep this hunting related for Bax, I will say the Expo tag finances are better thought out for comparison. We know what those are like....


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## Critter (Mar 20, 2010)

I wasn't being partisan either. 

It is just that 99% of our representatives have no idea of what they are voting on. They are told to vote on it one way or the other. 

There is no way that they will read a whole bill before the vote, I may be wrong but I believe that I heard that this stimulus bill was something like 2000 pages. They have a habit of voting on a bill and then having to go back to fix things as they become aware of problems with it. 

This is the way that pork gets placed into spending bills, just slip it in and don't worry about anyone knowing what is going on until it is too late. 

Both sides do it.


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## RandomElk16 (Sep 17, 2013)

Critter said:


> I wasn't being partisan either.
> 
> It is just that 99% of our representatives have no idea of what they are voting on. They are told to vote on it one way or the other.
> 
> ...


Yeah that schoolhouse rock video left a lot of stuff out:


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## backcountry (May 19, 2016)

I would wager we'll need to see round #2 for small businesses and individuals. The virus isn't unprecedented but our economic structure may be.


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## KineKilla (Jan 28, 2011)

My concern is that Congress rushed to get this bill passed saying that the emergency is now, families need the extra income, etc. Well, when this thing runs into week 8, 12, 16 or even 24 the issues will be far worse.

The small amount of $ they distributed to american families will not last more than a couple of weeks, if that and it will not put the supplies we need back on the shelves. Can't buy it if it isn't there.

If we put a bunch of money into small businesses so that they could keep their staff on the payroll then why are we also sending their staff cash? If I'm still collecting my paycheck then why do I need bailout money?


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## Vanilla (Dec 11, 2009)

The money ($1200 per adult and $500 per child) to individuals is not intended for people to pay bills and keep them afloat for the next 8, 12, or 24 weeks. Everyone knows people will do that, but the intent is to have people take that money and put it back into the economy. It’s an economic stimulus package. 

The biggest help to individuals in this bill is not the checks they are sending people, but the extra unemployment benefits. On top of what your state can give, the feds are kicking in $600 per week extra for people on unemployment. That is pretty big. If unemployment plus ~$2400 per month doesn’t keep one afloat temporarily, then those folks have bigger problems than what coronavirus presented and need to re-evaluate how they are living/spending. Especially considering that most mortgages won’t go to foreclosure proceedings during this stimulus package. 

Also, if businesses are able to obtain funds and keep people on the payroll throughout this even if they’re not working, that’s a pretty big trickle down effect to individuals as well. But the check you’re about to get (If you qualify) is not intended to help you survive this economic downturn. It’s for you to go and spend on things that will help others survive the economic downturn. 

While I’m opposed to the individual checks, I’m not sending mine back. I’ve got to decide what to spend it on. I’ve got LOTS of ideas. Just not sure my wife and kids are going to want me to use their $2700 for what I want to do...


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

Vanilla said:


> I've got LOTS of ideas. Just not sure my wife and kids are going to want me to use their $2700 for what I want to do...


Alaska Fishing trip for the family.

-DallanC


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## backcountry (May 19, 2016)

Agreed with Vanilla, though I tend to think individuals should get money if corporations are especially given their recent behavior.

Not to mention the very aggressive mortgage forbearance/freeze for those who need it. That allows monies to be redirected into the local economy for other day to day necessities instead of into massive holding companies, for those that might have to make such tough decisions. 

Same with federally backed student loans. Millions of us have those and payments and interest have been frozen until September. My wife and I will need to sit down and decide what is best for us on that front. She is still employed and we could continue to pay those down with 100% of the money going to premiums. But we also know our local economy is hurting and it might be appropriate to divert some (definitely not close to most) of the monthly budget from those to spending at local businesses.

My household still needs to sit down and figure out the best strategy for our stimulus checks. It's tempting to put it into an account and earn compound interest on it but that doesn't stimulate the local economy at all. Probably best to consider finally doing a project around the house.


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## Iron Bear (Nov 19, 2008)

We’re thinking about going on a cruise with our stimulus money. 🤓


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

Iron Bear said:


> We're thinking about going on a cruise with our stimulus money. &#129299;


If a guy had gotten over Cronavirus, and cant catch it again... now would be a helluva time to go see the world. No crowds, no pollution, cheap deals everywhere, probably could get first class on virtually any airline ... lol.

-DallanC


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## johnnycake (Jul 19, 2011)

backcountry said:


> Not to mention the very aggressive mortgage forbearance/freeze for those who need it.


People need to be very careful about this one as
some banks offering the 90 day suspension of mortgage payments are then requiring either payment in full of the missed payments at the end of the period or other modifications to the loan that will add a substantial amount to the loan balance.


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## willfish4food (Jul 14, 2009)

DallanC said:


> If a guy had gotten over Cronavirus, and cant catch it again... now would be a helluva time to go see the world. No crowds, no pollution, cheap deals everywhere, probably could get first class on virtually any airline ... lol.
> 
> -DallanC


I joked with my wife that we should go have a COVID-19 party like the chicken pox parties of old. Then we could go do what we wanted. She didn't think my joke was funny.


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## PBH (Nov 7, 2007)

Iron Bear said:


> We're thinking about going on a cruise with our stimulus money.


I wonder why the cruise lines are not included in the stimulus package like airlines are??

Cruise line companies have got to be sweating bullets right now. I can't imagine their futures being very bright.


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## middlefork (Nov 2, 2008)

PBH said:


> I wonder why the cruise lines are not included in the stimulus package like airlines are??
> 
> Cruise line companies have got to be sweating bullets right now. I can't imagine their futures being very bright.


Not US flagged.


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## backcountry (May 19, 2016)

PBH said:


> Iron Bear said:
> 
> 
> > We're thinking about going on a cruise with our stimulus money.
> ...


Because most of them intentionally sail under foreign flags to avoid US taxes and fees, consumer protection laws, employment laws, etc. Hard for me as an American to accept subsidizing a corporation that intentionally avoids our systems every moment it can get away with it.


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## Roserray (May 28, 2021)

It certainly looks cool, but the list will definitely be different for each person. In fact, more and more often I meet people who are wondering whether they should take out a loan/rent or save money and buy something. It seems to me that this is a normal phenomenon in our time. Why wait so long to buy something if you can do it quickly and reliably. Life is too short to hope for tomorrow. For example I really wanted to please myself with a new car and after studying a lot of information I came across yhdistalaina.com and I didn't regret trusting them. In addition, do not forget to take a very responsible approach to the consideration of the contract. I hope I helped you make your choice!


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