# Xperts vs Rio



## stick&string89 (Jun 21, 2012)

I went hunting the other day and noticed that I was having a hard time getting birds to fall. With that said I decided to try Rio 3 inch 1550 4 shot on this trip. The two trips before this one I only shot Winchester Xperts and had no problem with getting the birds to fall. Shot size is also 3 inch 1550 4 shot. I decided to pattern test the rounds head to head this morning. I shoot a SX3 with a Carlson blindside extended range choke. The targets were set at 40 yards with a 7.5 inch center circle on a 18 inch piece of card board. In the 7.5 inch circle the Rios had 12 pellets on target. The Xperts placed 38 pellets in the 7.5 inch circle. As for total number of pellets on the 18 board Rios placed 97 pellets. The Xperts placed 156 pellets on the same 18 inch board. I was curious how many pellets on average are in 1 1/8 ounce steel 4 shot. That average number is 216. Aw attached chart.

Bottom line for me is I will keep shooting. Xperts it's not worth the $2.00 a box savings for the Rio. I would like to hear others comparisons of the have they have done similar load tests. I'll try test blindside and blackcloud tomorrow.


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## robiland (Jan 20, 2008)

I have not done any shot comparison like this, but have had mixed results in my killing. I can see why now. I thought maybe I was getting bad at shooting or slow or no follow through. But maybe it was the shell. Now I have an excuse. But i had noticed I missed alot more shots with the RIO.


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## LostLouisianian (Oct 11, 2010)

One of my guns shot decent with RIO but the others didn't so I haven't bought any more. We seem to be having the best success with Federal #3 shot, 3" magnum 1550 FPS. In my Wingmaster magnum it's shooting lights out with a standard IC screw in choke. Out of a limit on opening day I think over half were first shot kills and the rest were 2nd shot kills. We knocked down quite a few ducks and only one wasn't dead when it hit the ground/water. Last year I did extensive patterning with all my guns. It's amazing how some barrels like certain shot sizes, brands and velocities and the next gun shoots that same shell like crap. I'm going to be sticking with Federals this season and try reloading my own next season.


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## stick&string89 (Jun 21, 2012)

I will have to give federal a try. I have never shot any federal steel loads.


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## Fowlmouth (Oct 4, 2008)

First off I shoot a SX3 with a Carlson full choke as well. I bought 2 cases of Rio Blue Steel last season and my shooting suffered tremendously. The Xperts are okay, but I shoot much better with the Federal blue box steel 3" #2's in either 1 1/8 oz. or 1 1/4 oz. Give them a try, they are the same price as the Xperts.


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## CPAjeff (Dec 20, 2014)

+1 Federal Blue Box! I ran a similar test earlier in the year and here are the results of that test.

http://utahwildlife.net/forum/16-waterfowl/124794-patterned-my-shotgun.html


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## stick&string89 (Jun 21, 2012)

CPAjeff said:


> +1 Federal Blue Box! I ran a similar test earlier in the year and here are the results of that test.
> 
> http://utahwildlife.net/forum/16-waterfowl/124794-patterned-my-shotgun.html


I tried to open the link and it is to another topic.


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## CPAjeff (Dec 20, 2014)

stick&string89 said:


> I tried to open the link and it is to another topic.


That's strange. I clicked on the link and it sent it to the results of my test. I didn't post any pictures of the patterns I had, only percentages of the pattern that hit the target.


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## Fowl_faith (Aug 27, 2015)

I also shoot a sx3 but I use a briley improved mod and the best thing I found have been federals (3" shot size 2) also with feochii a near 2nd worst for me were kents.


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## Fowlmouth (Oct 4, 2008)

Fowl_faith said:


> I also shoot a sx3 but I use a briley improved mod and the best thing I found have been federals (3" shot size 2) also with feochii a near 2nd worst for me were kents.


Call me crazy but I swear those Fiocchi 1 1/5 oz. steel loads feel light to me. The steel shot is even polished shiny like aluminum or something. I shot a few ducks and geese with them late last season and there were always pellets in the meat. Again it's probably just me, but I won't use them again.

I don't like the Kents either. I prefer to use slower steel around 1400 fps.


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## LostLouisianian (Oct 11, 2010)

CPAjeff said:


> +1 Federal Blue Box! I ran a similar test earlier in the year and here are the results of that test.
> 
> http://utahwildlife.net/forum/16-waterfowl/124794-patterned-my-shotgun.html


I don't think I've come across estate steel shot, how is the price compared to feds? Looks like you got really good patterns with them too.


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## Fowlmouth (Oct 4, 2008)

Estates are made by Federal. They are awesome, but dirty as heck. Gallensons has them. Around the same price. $12


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## Fowl_faith (Aug 27, 2015)

FM, feochii's are strange to me aswell they have great knock down to them. I only buy them when I'm walking threw my local cal ranch and they catch my eye. Other then that I stick to federal blues box. I have used black clouds on a snow goose hunt I liked them but to pricy for every hunt use. My son did get his turkey with a black cloud we had left over and was keeping the half box I still have for his swan.


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## Bax* (Dec 14, 2008)

I like Rios for water swatting cripples.


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## cootlover (Sep 26, 2015)

Stick now that's Almost funny how sad of pattern that is .I wish I kept my pattern of my 1 1/4 HW13 #4 I did at 50 yards holy crap There I like a 158 pellets in the load `118 were in a 24 inch circle at 50 yd talk about tight the only goose I hit with this load at 40 yd ish dropped like it got hit by a tank


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## cootlover (Sep 26, 2015)

Roger sporting goods on line have fed blue box 12 ga 2 3/4 for $90 a case free ship and 3 in for $110 free ship they are very fast on shipping


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## toasty (May 15, 2008)

Don't pattern shotgun loads, that will only lead down the road of spending more money buying new chokes and high density shot types. Looks like it already got cootlover.

I started patterning shotguns about 12 years ago, 1000+ patterns later and about 50 different after market chokes it is still a sickness. Sometimes I wish I didn't know what was going on downrange and just went to walmart and bought some win xperts and sky blasted with everyone else and hoped for that golden BB.


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## ultramagfan2000 (Nov 27, 2009)

I too played this game. 2 years ago I bought a box of Rio's to try and they were great. Last year half didn't want to fire or acted like squib loads and left a wad in my barrel. Thankfully something didn't feel right and I checked the barrel. Many people I hunt with had the same problems. I went back to the xperts in a hurry. I seem to have better luck with the #3 shot size although a comparison of 2 vs 3 were almost identical.


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## cootlover (Sep 26, 2015)

Toasty do you have TSS 7.5 for sale:mrgreen:


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## goosefreak (Aug 20, 2009)

I use to shoot Xperts exclusively (3" #1's) and I have never had any problems. Ever!
I smash birds with them. However I love Kent 3" 1's more. they are my favorite shell and thats what i'm shooting. If it weren't Kent then it would be Xperts simply because Federal doesn't make a 1 shot. My third pick would be federal for that reason.

I shoot a benelli nova with a patternmaster


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## cootlover (Sep 26, 2015)

I am with freak I shoot kents #2 and pattern master out of all of my benellis cant beat that combo.


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## toasty (May 15, 2008)

cootlover said:


> Toasty do you have TSS 7.5 for sale:mrgreen:


I have TSS #7s, #8s, and #8.5s. Been using the TSS #7s out of the 20ga this season for geese so far and I have been very impressed. Using #8.5 and #9s for ducks in a steel duplex load out of the 28ga and have loved the results as well. Here is a pattern of the choke I've been using. Image analysis makes counting pellets fast and works great to store patterns.


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## wyogoob (Sep 7, 2007)

In my shotguns both shoot low and behind the birds.

.


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## CPAjeff (Dec 20, 2014)

LostLouisianian said:


> I don't think I've come across estate steel shot, how is the price compared to feds? Looks like you got really good patterns with them too.


I picked up 3" 1-1/4 #2 for $10.99 a box at Smith and Edwards. They are dirty as FowlMouth said, but I clean my gun completely after each outing - whether I shoot one shell or 100 shells. So I don't mind them bring dirty.


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## rjefre (Sep 8, 2007)

I love to shoot Estate shells. They do seem a bit dirty, but they seem to do well in my 20 gauge. Modified factory choke in 20 gauge kills geese and ducks dead...usually shoot #3 shot in 2 3/4" for ducks and 3" for geese. If you shoot em close, the pattern is always tight.
R


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## utahgolf (Sep 8, 2007)

never patterned my gun. But boy this year I haven't missed! 3 inch 2's xperts out of an improved cylinder factory choke. It kills ducks! Now if I was pass shooting longer shots, I might mess around with pattern stuff. but decoying birds shouldn't really matter what you're shooting.


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## paddler (Jul 17, 2009)

Just a general comment. Patterning shotguns requires lots of data. A single pattern with one shell/gun combination tells you nothing. Maybe you'll get something statistically significant with five patterns, but ten is better. It gets confusing real fast. I test my guns for point of impact at close range, then at longer range just to get an idea of how it patterns with different loads. I don't put too much credence into the longer range patterns because I know how much data is required for repeatable results. I just use open chokes and hope for the best.


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## LostLouisianian (Oct 11, 2010)

utahgolf said:


> never patterned my gun. But boy this year I haven't missed! 3 inch 2's xperts out of an improved cylinder factory choke. It kills ducks! Now if I was pass shooting longer shots, I might mess around with pattern stuff. but decoying birds shouldn't really matter what you're shooting.


Pattern your gun...I had a gun once that shot high and to the left. I constantly had to adjust to hit with it and finally got it fixed. Sometimes guns actually don't shoot where they're pointed. I can tell you that my B2000 doesn't shoot any better with #3 or #2 shot in Federals. Fiochhi's are a different matter, #2 shot is awful and #3 shot is decent. Kent is just the opposite, #2 shot decent, #3 shot awful. Sometimes it's hard to keep tabs on what gun shoots what ammo the best. On every hunt we have to make sure we have the right amounts of ammo for each of the 3 shotguns we're taking. Hopefully next season all these issues will be resolved by reloading and seeing if I can find something that each of the guns likes that's in common.


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## utahgolf (Sep 8, 2007)

LostLouisianian said:


> Pattern your gun...I had a gun once that shot high and to the left. I constantly had to adjust to hit with it and finally got it fixed. Sometimes guns actually don't shoot where they're pointed. I can tell you that my B2000 doesn't shoot any better with #3 or #2 shot in Federals. Fiochhi's are a different matter, #2 shot is awful and #3 shot is decent. Kent is just the opposite, #2 shot decent, #3 shot awful. Sometimes it's hard to keep tabs on what gun shoots what ammo the best. On every hunt we have to make sure we have the right amounts of ammo for each of the 3 shotguns we're taking. Hopefully next season all these issues will be resolved by reloading and seeing if I can find something that each of the guns likes that's in common.


I would pattern mine if I was missing often or if I was shooting a bunch of cripples. If it ain't broke ;-) I do think guys shoot way too tight of a pattern though. Let the birds decoy instead of 50 yard shots and open up on them with an improved cylinder. Game over.


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## LostLouisianian (Oct 11, 2010)

utahgolf said:


> I would pattern mine if I was missing often or if I was shooting a bunch of cripples. If it ain't broke ;-) I do think guys shoot way too tight of a pattern though. Let the birds decoy instead of 50 yard shots and open up on them with an improved cylinder. Game over.


I switched to IC from Modified this season and my hit rate has gone waayyy up. Almost all one shot kills too!


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## CPAjeff (Dec 20, 2014)

LostLouisianian said:


> I switched to IC from Modified this season and my hit rate has gone waayyy up. Almost all one shot kills too!


++1


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## cootlover (Sep 26, 2015)

I like tight chokes but I shoot clays year round with tight chokes.


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## paddler (Jul 17, 2009)

Most guys will kill more birds with open chokes, at least over decoys. Pass shooting is completely different, and I don't do it. I shoot Cylinder, Skeet or IC only, nothing tighter. I'll bet the vast majority here would kill more birds with a factory Skeet tube than any aftermarket choke.


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## LostLouisianian (Oct 11, 2010)

paddler213 said:


> Most guys will kill more birds with open chokes, at least over decoys. Pass shooting is completely different, and I don't do it. I shoot Cylinder, Skeet or IC only, nothing tighter. I'll bet the vast majority here would kill more birds with a factory Skeet tube than any aftermarket choke.


Pass shooting isn't bad if you know what you're doing. Unfortunately for 98.793853% of the pass shooters almost all their shots are well beyond ethical killing range. We pass shoot at one of the WMA's regularly because I don't have a boat and we do ok. I just make sure I am calling the shots so the ducks are in range before we shoot. I frequently get asked by the son and grandson why we didn't shoot at a duck or ducks and have to repeatedly explain to them that they were beyond ethical range. They're both getting a better judge of ranges now but still occasionally want to take a shot longer than I am comfortable with.


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