# Kings in Utah???



## Duckholla (Sep 24, 2007)

I just heard from my neighbor that he read on the Division's website that the salaninity of the Great Salt Lake has finally reached a point that will sustain oceanic life or ie Alaskan King Salmon. I have searched all over the DWR website and I cannot find any indication that this is correct. Have any of you heard this rumor?

It would be fun to have them here for sure if it is true!


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## Chaser (Sep 28, 2007)

Its gotta be a load of BS... I could smell it as soon as I read it.

There is no way it could get LESS salty. If anything, the lake is MORE salty now, than ever before. The whole reason it is salty is because there is no outlet, and all the salt from Lake Bonneville over the years has concentrated into the much smaller lake we have now, the GSL. Considering the lake is at one of the lowest levels in history, it would stand to reason that it is more concentrated now than ever before.


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## Duckholla (Sep 24, 2007)

Interesting report about the GSL.

http://www.nytimes.com/1986/08/11/us/fish-are-now-able-to-survive-in-low-salt-great-salt-lake.html

Written in 1986 - but claims the salt levels are dropping.


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## lunkerhunter2 (Nov 3, 2007)

I have also read that the north end of the lake is getting more fresh as time goes on. There are already carp living right on the edge of the swamps.


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## Nor-tah (Dec 16, 2007)

Kings?? Nope... That article says that the lake had 28% salt 40 years ago.. now its only 4%?? That seems crazy to me.


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## Chaser (Sep 28, 2007)

So is Morton really taking that much salt from the lake? :lol: 

Even at 4%, its still much higher than the ocean.


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## Duckholla (Sep 24, 2007)

According to that article it was at 4% in 1986. The ocean is at 2%. They claim that the salinity levels dropped from 28% in the 1960's to 4% in 1986. If that data is true, I suppose that from 1986-2010 the salanity levels could drop to a 2% salinity level which would sustain oceanic life.

Interesting enough to make me want to research it a little more.


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## Nor-tah (Dec 16, 2007)

Duckholla said:


> According to that article it was at 4% in 1986. The ocean is at 2%. They claim that the salinity levels dropped from 28% in the 1960's to 4% in 1986. If that data is true, I suppose that from 1986-2010 the salanity levels could drop to a 2% salinity level which would sustain oceanic life.
> 
> Interesting enough to make me want to research it a little more.


Wonder if thats true??


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## cklspencer (Jun 25, 2009)

With the amount of salt that is pulled out of the lake every year I can see how that could happen.


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## wyoming2utah (Sep 12, 2007)

sorry, but having a viable population of any fish species in the GSL right now is totally and hopelessly a pipe dream...the lake is simply too salty.

In 1986 when the above article showed declines in the salinity of the GSL, the lake was at its highest water levels in a long long time. As the inflow of water into the GSL increases, salinity decreases and vice versa. During drought years, the salinity of the GSL increased as the inflow of water decreased.

http://ut.water.usgs.gov/greatsaltlake/ ... index.html
http://www.gslcouncil.utah.gov/docs/GSL ... 093008.pdf


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## kochanut (Jan 10, 2010)

i thought today was april 7th?


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

That NYTimes article is dated: _Published: August 11, *1986*_

-DallanC


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## Nor-tah (Dec 16, 2007)

wyoming2utah said:


> sorry, but having a viable population of any fish species in the GSL right now is totally and hopelessly a pipe dream...the lake is simply too salty.
> 
> In 1986 when the above article showed declines in the salinity of the GSL, the lake was at its highest water levels in a long long time. As the inflow of water into the GSL increases, salinity decreases and vice versa. During drought years, the salinity of the GSL increased as the inflow of water decreased.
> 
> ...


Thanks good to know. What does NY know about GSL anyway.


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## Briar Patch (Feb 1, 2010)

All of you naysayers are forgetting about the freshwater spring in the middle of GSL. 
You won't find much in the way of information on it because a couple of the head honcho's in DWR are in the process locking in on a lease of about 15% of the lakes area. Because they are keeping it secret they are getting it for practically nothing! Apparently they plan on selling guided trips - and it IS for King Salmon. I heard that one of the gentlemen already resigned from his position at DWR to avoid accusations concerning conflicts of interest.
I have a cousin and his buddy works at a fish farm in Canada. My cousins buddy says his boss already has a signed contract with the DWR guys to provide King planter stock. The DWR guys told them they have already started fencing in the area of the lake they are leasing. Fish might survive outside the fenced area, but probably so few of them that most people will pay the money to be guided inside the fenced area. I would guess they would probably patrol the fence and scare off anyone who tried to fish too close.
I'm planning on going and checking it out this weekend. Give me a holler if you want to go with. I plan on going pretty late at night, like, maybe 11 or 12. If you have camo you might want to wear it. I have some face paint, if you need some.


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## cklspencer (Jun 25, 2009)

> All of you naysayers are forgetting about the freshwater spring in the middle of GSL.
> You won't find much in the way of information on it because a couple of the head honcho's in DWR are in the process locking in on a lease of about 15% of the lakes area. Because they are keeping it secret they are getting it for practically nothing! Apparently they plan on selling guided trips - and it IS for King Salmon. I heard that one of the gentlemen already resigned from his position at DWR to avoid accusations concerning conflicts of interest.
> I have a cousin and his buddy works at a fish farm in Canada. My cousins buddy says his boss already has a signed contract with the DWR guys to provide King planter stock. The DWR guys told them they have already started fencing in the area of the lake they are leasing. Fish might survive outside the fenced area, but probably so few of them that most people will pay the money to be guided inside the fenced area. I would guess they would probably patrol the fence and scare off anyone who tried to fish too close.
> I'm planning on going and checking it out this weekend. Give me a holler if you want to go with. I plan on going pretty late at night, like, maybe 11 or 12. If you have camo you might want to wear it. I have some face paint, if you need some.


 :roll: :roll: :roll: 
This is wothles...unless you get some pics :mrgreen:

Looks like they have already tried it once. :shock: I can't see them wasting time and money to do it again.

http://www.utahcityguide.com/new/travel ... ?print=yes


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## Chaser (Sep 28, 2007)

Briar Patch said:


> All of you naysayers are forgetting about the freshwater spring in the middle of GSL.
> You won't find much in the way of information on it because a couple of the head honcho's in DWR are in the process locking in on a lease of about 15% of the lakes area. Because they are keeping it secret they are getting it for practically nothing! Apparently they plan on selling guided trips - and it IS for King Salmon. I heard that one of the gentlemen already resigned from his position at DWR to avoid accusations concerning conflicts of interest.
> I have a cousin and his buddy works at a fish farm in Canada. My cousins buddy says his boss already has a signed contract with the DWR guys to provide King planter stock. The DWR guys told them they have already started fencing in the area of the lake they are leasing. Fish might survive outside the fenced area, but probably so few of them that most people will pay the money to be guided inside the fenced area. I would guess they would probably patrol the fence and scare off anyone who tried to fish too close.
> I'm planning on going and checking it out this weekend. Give me a holler if you want to go with. I plan on going pretty late at night, like, maybe 11 or 12. If you have camo you might want to wear it. I have some face paint, if you need some.


Wow, that sounded pretty legit until I got down to the end there! You must have been pretty bored tonight to come up with that fish tale. :lol:


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## scott_rn (Sep 11, 2007)

Even if the salinity were right, I don't think the great salt lake would work very well. It's got to be too shallow and warm. They would probably make it in a lot of the colder, deeper lakes in Utah with a forage base the way they do in the great lakes as land locked fish, but I don't think that aligns with the DNR's goal of native fish restoration. Also, you'd just be substituting landlocked kings for lakers or something like that. Pretty sure salt water kings are out for Utah.

In New York you can fish land locked kings as they spawn in the rivers. Here's a really, really ripe land locked New York salmon caught by a friend of mine from Utah. Who wouldn't want these in the berry?


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## Petersen (Sep 7, 2007)

Well, this is a weird thread that I hadn't noticed.

The Great Salt Lake is far too salty and laced with all kinds dissolved minerals for anything other than brine shrimp to live there. Even if the salt levels decreased dramatically, like they did in the 1980s because of dilution from increased stream inflow, the lake couldn't support fish — there's nothing growing in that lake for fish to eat other than bacteria and a few hardy, salt-tolerant species of algae.


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## wyoming2utah (Sep 12, 2007)

Petersen said:


> - there's nothing growing in that lake for fish to eat other than bacteria and a few hardy, salt-tolerant species of algae.


Actually, the Great Salt Lake is loaded with brine shrimp that fish would do very well munching on...


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## HighNDry (Dec 26, 2007)

163 years of pickled sewage in the lake would make it hard for anything to live even if the salt level was diminished. Here is a better idea. Get some small perfume bottles and fill them with some of the bottom mud and water. Put a nice little label on them, maybe something like "Hooper Pine". You know the smell, the one that blows in off the lake with the wind. A little jingle like, "Your woman will smell fine with a litttle Hooper Pine!" Crack a bottle open and take a whiff of that pungent lake smell. Place a little right behind the ear of your precious love and snuggle in close for a smell as it mingles with her natural scent. Oh baby! I can see this stuff flying off the shelf!


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## PBH (Nov 7, 2007)

Briar Patch said:


> All of you naysayers are forgetting about the freshwater spring in the middle of GSL.


any freshwater spring in the GSL would immediately mix with the salt water, and become salt water.

If someone really wanted to make people believe that someone was attempting to get fish to live in the GSL, they would have had better results using fish like Orangemouth Corvina (croaker family).


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## Petersen (Sep 7, 2007)

wyoming2utah said:


> Petersen said:
> 
> 
> > - there's nothing growing in that lake for fish to eat other than bacteria and a few hardy, salt-tolerant species of algae.
> ...


Setting everything else aside that would prevent fish from living in the main body of the lake, GSL brine shrimp are subjected to season-dependent life cycles, so whether they could supply a viable food supply would depend on whether the fish could make it through the two- or three-month period in the winter when almost no live adult shrimp exist in the lake. If I understand correctly, the protective shells of the diapaused cysts are nearly impossible to digest.

Like I said though, it's a weird discussion. We might as well be discussing whether or not fish could live on the moon.


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## Daisy (Jan 4, 2010)

The South Arm of the GSL is currently about 15% salinity, the North Arm is at saturation or 28%. Normal seawater is 2-3%. 

The GSL will be at the lowest elevation it has been at in 50+ years this July unless massive amounts or precipitation fall between now and then. It will only get saltier.


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## Kingfisher (Jul 25, 2008)

most everything has been covered: the gsl is far to salty for any kind of fish. lower levels increase the concentration. its not likely to come back to higher levels any time soon. there are lots of other nasties in the lake. the sediments in the lake bottom would leach salt into the lake even if you took all the salt water out and put fresh water in, it would salt up quickly.

however, could this be confused with the proposal to dike off the farmington portion of the lake, using deep culverts in the bottom of the dikes to let the heavier salt water out the bottom keeping fresh water in and eventually making a fresh water portion of the lake? this proposal surfaces occasionally and even then, i would suspect that only fish not worth eating would survive in it.


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