# What .223 & 5.56 dies do you use



## LostLouisianian (Oct 11, 2010)

What brand of dies do you use for .223 & 5.56 and what crimp die do you use? Thanks.

P.S. if you have a spare set you're just dying to get rid of PM me.


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

The 3 die LEE set.


-DallanC


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## KineKilla (Jan 28, 2011)

I use Hornady sizing and seating dies and Lee Factory Crimp Dies.


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## wyogoob (Sep 7, 2007)

RCBS, both regular and small base

I crimp with Lee Factory Crimp Die for small base brass.


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## wyogoob (Sep 7, 2007)

I hear, and read, that a tapered crimp die is the way to go for AR platform 223s. Makes sense.


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## LostLouisianian (Oct 11, 2010)

wyogoob said:


> RCBS, both regular and small base
> 
> I crimp with Lee Factory Crimp Die for small base brass.


Educate me goob. There are different kinds of .223/5.56 brass? Regular Base and Small Base? Color me clueless. What's the difference, how do you identify etc?


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## wyogoob (Sep 7, 2007)

LostLouisianian said:


> Educate me goob. There are different kinds of .223/5.56 brass? Regular Base and Small Base? Color me clueless. What's the difference, how do you identify etc?


That's a great question LL.

A small base die squeezes the case above the head of the cartridge a coupla thousandths (to minimum specs really) smaller than a full length sizer die would. It's that part of the case that may expand considerably in firearms that have "big" chambers, weak brass, or you're using some hot loads. Larger chambers are common on pump and semi-auto rifles. Simply put, the larger chamber helps feed the cartridge.

The downsides of small base dies are moving the brass more each time you resize decreasing it's lifespan and there's a chance of pressure inconsistencies. And of course there's the claim that small base ammo is not as accurate as ammo with brass ran thru a FL or neck sizer die....blah, blah, blah

If you measure inexpensive off-the-shelf ammo you'll find the case diameter a little smaller than what your full length sizer die makes. Many ammo maker's cases are on the small side of the specs so the cartridge will easily feed in a variety of firearm actions and chamber sizes.

Anyway, I grew up in the part of the country where semi-auto and pump rifles were popular for big game hunting. The **** things always had some kind of cycling problems, especially reloads for semi-auto. So we just used small base dies for sizing brass. Geeze, I had small base .223 and .308 dies before I ever owned full length dies for those calibers.

It was before outdoor and shooting forums so it wasn't complicated back then.

If I have time I'll dig up some factory ammo, small base reloads, full length reloads and neck size reloads (for Rem 700) in .223 and measure the bases.

.


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## wyogoob (Sep 7, 2007)

In addition, for .223 bolt action or single-shot firearms I normally use a full length sizer and no crimp.


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## LostLouisianian (Oct 11, 2010)

This will be for one of those evil semi-auto black rifles. From what I understand you probably want the bullets tight in them so they don't go whopperdiggy and blow up


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## wyogoob (Sep 7, 2007)

*I give up*



LostLouisianian said:


> This will be for one of those evil semi-auto black rifles. From what I understand you probably want the bullets tight in them so they don't go whopperdiggy and blow up


No. Did you read any of my posts?

They blow up because they're too big, too tight, not crimped and the bullet gets pushed back into the case when you or the firearm forces the round into the chamber....like this:


I use small base die and a crimp. I'm not trying to match bullet holes at 1,000 yards for Kriste's sakes.


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## Critter (Mar 20, 2010)

The small base dies also help a lot when you are shooting a semi automatic, pump, or lever action rifles. It allows the round to chamber a lot easier in those rifles where on a bolt action the bolt and your hand strength will chamber one that is slightly oversize. 

The crimp die is for your protection when the round goes off. I don't remember if Al finally figure out just what caused his major malfunction but a bullet that has been pushed back into the case mouth could of been part of it.


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## wyogoob (Sep 7, 2007)

Actually I think a pump is the worst. I have a lot of pumps with tubular magazines. With those the cartridge has to turn 90° from the tube to the loading/ejection port. Sometimes that motion doesn't go too smooth and an uncrimped round gets hung up o pushing the bullet into the brass some when you get rough with it. Bullets used in tubular magazines are usually flat or rounded, further adding to difficulty the bullet may have going around the corner then up the ramp into the chamber.

Lever actions can be quirky too. I remember getting a wild hair one time and neck sizing for an 1894. In the basement the rounds went into the chamber, one at a time by hand, with ease. So I load up a box of them, took them to the range and crap, they wouldn't cycle from the tube. The bases were just "that much" too big. Lesson learned. 

A dirty semi-auto can have some timing issues or the cartridges come into the feed ramp out of alignment for some reason. If the chamber is tight or the base of the brass is pushed out the round may hang up, not feed. 

I have a really nice 7mm Mag BAR but the thing just will not feed cartridges other than new ammo in the green and yellow box. So I size the brass with a small base die and it's OK. 

.


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