# gutless method waste question



## Elkoholic8 (Jan 15, 2008)

So I have been using this gutless method for the last several years, and love it!! I have also been accused (not legally) of wasting meat. My question is, for those of you who use the gutless method, what is considered wasting?
I typically take the 4 quarters, tender loins, backstraps, and neck meat. On a bigger animal where there is actually decent meat around the brisket I'll take that too. Is that leaving too much?

My buddy (the accuser) prefers to bring his out whole, and take it to the butcher where ALL the meat gets used. I don't think he realizes that the butcher throws away most of the stuff I leave, it's just done behind closed doors.


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## Nambaster (Nov 15, 2007)

I would be able to sleep soundly with what you are doing....


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## Critter (Mar 20, 2010)

Butchers don't throw too much meat away since that is how they get paid, by the pound. 

As for which way is best, it depends on you. I prefer to bring my animal out whole but there are times that it needs to be cut up. If I am by myself and know that there won't be any help I'll bring out what you said that you did and do it with no bad feelings. If I have others that will help pack then I'll bring out the whole animal bones and all weather it is in pieces (up to 8 for a elk or 4 for a deer) or the animal intact.


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## Mountain Time (Sep 24, 2007)

Nambaster said:


> I would be able to sleep soundly with what you are doing....


Why?


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## mack1950 (Sep 11, 2007)

yeap the butchers get paid by the pound but during the processing any meat that is unusable is discharged when the animal is brought in its weighed at that time just hope you didnt shoot your critter in the hinney becouse your still gonna get charged by the carcass weight


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## Critter (Mar 20, 2010)

The butcher that I have taken my animal to when I didn't have the time to do it myself charged by the final weight and not what you brought in.


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## Nambaster (Nov 15, 2007)

Mountain Time said:


> Nambaster said:
> 
> 
> > I would be able to sleep soundly with what you are doing....
> ...


4 quarters, backstraps, tenderlions, and neck meat=an animal not wasted. Rib meat is something that is up to the hunter to take home. In Idaho you used to be required to take the rib meant however that stipulation has been removed since it is not always consumed. Neck meat is generally ground up into hamburger. Bringing out an animal whole is not always practical. 1st of all, it creates a spectacle if the animal in whole is visible during transportation. 2nd of all, the animal cannot cool as well when it is whole with a hide and bones intact. 3rd of all, it is more to pack.

Boning an animal is sometimes even more practical and takes the 4 quarters 1 step farther. Removing the bones from the quarters greatly reduces the amount of weight that you are tranporting by foot. Infact packing out a whole elk boned out can be done in one trip. Making a successful elk hunt 1 trip with boned out meat and 1 trip with antlers head and cape. On the ethical aspect there is hardly any wasted meat left on a carcass that has been properly boned. A skinned elk hide makes for an excellent warm platform to sit on while boning an animal.


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## stablebuck (Nov 22, 2007)

If someone is giving you a hard time about the gutless method they must be a very critical person. I consider myself to be pretty critical and I can think of about a thousand other things to give someone a hard time about than the difference in the amount of meat being salvaged whether one brings the whole carcass home or uses the gutless method. The gutless method is the only reasonable method for most of the hunting scenarios I find myself in. Really unless you can drive an ATV directly to the animal or it is a steep downhill drag back to the pickup then the gutless method is hands down the way to go...ethically and practically.


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## skeet4l (Sep 11, 2007)

Great subject (again) so how about a buffalo, anybody tried it? I'm going to stop by the butcher tonight and see what their take is. I can only imagine what the straps will look like. Kinda wondering how effective the cordless sawzall will be too. Just getting some ideas together. skeet


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## hossblur (Jun 15, 2011)

we hunt with a butcher, and he always makes fun of guys that bring things out whole. He always says, I wonder if they realize I am going to cut that up? I used the gutless method this year and there is some meat left in the rib cage, but we rarely cleaned it up that much when we gutted and quartered. Sure was nice to not carry all that rib and backbone and extra hide out, just to leave it further down the mountain when we skinned and boned. The butcher that hunts with us did have a laugh at how poorly I did cutting out the arse end, but at 38 i am still learning.


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## 2full (Apr 8, 2010)

How do you get the tenderloins out if you do the gutless method ?
I like the idea of gutless, should have done it a couple of times.
Have about killed myself getting deer or elk out a couple of times whole, and/or in pieces.
Just have not figured out how to get the tenderloins if it's not gutted, esp. on an elk. 
Lots of great meat in elk tenderloins!!

As for the Buffalo question:
A friend of mine drew 4 years ago.
That's how they did his when he killed it.
But, he did not get the tenderloins.
He got a WHOLE lot of meat, but for some reason put almost all of it burger.
Buffalo eats too well to "waste" the majority on burger !!!! (in my opinion)
o-||


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

2full said:


> How do you get the tenderloins out if you do the gutless method ?


The tenderloin is right behind the last rib towards the pelvis. You can carefully remove it easily after the tenderloin for that side is removed.

-DallanC


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## Igottabigone (Oct 4, 2007)

Tender loins ought to be called tender guts because that's what they taste like.


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## Kingfisher (Jul 25, 2008)

rib meat? seriously? you just shot this critter once or twice thru the rib cage and you are dragging it out head over teakettle for a mile... 2, maybe 3? and all the dust, crap weeds and whatever else gets in there... and heaven help if you nicked a gut either with a bullet or a knife and you get that kind of bacteria in there. i never take a chance on rib meat... had food poisoning once... was so bad i was afraid i wasnt going to die. wont take a chance on that again. i have several really great friends... KC, Booger and Mikah who get all my ribs, bones, fat, tendons and pheasant carcasses... and they love it. gutless all the way. i am flat out tired of carrying out a whole animal only to butcher 50% or more away in bone, fat, hide, head, hooves, etc.


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## jpolson (Jun 12, 2011)

2full said:


> How do you get the tenderloins out if you do the gutless method ?
> I like the idea of gutless, should have done it a couple of times.
> Have about killed myself getting deer or elk out a couple of times whole, and/or in pieces.
> Just have not figured out how to get the tenderloins if it's not gutted, esp. on an elk.
> Lots of great meat in elk tenderloins!!


Tenderloins...the easy way...at about 7:15


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## elkfromabove (Apr 20, 2008)

Per page 38, 2012 Big Game Field Regulations Guidebook, "You may not waste any big game animal or permit it to be wasted or spoiled." (Waste means to abandon a big game animal or allow it to spoil or be used in a manner not normally associated with its beneficial use....).

I guess if you want to get technical, you shouldn't leave the hide, ribs, heart, liver or kidneys either.

And the "spoiled" part comes in as well! I once allowed an elk hind quarter to spoil because I pulled a rib muscle trying to lift the top hind quarter while skinning the top side, and had to come down off the mountain. It was late and I couldn't get help until the next morning and by then the bottom hind quarter had bone soured (A solo archery hunt in August and I hadn't gutted it because I was using the gutless method.) We saved the top side including the top hind quarter, the cape, both front quarters and the back straps and neck because I had skinned off nearly all of the top side and had already removed the top front quarter, so all of that cooled, but the bottom hind quarter held too much heat during the night. So I guess I could have been cited for the spoilage since I "allowed" it to happen, but I doubt it would have been an issue with DWR. I guess it's a matter of choice, but leaving the rib meat on a deer or antelope isn't likely to be a DWR issue either. There isn't much there and unless you put it in a bag right away and cool it down, it's going to crust over and be unusable (spoiled) anyway.

I know that looking at a quartered animal leads to an impression that there is a lot of stuff left behind, but very little of it is edible, at least to humans. I wouldn't be too concerned!


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## 2full (Apr 8, 2010)

Dallen,
Do you mean: you can easily remove the tenderloin after the backstrap on that side has been removed?
I know where the tenderloin is, but how to get it out without going into the chest/stomach cavity is the issue?
It is along the inside of the backbone..........
(and the youtube won't let me in, I'll try that when I get home to my laptop.)


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

2full said:


> Dallen,
> Do you mean: you can easily remove the tenderloin after the backstrap on that side has been removed?


Yes, in fact I did it this year on my wifes deer. I roll the animal so the spine is uphill, lets the guts settle away from the spine to give you some more room. Its not hard but you need to be careful.

-DallanC


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## Critter (Mar 20, 2010)

The little time that it takes to gut a animal I'll gut it first and then I can take my time removing the meat if I am going to bone it out in the field. At leat if you gut it first you don't have to worry about poking a hole into something accidently and you can get the animal away from the guts to do the rest of the work. Also if you liike the liver and heart like I do you can get to them a lot easier.


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## Nambaster (Nov 15, 2007)

In response to 2full's question. On my elk this year. I skinned my bull elk along the back this year and removed the quarters and the back straps... After the back straps are removed you can easily see where the tenderlions are and remove the tennderlions where they are un protected by the rib cage.... Where the rib cage ends is where the tenderlions begin... They are very accessible.


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## 2full (Apr 8, 2010)

Nambaster,
Thanks, that does sound like it would work.
Would like to give it a try next time I shoot one in a tough spot.
I'm like Critter, have always done the "gut" thing, even if I pulled 'em out in pieces.
Willing to give it a try.


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## wyogoob (Sep 7, 2007)

Elkoholic8 said:


> So I have been using this gutless method for the last several years, and love it!! I have also been accused (not legally) of wasting meat. My question is, for those of you who use the gutless method, what is considered wasting?
> I typically take the 4 quarters, tender loins, backstraps, and neck meat. On a bigger animal where there is actually decent meat around the brisket I'll take that too. Is that leaving too much?
> 
> My buddy (the accuser) prefers to bring his out whole, and take it to the butcher where ALL the meat gets used. I don't think he realizes that the butcher throws away most of the stuff I leave, it's just done behind closed doors.


Geeze, sounds like you took out more than enough, good job.

The gutless method sounds cool. When I get old I'm gonna try it.

Elk ribs anyone?









:mrgreen:


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## Squigie (Aug 4, 2012)

There are certain pieces of meat that I don't use: rib meat, flank meat, etc.*
-By rib meat, I'm not referring to the muscles on the outside of the ribs, but the muscle _attached_ to the ribs. The meat outside the ribs is saved (makes good "flank steaks" and stir-fry). Most butchers refer to it as brisket or 'plate' meat.

Whether I use the 'gutless' method, bone it out, or haul out the whole carcass... nothing changes. I still eat and 'waste' the same parts of any big game animal*.

*(Really fatty antelope are an exception. I don't bother with the little bit of neck meat, if it's marbled with fat. It tastes like crap, and there's no way to fix it or get the fat out.)

--wyogoob
I can't handle the tallow and fat in the rib meat. Sticks to my teeth and the roof of my mouth. Makes me feel like a dog with a mouth full of peanut butter. :roll: 
...And I don't know anyone else that will eat it, either.


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## wyogoob (Sep 7, 2007)

Squigie said:


> There are certain pieces of meat that I don't use: rib meat, flank meat, etc.*
> -By rib meat, I'm not referring to the muscles on the outside of the ribs, but the muscle _attached_ to the ribs. The meat outside the ribs is saved (makes good "flank steaks" and stir-fry). Most butchers refer to it as brisket or 'plate' meat.
> 
> Whether I use the 'gutless' method, bone it out, or haul out the whole carcass... nothing changes. I still eat and 'waste' the same parts of any big game animal*.
> ...


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## wyogoob (Sep 7, 2007)

Geeze, then there's heart and the liver.


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## wapiti67 (Oct 2, 2007)

I have been using the gutless method since 2005, and I feel I "waste" a whole lot less then an idiot that drags an animal out whole...It WILL NOT cool without skinning it and opening the meat to the major bones...after you kill an animal those bones heat to 160 deg and will start slow cooking the meat...I can skin, quarter and debone an elk in 2 hours...less if I have more helpers that know what they're doing. Tex-o-bob's bull was done in 45 min because we had 4 guys..


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## wyogoob (Sep 7, 2007)

I'm thinking it's fine to leave the kidneys.


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## Moostickles (Mar 11, 2010)

Nambaster said:


> A skinned elk hide makes for an excellent warm platform to sit on while boning an animal.


 :shock:


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## wyogoob (Sep 7, 2007)

I think one could reach in where the windpipe comes out of the chest and get the heart out.


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## Mountain Time (Sep 24, 2007)

Nambaster said:


> Mountain Time said:
> 
> 
> > Nambaster said:
> ...


Thanks for responding....we use the gutless method as well and just wanted to hear your thoughts. You are right about the tenderloins, fairly easy to get to if you take the pressure off the stomach....got to be careful not to puncture the guts.


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## Mountain Time (Sep 24, 2007)

Wyogoob. Any chance you would put together a video the next time you butcher an elk. It might be helpful for some of us with less experience, especially regarding the rib meat.


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## skeet4l (Sep 11, 2007)

MT, I pulled this off of a prior thread.
http://elk101.com/webisodes/gutless-video/


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## Elkoholic8 (Jan 15, 2008)

Thanks for the replies guys. I thought I was doing an ethical job of removing the useable meat, but I thought I would ask and see if I was missing something. I'll see if I can get a video going on my late cow hunt if I get one down that isn't by the road.

As for the question about tenderloins, here is how I get mine out. After the quarters and back straps are removed, I roll the carcass up on the stomach cavity (spine up) then take the knife and cut the tissue holding the spine to the entrails. Note: you can do this with one person, but a helper will make it real easy. As you cut that tissue going forward toward the neck, the spine will lift up off the entrails. Cut both sides and lift while the second person reaches in and cuts the loins out. It's real simple, and very clean. Unless you jab a long blade under the spine you won't hit any of the gut while doing this. This also creates an easy way to get to the heart or liver if you so desire.

Goob, I'll have to keep some ribs on the next elk I get close to the truck. I would like to try the elk ribs. I love beef ribs, but I have never kept any elk ribs. Not so sure I want to try the toungue though. I hear it's good, but I don't know, I'm sceptical.


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## Elkoholic8 (Jan 15, 2008)

One more thing I forgot to mention. I don't skin the entire animal either. I just skin each leg as I work on it. One it's skinned I remove the leg and go one to the next one. For the back, I skin just enough area to pull out the back straps (basically parting the hide to expose the meat), then open up the neck area and start cutting out the meat. I figure this saves a little time and also saves the blade from getting dull as fast. Now if you are working on a trophy animal that you are going to mount, this process will have to be changed, and the front half will have to be skinned instead of the individual legs. 

Maybe that's where my friends perception of waste comes from. When I am done it looks like a legless carcass laying on the ground instead of animal parts all over the place. It would somewhat resemble a poached animal if a guy didn't inspect it closely.


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## wyogoob (Sep 7, 2007)

Mountain Time said:


> Wyogoob. Any chance you would put together a video the next time you butcher an elk. It might be helpful for some of us with less experience, especially regarding the rib meat.


Uh..I'm not much of a video guy. I could do a pictorial. Do you want the gutless method or the traditional way? I'm flexible. If you read my thread on elk ribs in Recipes many of the questions you have might be answered. Note that I only use the ribs from "lean" animals, spikes, yearlings, maybe a bull that's skinny for whatever reason. The cut is the short rib, the top part of the ribs under the loin. There is some work involved removing the fat. If I have the time they're worth saving, that muscle group is tender, doesn't get used much.

You did more than an adequate job on your elk. If its hot I will go gutless, do what ever is the quickest. Otherwise I'll go the old-fashioned way. My call, my license, no one needs to tell me I'm an idiot because I don't do it their way.


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## Fishracer (Mar 2, 2009)

I used the gutless method for the first time on my wifes elk his year. I was curious as to how it would compare with dragging out the whole animal ( amount of meat). We took the 4 quarters, backstraps, neck meat and rib meat. I was really surprised by how much meat i got back from the butcher. It was more than any elk i have taken out whole. It was also compared to smaller animals as this was a bull and the ones past where cows but still was surprised. Weight is also by the drop off weight not he pickup weight. This bull cost less but got more meat ( and same cuts) as the 2 cows taken out whole.

Next time try skinning one side of the animal from rear quarter to front leg and up to the spine. This allows you to remove all the meat you want from that side with very little hair. Plus the hide that is skinned off acts as a place to set meat without setting it in the dirt.


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## Seedy (Nov 20, 2012)

We have kept track of the gutted, and butchered weights of harvested deer over the years. Back in the day, everyone in our family gutted, and we dragged deer out whole. We passed up deer in places we did not want to drag them out of, because of this. After switching over to the guttless method, and comparing butchered weights of similar deer, it works out to within a couple pounds either way.


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## wyogoob (Sep 7, 2007)

Seedy said:


> We have kept track of the gutted, and butchered weights of harvested deer over the years. Back in the day, everyone in our family gutted, and we dragged deer out whole. We passed up deer in places we did not want to drag them out of, because of this. After switching over to the guttless method, and comparing butchered weights of similar deer, it works out to within a couple pounds either way.


Good info, welcome to the forum.


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## martymcfly73 (Sep 17, 2007)

Unless I shoot one like I did this year, within 50 feet of a paved road, I'll never gut another animal. I'm sold on the gutless method.


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