# action vs no action



## campfire (Sep 9, 2007)

Here is a question for you still water experts while we are waiting for open water. I frequently enjoy "trolling" flies with sinking line on my flyrod either in my float tube or from my canoe with an electric trolling motor. Obviously, in my canoe I can troll faster longer than in my tube. Most lures like rapalas, flatfish or even Jakes or spoons have some kind of action when trolled. But flies don't. They just drag along like an artificial fly being trolled. So I have habitually tried to give my flies some "swimming action" by "twitching" or "jigging" my rod tip. But I had a couple of experiences last summer when I had at least as good of luck or even better luck just trolling flies without the action. It seems that every time I set my rod down to rest my carpel tunnel syndrome I would get a hit. Now, in each case I was in my canoe and trolling a bit faster than I usually do in my tube. But I do not recall ever "trolling" in my float tube with out "jigging" my rod. I don't know if the speed had anything to do with it or not. What are your thoughts and experience?


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## cheech (Sep 25, 2007)

It all just varies. Sometimes a dead troll works. Sometimes a twitch works. Sometimes a hand retrieve works. Sometimes you have to strip faster than Carmen Elektra. One of my favorite methods is to strip a few times, rest the fly for a few seconds, and then resume stripping. Chances are as soon as you start to put action on the fly again, you will hook up. I have a video that demonstrates this pretty well. I know some of you have seen this already, so bear with me.






Yeeeeehaw....


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## threshershark (Sep 7, 2007)

The primary variables in my experience seem to be pattern, depth, and speed/type of retrieve. I routinely try a wide variety of retrieves as part of my search cycle. Trolling, drifting, twitching, and various speeds and lengths of stripping are all methods I use. 

I typically do not use my rod tip to jig or twitch a fly, preferring to keep my rod in the water essentially pointing at the fly. The reason for this is to eliminate slack in the line as much as possible. Any time you lift your rod tip, slack will form and then needs to settle back out which lessens the ability to feel strikes. I give the fly action using line control and stripping.

In my experience, trolling a fly setup seems to be most applicable when fish are widely spread out, and the objective is to cover quite a bit of water. If the fish are concentrated, I generally use the line to give the fly the type of action I want while presenting it at the proper depth. Long, slow stripping retrieves can be very effective and don't differ much from trolling, except I seem to have much better control over presentation depth this way.

It's a valid method, but I have to say it's generally not the most productive style for me.


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## .45 (Sep 21, 2007)

cheech said:


> It all just varies. Sometimes a dead troll works. Sometimes a twitch works. Sometimes a hand retrieve works. Sometimes you have to strip faster than Carmen Elektra. One of my favorite methods is to strip a few times, rest the fly for a few seconds, and then resume stripping. Chances are as soon as you start to put action on the fly again, you will hook up. I have a video that demonstrates this pretty well. I know some of you have seen this already, so bear with me.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That video is amazing !! :shock:

I don't know how the hell you guy's catch fish without using a worm.!! :shock:


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## Greenguy88 (Sep 7, 2007)

Cool video cheech, thanks for sharing.


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## Ben Trod (May 7, 2008)

One of the most effective yet most difficult stillwater methods to master is not moving your fly at all or just letting it fall. Methods to aid this approach are: 
1. Sight fishing and targeting a specific fish; just time your cast so your weighted fly is falling directly in front of a cruising fish.(extremely deadly ) 
2. Hopper dropper: Try dropping a damsel fly pattern below a bushy dry fly during a damsel fly hatch this can be better than any movment imparted by the fisherman, a slight chop should give the fly plenty of motion. (I know it sounds crazy because the damsel flies are swimming right) just try it ...
3. strike indicator aka fly below a bobber, used alot w chironomids(midge pupae/larvae). 
4. Gary Lafontain coined the term "retro strip" when imparting action to a fly w a strip strip pause. Even better then a pause, is to "retro strip" feeding line back through the rod guides thus alowing the fly to actually fall.(an extremely deadly method at times) Some days a retro strip = fish, and just a pause during your strip = no fish. :


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## Packfish (Oct 30, 2007)

When you are trolling with a rapala or what ever and you are zip trolling or making S turns- in the middle of the turn your lure actually slows way down and almost stops and then as the boat pulls out of the S turns the lure picks up speed quickly and you get hits at either of those stopping or starting points. - Change in speed of the lure----- or fly. I do basically everything that has been mentioned above and feel that I am fairly proficient at what I do- now I have a buddy who just paddles around flicking the end of his fly rod like he is a spastic and he hammers the fish as well as anyone I see on a lake. It's like this fish don't care that the rest of us have figured out how they should react to our tested presentations. Amazing creatures with the brain the size of my ex-wife.


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## Chaser (Sep 28, 2007)

Packfish- I didn't think a fish brain could weigh 300 lbs!

The funny thing is that any technique can work on any given day. That's why its important to do like many of the guys before me have said, and switch it up. Many times if you twitch, jig or jerk a fly around a bit, it makes it look injured, which catches the fishes attention. If you stop for a second or three, it gives the fish an opportunity at an easy meal. But when you start again, it can trigger a response in the fish to eat it with a "hurry up, it's getting away" type strike. Just the other night up at Jordanelle I had been slowly retrieving a leech pattern without any action. Not much had happened, that is until I started putting some jigging into it. Immediately, between my first and second sets of jigging, a fish nailed it. 

Another thing that you may not see with many flies is small scale action in them. If you are trolling a maribou leech, or a woolly bugger for instance, there will be action in the tail of that fly. It is small, but it is there. Just looks like something swimming along.


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## Packfish (Oct 30, 2007)

Hey- that's only 262#- the other leg was 264#


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## scott_rn (Sep 11, 2007)

campfire said:


> Most lures like rapalas, flatfish or even Jakes or spoons have some kind of action when trolled. But flies don't. They just drag along like an artificial fly being trolled.


I have fished wooly buggers with a decent sized split shot on a spinning rod (mostly because I don't own sinking line and can get it deeper that way) and fished it like a jig. My vote is for more action on the still water.


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## Wild One (Nov 3, 2007)

Great advice so far. The only 2 things I would add if you're looking for a little more action is to tie your fly on a loop or use a wiggle method when tying your flies (I don't know if it actually has a term, but that's what it does). There are diffferent loop knots that work for this. I like a double figure-eight knot (yea it's a climbing knot) but only because I know so well I can tie it in the dark when it cold out. Some people use a surgeon's loop, but that takes up a little more tippet that way. I guess you could use a Duncan Loop too if you can get it to stay as an open loop and not slip tight.

One other thing to do is tie your flies with a wiggle method. This is done by tying the second half of your fly on a hook appropriately sized, clipping off the hook at the bend and then looping a piece of mono through the eye of that hook and tying it in to another hook. This fly is called a wiggle-stone and was developed by Greg Senyo specifically for Lake Eerie steelhead. 
I believe that Charlie Craven has a wiggle damsel fly pattern on his website too.


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