# Black Cloud Ammo



## uttrkyhntr (Sep 19, 2007)

Has anyone out there used the new Federal Black Cloud ammunition? I have bought a few boxes and will be trying out soon. I will be sure to let everyone know how well it shoots once I have the opportunity.


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## deadicated1 (Mar 17, 2008)

hey man i know im a little late, but i just joined and read your post. I was skeptical at first, but i gave in adn bought a box cuz it looked cool. It totally proved itself this season!! My two friends and i killed over 550 ducks, and usually shot about one box of black to two boxes of other steel. Many talk negative about this product, but i love it and have obviously put it to the test. definitely recommend it


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## Huge29 (Sep 17, 2007)

I would not believe it had I not seen it with my own eyes... _(O)_ the stuff is incredible, my buddy knocked one down that I thought he was crazy for even trying, 3-1/2" 4 shot, I hit a double for the first time ever with my first shot...well worth the extra 2-3 bucks IMHO.


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## Riverrat77 (Sep 7, 2007)

Run a search... guys used it last year and it was blowing the hell out of ducks that were close.... if you're landing them in your dekes and want to eat the birds, I wouldn't use it based on what I heard last year... save it for geese or swans that can take the punishment... otherwise its overkill. 8)


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## dkhntrdstn (Sep 7, 2007)

I shoot a couple shells of it last year and was not in press with it at all. All the people I have talked to that shoot it was not happy with it and are not going to spend the money on it again.


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## hairy1 (Sep 10, 2007)

It might kill better but it didn't pattern any better than my Kent's.

So to me it is not worth almost double the price.

I don't have a problem with cripples...But I don't shoot until I see the landing gear.


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## Mojo1 (Sep 8, 2007)

*a safety warning for Black cloud users*

My buddy was going to purchase a Patternmaster choke tube from the Patternmaster booth at the ISO hunting show until the Patternmaster rep told us NOT to shoot Black Clouds thru the Patternmaster. The Rep said the heavy shot cup blew up/came apart againist the wad retrading ring inside the Patternmaster tube and could create a blockage hazard on following shots.


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## woollybugger (Oct 13, 2007)

I've been killing ducks well enough dead with my little 1oz. ultra fast reloads. I don't need the extra expense. I decoy my birds <30 yards. One ounce of steel #3 has 165 pellets. At 1600 fps (the new recipe this year), they really take it hard! I only shoot 3" when I want a larger payload for the larger shot sizes (#1, BB). I shoot #4, #3, and #1 steel reloads in 2 3/4" shells and feel no need for the $3 per shell stuff. I can reload a box of steel shells for < $6 a box. I usually reload a couple of cases at a time and that gets me through a season. Last season I only shot about 14 boxes of shells. ($6 x 14 boxes = $84) Hevi shot at $35 BOX (PER 10) / $84 = 24 SHOTS!!! 350 SHOTS VS. 24 SHOTS. SAME EXPENSE!?!?!? Black cloud at $21 per box is 84 cents a shell. I would have only 100 shells at $21 per box of black could, compared to the 350 of my reloads. 

Use good decoys, use good binoculars, scout, plan, get'em in close and enjoy the hunt all the more. Fast steel kills reliably enough for me. I still have all of my teeth and don't need the "hamburger helper" effect of blowing my birds to shreds. :wink:


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## JMF (Feb 24, 2008)

Hey Huge, you're right that was an incredible shot. I should have had you buy me dinner on that one. 

I had a good experience overall with the black cloud, but if you really nail a bird it was hamburger. I think it is worth a try to see if you like it.


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## Huge29 (Sep 17, 2007)

JMF said:


> Hey Huge, you're right that was an incredible shot. I should have had you buy me dinner on that one.
> 
> I had a good experience overall with the black cloud, but if you really nail a bird it was hamburger. I think it is worth a try to see if you like it.


WTF? Who let the gay guy in? :evil: Creative screen name! Is that why it took you so long to join, couldn't figure out the perfect name for a year or two? Oh, I have your dinner right here...(from William)


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## JMF (Feb 24, 2008)

> WTF? Who let the gay guy in? Creative screen name! Is that why it took you so long to join, couldn't figure out the perfect name for a year or two? Oh, I have your dinner right here...(from William)


Hey loser, they let you in and you're about as queer as a 3 dollar bill. How is your trip with Steve going? Word has it that he likes to sleep with nothing but a wet sheet..........Williams words, not mine. :twisted:


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## Donttreadonme (Sep 11, 2007)

I shot through a couple boxes of it last season and don't think it is worth the extra $$. I shot #2's and the Flight Stopper pellets (the ones with the ring on them) made some huge holes in the birds. Bigger than I want to have. The effective killing range is no more than standars steel because it is only steel shot with a ring. The Flight Control wad does hold the pattern together longer for a tighter pattern but again the same thing can be acomplished by simply shooting a different choke with standard steel.

IMO it isn't worth the money. I do believe that some people shoot it better because they think it is better. So if you believe it kills ducks/geese better and don't mind paying the extra $$ go for it. Shooting is hugely a mental game and if Black Cloud gives you added confidence then shoot it.


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## deadicated1 (Mar 17, 2008)

one other good thing about shooting black is the speed and shot wieght compared to nearly everything else. I do a lot of late season diver hunting, and i usually shoot 3 1/2's. they shoot 1500fps with a 1 1/2 oz. load, which is the best combination i have seen. I am also a big beleiver of "if you like it and think you shoot better with it, then by all means, stick with it" but those are facts and numbers, not just opinions


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## hamernhonkers (Sep 28, 2007)

> one other good thing about shooting black is the speed and shot wieght compared to nearly everything else.


You are talking about payload when you say shot weight right?


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## deadicated1 (Mar 17, 2008)

ya, sorry i dont know all the correct teminology. But if you multiply the speed and the weight of the shot does it equal ft/lbs of energy like it does with a rifle? i figured out all the different weights and speeds one day and this load beats all the real heavy, slow ones, and the real light, fast ones. am i right about multiplying them together or is there more to it than that?


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## Huge29 (Sep 17, 2007)

woollybugger said:


> I've been killing ducks well enough dead with my little 1oz. ultra fast reloads. I don't need the extra expense. I decoy my birds <30 yards. One ounce of steel #3 has 165 pellets. At 1600 fps (the new recipe this year), they really take it hard! I only shoot 3" when I want a larger payload for the larger shot sizes (#1, BB). I shoot #4, #3, and #1 steel reloads in 2 3/4" shells and feel no need for the $3 per shell stuff. I can reload a box of steel shells for < $6 a box. I usually reload a couple of cases at a time and that gets me through a season. Last season I only shot about 14 boxes of shells. ($6 x 14 boxes = $84) Hevi shot at $35 BOX (PER 10) / $84 = 24 SHOTS!!! 350 SHOTS VS. 24 SHOTS. SAME EXPENSE!?!?!? Black cloud at $21 per box is 84 cents a shell. I would have only 100 shells at $21 per box of black could, compared to the 350 of my reloads.


If you believe that they simply do not work or that they are no different from any other that is one issue, I personally, strongly disagree with that, but to say that I save $30/season, that simply does not make sense to me IMHO. You obviously hunt more than the average waterfowler, but I still don't think that it makes sense. We each pay $20k+ for a truck, thousands in your dog for purchase, training, vet, food, etc., hundreds in gas, $1,200 for shotgun, $500 for dekes, $100 for calls, $100 for licenses/tags, $200 for clothing, $150 for waders....at what point does saving $50 matter when it is such a miniscule figure as a percentage of all expenses for hunting? I personally only go through 2-3 boxes, which would be about $24 for the season, I think the success rate is significantly better with the blackies, and to increase my success rate by a significant factor and make the difference of numerous succesful days vs crappy days-I will pay the $24 willingly. I think it is a product that increases my chances quite a bit, I am a firm believer...  Again, if you believe they are the same as any other, disregard this, but I do not know how anyone could really believe that when looking at the anatomy of them , cool idea, but the proof was in the pudding in using them.


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## woollybugger (Oct 13, 2007)

> If you believe that they simply do not work or that they are no different from any other that is one issue, I personally, strongly disagree with that, but to say that I save $30/season, that simply does not make sense to me IMHO. You obviously hunt more than the average waterfowler, but I still don't think that it makes sense. We each pay $20k+ for a truck, thousands in your dog for purchase, training, vet, food, etc., hundreds in gas, $1,200 for shotgun, $500 for dekes, $100 for calls, $100 for licenses/tags, $200 for clothing, $150 for waders....at what point does saving $50 matter when it is such a miniscule figure as a percentage of all expenses for hunting? I personally only go through 2-3 boxes, which would be about $24 for the season, I think the success rate is significantly better with the blackies, and to increase my success rate by a significant factor and make the difference of numerous succesful days vs crappy days-I will pay the $24 willingly. I think it is a product that increases my chances quite a bit, I am a firm believer... Again, if you believe they are the same as any other, disregard this, but I do not know how anyone could really believe that when looking at the anatomy of them , cool idea, but the proof was in the pudding in using them.
> 
> 
> woollybugger said:
> ...


Whatever cranks your tractor!

*Use what you like*. I save a LOT more than $50 a season by reloading. I shoot some 3" shells as well (factory loaded) and think that the Black clouds don't hold a candle to the 3" Kent Faststeel. You can clobber anything that flies with a 3" mag Kent in BB or #1 steel. On days when the only shooting is on the 40-45 yard fringe, Kent gets it done! Decoying ducks into 20 yards hovering, and then shooting them with 1 1/2 oz. of #2 black cloud or hevishot is WASTEFUL!!! I like to _eat _my ducks. Do you mean that you would rather only take 24 shots per season, vs. , 350 shots? 24 shots makes for a pretty good day in the field, but it's only *one* day. The only way I can see taking 24 shots in a season is if you a die hard goose hunter (3 boxes of hevi, and you're good for the year). That does make sense to me. But, for ducks, at <30 yards I'll keep on folding 'em with my steel reloads.


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## Huge29 (Sep 17, 2007)

I don't follow your math, clearly we each do have our own choices, maybe I misunderstood your previous post; I took it that you thought that it was a waste to pay the extra few dollars. Clearly, we each load based on what we expect our shot to be, I personally load life a 4-2-BB type of thing, or if I expect them all in the dekes, maybe all 4's all depends on what action I see/expect. I also understand that reloading brings a whole new dimension to the enjoyment of hunting, a dimension that my time will not currently allow; appears to provide a great deal of satisfaction; good on ya. We will simply have to agree to disagree, we each are clearly happy with our own plan, I do not mean any disrespect. My point was simply what is $30/year, in my case, in a sport where we spend thousands, what is another drop in the cup if the hunter believes the odds are improved? :wink:


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## deadicated1 (Mar 17, 2008)

i agree and have seen that anyone can kill ducks inside of thirty yards over decoys, but-- have you ever tried shooting divers on big water, which are tough enough to bring down, let alone kill em dead, cuz if you dont, they are swimming with a 30 or 40 yard head start on your dog. even the best dogs cant always catch up to all the cripples. i used to shoot kent 3 1/2 1 9/16 oz #1 or bb on late season goldeneyes and watch my pattern all around em, and sometimes not even knock a bird down, or knock it but not kill it. black has been the most effective on killing birds, at farther distances, of all the loads and brands etc. that i have used


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## Duurty1 (Sep 10, 2007)

how much is that stuff a box???


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## hamernhonkers (Sep 28, 2007)

I have seen it anywhere from 18 to about $26 a box. For that price I would shoot hevi steel. With it you at least getting a pellet with a heaver density.


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## woollybugger (Oct 13, 2007)

> I don't follow your math


Reloaded steel $6 / box of 25 = $0.24 per shell
Factory steel $12 / box of 25 = $0.48 per shell
Black Cloud $23 / box of 25 = $0.92 per shell
Hevishot $35 / box of 10 = $3.50 per shell

Tab for the season shooting 350 shells (14 boxes):

Reloads : $84
Factory : $168
Black Cloud : $322
HeviShot : $1225 !!! :wink:



> i agree and have seen that anyone can kill ducks inside of thirty yards over decoys, but-- have you ever tried shooting divers on big water, which are tough enough to bring down, let alone kill em dead


You'd be surprised! If anyone can kill ducks over decoys inside 30 yards, then why don't they??????????? :?:

I have shot my fair share of divers over the years. I only take birds that I will eat. Goldeneyes are on my list of non-shooters (which includes mergansers, spooners, buffleheads, etc.) Perhaps the gadwall, mallards, teal, and widgeon that I do shoot are just creampuffs that will succomb to a measly steel load.

I don't disagree that 'Black Cloud' will work on ducks at extended range. I just think that there is a lot of marketing and hype involved, that's all (I still think Kent is the better shell!). I don't think that anything compares to Hevishot. Period. Unfortunately that means price as well. I love hunting waterfowl. I don't have a six-figure disposable income that allows me to pursue as much hunting as I want if I shoot the ultra-spendy stuff. Besides, I am addicted to whacking birds at close range. I like reloading. I reload as a hobby in itself. Producing loads that are very effective while saving money is rewarding.

My intent is not to argue, I just like a good debate. 8)


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## deadicated1 (Mar 17, 2008)

this is a good debate, and i like to hear everybodys sides of it. it is true about the cost of reloading, and i would love to invest in one someday. I shoot about four rounds of skeet every week during the year, not to mention over two cases of steel at ducks last year, so obviously reloading would be a good idea. but for now, ill stick to factory loads adn store bought shells to get me by--including black cloud. im not saying that all the puddlers drop the moment they hear the 1 oz steel coming at them, but lets just say that black cloud makes you feel like you are still whacking em at close range!!


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## fishduck (Apr 12, 2008)

I sure done think the blackcloud bullets do the trick for knocking the birds down at those far distances but they sure are expensive and hard to come by out where I live. I usually just stock up real good with the cheap stuff at walmart and use them 4 my close shots.


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