# Comparing fly tying kits for a beginner



## mjbarney12

Wapsi Concise Fly Tying Kit $100.00: http://www.fishusa.com/Wapsi-Concise-Fl ... Qgod3CQAGg

vs.

The Wapsi Delux Fly Tying Kit $80.00: http://www.fishusa.com/Wapsi-Deluxe-Fly ... Kit_p.html

vs.

Cabelas Premium Fly Tying Kit $200.00: http://www.cabelas.com/product/Cabelas- ... l+Products

I'm wondering if any tying pros out there would think that the $20.00 or so difference between the two Wapsi kits is worth it.

Also, I'm wondering if the $100.00 or so difference between the Wapsi Concise kit and the Cabelas Kit is worth it.

Any thoughts out there?


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## slapwater

The question you should ask yourself is how serious about learning to tie flies are you. If you are relatively committed you should skip all these packages. I have seen good kits before but the all revolve around a good vise. Everything else in the kit is disposable or gets used up quickly and in the end when everything else in the kit is used up you don't want to be left with a crappy vise. The vises in the kits you linked will all work okay but ultimately aren't very high quality. Look for a better vise, even if you get a used one to save money and the build around it. It won't cost you much more and you'll wind up with a vise that works better. If you're not really all that committed than buy the cheapest one. You'll only be out $80 either way. Just know that if you enjoy tying you'll want to upgrade the vise quickly.


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## mjbarney12

*Interesting thoughts Slap...*

I figured at some point I'd upgrade the vice but frankly I have no idea if going with a kit like this will save more money because of the comination of a "decent vice" or "ok vice" with what I hoped would be less cost on quite a bit of material or if it would be better and less expensive to get a "good vice" and then to have to pay all the extra money to buy all the material that these kits ultimately provide as part of their package.

I guess I've been figuring that the cheaper route to go would be to get the kits, deal with the "lessor" vice but get all the material, and then to upgrate the vice later.

Maybe that's not the best way to think about this however.


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## slapwater

It is likely that if you were to buy all the materials in any of these kits separately, you would pay more than what you will pay for the kit. Finding the cheaper route again depends entirely on your timeline. It almost certainly would be cheaper to just buy one of these kits and get tying than to start from scratch. Over the next year though, if you get into tying you will want better tools, a better vise, you'll find the quality of the kit hackle to be poor and need better stuff, you'll realize that red and yellow bucktail aren't called for in most patterns you use, you'll have dubbing you rarely use and lack dubbing you'll use regularly, etc. If you look at it from a time span of a year or more, it is definitely cheaper to skip the kit and get better stuff. If you go for one of these kits, I'd go for one of the cheaper 2. If you have $200 to spend then I'd do that and get better stuff than what is in the kit. You might not get as much stuff but if you are careful you will get only stuff you will use and tools that will last a little longer.


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## GaryFish

All flies require 3 tools - vise, scissors, and thread bobbin, and most flies will also require hackle pliers. The rest of the tools you can get, make, or figure something else out to use without spending money. I've been tying now for nearly 30 years. I have a $60 regal style vise I absolutely love, because it holds every hook rock solid with no adjustment. The best investment I made was in quality scissors - $30 for some Dr. Slicks. Get a ceramic lined bobbin, and hackle pliers are not expensive. 

For materials, most of the stuff in beginner kits is junk. Start with a simple fly - woolly bugger - and get the materials to tie it. Tie up a bunch. Then pick another simple fly - pheasant tail, or hare's ear, etc.... and get the materials for those. Spend $10-12 each time, and you can build up a supply box with good stuff you can use, instead of lots of bright colored junk that you'll never use. I tie most of my flies any more with about a dozen different materials. but that is me. Everyone is different. But these are my suggestions.


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## Pumpgunner

I'd say Garyfish hit it right on the money. You can get a decent vise for not much money too, I tied for over 20 years on a cheap Thompson vise. The bells and whistles can be nice to have but aren't totally necessary.


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## swbuckmaster

+1 with what garyfish said.

Dont buy a kit. I did and hardly used any of the stuff in it. I always wanted a better vice. If i ever get back into tying i wont even use the stuff i have. Ill just get the good stuff.


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## mjbarney12

*Good feedback you guys*

I think I'm going to forego the kit and get some decent tools to start including a lower mid-range vice in the Griffin Odessy Spider Vice and some decent Dr. Slicks scissors or two , a ceramic bobbin or two , etc., etc. Then I'll get my brother's help to just pick out the most commonly used material for the most common flies I use and go from there. For nymphs I tend to use princies, PTs and hare's ear. He's got me started on fishing Chronimids as of last year so I'll likely get some stuff for two or three Chronimid patterns and then I'll get stuff for Royal Wulfs, Elk Hair Caddis, Renegades, Griffith's Gnat, PMD, BWO, and maybe a stimulator-style pattern or two , oh, and a purple haze pattern. We've been having A LOT of success on Purple Haze. That's my dream start anyway. Maybe a bit ambitious and I'm certain I'm missing a fly or two that I ought to do instead or add to my list. Perhaps I'll get everything and then say "whoa, I can't afford all of this" and then cut out a few flies and add to my list a bit more gradually, I don't know. Anyway, that's my overall plan. Crap, see I already overlooked woolybuggers and streamer ideas. I probably should add a leach pattern at least lol!!!


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## GaryFish

GREAT move. You'll be glad to have quality scissors and an upgraded vise. And the ceramic bobbin - I don't know how I lived without it for so many years. Crappy bobbins that come in kits break your thread all the time- especially when you haven't learned the best tension and touch. 

For the flies you are looking at, pick up some pheasant tail feathers, pea**** herl, biots, some dubbing, and dark brown or olive thread, some wire, and a package or two of hooks and you can get to tying. And those are great flies to start with - simple to tie, and VERY effective - which will hook you on fly tying - once you catch a fish on a fly you tied yourself, you'll be hooked. And those are flies that even a beginner can tie and make them look good enough to catch fish. Add some olive and black chinelle, and some bugger marabou feathers to match and you'll be all set.

And just a bonus hint while tying with wire - never use the fine tips of your scissors to cut the wire. Use the back part of the blades. Keep the tips for the fine work - trimming a single hackle fiber, stuff like that. 

And last tip of all - not that I would advocate such practice, but buying two or three materials every couple of weeks seems to be easier to explain to the wife than a $50-60 expense that she'll notice. They don't notice the $3-6 purchases nearly as much. At least,..... that's what I've heard........


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## Grandpa D

Try to tie flies that don't require dry hackles.
The cost of a dry neck will scare you away from tying.
Tie flies that use dubbing and saddle hackles.
Most of the flies that you have posted will be great flies to tie and won't need dry hackles.
Simple flies like Brassies, Zebra Midges, Pheasant Tails and Woolly Buggers are cheap to tie and work very well.
Dry flies will cost more but when you spread out the cost for materials over several months, it's manageable.


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## madonafly

mjbarney12 said:


> Wapsi Concise Fly Tying Kit $100.00: http://www.fishusa.com/Wapsi-Concise-Fl ... Qgod3CQAGg
> 
> vs.
> 
> The Wapsi Delux Fly Tying Kit $80.00: http://www.fishusa.com/Wapsi-Deluxe-Fly ... Kit_p.html
> 
> vs.
> 
> Cabelas Premium Fly Tying Kit $200.00: http://www.cabelas.com/product/Cabelas- ... l+Products
> 
> I'm wondering if any tying pros out there would think that the $20.00 or so difference between the two Wapsi kits is worth it.
> 
> Also, I'm wondering if the $100.00 or so difference between the Wapsi Concise kit and the Cabelas Kit is worth it.
> 
> Any thoughts out there?


I tie professionally and I recommend the Wapsi Deluxe all the time. Every single fly in that kit is a keeper. It is WAPSI. The tools are good, the material is great.
I tied on a $15.00 vise for many years till it broke. I have been using a Renzettti for over 25 years and would never get rid of it. I would take a NOR however :lol: 
If you tie much, a rotary is worth it's weight in gold. Trying to do a dubbing loop with out is insane. Not that you will always use the rotary, but so worth it when you do. Sometimes being able to work on a fly from different angles is a must.


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## Frito

If you're up for some reading, we have a "Fly Tying 101" section on our website and it covers some of the aspects of what you're asking. There's a lot more in there, but poke around and you might find something: http://www.flyfishfood.com/p/fly-tying-class.html


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