# Monroe Mountain bull



## wyoming2utah (Sep 12, 2007)

Does anyone have an LE tag for Monroe Mountain? IF so, you should definitely be looking for the monster 9x15 that is running around up there...I took this picture with a cell phone of the bull and hope some lucky DIY hunter can get him! Word is that the bull is already sporting over 400 inches of horn..lots of speculation on how big he really is...for me, he looks big enough!


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## dkhntrdstn (Sep 7, 2007)

i got link from my wife boss with that bull. mossback already watching him and a guy that has the gov tag is going after him. her is the link http://www.mossback.com/ it the bull on the front vedio. injoy. by the way my wife boss lives down there and has seen this bull with his own eyes.


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

WY2UT, glad you are still alive, you had me worried. 8)

I know many don't like Mossback, but there is a short video clip of this bull on the Mossback website: http://www.mossback.com/


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## PBH (Nov 7, 2007)

People in Monroe are doing what they can to keep Mossback away from the bull.



I agree with W2U -- I hope a Do-it-yourselfer gets to whack this bull!


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## dkhntrdstn (Sep 7, 2007)

my understanding is it on privit land.


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

PBH said:


> People in Monroe are doing what they can to keep Mossback away from the bull.
> 
> I agree with W2U -- I hope a Do-it-yourselfer gets to whack this bull!


How mature and 'ethical'. :? :roll:

For the record, I hope a crippled old long bow hunter takes the monster. :|


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## dkhntrdstn (Sep 7, 2007)

proutdoors said:


> PBH said:
> 
> 
> > People in Monroe are doing what they can to keep Mossback away from the bull.
> ...


Are you meaning TEX  :lol: Just joking buddy o tex.


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

TEX isn't 'man' enough to hunt with a long bow, he wimped out and hunts with a recurve, freakin cheater!

What is PBH/WY2UT's definition of a DIY hunter? Just curious. :?


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## chet (Sep 7, 2007)

I hope he migrates and Pro and COTW both get ten yard shots and MISS!!! Then he migrates some more and i find his sheds!!!!!!! :twisted:


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

chet said:


> I hope he migrates and Pro and COTW both get ten yard shots and MISS!!! Then he migrates some more and i find his sheds!!!!!!! :twisted:


I could live with that. 8) :mrgreen: <<--O/


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## Bullcrazy (Dec 28, 2007)

I have a brother with a tag. I hope the bull moves east into the thick stuff and no one gets him. With everyone after him we should have the rest of the mountain to ourselves.


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

Bullcrazy said:


> I have a brother with a tag. I hope the bull moves east into the thick stuff and no one gets him. With everyone after him we should have the rest of the mountain to ourselves.


Best of luck, and hopefully the 'spider' circus won't mess up your hunt.


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## Anaconda Pintler (Oct 29, 2007)

proutdoors said:


> PBH said:
> 
> 
> > People in Monroe are doing what they can to keep Mossback away from the bull.
> ...


besides that Tex is a puss he could get far enough off the road to kill that thing! :wink: :wink: JK buddy!

Pro that is very thoughtful of you, but first off I am not really crippled sssshhh, I just walk like that cuz of workman's comp :lol: But I think I would rather take a nice typical! :mrgreen:


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## Bullcrazy (Dec 28, 2007)

[/quote]Best of luck, and hopefully the 'spider' circus won't mess up your hunt.[/quote]

Thanks Pro, good luck to you also. It's getting close.


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

Yeah buddy! *()* *()* *()* *()* *()* *OOO* <<--O/ -/O\- -()/-


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

Anaconda Pintler said:


> Pro that is very thoughtful of you, but first off I am not really crippled sssshhh, I just walk like that cuz of workman's comp :lol: But I think I would rather take a nice typical! :mrgreen:


I'm blowing the whistle! 

I agree, I would take a symmetrical 6X6 over this bull in a heart beat. I like clean beams with long tines and a solid whale tail. 8)


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## Cold Track (Sep 11, 2007)

My brother also has a tag, maybe we'll be the lucky guys to find him. Two years ago I seen a bull with this same similar rack in a smaller toned down version. I thought you said Monroe isn't worth hunting for a real big bull Pro!


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

Cold Track said:


> I thought you said Monroe isn't worth hunting for a real big bull Pro!


I said there are SEVERAL LE units that have MORE top end bulls on them than the Monroe including the Fish Lake unit, and I stand by that. One bull does NOT make a unit. Knowing this bull is on the Monroe, I still would NOT trade my Dutton tag for a Monroe tag for this year, and I KNOW right where this bull is hanging out at this time. :shock:


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## utbowhntr (Sep 11, 2007)

I'm going after him this weekend with a wristrocket and a pocket full of steelies!


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## EvenOlderFudd (Jun 18, 2008)

MOSS BACK Great Bull.


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

EvenOlderFudd said:


> MOSS BACK// If you want a crack at this beauty and you have a tag that has taken you 10 years to draw. Cough up an extra 10,000 20.000 30.000 dollars, give up your first born. Or just get another home loan, Park a white ford truck accross the road. Make sure you get everything on viedo, so some one can profit off it. and then call yourself a HUNTER,, MOSSBACK . Hunting is not a rich mans sport??.


Put the glue bottle down already, Mossback drives a Dodge.  :roll:


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## chet (Sep 7, 2007)

If you see Mossback doing ANYTHING illegal..... helicopters, locking gates, blocking roads (dead elk excluded) PLEASE take a picture so you can have proof. I am soooooo sick of the jealous Joe Blow Hard that runs his mouth about this kind of bull shiz! :evil: 
Catch him in the act and show me proof! Then you can bad mouth all you want. Until then please climb off your cross, build a bridge with the wood, and GET OVER IT!!!

I for one am very excited to see the next Legends of the Fall, because I know, no matter who kills this magnificent animal, Doyle will have quite a story to share with us.


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

chet said:


> If you see Mossback doing ANYTHING illegal..... helicopters, locking gates, blocking roads (dead elk excluded) PLEASE take a picture so you can have proof. I am soooooo sick of the jealous Joe Blow Hard that runs his mouth about this kind of bull shiz! :evil:
> Catch him in the act and show me proof! Then you can bad mouth all you want. Until then please climb off your cross, build a bridge with the wood, and GET OVER IT!!!
> 
> I for one am very excited to see the next Legends of the Fall, because I know, no matter who kills this magnificent animal, Doyle will have quite a story to share with us.


+1 MILLION!


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## EvenOlderFudd (Jun 18, 2008)

Chet. Man! 


CAN"T WE ALL JUST GET ALONG??


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## coyoteslayer (Sep 10, 2007)

I hope no one gets this huge bull this year and I draw the **** tag next year and shoot him during the archery hunt with a rifle. :lol: BTW that is legal for me because I get 30 extra days either before the hunt or after.


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## coyoteslayer (Sep 10, 2007)

That my friends and foes would make an awesome story. (ME) Coyoteslayer :lol: The wheelchair huntin fool slams a big bull from a wheelchair *()* *()* *()* *()* *()* *()* *()* *()* *()* *()* *()* *()* *()* *()* *()* *(())* *(())* *(())* *(())* <<--O/ _O\ _O\


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## coyoteslayer (Sep 10, 2007)

Hell if I drew an LE archery tag then my HUNT would start next week


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## coyoteslayer (Sep 10, 2007)

And if i drew a rifle tag then my hunt could actually start before the archery hunt because of the 30 day extension    :mrgreen:


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## coyoteslayer (Sep 10, 2007)

Which brings my next point. What if an archery hunter (dont get mad at me archery hunters) was sneaking up on this bull and ME (coyoteslayer) dropped the bull in his tracks at 200yds before you (the bow hunter) could blink and eye.

How would you react if I did such a thing???? Sorry I really wouldn't do this unless the bull was huge but then again I wouldnt pull the trigger unless the bull was huge so I would be tempted to drop him before you got within bow range.

Again your react to the situation???


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## coyoteslayer (Sep 10, 2007)

> I'd give them to coyoteslayer.


No fatbass we would be road hunting with mullets and you would have a tag and I would slam on the brakes and you would shoot the sucka and I would even watch you perform the gutless method.


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## coyoteslayer (Sep 10, 2007)

> Does anyone have an LE tag for Monroe Mountain? IF so, you should definitely be looking for the monster 9x15 that is running around up there...I took this picture with a cell phone of the bull and hope some lucky DIY hunter can get him! Word is that the bull is already sporting over 400 inches of horn..lots of speculation on how big he really is...for me, he looks big enough!


Wyo2ut this bull wont be a DIY hunt. The person who shoots this bull will have help from family and friends or guides which ISNT the defination of a DIYourself hunt. What is wrong with guides, OR family and friends helping??? ABSOLUTELY NOTHING!!!! GET OVER THIS DIY B.S.

Wyo2ut, I thought you were just dust in the wind  Im kiddin.

wYO2UT Im in a wheelchair and have shot some great deer and antelope and I did have help so are my hunts considered DIY or cheating???


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## Riverrat77 (Sep 7, 2007)

You know... it honestly won't matter who shoots this bull or how. The whole circus around this freak of nature is already taking away from the hunt and the animal as far as I'm concerned. CS is right in that this bull won't be taken by one guy with a scope bedding this bull and going in for a shot. There are too many other folks thinking they "deserve" this bull for whatever reason they may have so somebody will do something stupid and ruin it for another person out of selfishness. It'll wind up harassed, chased, dogged to death until it just can't run anymore and then somebody and their crew, posse, family or whatever will close in and finish off the bull thats half dead from running anyway. Ridiculous?? Yeah, absolutely. This kind of bull deserves better than the fate awaiting him come hunting season. Unfortunately, I think all that will be long forgotten, trampled on by greed and desire to be "the man" in everyone's eyes until the next big thing rolls around. Oh well... at least they don't hunt where I will be but I'm pretty sure we'll get our fill of stories about "I'm pissed off at so and so because" once this bull hits the dirt. Great bull in line for a not so great ending. :|


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## coyoteslayer (Sep 10, 2007)

That is very true River77. Wyo2ut, PBH, Olderelmer act like they own the mountain and they want to do anything to keep Mossback from getting this bull? Will fist fights occur on the Monroe this year??? This bull already has a death warrant and many, many, many people will be looking for him.

Wyo2ut, you claim that mossback chases people off the mountain or away from trophy animals, but you are the biggest hypocrite because you want to do the very same thing.


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## FishlakeElkHunter (Sep 11, 2007)

I think it is GREAT that this bull is up there this year.......My uncle has a Monroe Muzzy tag, and I have been spending a TON of time up there. I have seen this bull with my OWN eyes....he is very nice. But the great thing is, is that EVERYONE is watching this bull.........and leaving the rest of the mountain ALONE!!!! I have seen over 100 branch antlered bulls and I have seen some MONSTERS!!!! I hope that everyone just goes and chases this bull and leaves the "LITTLE" bulls to us!

Hey wyo2ut.....you say this pic came from YOUR cell phone???? I know where this pic came from and it was off a video.......???????????


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## coyoteslayer (Sep 10, 2007)

> Hey wyo2ut.....you say this pic came from YOUR cell phone???? I know where this pic came from and it was off a video.......???????????


Wyo2ut has one of those cellphones with a high powered zoom lense or he took the picture with his cellphone through a spotting scope.


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## Treehugnhuntr (Sep 7, 2007)

chet said:


> I hope he migrates and Pro and COTW both get ten yard shots and MISS!!! Then he migrates some more and i find his sheds!!!!!!! :twisted:


Haha! You remember that conversation Bart?


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## elkfromabove (Apr 20, 2008)

Leave him alone and let him have lots of babies and then you can all shoot one in the coming hunts when you finally draw!!!

Lee


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## UintaMan (Sep 16, 2007)

EvenOlderFudd said:


> MOSS BACK// If you want a crack at this beauty and you have a tag that has taken you 10 years to draw. Cough up an extra 10,000 20.000 30.000 dollars, give up your first born. Or just get another home loan, Park a white ford truck accross the road. Make sure you get everything on viedo, so some one can profit off it. and then call yourself a HUNTER,, MOSSBACK . Hunting is not a rich mans sport??.


Here we go again! :roll:


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## PlantMAN (Oct 26, 2007)

We need to remember that it is the *Utah Wildlife *that brings all the outfitter guiding money to Utah. One could not exist without the other. :wink:


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## PBH (Nov 7, 2007)

coyoteslayer said:


> Wyo2ut this bull wont be a DIY hunt. The person who shoots this bull will have help from family and friends or guides which ISNT the defination of a DIYourself hunt. What is wrong with guides, OR family and friends helping???


I can't stand the guiding stuff. Family and friends is EXACTLY how this should happen. I hope whoever gets this bull does it with his family and friends, and doesn't have to $$$ spend $$$ andy $$$ money $$$ for $$$ whatever $$$ help $$$ he/she $$$ gets $$$.

See the difference?

Pro -- that's what I call a DIY hunt. You don't have to pay for your help.

We fish B.C. nearly every year. We have never had to rely on guide services to figure out the area we fish, and learn how to fish it. We've done it all through our own hard work and efforts, and we are to the point of actually knowing what we are doing.

I'm the kind of person that enjoys the fruits of my own labor.


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## PBH (Nov 7, 2007)

coyoteslayer said:


> wYO2UT Im in a wheelchair and have shot some great deer and antelope and I did have help so are my hunts considered DIY or cheating???


How much did you have to pay to get someone to help you?


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

PBH said:


> coyoteslayer said:
> 
> 
> > wYO2UT Im in a wheelchair and have shot some great deer and antelope and I did have help so are my hunts considered DIY or cheating???
> ...


Myself and other GUIDES did it for FREE! :shock:

I am fine with liking to do it w/o a guide, good on you. But, what does that have to do with ANYTHING? I like to bow hunt ONLY, so should I have the stance that ALL other types of hunting are bad/wrong? Isn't that a little bit elitist? Why is having 10 friends "Do It *Yourself*", but having a PAID guide or two "ruining the sport"? Nonsensical hypocrisy at it's worst!


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## Derek4747 (Jun 23, 2008)

Can the guy with the governers tag hunt before the start of the archery season?


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

Derek4747 said:


> Can the guy with the governers tag hunt before the start of the archery season?


NO!!


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## Derek4747 (Jun 23, 2008)

That's cool. I didn't know the season length on a tag like that. Thanks


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

EvenOlderFudd said:


> . Also he was driving a White Ford down on the Phavant a year ago.
> 
> CAN"T WE ALL JUST GET ALONG??


Not true, he hasn't owned/driven a Ford since 2005. :?

We can get along a lot better when people STOP spreading LIES/stories/gossip with out an OUNCE of PROOF. :idea: What a concept eh?

Derek, the Governors tag is good from September 1 through January 15. 8)


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## PBH (Nov 7, 2007)

proutdoors said:


> Myself and other GUIDES did it for FREE! :shock:


that's great! Especially when done for people in similar situations as coyote.

I wonder if Doyle would do that?


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

PBH said:


> proutdoors said:
> 
> 
> > Myself and other GUIDES did it for FREE! :shock:
> ...


If you ever bothered getting educated about the man and didn't speak with complete IGNORANCE you would know that he does, and HAS. In fact, Doyle paid for coyoteslayers hotel/food for his Book Cliffs LE deer hunt. He also carried the Sportsman tag holder on HIS BACK up a big ridge to get the disabled hunter into position for a monster buck on the Henries, not exactly flat terrain down there. All that hunt was down on Doyle's dime as well. He does things like that fairly regularly. Shocking isn't it, the man is a human just like you/me.


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## chet (Sep 7, 2007)

> I wonder if Doyle would do that?


OMFH!!!

Bart, would you please enlighten us with the details of coyote slayers hunt as well as mr Gihradelli's hunt (sorry bout the sp richard)


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## chet (Sep 7, 2007)

woops too late, **** pro, you're gettin fast in your old age :lol:


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

chet said:


> woops too late, **** pro, you're gettin fast in your old age :lol:


 :mrgreen:


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## coyoteslayer (Sep 10, 2007)

> How much did you have to pay to get someone to help you?


Doyle guide wouldnt even accept a tip from me after the 12 day hunt. Well my dad and brothers just want a Big gulp after they help me on hunts. I have offered to tip people everytime I go on a special trip. Sometimes they take the tips and some reject them.

PBH, so you wouldn't you be fine with Doyle killing world class elk? What is wrong with paying someone for a service they provide??? I pay to get my oil changed. People pay for construction on homes, plumbing, landscaping etc. because people offer this type of service. So why should guiding be any different???

PBH I just think it all boils down to jealousy


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## Treehugnhuntr (Sep 7, 2007)

coyoteslayer said:


> > How much did you have to pay to get someone to help you?
> 
> 
> Doyle guide wouldnt even accept a tip from me after the 12 day hunt. Well my dad and brothers just want a Big gulp after they help me on hunts. I have offered to tip people everytime I go on a special trip. Sometimes they take the tips and some reject them.
> ...


While I agree with you on guiding not being a big deal, that's a fairly big speculation to throw out on the table. Everyone has their reasons for agreeing/disagreeing or likes/dislikes, but they are only opinions and valid to each and every person owning those opinions and feelings.

Let's not get into Doyle bashing anymore, he's not here to defend himself against unsubstantiated claims, Everyone chill out.


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## chet (Sep 7, 2007)

I think that if we had a "flippin the bird" smiley, everyone would get along much better. 8)


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## UintaMan (Sep 16, 2007)

PBH said:


> proutdoors said:
> 
> 
> > Myself and other GUIDES did it for FREE! :shock:
> ...


As if you hadn't already informed us of this with your previous posts on this topic, you have now officially displayed that you have no idea what you are talking about! It kind of sucks to shoot yourself in the foot so to speak and loose all credibility in just a few words. If you know nothing about Doyle Moss or his company, how can you be so ignorant as to come on this forum and spew speculative BS out of your pie hole regarding him as a person and or businessman? Speculative BS being (anything spewing out of your pie hole without any kind of facts to support the spewage, of course the underlying issue here could be that you have been diagnosed with the buggsz24 syndrome) Are you two related? :roll:


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

UintaMan said:


> PBH said:
> 
> 
> > proutdoors said:
> ...


  *(u)*


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## weatherby25 (Sep 10, 2007)

I just want the mossback guys to guide me on my spike hunt. They can block roads use coppters or what ever it takes.


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

weatherby25 said:


> I just want the mossback guys to guide me on my spike hunt. They can block roads use coppters or what ever it takes.


All yours for $2500.00 a day, 10 day minimum. :mrgreen:


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## High Country (Apr 27, 2008)

I might be new to this forum, however, we have a tag for Monroe this year and have hunted this mountain for deer and elk for 30 years. I don't care what Doyle does as long as it is legal. If I find a truck or trailer blocking the road(which I have heard has happened) I WILL hook a chain to it and move it out of my way and continue hunting. That is illegal.

Just for the record, I know where this bull is and Doyle won't be alone hunting him. We will also not take $10,000 from him to stay away either.


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

High Country, first congrats on a great tag. Second, don't believe the STORIES about roads being blocked, it does NOT happen, at least not by Doyle and crew. Third, if anyone is hoping for a $10,000 payoff to not hunt this bull they will be deeply disappointed. Fourth, I hope you have a great hunt and have an enjoyable time pursuing the 'trophy' of your dreams, whatever that 'trophy' may be.


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## TAK (Sep 9, 2007)

High Country said:


> I might be new to this forum, however, we have a tag for Monroe this year and have hunted this mountain for deer and elk for 30 years. I don't care what Doyle does as long as it is legal. If I find a truck or trailer blocking the road(which I have heard has happened) I WILL hook a chain to it and move it out of my way and continue hunting. That is illegal.
> 
> Just for the record, I know where this bull is and Doyle won't be alone hunting him. We will also not take $10,000 from him to stay away either.


Man I like your style!!!! I don't think you will have to worry about anything like that happening. I would guess this Mosewhatever has got to know that every fish cop from Utah will be watching him and his clan! Not to mention every cop possible!!!
Hope ya get him, love to see a real hunter plug it rather than $$$$$


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## coyoteslayer (Sep 10, 2007)

> Hope ya get him, love to see a real hunter plug it rather than $$$$$


What your defination of a REAL hunter??? Jimmy Ryan and Ron Skoronski are Real hunters and probably can out hunt most of the people on here.


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## coyoteslayer (Sep 10, 2007)

Plus I probably would guess this bull is very smart. After all where was he last year? Surely he was just as impressive last year as this year's rack. I guess this goes to show that even wild elk have the same funky genes for growing weird antlers. 

So do ranch raised bulls grow funky antlers because of their feed or genes or both?


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## UintaMan (Sep 16, 2007)

TAK said:


> High Country said:
> 
> 
> > I might be new to this forum, however, we have a tag for Monroe this year and have hunted this mountain for deer and elk for 30 years. I don't care what Doyle does as long as it is legal. If I find a truck or trailer blocking the road(which I have heard has happened) I WILL hook a chain to it and move it out of my way and continue hunting. That is illegal.
> ...


Is it safe to assume you consider yourself as fitting into the REAL HUNTER category as apposed to the FAKE HUNTER category? Or what exactly do you call someone whom you believe not to be a real hunter? Because someone has money now and is willing to spend it on whatever they want to enjoy their life, that justifies not considering them a real hunter? :roll:


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## TAK (Sep 9, 2007)

coyoteslayer said:


> > Hope ya get him, love to see a real hunter plug it rather than $$$$$
> 
> 
> What your defination of a REAL hunter??? Jimmy Ryan and Ron Skoronski are Real hunters and probably can out hunt most of the people on here.


All I am saying is I have to go and scout for myself, do the leg work, plan the trips on and on..... Just don't see the sport in having someone take all the fun of the hunt away and say he will be here at this time, walking at this pace, scratch his butt this way, he likes his eggs lightly turned and hates the yoke broke, loves long walks with all the cows...... Just would like to see a guy that puts the time in take an animal like this rather than some $$$$$$ feller get jetted in, stood in a spot and let er fly..... Some hunt, worth every penny!


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## TAK (Sep 9, 2007)

UintaMan said:


> TAK said:
> 
> 
> > High Country said:
> ...


OK well enough.... I would not consider a feller that does nothing but pays the $$$$ to take an animal like this, just not a real "Good" hunter.... Before thinking I am jeoleus, I still would not pay to have someone guide me to him if I had a tag! But believe me when I do, the time will be spent with friends looking for the biggest SOB that that Unit will hold, and when the day comes that I take a animal like this I can say it cost me blood, sweat and 14 and counting years to get him!


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

TAK said:


> All I am saying is I have to go and scout for myself, do the leg work, plan the trips on and on..... Just don't see the sport in having someone take all the fun of the hunt away and say he will be here at this time, walking at this pace, scratch his butt this way, he likes his eggs lightly turned and hates the yoke broke, loves long walks with all the cows...... Just would like to see a guy that puts the time in take an animal like this rather than some $$$$$$ feller get jetted in, stood in a spot and let er fly..... Some hunt, worth every penny!


I have guided SEVERAL of these 'money shooters' and have yet to have ONE that had a hunt anywhere near what you described. Nice fiction, are you a professional fiction writer or just a wanna be? :roll:


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## coyoteslayer (Sep 10, 2007)

> All I am saying is I have to go and scout for myself, do the leg work, plan the trips on and on..... Just don't see the sport in having someone take all the fun of the hunt away and say he will be here at this time, walking at this pace, scratch his butt this way, he likes his eggs lightly turned and hates the yoke broke, loves long walks with all the cows...... Just would like to see a guy that puts the time in take an animal like this rather than some $$$$$$ feller get jetted in, stood in a spot and let er fly..... Some hunt, worth every penny!


TAK you make it sound like the rich guy just rolls out of bed in the morning and they have the elk or deer tied to a tree and he just walks up and shoots him. This simply is not the case.

When I hunt in Wyoming and Colorado then I have local guys doing the scouting for me. I don't have the time to drive back and forth to these two states. I still have a hunt of a lifetime regardless if I was involved in their pre-season scouting or not. This is kind of like the rich guys but they are paying guys mega bucks to find these animals because they may live in another state and dont have the time to scout or they simply dont know the area. This doesn't make me any less of a hunter and it doesnt make the rich guys any less of hunters.

Many rich guys pay others to do the scouting for them.

If you took a trip to Alaska or Africa then of course you would be very smart to hire a guide because it increases your odds of harvesting an animal.

Maybe you TAK would fly to alaska every weekend to scout, but personally like i said I would hire a guide. Th


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## TAK (Sep 9, 2007)

proutdoors said:


> TAK said:
> 
> 
> > All I am saying is I have to go and scout for myself, do the leg work, plan the trips on and on..... Just don't see the sport in having someone take all the fun of the hunt away and say he will be here at this time, walking at this pace, scratch his butt this way, he likes his eggs lightly turned and hates the yoke broke, loves long walks with all the cows...... Just would like to see a guy that puts the time in take an animal like this rather than some $$$$$$ feller get jetted in, stood in a spot and let er fly..... Some hunt, worth every penny!
> ...


Pro..... First lets get this out! I have no problem with those who guide, great more power to them it is a job that is better than most! I am just saying that there is so much more joy and reward in taking an animal that you did the leg work... Am I right or wrong? This Bull in question I am sure has eyes on him about 24 hours a day and it aint the eyes of this "HUNTER" that is paying for the service to get this bull.... Right or Wrong! As said in the many posts they are just worried that your man Moss does it legal. If I recall from times ago you yourself had said that Moss and crew had a bull located out in the books and had eyes on him well before the season began.....
I have mixed opionions about this type of hunting, I even have an uncle that spends this type of money to get animals like this, has a house full of giant and wonderfull mounts, but I promise you he did not walk not 100 yard to take any of them, but has ran a pen or 10 dry writing the checks....
Sorry but I would rather hear some "HUNTER" that put the time in rather than the money in to get this bull....

Fiction writer? Been called a Bull****ter a time or two!


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## TAK (Sep 9, 2007)

coyoteslayer said:


> > All I am saying is I have to go and scout for myself, do the leg work, plan the trips on and on..... Just don't see the sport in having someone take all the fun of the hunt away and say he will be here at this time, walking at this pace, scratch his butt this way, he likes his eggs lightly turned and hates the yoke broke, loves long walks with all the cows...... Just would like to see a guy that puts the time in take an animal like this rather than some $$$$$$ feller get jetted in, stood in a spot and let er fly..... Some hunt, worth every penny!
> 
> 
> TAK you make it sound like the rich guy just rolls out of bed in the morning and they have the elk or deer tied to a tree and he just walks up and shoots him. This simply is not the case.
> ...


If it sounds like they just roll out of bed then that must be what it is...... You are right I would not be tripping very far to do scouting if I had a out of state tag, yet I don't hunt big game out of state! However I do birds and 99.% or the time it is from the hip! OK there was the trip to AZ this year met up with a friend that lives there. He told me head that way.... I did, it was me dogs, my gun and my boots that did the work.

Again I am not saying GUIDES are bad, I am not even ragging on Moss, I am just saying I hope some guy that did some leg work and this trophey will be more of a life time hunt than just another head mount in some office!

And to stir this chit up a bit... You know **** well this guy Moss is working for has only seen pictures and vids and was told a price for him! And deep inside you hope some local snot nosed kid sneaks in there and drills it right infront of them!


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## Huge29 (Sep 17, 2007)

For what it is worth, I will second TAK's motion for it to go to a local yocal who has invested a lot of time into the hunt over the big money show up and shoot hunter. What TAK has described does happen, I am fairly familiar with a pretty high caliber guide who has several records to his name as a guide in a couple of categories; he has shared a couple stories exactly the way TAK describes (specifically with mtn lion and antelope with a few celebtrity names that every person would recognize, with pics to prove it), fly in to the local municipal airport in his own personal Cesna about 7 am. Back on that same Cesna at 4 pm with meat in coolers along for the ride. The humor in it all is that those same guys who only have to walk a short distance and then pull the trigger exactly as instructed have second guessed this same guide and were not in the position where they were told to sit and wait; it is incredible that they would not trust the guide who has watched the animal nearly daily for months to have patterns down to a science. Or the guy shooting the would-be-record-animal in the head and cracking the skull plate and therefore disqualifying it for a record, it gets him very hot under the collar :x . He is very passionate about satisfying each client as it is his livelihood, and he does very well at it, I do personally think that it does lessen the experience and the majesty of the great animal. Of course, those stories are only a few, I'm sure that many are not quick like that, but it certainly does happen exactly like TAK describes on occasion.


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

TAK, I have said REPEATEDLY that I hope a 'Average Joe' gets this bull. That is NOT where I take issue with your comments. Pay attention as I type slowly, when you imply the hunter "rolls out of bed" and simply pulls the trigger you are in the Land of Oz. I have been in the 'biz' for 20+ years and have NEVER seen it happen that way, and neither have *you*, you are simply repeating GOSSIP that you heard/read like a magpie. I get MORE enjoyment helping other hunters than I do hunting for myself, that may sound weird/dumb, but that is why I guide. I would gladly do it for free, but when people are willing to give me value for the value I give them it makes it possible to enjoy hunting world class animals EVERY year. I drew a great tag thanks in part to Callofthewild, I want HIM to get a great bull MORE than I want to get me a great bull, and he WILL w/o 'buying' his bull. And, he WILL work for it just as ALL my clients do! The picture you paint of how a guided hunt occurs is as accurate as a painting of a unicorn, BOTH are 100% fictional.


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## TAK (Sep 9, 2007)

fatbass said:


> I gots one question for pro...how much will you be willing to pay your guide when you draw your OIL or LE elk hunt? You couldn't possibly want a DIY elk hunt. That would be against your principles. :wink:


Hey I was thinking of that! I must have not put it to type!


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

fatbass said:


> I gots one question for pro...how much will you be willing to pay your guide when you draw your OIL or LE elk hunt? You couldn't possibly want a DIY elk hunt. That would be against your principles. :wink:


I am 'paying' Callofthewild/swbuckmaster/broadside-shot/treehugginhntr/berg/wapiti67/4X4 bronco/skull krazy, and a few others the PRIVILEGE of spending time with ME. What more could these guys ask for? :mrgreen:


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

huge, does this 'guide' operate on public or private land? Because if he operates on public land and has his hunters kill on the same day they flew in, I WANT to know who he is, so I can STOP that kind of UNETHICAL hunting. I think either he/you are guilty of a little hyperbole, so I am doubting it really happens 'exactly' that way. :?


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## Huge29 (Sep 17, 2007)

proutdoors said:


> huge, does this 'guide' operate on public or private land? Because if he operates on public land and has his hunters kill on the same day they flew in, I WANT to know who he is, so I can STOP that kind of UNETHICAL hunting. I think either he/you are guilty of a little hyperbole, so I am doubting it really happens 'exactly' that way. :?


He swears that it has happened exactly that way, what more can I say? What difference would it make if he flew in the night before shot it at 8 am and was on his way at noon? Again, we are talking about antelope most often, I have two friends who had the exact same experience on a DIY hunt in a car vs plane showed up with no scouting whatsoever and were on their way back home by 11 am with two harvests. Seriously, what difference would it make ethically if it were overnight vs same day? If the animal is ready based on the numerous hours of preparation by the guide and the client only has a short amount of time I would think that that would be acceptable??? But honestly he states that he has same days...again, antelope with a rifle, I might guess that they could be the easiest big game to bag quickly when you have a guide in a limited entry hunt.

Anyways, congrats on the draw, which unit is it? Are you taking all of these guys or are they just all helping in scouting and such? That seems like a lot of folks for archery, but I guess spotters certainly are very helpful. Good luck!


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

Huge29 said:


> Anyways, congrats on the draw, which unit is it? Are you taking all of these guys or are they just all helping in scouting and such? That seems like a lot of folks for archery, but I guess spotters certainly are very helpful. Good luck!


Dutton LE archery elk tag, same as Callofthewild drew, Another friend drew the same tag, so there will be 3 tags to punch, mine being the lowest priority. These guys will/have help scout and help during the hunt, I need EVERY road closed and spotters on EVERY ridge to ensure the bull has no chance of escape when I use the Mossback helicopter to push the bull to Cotw. It will all be 'fair chase' though since we will NOT be hunting the same day we fly in. :shock: :wink:


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## Huge29 (Sep 17, 2007)

proutdoors said:


> Huge29 said:
> 
> 
> > Anyways, congrats on the draw, which unit is it? Are you taking all of these guys or are they just all helping in scouting and such? That seems like a lot of folks for archery, but I guess spotters certainly are very helpful. Good luck!
> ...


I was very serious, congrats, sincerely! I meant that as a totally separate note from where this thread has gone. But, since you went there, it is good that you have such a good sense of humor, I guess the alternative would be prescription drugs from all of the shiz that you catch! Good on ya! BUT, since you have the chopper already, why bother getting your boots dirty? Can't you get a fixed mount arrow flinger from the chopper?

Here is your prayer that you can recite:


> As I lay me down to sleep, I pray the Lord his elk to keep.
> If I should die before I wake , tell the elk they are finally safe.


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## TAK (Sep 9, 2007)

proutdoors said:


> TAK, I have said REPEATEDLY that I hope a 'Average Joe' gets this bull. That is NOT where I take issue with your comments. Pay attention as I type slowly, when you imply the hunter "rolls out of bed" and simply pulls the trigger you are in the Land of Oz. I have been in the 'biz' for 20+ years and have NEVER seen it happen that way, and neither have *you*, you are simply repeating GOSSIP that you heard/read like a magpie. I get MORE enjoyment helping other hunters than I do hunting for myself, that may sound weird/dumb, but that is why I guide. I would gladly do it for free, but when people are willing to give me value for the value I give them it makes it possible to enjoy hunting world class animals EVERY year. I drew a great tag thanks in part to Callofthewild, I want HIM to get a great bull MORE than I want to get me a great bull, and he WILL w/o 'buying' his bull. And, he WILL work for it just as ALL my clients do! The picture you paint of how a guided hunt occurs is as accurate as a painting of a unicorn, BOTH are 100% fictional.


Gossip? MAGPIE? Take a few breaths there big fella! Well kinda sorta seen it... Hows a video big fella?! That would be a personal video and not talking about this stuff you see on TV!
Just maybe you are in the dark on this? DO U really work for Moss..... Tell me this, is the hunter going to set foot on the land before the hunt? I am not talking aboiut the night before either! No he will be set up with camp(that he did not set up) be up at day break and within minutes has a good chance to kill the bull.... Is that not getting out of bed and pulling the trigger? By god if I was paying that type of money I sure as hell better be doing that same thing!

And PRO! Sorry I am painting a picture that you don't like, it is not intended to degrade a service, just is FACT that it happenes more times than not, and with a CREW like MOSE has I am sure it is quick and efficent!

Here is one just for you!

Hi, this is TAK, I am up in the most far out reached mountains of Utah, Kinda looks like Scofield. I have me trusty guide PRO. We are working at getting a monster bull. He has patterned this bull for me for the last two months, each morning he is up in a meadow feeding with 2 other bulls of smaller size. That is what Pro said. The night before festivities were great and fun, I meet some of Utahs best hunters like 25 of them!
We set out this morning for a walk that was for ever and a day. ODD but I think I passes this same tree 4 times... Anyway I am working for it. Then all of the sudden the bull come running out, PRO quick to the call stops him, I take aim.... The ring of the mag sends this bull to the ground! Photo times, me my Trusty guide PRO and all the other great Utah hunters get our picture taken! The walk seems to be much shorter back to the camp than getting there...kinda odd. Before I know it all the meat and me horns are at the camp. 
It is not every day Man and Beast meet like this and Man is the Victor!
THis is copy righted also, you can't use it on any other hunts!


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## TAK (Sep 9, 2007)

proutdoors said:


> fatbass said:
> 
> 
> > I gots one question for pro...how much will you be willing to pay your guide when you draw your OIL or LE elk hunt? You couldn't possibly want a DIY elk hunt. That would be against your principles. :wink:
> ...


Now that is a type of hunt I would pay for, good ol'boys huntin the biguns! Nothing better than pals havin some fun....... :!:


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## ut1031 (Sep 13, 2007)

All I can say is.....you are absolutely correct! You have a great bunch of guys that all want to be part of a GREAT hunt and want nothing more than to see one of their own succeed. I just wish that I was invited to this awesome hunt. 
Kelly


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## coyoteslayer (Sep 10, 2007)

> Hi, this is TAK, I am up in the most far out reached mountains of Utah, Kinda looks like Scofield. I have me trusty guide PRO. We are working at getting a monster bull. He has patterned this bull for me for the last two months, each morning he is up in a meadow feeding with 2 other bulls of smaller size. That is what Pro said. The night before festivities were great and fun, I meet some of Utahs best hunters like 25 of them!
> We set out this morning for a walk that was for ever and a day. ODD but I think I passes this same tree 4 times... Anyway I am working for it. Then all of the sudden the bull come running out, PRO quick to the call stops him, I take aim.... The ring of the mag sends this bull to the ground! Photo times, me my Trusty guide PRO and all the other great Utah hunters get our picture taken! The walk seems to be much shorter back to the camp than getting there...kinda odd. Before I know it all the meat and me horns are at the camp.
> It is not every day Man and Beast meet like this and Man is the Victor!
> THis is copy righted also, you can't use it on any other hunts!


WOW you actually believe this crap that you just wrote. I also hope you realize TAK that when you watch a video then you dont actually see the entire hunt from start to finish. You make it sound soooo simple. I think you have been brainwashed from watching to many videos.

I bet it's rare for Mossback to kill on the first day of the hunt.


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## elkfromabove (Apr 20, 2008)

TAK, I love your idea! I'm going to try it on my wife when she wants to go on a cruise next year when she retires.

"Sorry, honey, but we can't do it 'cause since they do everything and we just lay back and enjoy ourselves, it ain't a "real" vacation and we aren't "real" vacationers. Now, if we were to buy a seaworthy boat and learn to sail and pay for the gas and study the charts, etc.,etc. Now that would be a "real" vacation."

Think it'll work?

Lee


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## goofy elk (Dec 16, 2007)

High Country, I'm so glad to welcome somone with some common sense to this forum, Also TAK , your dead on the money on about how 90% of the guiding situations go down.
Now, for YOTE, to continuously be so defensive and has personaly attacked my posts 30+ times I think the MOD's need to take a serious look at CS posts, They are bring down a very good site, The personal attacks are totaly out of line and un called for.


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## coyoteslayer (Sep 10, 2007)

> TAK, I love your idea! I'm going to try it on my wife when she wants to go on a cruise next year when she retires.
> 
> "Sorry, honey, but we can't do it 'cause since they do everything and we just lay back and enjoy ourselves, it ain't a "real" vacation and we aren't "real" vacationers. Now, if we were to buy a seaworthy boat and learn to sail and pay for the gas and study the charts, etc.,etc. Now that would be a "real" vacation."
> 
> ...


 :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: You might be able to pull that one off!! :lol: :lol:


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## coyoteslayer (Sep 10, 2007)

> I think the MOD's need to take a serious look at CS posts, They are bring down a very good site, The personal attacks are totaly out of line.


 :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: What personal attacks have I made???


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## coyoteslayer (Sep 10, 2007)

Are you talking about the Nebo thread Goofy. You stated your opinion about the unit and I stated mine. If you don't want someone to comment against your statement then dont post one. This is a discussion forum and people post their opinions on topics.

Get over it.


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## goofy elk (Dec 16, 2007)

You have made numerous false accusations and accused me of many things I've never done, I call those personal attacks. On the Nebo pictures thread alone theres 15+ of these statments you have made YOTE.


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## coyoteslayer (Sep 10, 2007)

> You have made numerous false accusations and accused me of many things I've never done, I call those personal attacks. On the Nebo pictures thread alone theres 15+ of these statments you have made YOTE.


Sorry if you took them very personal. I just accused you of saying the Nebo unit is going down hill and you thought I was clueless. You believe it has since 2001 and I dont believe so. Goofy Im sorry if you take things personal and i will try to agree with you sometimes.


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## High Country (Apr 27, 2008)

Man this thread been quite the popular one about $$$$ and guides. Knowing the mountian range and the quality of animals on that mountain is all that you need to harvest a great trophy. For the record, my uncle drew out on monroe 2 years ago after putting in for 20 years, He shot a 360 bull on the 3rd day after passing up bulls every 1/2 hour. 

It does not take $$$$ to kill a great bull, only great friends, dedication, and time spent scouting. We will have 10 friends and family on this hunt this year.

I have drawn a premium muzzleloader take in Nevada this year for deer and I am already starting to see some 30" class bucks on this unit.

Hunting season is just around the corner.


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## coyoteslayer (Sep 10, 2007)

> I have drawn a premium muzzleloader take in Nevada this year for deer and I am already starting to see some 30" class bucks on this unit.
> 
> Hunting season is just around the corner.


Congrats. I hope you kill an awesome buck and post some pictures!!!


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## goofy elk (Dec 16, 2007)

hey High Country, What muzzy hunt? I was on 114 and 115 last November.


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## High Country (Apr 27, 2008)

I drew out for unit 10 which covers all of the Ruby mountains outside of Elko. I just relocated from Utah to Elko, NV last year with my job and put in for the 1st time as a resident. I'm pretty stoked about drawing without any points. I live in Spring Creek, so this unit is in my backyard.


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## TAK (Sep 9, 2007)

coyoteslayer said:


> > Hi, this is TAK, I am up in the most far out reached mountains of Utah, Kinda looks like Scofield. I have me trusty guide PRO. We are working at getting a monster bull. He has patterned this bull for me for the last two months, each morning he is up in a meadow feeding with 2 other bulls of smaller size. That is what Pro said. The night before festivities were great and fun, I meet some of Utahs best hunters like 25 of them!
> > We set out this morning for a walk that was for ever and a day. ODD but I think I passes this same tree 4 times... Anyway I am working for it. Then all of the sudden the bull come running out, PRO quick to the call stops him, I take aim.... The ring of the mag sends this bull to the ground! Photo times, me my Trusty guide PRO and all the other great Utah hunters get our picture taken! The walk seems to be much shorter back to the camp than getting there...kinda odd. Before I know it all the meat and me horns are at the camp.
> > It is not every day Man and Beast meet like this and Man is the Victor!
> > THis is copy righted also, you can't use it on any other hunts!
> ...


Well no it was ment to be fiction!!! PRO likes me writin like this so I thought I would make his day! OK most of it could be true, but there would be lots of beer drinkin if it were me camp!!!! Then we would just tose the can all around, maybe even a live band, I would sing, then we would feed out horses weeded up feed, and then even ride the wheelers everyplace but the trails!
Hey I can tell you are a MOSS lover, that is fine he did you a good job, this post is not directed at him, his name just is mentioned. To him and all guides may all your hunts end on a picture with a trophey animal. My point is that I hope that some "HUNTER' gets the bull, over this guy that is paying to take the animal!

And if MOSS aint killing on the first day in a super dupper area like this, he to aint doin his homework, and all that money has been spent for nothing.... Think about it, get past your love for him and think about it!!!! HE and OTHERS have eyes on this bull at all times, someone right ....NOW is looking at him to make sure where he is and what he is doing... So beat your tighty whities that the second this bull can be taken it will be!


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## TAK (Sep 9, 2007)

elkfromabove said:


> TAK, I love your idea! I'm going to try it on my wife when she wants to go on a cruise next year when she retires.
> 
> "Sorry, honey, but we can't do it 'cause since they do everything and we just lay back and enjoy ourselves, it ain't a "real" vacation and we aren't "real" vacationers. Now, if we were to buy a seaworthy boat and learn to sail and pay for the gas and study the charts, etc.,etc. Now that would be a "real" vacation."
> 
> ...


Well not sure if it will or not? Don't know your wife, but Y don't you introduce her to me and you won't have to worry about going at all!!!!!!!!!

But really I am not talking about getting a service from a guide I am just talking that I want a "Hunter" that does his own Chit 2 take the bull!

Ohh ya buy a few of them really colorfull shirts 2! Then you will be a REAL vacationer!

Now stop being a TARD!


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## coyoteslayer (Sep 10, 2007)

> Well not sure if it will or not? Don't know your wife, but Y don't you introduce her to me and you won't have to worry about going at all!!!!!!!!!
> 
> But really I am not talking about getting a service from a guide I am just talking that I want a "Hunter" that does his own Chit 2 take the bull!
> 
> ...


Now Now TAK, the alcohol is talking again and maybe even goofy will say the MODS need to look at your posts. :lol: :lol:


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## goofy elk (Dec 16, 2007)

High Country, I had a muzzy Ruby tag in 92, Found a couple of real good bucks up high in John day canyon, also spent alot of time in Lizzies basin. Passed on some deer I shoud'nt have. The problem was I also had a Bookcliff elk tag running the same dates that year, I killed my elk but it took longer than exspected and never made it back to the Rubys.


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## UintaMan (Sep 16, 2007)

proutdoors said:


> Huge29 said:
> 
> 
> > Anyways, congrats on the draw, which unit is it? Are you taking all of these guys or are they just all helping in scouting and such? That seems like a lot of folks for archery, but I guess spotters certainly are very helpful. Good luck!
> ...


LMAO, Just let me know if you need some help, I can recruit some boys with those red and blue lights on the top of a vehicle and we can shut the whole **** unit down for you. _O\ :wink:


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

UintaMan said:


> Just let me know if you need some help, I can recruit some boys with those red and blue lights on the top of a vehicle and we can shut the whole **** unit down for you. _O\ :wink:


I may take you up on that offer. *\-\*


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## TAK (Sep 9, 2007)

coyoteslayer said:


> > Well not sure if it will or not? Don't know your wife, but Y don't you introduce her to me and you won't have to worry about going at all!!!!!!!!!
> >
> > But really I am not talking about getting a service from a guide I am just talking that I want a "Hunter" that does his own Chit 2 take the bull!
> >
> ...


Ahh come on you know it was funny... Just how big ol boy is this guy and should I be scared.....


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## TAK (Sep 9, 2007)

What does the Mossback Copter look like? Is it a camo pattern, or is the new stealth stuff that blends in? Ya could call it OPERATION BACKMOSS! Only those with MOSS on there backside(get your mind out of the gutter, talking back hair here!) can ride in it!

And PRO.. You let me down here, never known ya not to comment on something! Come on Bro lets have some more of that good ol fiction!


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

TAK said:


> What does the Mossback Copter look like? Is it a camo pattern, or is the new stealth stuff that blends in? Ya could call it OPERATION BACKMOSS! Only those with MOSS on there backside(get your mind out of the gutter, talking back hair here!) can ride in it!
> 
> And PRO.. You let me down here, never known ya not to comment on something! Come on Bro lets have some more of that good ol fiction!


The Mullet Air Ghost is undetectable to the 'average Joe' and can only been seen/heard by those who have the 'fair chase' by-pass goggles. Since I am unable to grow a mullet any longer, my goggles have been taken away, hence my need to block EVERY road/trail from the general public on my unit to ensure my ability to harvest MY bull w/o fear of a 'commoner' taking MY bull.


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## TAK (Sep 9, 2007)

UintaMan said:


> proutdoors said:
> 
> 
> > Huge29 said:
> ...





> UMwrote: I might be new to this forum, however, we have a tag for Monroe this year and have hunted this mountain for deer and elk for 30 years. I don't care what Doyle does as long as it is legal. If I find a truck or trailer blocking the road(which I have heard has happened) I WILL hook a chain to it and move it out of my way and continue hunting. *That is illegal.*
> Just for the record, I know where this bull is and Doyle won't be alone hunting him. We will also not take $10,000 from him to stay away either.


So... Ya the Pot or the Kettel?


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## TAK (Sep 9, 2007)

"The Mullet Air Ghost" That is good!  

Really I do hope that you and the bro's have a great hunt, me lady's nephew drew a Wastch bow tag and it has just started to get interesting! Just some day I will draw me a tag and have a crack at a nice bull again.


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## HOGAN (Sep 8, 2007)

Imagine not having a whole lot of time to scout and having a tag. That monster steps out! You would blow it from a stroke.


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## bigbr (Oct 24, 2007)

*Too Much Fun!!!...... bull*

I don't think I have had this much entertainment, or wasted more time, since I took three days off and read the ol' One Eye thread.*()* *()* *()* *()* *()*

Since the sticks are out! And the chit pot needs a few more lapse.

I got it from good authority that the King boys got out the mustangs and tore down Maglby's gate and cut the horns of that poor unix of an elk, just so the broke back boys couldn't fly in them fellers in black helicopters in and shoot that elk whiles't they block the road with Ford pickemup trucks........

Sorry Bart, I just could not pass up such an opportunity as this thread afforded to sling a little mud.....

Oh, and just for the record! It is a good thing, some twenty years ago, we pushed a few head of elk off the Forshee and across the road, because had we not pushed something with proper bloodlines over, the Dutton would have nothing but jack rabbits and coyotes. The three amigo's would by pushin wood at volcanic rocks this August, if not for us Piute County backyard Biologists.......*OOO* <<--O/

Bigbr -/O\- -()/- :mrgreen:


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## goofy elk (Dec 16, 2007)

BigBR, Did you happen to know Garth "COUGAR" Robertson? (hope I spelled it right)
I would say he was the all time king of that Dutton country, Met him and his family several times while hunting dutton and Monroe during the 90s. The last time I saw him was in 2001 cutting fire wood at the head of Hoodie creek with his great grand daughters. I heard he passed away, He sure loved that mountain.


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## coyoteslayer (Sep 10, 2007)

> BigBR, Did you happen to know Garth "COUGAR" Robertson? (hope I spelled it right)
> I would say he was the all time king of that Dutton country, Met him and his family several times while hunting dutton and Monroe during the 90s. The last time I saw him was in 2002 cutting fire wood at the head of Hoodie creek with his great grand daughters. I heard he passed away, He sure loved that mountain.


I heard Proutdoors was the all time king of the Dutton. He knows every rock and tree by their last names. Im sorry to hear about your friend Goofy. Im sure he left behind a great legacy. I heard that Pro sometimes marks his territory so the "average joe" stays clear of the area. Some say the mountain where Pro roams is haunted but I will leave that up to your imagination.

*Ole Goofy, give me a home, where the buffalo roam, and the deer and the antelope play. Where seldom I post some discouraging words to my ole buddy Goofy the elk whisper. I meant him no harm cuz he lives on a farm and the skies are not cloudy all day......*

*-band-*


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## Derek4747 (Jun 23, 2008)

With all the attention the "Spider" bull is getting, I'm surprised nobody is trying to sell the info on where he's at on ebay or ksl. :lol: Haha


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## bird buster (May 25, 2008)

I wasn't going to share my plan, but what the hell. I've hooked up a remote GPS signal to Mossbacks truck, gun, binos, and H20 bladder. So I don't even have to scout for this bull, everyone else is doing it for me. The price of fuel has kept home, but don't think I don't know where this bull is :evil: . Oh yeah, he's not the only one I keeping tabs on, just one of the many. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: just call me "BIG BROTHER"


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## elkfromabove (Apr 20, 2008)

TAK said:


> coyoteslayer said:
> 
> 
> > > Well not sure if it will or not? Don't know your wife, but Y don't you introduce her to me and you won't have to worry about going at all!!!!!!!!!
> ...


Tak, You don't have to worry about me doing physical harm to you. I'm a 67 year old man, retired, 145 lbs, out of shape, don't know martial arts, and have never been inclined to fight, though I was forced into some when I was a kid. (I whipped every one of them, except my older brother.)

I prefer to fight with my intellect and wry sense of humor, and by the looks of things, I have the upper hand with you.

BTW, I worked with "TARDS" in the local pool as a teacher's aide and was a volunteer Aquatics Coach for Special Olympics and I loved working with those kids 'cause they are some of the funnest, funniest, happiest, friendliest, and even cleverest people I know. I am proud to be their friend. Even to this day most of them give me hugs when I meet them at Walmart or wherever, so I appreciate your compliment in that regard.

And BTW, My wife declined the offer to meet you 'cause she said we've already raised six children to adulthood and she doesn't want to raise another one.

Back to the discussion at hand. At what point financially and/or time spent scouting/practicing/getting ready, method of hunting does a HUNTER become a non-HUNTER? Do you consider distance to the hunting area, method of getting to there, who's doing the cooking, where the hunter sleeps, the actual costs as part of the equation? What about the time and effort spent earning the money for the trip? Your definition of a HUNTER is so vague it's hard to tell what you're upset about. I suspect your definition of a HUNTER is someone who is pretty much just like you. He has to make and spend about the some amount of money, take the same amount of time pursuing the hunt, take the same chances on the draw, and not use his hard earned money to his advantage over others. This discussion, like many others on this forum, isn't about "wildlife" per se, it's about money and who has it and who doesn't and what they are doing with it regarding wildlife.

That bull will indeed be taken by a HUNTER who has legally and ethically done whatever it took to get it. Just because he/she took a completely different route than what you're comfortable with, doesn't make them any less worthy of taking that bull. If you or anyone else wants that bull bad enough you're more than welcome to do the same.

And one thing everyone seems to forget. Knowing where that bull is isn't the same as getting him broadside within 30 yards. He ain't big because he's stupid!!


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

elkfromabove, that post is pure poetry! Well done and well said. Thank you for your "wit and humor" on the subject. Your points on money are 100% dead on out of the ball park stuff.


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## marksman (Oct 4, 2007)

I can understand how it would be frustrating to someone who has been waiting 15 years to draw a tag and then spent all their free time for a whole summer trying to scout for a big buck to see someone just buy a tag and pay someone to scout for them then just show up one weekend and get a huge bull.


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

marksman said:


> I can understand how it would be frustrating to someone who has been waiting 15 years to draw a tag and then spent all their free time for a whole summer trying to scout for a big buck to see someone just buy a tag and pay someone to scout for them then just show up one weekend and get a huge bull.


I hear you, it's like saving for 15 years to be able to go to Hawaii and then run into someone who goes every year, ticks me off!! :evil: :roll: I thought that scouting was half the fun, so the guy who spent the "whole summer" scouting is the 'lucky' one, right? :?


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## weatherby25 (Sep 10, 2007)

> I can understand how it would be frustrating to someone who has been waiting 15 years to draw a tag and then spent all their free time for a whole summer trying to scout for a big buck to see someone just buy a tag and pay someone to scout for them then just show up one weekend and get a huge bull.


But why can that person not save a little bit of money for that 15 year's while waiting there 15 years then hire mossback to help them with there 400 bull. I have no need to shoot a 350+ bull so I will hunt areas that can but normally do not hold them. I also for that very same reason would not ever hire a guide(other then the spike hunt PRO is taking me on) If I was putting in for units that took me more then 10 years or longer to draw you better belilve I would do all I can to make it the hunt it should be. I might not be in favor of guides but If it took me that long to draw and knowing it was my only chance to hunt it then I would also be planning on the guide service to make sure I get that once in a liftime bull.


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## marksman (Oct 4, 2007)

weatherby25 said:


> But why can that person not save a little bit of money for that 15 year's while waiting there 15 years then hire mossback to help them with there 400 bull. I have no need to shoot a 350+ bull so I will hunt areas that can but normally do not hold them. I also for that very same reason would not ever hire a guide(other then the spike hunt PRO is taking me on) If I was putting in for units that took me more then 10 years or longer to draw you better belilve I would do all I can to make it the hunt it should be. I might not be in favor of guides but If it took me that long to draw and knowing it was my only chance to hunt it then I would also be planning on the guide service to make sure I get that once in a liftime bull.


I think there's 2 things going on here. First of all some people work there buts off and will never be able to save enough money to pay mossback to guide their hunt. Yes maybe they could save enough to pay him but when the time comes and they are presented with buying a hunt or a new car they need I hope most people would choose to spend the money on the necessity instead of the luxury. For most people that's just alot of money. The second thing is that just because someone can save up the money and didn't doesn't mean they won't feel frustrated. One of the things mentioned here is that no one knows how hard that person worked to earn the money to pay for the tag and hunting service. That's true and in fact that's why other hunters that picked the put in for the draw and scout yourself route are going to be frustrated it's because they don't know what the other hunter went through he hasn't been around through the whole process so they'll assume he hasn't been their working for it. That may be a false assumption but all I said was that I can understand why they feel the way they do. In the Hawaii example I don't know what sacrifices that person has made in their life to go to Hawaii every year but I may be frustrated anyway.


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## elkfromabove (Apr 20, 2008)

You certainly have the right to be frustrated, but not at the person who's got the hunt. Look in the mirror!!!


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## marksman (Oct 4, 2007)

elkfromabove said:


> You certainly have the right to be frustrated, but not at the person who's got the hunt. Look in the mirror!!!


I'm not saying I'm frustrated in fact I am very new to hunting and have only been putting in for 2 years now. I understand that there are opportunities that only the wealthy can afford and the rest of us must wait for. That's life. I was just saying that I understand why people have the feelings they have. If you have never felt frustrated because someone else got an opportunity that you wanted then you are a rare individual indeed.

BTW love the personal attack. :wink:


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

marksman said:


> I'm not saying I'm frustrated in fact I am very new to hunting and have only been putting in for 2 years now. I understand that there are opportunities that only the wealthy can afford and the rest of us must wait for. That's life. I was just saying that I understand why people have the feelings they have. If you have never felt frustrated because someone else got an opportunity that you wanted then you are a rare individual indeed.
> 
> BTW love the personal attack. :wink:


IN fairness, I believe he meant "you" in general, not you specific. 8)

Just because someone is frustrated because they are working for peanuts instead of for cashews, doesn't make their complaints legit. I want to be able to afford certain 'perks' in my life for me and my family/friends, so I am looking for ways to make that happen. I suppose I could just stay where I am in life and be "frustrated" because a few have what I want. Yeah that makes sense. :? "It's not fair" is a lame phrase for a 6 year old, let alone an adult.


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## marksman (Oct 4, 2007)

proutdoors said:


> IN fairness, I believe he meant "you" in general, not you specific. 8)
> 
> Just because someone is frustrated because they are working for peanuts instead of for cashews, doesn't make their complaints legit. I want to be able to afford certain 'perks' in my life for me and my family/friends, so I am looking for ways to make that happen. I suppose I could just stay where I am in life and be "frustrated" because a few have what I want. Yeah that makes sense. :? "It's not fair" is a lame phrase for a 6 year old, let alone an adult.


I guess I sort of disagree. I agree that people largely make their own destiny. I agree that some people work hard and they deserve what they get. I however need only to point to Paris Hilton to show that not everyone deserves what they have. I believe that "The best-laid plans of mice and men/often go awry" there are also people out there that work as hard as they can and just have bad breaks. And that's why I say life isn't fair. You say that's "a lame phrase for a 6 year old, let alone an adult" I'm surprised that there are adults who haven't discovered it for themselves. I say this not to justify those that give up and fail to try because they say the deck is stacked against them but because it's true. However it's not an excuse because you'll never know if you could have made it unless you kept on trying. I also stated that I understand that some people get frustrated not because I wanted to justify their feelings but just because I can see where those feelings are coming from.


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

marksman said:


> I guess I sort of disagree. I agree that people largely make their own destiny. I agree that some people work hard and they deserve what they get. I however need only to point to Paris Hilton to show that not everyone deserves what they have. I believe that "The best-laid plans of mice and men/often go awry" there are also people out there that work as hard as they can and just have bad breaks. And that's why I say life isn't fair. You say that's "a lame phrase for a 6 year old, let alone an adult" I'm surprised that there are adults who haven't discovered it for themselves. I say this not to justify those that give up and fail to try because they say the deck is stacked against them but because it's true. However it's not an excuse because you'll never know if you could have made it unless you kept on trying. I also stated that I understand that some people get frustrated not because I wanted to justify their feelings but just because I can see where those feelings are coming from.


I used to think that things "just happen" and that sometimes life blows. I now believe that EVERYTHING happens by design, whether we are aware of how our thoughts/actions directly impact our state in life. Those who look at the 'more fortunate' and being "frustrated" will get one no where but MORE frustrated. And yes, I get why people *make * these stories up, to help them deal with their own short-comings. It does NOT make it any less WRONG however. It only keeps them from getting some "breaks" down the road.


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## marksman (Oct 4, 2007)

proutdoors said:


> I used to think that things "just happen" and that sometimes life blows. I now believe that EVERYTHING happens by design, whether we are aware of how our thoughts/actions directly impact our state in life. Those who look at the 'more fortunate' and being "frustrated" will get one no where but MORE frustrated. And yes, I get why people *make * these stories up, to help them deal with their own short-comings. It does NOT make it any less WRONG however. It only keeps them from getting some "breaks" down the road.


I'm interested in continuing this conversation but since it's getting a little too off topic I'll pm you.


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## TAK (Sep 9, 2007)

> Tak, You don't have to worry about me doing physical harm to you. I'm a 67 year old man, retired, 145 lbs, out of shape, don't know martial arts, and have never been inclined to fight, though I was forced into some when I was a kid. (I whipped every one of them, except my older brother.)
> 
> I prefer to fight with my intellect and wry sense of humor, and by the looks of things, I have the upper hand with you.
> 
> ...


As PRO said very well put "KINDA" but sorry I don't buy it.... I just find a lot more respect for the hunter that does it for himself. But all the power in the world to the feller that pays for it and feels like he has done something really neat!


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## TAK (Sep 9, 2007)

Even if I had the money to spend to have a guide, I still wouldn't. That is my opinion and that is how I would want it to play out. Like PRO's hunt that is around the corner, bunch of friends gettin it done... Now that to me sounds like a hunt!


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## coyoteslayer (Sep 10, 2007)

Well and that is your opinion TAK. People that spend 60,000 dollars arent bad hunters and to many that is just pocket change. Why would a guy spend less money and more time in search of the biggest baddess bull on the planet when he can spend pocket change and have someone else find him a great bull and then the hunt is on. The hunt isnt easy and both the hunter and guide will hike their guts out and both will have a fantastic hunt.


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## straightshooter (Jun 24, 2008)

Ok this is what my prediction is going to be. That bull opening morning is gonna have about 30 arrows stuck in him with about 30 TARDS standing around him trying to figure out who killed him. They'll end up having to do an autopsy on him and the medical examiner will be taking bribes to falsify his report. Then he'll get caught and the DWR will step in and confiscate that bull and have him mounted to put in some museum. I only hope the taxidermist will put a big old smile on his face before he sews him up


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## Packout (Nov 20, 2007)

Whoever kills that bull should have the vet's semen collector and make back whatever $$$$$ is spent killing it. I few straws at $50,000 each can go a long way to covering the expenses. The semen would be good for an hour or more if they can collect it. 

I'll add there is sarcasm intended in my post.


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## marksman (Oct 4, 2007)

I think someone already noted this but I think using the phrase "TARDS" is offensive. I prefer losers.


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## straightshooter (Jun 24, 2008)

Oh TARDon me :lol:


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## 4x4 Bronco (Sep 7, 2007)

straightshooter said:


> Oh TARDon me :lol:


 :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:


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## BIG DADDY (Sep 16, 2007)

We all hunt for the experience, don’t we? Whether we pay for it or we do it for ourselves. There is no one to blame or get mad at. That is just the way things are. We all want and have different experiences. There is now way to make every one have the same experience the same way. 

If you hate the guides, blame the hunter that pays. Mossback is just providing a service. If he had no customers he would be out of a job. 

These hunters are just paying for an experience, aren’t they?

You are paying for an experience when you buy a tag. Should we blame you?

Let’s all just go out and have a good time and our own experiences.


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## wyoming2utah (Sep 12, 2007)

BIG DADDY said:


> We all hunt for the experience, don't we? Whether we pay for it or we do it for ourselves. There is no one to blame or get mad at. That is just the way things are. We all want and have different experiences. There is now way to make every one have the same experience the same way.
> 
> If you hate the guides, blame the hunter that pays. Mossback is just providing a service. If he had no customers he would be out of a job.
> 
> ...


Hmmm...by this logic, you must also think it is ok for they guy next door to pay for the hooker he purchased from the local pimp too. I mean, after all, isn't the guy just paying for the experience and aren't the hookers just providing a service?

To me, Mossback is nothing more than an expensive pimp providing an immoral service that does nothing good for the sport of hunting and definitely hurts the hunting tradition.


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## wyoming2utah (Sep 12, 2007)

FishlakeElkHunter said:


> Hey wyo2ut.....you say this pic came from YOUR cell phone???? I know where this pic came from and it was off a video.......???????????


No, this pic actually came from my wife's phone...I took it from the back of my ATV. Call me a liar all you want...but I know the truth! The bull was standing less than 50 yards from me along with a pretty good six point and a good sized herd of cows, calves, and raghorns on the north end of the meadow before Manning Meadow Reservoir. None of the elk seemed to mind one bit that I was there...I took the pic on Sunday June 22nd in the late afternoon.

On the same day there was a group of 15 bulls standing just a bit south of the Parson's cabin...


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## coyoteslayer (Sep 10, 2007)

> To me, Mossback is nothing more than an expensive pimp providing an immoral service that does nothing good for the sport of hunting and definitely hurts the hunting tradition.


Boy Mossback must have really rubbed you wrong once or twice. Mossback isnt going away anytime soon so it sounds like you will have this HATE relationship for a very long time. Mossback isnt ruining the sport of hunting so you and I will just disagree like everything else.

What is Immoral about mossback? Does Mossback need to repent of their sins??? :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

wyoming2utah said:


> To me, Mossback is nothing more than an expensive pimp providing an immoral service that does nothing good for the sport of hunting and definitely hurts the hunting tradition.


To me, people who say such *STUPID* things like this are self-righteous pinheads who see themselves in a better light than the rest of us. How arrogant can one be? Guides, and guide services go back hundreds of years. It is NOT a new concept, of course either is running down those who do things different than ourselves. :?

Lewis and Clark hired GUIDES to get across the great frontier, does that mean their 'experience' wasn't as grand as if they had gone 'DIY'?

You want to know what is NOT "good for the sport of hunting"? It is those who CHOSE to separate hunters and limit ALL to one way of hunting. THAT hurts the "good of the sport" and it hurts "the hunting tradition" as well. My great-grandfather in Idaho started one of the first hunting clubs in the Idaho Falls area back in the 1920's, they GUIDED hunters clear back then. Jim Bridger, Jedidiah Smith (distance relative of mine), and MOST of the 'real' mountain men were hired as GUIDES both to get people from point A to point Z, AND to kill animals. What tradition are you referring to? Were the mountain men back in the 1800's "pimps/hookers" in you eyes? Get a grip!


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## coyoteslayer (Sep 10, 2007)

> Lewis and Clark hired GUIDES to get across the great frontier, does that mean their 'experience' wasn't as grand as if they had gone 'DIY'?


Pro, that would mean that Lewis and Clark werent "REAL" explorers. They had people cooking their food. They had people to set up and break down camp. They sent out scouts/guides to find the best trails.

Lewis and Clark were just rich businessmen in todays world.


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