# ESPN Team Preview - BYU Cougars



## Comrade Duck (Oct 24, 2007)

http://insider.espn.go.com/ncf/insider/ ... 3dtab3pos1

Anyone else getting excited?

Shane


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## buggsz24 (Mar 18, 2008)

Whats more exciting than hype?

Mediocre finish last year, and playing in a high school rec league doesn't impress national press, so don't expect a real bowl game this year either. besides the Losses to decent teams out of conference doesn;t bode well either. 

What would be impressive is a win out of conference against a non-D2 opponent


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

buggsz24 said:


> Whats more exciting than hype?
> 
> Mediocre finish last year, and playing in a high school rec league doesn't impress national press, so don't expect a real bowl game this year either. besides the Losses to decent teams out of conference doesn;t bode well either.
> 
> What would be impressive is a win out of conference against a non-D2 opponent


You WILL eat these words!!!! |-O-|


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## buggsz24 (Mar 18, 2008)

I've got relatives on the team, both as coaching staff and players and I still don't think they will get into (let alone win) a legitimate bowl game. And besides, they no longer hold the title of the only in state national champion.


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

buggsz24 said:


> I've got relatives on the team, both as coaching staff and players and I still don't think they will get into (let alone win) a legitimate bowl game. *And besides, they no longer hold the title of the only in state national champion*.


Please explain. :? Or, are you referring to Snow winning the Jr College title my Freshman year in 1985? :mrgreen:


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## buggsz24 (Mar 18, 2008)

Well byu was "awarded" the national champion after going undefeated then playing a half-A team in their bowl game. The utes had 1 loss in two seasons, went undefeated and beat a quality team in a bowl game. 

By the same standards that byu got theirs, the utes deserve one as well.

On top of that, every queer cat seems to forget the utes won in 44


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

buggsz24 said:


> Well byu was "awarded" the national champion after going undefeated then playing a half-A team in their bowl game. The utes had 1 loss in two seasons, went undefeated and beat a quality team in a bowl game.
> 
> By the same standards that byu got theirs, the utes deserve one as well.
> 
> On top of that, every queer cat seems to forget the utes won in 44


Typical utefan starts hurling the insults early. I'm just confused; in one post you say "they no longer hold the title of the only state national champion", and now you say they won it in 44 and "queer cats seem to forget that". What do you call a utefan that trips all over himself talking smack? Answer: typical utefan.

FYI, BYU "got theirs" by being the TOP ranked team at the end of the season, The urbanutes can NOT say the same. See, that is how being the National Champions is decided, not by utefan's warped 'logic'. :roll:


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## Huge29 (Sep 17, 2007)

buggsz24 said:


> Well byu was "awarded" the national champion after going undefeated then playing a half-A team in their bowl game. The utes had 1 loss in two seasons, went undefeated and beat a quality team in a bowl game.
> 
> By the same standards that byu got theirs, the utes deserve one as well.
> 
> On top of that, every queer cat seems to forget the utes won in 44


I have heard a lot of drunken slurred utes talking smack, but this one takes the cake, that is hysterical!!! *\-\* *\-\* *\-\* *\-\* *\-\* *\-\* Oh have the tables turned, what happened to Utes saying '84 was too long ago, what have you done lately? Now it is that it was not legit, but a non championship at all is now declared a championship-go Utes. -BaHa!-

Pro-I am with you, I was thinking Snow! Go Badgers!

Comrade-answer to your question, "YES" *OOO* *(())*


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## Comrade Duck (Oct 24, 2007)

buggsz24 said:


> Well byu was "awarded" the national champion after going undefeated then playing a half-A team in their bowl game. The utes had 1 loss in two seasons, went undefeated and beat a *quality team* in a bowl game.
> 
> By the same standards that byu got theirs, the utes deserve one as well.
> 
> On top of that, every queer cat seems to forget the utes won in 44


Quality team? Who Pitt? What bowl game were you watching? The Panthers had no business being in a BCS bowl game and every Ute fan that had any common sense felt ripped off that they had to play them.

Shane


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## mjschijf (Oct 1, 2007)

Yuck! BYU...I just vomitted all over my keyboard. 

BYU has gotten lucky against the U during the past two seasons. I remember watching last year's game and the most B.S. pass interferance call I've ever seen basically handed BYU the game-winning touchdown. I am not even exaggerating...the WORST call I've ever seen.

Oh well, BYU's luck can't last for three seasons in a row. Even counting BYU's lucky wins during the past two season, the Utes are still 9 and 6 against them since the 1992 season. You can't argue with the stats...


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## Huge29 (Sep 17, 2007)

mjschijf said:


> BYU has gotten lucky against the U during the past two seasons. I remember watching last year's game and the most B.S. pass interference call I've ever seen basically handed BYU the game-winning touchdown. I am not even exaggerating...the WORST call I've ever seen.
> 
> Oh well, BYU's luck can't last for three seasons in a row. Even counting BYU's lucky wins during the past two season, the Utes are still 9 and 6 against them since the 1992 season. You can't argue with the stats...


Where do I start? Since you love stats, how about two consecutive wins? How about two consecutive undefeated conference seasons? How about something like 16-9 over the last 25 years? There are all kinds of convenient stats, but I think we all know which ones are most important. I really do love Ute fans, sorry for coming off abrasively  I just don't like your way of having to defend a team that is indefensible; I'll give credit where credit is due, I am very impressed with how the Utes turned it around last year, congrats!

Please do remind of which PI call "handed" the Y the game; I'll find the rule for you and maybe without your rose/crimson colored glasses/beer goggles you will see the light. Sorry, I am just having fun with you! I think you will quickly see the major defensive hold on the same series from what I remember; watch both angles, if you are referring to the one that I think you are, that was the correct call! Was that not the one where Collie was grabbed from the back arm and twisted? Correct if I'm wrong! I had to switch from Comcast, so I don't have it on the DVR; are you sure that you are not thinking about the play that the freshman Unga flattened the U senior captain Tate into the fetal position on the goal line? I can't find it on Youtube. Sorry, I had to


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## Comrade Duck (Oct 24, 2007)

mjschijf said:


> Yuck! BYU...I just vomitted all over my keyboard.
> 
> BYU has gotten lucky against the U during the past two seasons. I remember watching last year's game and the most B.S. pass interferance call I've ever seen basically handed BYU the game-winning touchdown. I am not even exaggerating...the WORST call I've ever seen.
> 
> Oh well, BYU's luck can't last for three seasons in a row. Even counting BYU's lucky wins during the past two season, the Utes are still 9 and 6 against them since the 1992 season. You can't argue with the stats...


You're right you can't argue stats.

My point of reference will be 1976 since that is when it all started for me.

You brought up 9 and 6 since 1992. How about the 16 games before that. The Utes won twice. I have seen the Cougars beat the Utes 21 times to only 11 losses in my time as a BYU fan. Pretty good results. Argument?

What have you done for me lately? In the last two years the Cougars have beat the Utes. If you and Bugz want to make excuses and rationalize why you are still a better team even though the numbers don't prove it, go for it. It makes your argument even more pathetic.

How many conference championships have you seen the Utes win outright? How many have they won outright since the late 1950's (I believe 1957)? I'll give you a hint. They are the same number. Two. How many shared conference championships do they have? I don't have the answer to that one but if you do know it and want to share it with us please do. I need a good laugh.

It goes to show that the only game that matters to Utefan is the one at the end of the regular season. They can have a miserable record but as long as they beat the Cougars the year is a success.

In my lifetime I have witnessed the Cougars win 21 conference championships with 15 of those being outright. Since 1992 they have won 8 championships with 3 being outright. Bronco, in his short 3 year career, has more outright championships than the storied Ute history going back nearly 5 decades. What's your argument to that?

Top twenty finishes? Top ten? National Championships? How many hall of famers have the Utes produced? Heisman Trophies?

Stats are a funny thing. If you have a point to prove, you can always find a stat to make an argument with. It all depends on your point of reference.

Before you reply, let me just go ahead and congratulate you on being the Poinsettia Bowl, Armed Forces Bowl, as well as Emerald Bowl champions. Your record of Bowl game wins in a row is quite impressive.

All those trophies in the case must look real great sitting next to all of your awards for gymnastics.

You should be proud.

Shane


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## Comrade Duck (Oct 24, 2007)

Huge,

Great pictures. I've seen them before but they always make me laugh. 

Shane


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## buggsz24 (Mar 18, 2008)

proutdoors said:


> Typical utefan starts hurling the insults early. I'm just confused; in one post you say "they no longer hold the title of the only state national champion", and now you say they won it in 44 and "queer cats seem to forget that". What do you call a utefan that trips all over himself talking smack? Answer: typical utefan.


First off I'm not even a Ute fan, the mountain west is a joke as are most of the teams in conference. Secondly I went and checked NCAA records mid post and to my surprise found the Utes did have a national championship so I gave them their due credit even though it contradicted my previous statement.

The funniest thing in all of this is the breed-em young fans who are absolutely clueless when it comes to athletics. The cougar who cry every year about the seed thier "below average team" gets in the tourney, the cougar who whines about no respect for an 11-2 season with wins over power house teams like Eastern Washington and Arizona. (a D2 school mid season?, was highland high busy that weekend?)

And if you actually look at the year byu was "awarded" the championship, they weren't the top team going into the bowl games or even close for that matter. But they were the only team to have gone undefeated, thanks in part to a weak bowl opponent. That coupled with Edwards whining to congress on a routine basis about inequity in college football, the NCAA had two choices: give BYU the championship even though they were not the best team that year, or incur the wrath of the federal government.

Several very respected sports commentators as well as players from other colleges during the year in question have expressed the same sentiment, so this isn't just one drunken ute fans opinion. Outside of conference your national championship is 
respected much as your team is.........


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## Huge29 (Sep 17, 2007)

buggsz24 said:


> The funniest thing in all of this is the breed-em young fans who are absolutely clueless when it comes to athletics. The cougar who cry every year about the seed thier "below average team" gets in the tourney, the cougar who whines about no respect for an 11-2 season with wins over power house teams like Eastern Washington and Arizona. (a D2 school mid season?, was highland high busy that weekend?)
> 
> And if you actually look at the year byu was "awarded" the championship, they weren't the top team going into the bowl games or even close for that matter. But they were the only team to have gone undefeated, thanks in part to a weak bowl opponent. That coupled with Edwards whining to congress on a routine basis about inequity in college football, the NCAA had two choices: give BYU the championship even though they were not the best team that year, or incur the wrath of the federal government.


A D2 team like NAU like the Utes played in 2006? Arizona is in the Pac 10, right? The same team who beat USC in 2006? Weak bowl opponent like Pitt? You are referring to Michigan from the Big 10, correct? The same team that will wipe the floor with the utes in two months? The same team with the most all-time wins and highest all-time winning percentage in NCAA Division I-A history? That same team? The system clearly is not perfect, but is this the only thing you have to do today; can you pump me some gas? J/K, I am sure that you recall that remark. Your Edwards comment about congress in 2002??? That is what got them the championship in 1984? :lol: You lost me on that one, but I still love utefan!  Clueless is a good term, please give us a clue! That is awesome to say pot, meet kettle, The Utes did win a championship a couple of years ago, but the Y has not ever, U R killing me, get a job already!


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

buggsz24 said:


> Several very respected sports commentators as well as players from other colleges during the year in question have expressed the same sentiment, so this isn't just one drunken ute fans opinion. Outside of conference your national championship is
> respected much as your team is.........


Did you not read the link Comrade put up? Sounds like BYU gets some National respect to me. :? Barry Switzer and a few other Mormon haters along with those who believe only their conference plays 'good' football doesn't exactly make me too concerned about the way most 'intelligent' football fans view BYU football. FYI, LaVell Edwards is one of the most respected college coaches EVER. Go ahead and belittle the man who was one of the pioneers of the passing game, that shows your bias right there. Few college coaches have had a bigger impact on the way the game is played today the Edwards. Bronco is solid, and the national 'experts' see that. Is BYU the 'greatest' program in the nation? No, but they sure are fun to watch, and they ARE one the upper echelon college football programs in the country.


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## buggsz24 (Mar 18, 2008)

Huge29 said:


> Your Edwards comment about congress in 2002??? That is what got them the championship in 1984? :lol: You lost me on that one, but I still love utefan!  Clueless is a good term, please give us a clue!


Number three going into a bowl game against a 6-5 team, losses by number one and two Nebraska and South Carolina made BYU the winner by default. One interesting thing to note, not a single team BYU played that year was even on the AP top 20. BYU is the reason that difficulty of schedule was added as criteria for determining the final rankings.

And unless your completely daft, you would already know that Level was complaining about "The System" long before he appeared and not for the first time in 02.



Huge29 said:


> can you pump me some gas? J/K, I am sure that you recall that remark.


"Bo Diddly Tech", remember that one

AND FOR THE FINAL TIME, NOT A UTE FAN. Attacking another weak in conference team does nothing but prove my point.


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## buggsz24 (Mar 18, 2008)

proutdoors said:


> LaVell Edwards is one of the most respected college coaches EVER. Go ahead and belittle the man who was one of the pioneers of the passing game, that shows your bias right there. Few college coaches have had a bigger impact on the way the game is played today the Edwards.


No argument there, all I said was he whined about being left out. Weak schedules don't get respect, get used to it.


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## Guns and Flies (Nov 7, 2007)

Go BYU!  _(O)_


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

buggsz24 said:


> One interesting point of note, as the coaching staff around lavell began to leave so did the success (even when lavell was still there).


In the book "Good to Great"they talk about how you need to have the right people on the 'bus' and to have them in the right seats. Every great coach needs to have a great staff, and every great program goes through peaks and valleys. Look at Penn State, FSU, USC, Texas, Michigan, LSU, Tennessee, and so on. To expect BYU, with their limited recruiting base to be immune to the same cycles is inane.


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## buggsz24 (Mar 18, 2008)

BYU's cycle is just that, they had A coach. Before and after that they have been average.. Bronco is a good coach, but is his days are limited. Fairly well known fact within the program.


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

buggsz24 said:


> BYU's cycle is just that, they had A coach. Before and after that they have been average.. Bronco is a good coach, but is his days are limited.* Fairly well known fact within the program.*


Do tell. :? :roll: They said the same thing about Edwards. _(O)_ They are well above 'average' for this year, look at where they are ranked by those who supposedly have no/little respect for BYU's program. //dog//


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## Huge29 (Sep 17, 2007)

buggsz24 said:


> BYU's cycle is just that, they had A coach. Before and after that they have been average.. Bronco is a good coach, but is his days are limited. Fairly well known fact within the program.


U R KILLING ME!! By average you mean the "mean" statistically, correct? In this case with 119 d1 teams would result in #60, correct? So please extrapolate just how many standard deviations #14 is away from #60 in a sample of 119, plz? Two consecutive top 20 finishes, two consecutive undefeated conference seasons. BYU also holds the NCAA record for most consecutive games without being shutout - 361 games over 28 years. Since 1974 the program has won 23 conference championships and has played in 26 bowl games. Can I just call you Y-hater; I think that is basically synonimous with utefan?? Going back to 1984 with you and Uncle Rico, the Y did get a unanimous vote for #1, right? So, who was it that was fighting that issue that you alluded to?


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## buggsz24 (Mar 18, 2008)

Bronco has been looking for a "top flight" team, not your version of a top flight team, but a real top tier, year to year BCS bowl contender. This isn't a secret, the media is aware of it and so is the current coaching staff/administration. 

And whether you can see it or not, they are an average team. If BYU were to play in the same conference as UCLA or Texas or Miami, you would see just how average they really are. Big fish, very little pond. 

Winning out on a weak schedule really won't prove anything, UCLA appears to be the only opponent that has any merit and they had a loosing record overall.


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## buggsz24 (Mar 18, 2008)

Huge29 said:


> U R KILLING ME!!


Logic does that to the illogical.

By average I mean just that. Given the level of talent across the entire division they are an average team, somewhere in the middle.

Put BYU in one of the top conferences and they would be just that, an average team with an average record .500.

*Winning a lot in a league filled with teams who are consistently below average does not make you above average. * This is the reason that BYU has the winning record it does, for proof of that just look into their out of conference success against teams with winning records. D2 schools do not count!

Should BYU actually decide to schedule teams that are above average (legitimate top 20 teams) that fact would become very obvious very quickly.


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## Huge29 (Sep 17, 2007)

buggsz24 said:


> Huge29 said:
> 
> 
> > U R KILLING ME!!
> ...


I get all of that, but since we are in reality and la la land, or the illogical what if scenarios, is only where utefans live, please calculate how many standard deviations it is to go from a mean of 60 to 14 in a sample of 60, pretty please!


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## buggsz24 (Mar 18, 2008)

Huge29 said:


> I get all of that, but since we are in reality and la la land, or the illogical what if scenarios, is only where utefans live, please calculate how many standard deviations it is to go from a mean of 60 to 14 in a sample of 60, pretty please!


I really don't think you do, your current ranking is in REALITY a result of playing a weak schedule, nothing more nothing less. What is it your high on to make you think a schedule without a single top 20 opponent in the last five seasons makes a you a top twenty team ?

UCLA finished with a loosing record, so dont bother pointing out them at no.13 before they played you. You lost to them anyway right ? .500 team in a premier league and you still couldn't beat them. right? Your *ONLY* top 20 opponent since 2002 was USC and they beat the snot out of you.

You look good against bad teams, who doesn't? If your not going to schedule top tier teams (which BYU is not) your not going to be considered a top tier team.


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## martymcfly73 (Sep 17, 2007)

proutdoors said:


> buggsz24 said:
> 
> 
> > Several very respected sports commentators as well as players from other colleges during the year in question have expressed the same sentiment, so this isn't just one drunken ute fans opinion. Outside of conference your national championship is
> ...


+ 1 good post. Lavell invented the "West Coast offense" before it even had that name. All of his jr coaches have used it with some success in the NFL. too bad Lavell never got the props he deserved. Barry Switzer is just a douche bag. If lavell were still coaching wth todays standards the NFL would be tripping over themselves trying to get ahold of him.


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## buggsz24 (Mar 18, 2008)

Ok, here are stats as provided by the following sources: BYU's web schedule/results, ESPN's team records by season and BCS year end rankings as provided on their website. 

BYU non-conference record 31-26 .543% (seems average to me)
BYU opponent records on losses out of conference 156-79 .663%
BYU opponent records on wins out of conference 84-122 .407%
Top 15 teams played over period: 6, wins in those games 0
Bowl record over period 3-3, with 4 seasons without bowl games (3-3 seems average)

This tells me: you loose to teams out of conference with winning records, your wins out of conference come from teams with loosing records and when you get the shot at a top tier team you loose. This means all of your wins came from in conference (a conference that is not good), what is there that I am missing that would make you a top tier team?



*DII teams were not counted in these statistics as they were out of league play
**Rankings were determined by year end rankings, not the ranking at the time of play
*** Bowl opponents not factored into out of conference games as the team did not select opponents 
****Results covered the period of play beginning with the 1997-1998 and ending 2007-2008


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## buggsz24 (Mar 18, 2008)

martymcfly73 said:


> + 1 good post. Lavell invented the "West Coast offense" before it even had that name.


Bill walsh is cited by many reputable sources as creating the offense in 1968 while with the Bengals, even if he didn't create it, it was used by the Bengals before Edwards was head coach and changed the O. Edwards wasn't in using the system at BYU until he was HC in 1973. So regardless of what you call it, he used it, but it wasn't his creation.


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## UintaMan (Sep 16, 2007)

buggsz24 said:


> proutdoors said:
> 
> 
> > Typical utefan starts hurling the insults early. I'm just confused; in one post you say "they no longer hold the title of the only state national champion", and now you say they won it in 44 and "queer cats seem to forget that". What do you call a utefan that trips all over himself talking smack? Answer: typical utefan.
> ...


Not even a ute fan? Give me a freaking break! Be a man and admitt your faults especially when you have been raked through the coles by some of these boys! Now that every one of your comments have been proven to be based on pure ignorance your going to play the "i'm not even a ute fan". Great come back, you really got them on the ropes now! Typical uneducated ute fan who gets caught running at the mouth! :roll: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:


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## buggsz24 (Mar 18, 2008)

UintaMan said:


> Now that every one of your comments have been proven to be based on pure ignorance your going to play the "i'm not even a ute fan". GrTypical uneducated ute fan who gets caught running at the mouth! :roll: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:


Your either illiterate (which would make posting difficult) or your reading comprehension skills fall short of what one would expect from an adult (I assume your an adult)

The statistics that I provided have supported my claims, running at the mouth and uneducated really don't describe someone who took the time to compile data to prove a point.

And please stop referring to me as a ute fan, I take offense at the allegation. I am in fact of U of T (TX that is) alum, and I'm sure you don't want to start comparing records to that school.


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

buggsz24 said:


> And please stop referring to me as a ute fan, I take offense at the allegation. I am in fact of U of T (TX that is) alum, and I'm sure you don't want to start comparing records to that school.


That would explain the elitist attitude. _(O)_ :mrgreen: That is no excuse, I am a U of U alum, but I never lost sense of what football program is GOOD, and dang entertaining. I don't get why people from other regions feel the need to minimize the local programs, it reeks of a insecure faith in your own team of choice. Now, utefan and zoobe talking smack makes sense, as does longhorns and aggies talking smack. I fail to see what is accomplished by a steer talking smack to a puma. Go find your marbles and watch boring hand off to the RB football. :shock: :wink:


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## buggsz24 (Mar 18, 2008)

I'm starting to see a trend here pro, your always the rational response to an argument. I grew up in state, went to school out of state and now I'm back so its not really a regional thing.

Like I mentioned previously I have relatives who played for, play for and coach FB at the Y, there are ties there, I just don't feel the love so to speak. I don't hate the Y, they are at times fun to watch. 

What I dislike about the Y, is the fans who are so delusional about the program that they think they belong in the same class of teams as SC, OK, Florida, FSU. The power house teams are disappointed by a two loss season, and those two losses usually come from teams in the top ten/. Being a fan is one thing, thinking your SC is a whole nother level of crazy.


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## UintaMan (Sep 16, 2007)

buggsz24 said:


> I'm starting to see a trend here pro, your always the rational response to an argument. I grew up in state, went to school out of state and now I'm back so its not really a regional thing.
> 
> Like I mentioned previously I have relatives who played for, play for and coach FB at the Y, there are ties there, I just don't feel the love so to speak. I don't hate the Y, they are at times fun to watch.
> 
> *What I dislike about the Y, is the fans who are so delusional about the program that they think they belong in the same class of teams as SC, OK, Florida, FSU.* The power house teams are disappointed by a two loss season, and those two losses usually come from teams in the top ten/. Being a fan is one thing, thinking your SC is a whole nother level of crazy.


I'm sorry, did I miss something here. Who in the world stated that my beloved Cougars belong in the same class as USC, OK, Florida, and FSU?


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## rapalahunter (Oct 13, 2007)

buggsz24 said:


> UintaMan said:
> 
> 
> > Now that every one of your comments have been proven to be based on pure ignorance your going to play the "i'm not even a ute fan". GrTypical uneducated ute fan who gets caught running at the mouth! :roll: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:
> ...


I love that in the same sentence that you call him illiterate, you misspell the contraction *you're* and write *your*. :lol: That's funny stuff... what a wonderful education you received at the Univesitee of Tecksas. :wink:


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## Comrade Duck (Oct 24, 2007)

Funny thing is that the Longhorns have never beat the Cougars. In the two times that they have gone against each other BYU has come out on top.

Following Ute logic that would mean that BYU is actually the better program. After all, you can't argue stats.

They pretty much historically have owned you guys.  



Shane


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## buggsz24 (Mar 18, 2008)

rapalahunter said:


> I love that in the same sentence that you call him illiterate, you misspell the contraction *you're* and write *your*. :lol: That's funny stuff... what a wonderful education you received at the Univesitee of Tecksas. :wink:


Where do I start? Are you retarded, because making fun of the mentally challenged is not cool.

First off, illiterate as it was spelled in the original post and in your quote is correct. Proof that you're wrong can be found here:
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/illiterate
As you can see , either Merriam-Webster is a moron, or you are.

The use of your was incorrect, but I'm willing to bet my engineering degree makes at least twice what that English degree gets you.

Go Horns


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## rapalahunter (Oct 13, 2007)

I never said you spelled illiterate wrong. Talk about poor reading comprehension skills. I was pointing out that in the same sentence you call in to question his intelligence by calling him illiterate you also misspell a word. It was funny.

Go Horns!


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

buggsz24 said:


> The use of your was incorrect, but I'm willing to bet my engineering degree makes at least twice what that English degree gets you.


I have an engineering degree from the U of U that you can have. it is just a piece of paper that gets you in the door, nothing more.

I have never said that the Y is on par with the 'powerhouse' teams, but they ARE respected nationally as a football program evidenced by their PRE-SEASON rankings and how difficult it is to get games against teams from 'powerhouse' schools. They don't want a non-conference game against a team that could likely light them up. They are more willing to schedule a home game against Utah because BYU refuses to be just a 'bought' win and they demand a home and home agreement and that scares 'powerhouse' teams. Very few schools see an upside to traveling the LaVell Edwards Stadium, that all started back with Miami getting ROLLED on national TV by Detmer and company.


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