# AR Build ????'s



## Al Hansen (Sep 7, 2007)

Ok I'm not much of an AR guy. More of the black bolt gun single shot varmint type. But that being said I have always owned a black rattle gun. Colt and Rock River mainly. So my current is a Rock River Tactical Entry with the Triangle front sight gas block. I recently mounted a Nikon Scope to the receiver and the objective lens is almost hitting that front sight. Yes it functions but it's weird looking and I'm going to change the gas block out to a low profile so it looks decent and put on a 10 inch free float hand rail. That's my fix for this rifle. But..............it got me to thinking which has led to internet research that is quite overwhelming. So here's the questions. I'm looking at a upper build that will go with the Rock River lower. What are you folks building for the uppers ?? Varmint barrel length ? 20 or 22 or 24 inch ? What twist ? 7, 8, 9 or what ? What combination of twist and barrel ? Who are you going to to buy the items ? My goodness there is a huge number of dealers. Is there one barrel company better than the others ? I would like to shoot the 50 to 55 grain bullets so that should help decide twist rate. Sharing your knowledge is greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance.


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## gdog (Sep 13, 2007)

Take a look at Palmetto. A few friends and I have their complete uppers. Not a single problem and all have been shooters. Inventory is hit and miss at times, but they do have specials often.


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

Stag model 6 upper. Extremely accurate upper / barrel.


-DallanC


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## Seven (Jan 8, 2009)

Al Hansen said:


> Yes it functions but it's weird looking and I'm going to change the gas block out to a low profile. Cutting the current gas block down to size is also an option. Do a internet search for A2 gas block cutting/chopping. getting out the taper pins is not fun and may require a big hammer, good punches, and some swear words. The important word is taper, as they only come out one way.
> 
> so it looks decent and put on a 10 inch free float hand rail. That's my fix for this rifle. What length of gas system do you currently have? Also what is your budget for the free float? Do you have a preference on weather it is a Railed free float, smooth free float or something of an hybrid design?
> 
> ...


Hopefully that answered some questions. but I had some questions of my own to ask you.


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## NVDuckin (Apr 18, 2016)

Seven has good answers. I've build 5 AR15's now and his answers are spot on.


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## Bax* (Dec 14, 2008)

Ahhh the AR-15.... the firearm form of Legos for grownups.

Let me start by saying that I hate the AR-15. It has so many options that it makes my head spin and every time I buy / build one, I find a new feature that I wished that I had thought of. So I sell, and build another. They are almost more fun for me to build than to own.

That being said: If I were to build a rifle today as a varminter that wasn't a factory NIB model, I would buy a Lilja 20-22" 1/9" twist heavy barrel that was fluted along with a Todd Jarret handguard that has picatinny rails on the muzzle end of the grip (to attach a bipod, or other accessories).

I likely wouldn't install a muzzle brake, mainly because the rifle recoil is so low anyways.

I have bought parts from http://www.precisionfirearms.com/ several times and have been very happy with them.

Oh and I would put a Magpul PRS stock on it.


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

Anyone recommend a nice softer grip for an AR vs the crappy hard uncomfortable A2 grip?


-DallanC


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## Seven (Jan 8, 2009)

DallanC said:


> Anyone recommend a nice softer grip for an AR vs the crappy hard uncomfortable A2 grip?
> 
> -DallanC


I really like the MOE+(plus) grip. Or the ERGO grip. There are a ton of choices out there.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/2319198047/magpul-moe-plus-pistol-grip-ar-15-rubber

https://www.wingtactical.com/firear...-grips/ergo-the-original-ar-15-grip-suregrip/


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## Bax* (Dec 14, 2008)

I agree with Seven.

Magpul has a nice rubberized grip.

I would also suggest swapping out the trigger guard to a Magpul guard as well if you have the standard straight trigger guard that most receivers come with.


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## .45 (Sep 21, 2007)

Daniel Defense has some 'soft' grips Al. In fact mine has a lot of DD stuff along with magpul equipment. You could just buy mine and save yourself a lot of miss match.


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## Al Hansen (Sep 7, 2007)

Thanks for all the replies as I am becoming educated to the rattle gun explosion. Mine is a carbine tactical entry . The twist rates are about the same as all my bolt gun info, so nothing to new there. No carry, if I decide to build a varminter upper. Truck to porta-bench. Weight is no issue. In fact the heavier the better for me. I have found a local maker, Davidson Defense in Orem. The Gas block and hand guard is as cheap as I can find. I have a local Gunsmith that will pop the pins and install the hand guard and gas block for $37.00. I gotta save some $$$$ for a upper so maybe in the future a .223Wylde 9twist 24 inch upper. Thanks .45 for the offer.


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## Al Hansen (Sep 7, 2007)

.45 said:


> Daniel Defense has some 'soft' grips Al. In fact mine has a lot of DD stuff along with magpul equipment. You could just buy mine and save yourself a lot of miss match.


I looked at some Daniels Defense stuff. UHHHH . I'm retired and can't afford you. LOL.


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## Seven (Jan 8, 2009)

Al Hansen said:


> Thanks for all the replies as I am becoming educated to the rattle gun explosion. Mine is a carbine tactical entry . The twist rates are about the same as all my bolt gun info, so nothing to new there. No carry, if I decide to build a varminter upper. Truck to porta-bench. Weight is no issue. In fact the heavier the better for me. I have found a local maker, Davidson Defense in Orem. The Gas block and hand guard is as cheap as I can find. I have a local Gunsmith that will pop the pins and install the hand guard and gas block for $37.00. I gotta save some $$$$ for a upper so maybe in the future a .223Wylde 9twist 24 inch upper. Thanks .45 for the offer.


 Davidson Defense sometimes sells items that they don't have in stock and then leaves you waiting. so be aware of that. and realize that their parts most likely is from china. My other suggestion is that make sure your low profile gas block is steel and not aluminum. While aluminum works and is actually used by some major gun makers, it just makes sense in my mind to go with steel. aluminum and steel have different properties especially how they expand and contract with heat.

Going over 20 inches in the ar platform increases the price dramatically. That being said Here is a barrel that could possibly work for you.

https://www.rainierarms.com/rainier-arms-ultramatch-223-wylde-varmint-barrel-rifle-24


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## Cooky (Apr 25, 2011)

Some opinions based on my experience:
.223 Wylde chamber
No chrome lining.
1-8 twist you'll probably find that a high BC is better at longer range than starting a light bullet fast.
Houge grip.
Floated barrel, 18"-20".
Do get a muzzle devise, one of the ones that send all the report forward. 
Put an after market trigger in it. The stock ones can't be made good enough.


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## Loke (Sep 7, 2007)

DallanC said:


> Anyone recommend a nice softer grip for an AR vs the crappy hard uncomfortable A2 grip?
> 
> -DallanC


I've put Hogue's on both of mine. They make a couple of different sizes. I like the smaller ones.


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## reb8600 (Sep 8, 2007)

The two things to not cut corners on is the barrel and triggers. The AR can be extremely accurate. I have built many of them from scratch. Before making recommendations it would be nice to know what you intend to do with it. If you want extreme accuracy stay away from PSA that was recommended and Stag. You can do a lot better than that. I have built several that shot 1/2-3/4 MOA.


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

Al Hansen said:


> I'm retired and can't afford you. LOL.


https://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/99072

$890 ... 24" heavy barrel, comes with a .5 MOA guarantee. Reload using the new Sierra 65gr Gamekings and you can get that down under .4

You're welcome.

-DallanC


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## Loke (Sep 7, 2007)

If I had known how good a good trigger could be, I'd have gotten one ten years sooner. I have a Geissele in my Armalite and strongly recommend them.


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

Loke said:


> I've put Hogue's on both of mine. They make a couple of different sizes. I like the smaller ones.


Oh I didnt know there were different sizes. Does the "best gun store in utah" stock them in different sizes? I'd like to stop in and see how they fit (I tend to like smaller grips too).

-DallanC


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## Al Hansen (Sep 7, 2007)

reb8600 said:


> The two things to not cut corners on is the barrel and triggers. The AR can be extremely accurate. I have built many of them from scratch. Before making recommendations it would be nice to know what you intend to do with it. If you want extreme accuracy stay away from PSA that was recommended and Stag. You can do a lot better than that. I have built several that shot 1/2-3/4 MOA.


I was wondering if you were still here. Good to see you on here again. I trust your opinion. My intent is to keep the tactical entry RR and use it as intended ( a combat ready street fighter) and possibly build a varminter upper 20-24 inch in .556/.223 that will work on my RR lower. Possibly a project for next winter. I've built enough varmint bolt guns for this year and I can't spend anymore $$$$.


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## Al Hansen (Sep 7, 2007)

DallanC said:


> Oh I didnt know there were different sizes. Does the "best gun store in utah" stock them in different sizes? I'd like to stop in and see how they fit (I tend to like smaller grips too).
> 
> -DallanC


OK I'll bite. Which one is the best gun store in Utah ???


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## Loke (Sep 7, 2007)

DallanC said:


> Oh I didnt know there were different sizes. Does the "best gun store in utah" stock them in different sizes? I'd like to stop in and see how they fit (I tend to like smaller grips too).
> 
> -DallanC


Yup.


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## KineKilla (Jan 28, 2011)

I've built a number of AR rifles....some I used a Palmetto State upper some I did not.

My "Tactical/Zombie/SHTF" one is a bushmaster 16" upper, Magpul moe + stock and grip, UTG Pro 10" handguard, New Frontier Aluminum Lower, ALG Defense Trigger, Holo sight and MBUS Backups.

The one I would choose for varmints or coyotes is my 18" franken-gun.

It has an 18" Black Hole Weaponry barrel, SAA Upper, 15" Diamondback hand guard, ACE Skeleton fixed stock, MOE+ grip, Spikes Tactical BCG and sits on top of a New Frontier Polymer Lower that has a Palmetto State parts kit installed. This one will shoot 14/15 shots through the bulls-eye at 100yds. all day long.

I found it likes my hand loads a little better than factory ammo. I load them to Hornady book specs using 24.4 gr of XBR powder and 55gr FMJ or SP projectiles. Although my 18" has a 1/7 twist rate, it still prefers the lighter bullets.

I love the AR platform because I am naturally a "tinkerer" and enjoy taking a pile of parts and turning them into a functioning, accurate and dependable firearm.


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

reb8600 said:


> If you want extreme accuracy stay away from PSA that was recommended and *Stag.*


I'm curious why you mentioned Stag? The Model 6 I mentioned comes with a .5MOA guarantee. I found my 6L (lefty version) easily did that right out of the box. Its the 2nd most accurate rifle I've ever owned (Rugar #1 in 22-250 being the most accurate).

-DallanC


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

KineKilla said:


> It has an 18" Black Hole Weaponry barrel, SAA Upper, 15" Diamondback hand guard, ACE Skeleton fixed stock, MOE+ grip, Spikes Tactical BCG and sits on top of a New Frontier Polymer Lower that has a Palmetto State parts kit installed. This one will shoot 14/15 shots through the bulls-eye at 100yds. all day long.


I have a gun build off a New Frontier Poly as well... its been surprisingly reliable and accurate.

-DallanC


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## .45 (Sep 21, 2007)

Al.....you gotta be up to 6 or 7 grand already, then you'll put a NEW scope on it....wow. 

You might need trainer wheels to carry that monster from the truck to the shooing table, if you need help call me.


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## Al Hansen (Sep 7, 2007)

Seven said:


> Davidson Defense sometimes sells items that they don't have in stock and then leaves you waiting. so be aware of that. and realize that their parts most likely is from china. My other suggestion is that make sure your low profile gas block is steel and not aluminum. While aluminum works and is actually used by some major gun makers, it just makes sense in my mind to go with steel. aluminum and steel have different properties especially how they expand and contract with heat.
> 
> Going over 20 inches in the ar platform increases the price dramatically. That being said Here is a barrel that could possibly work for you.
> 
> https://www.rainierarms.com/rainier-arms-ultramatch-223-wylde-varmint-barrel-rifle-24


For what it's worth I ordered up a gas block and hand guard from Davidson Defense. Parts were at my door a day and a half after I placed the order. Pretty good follow through. Parts quality are I would say just OK. They'll work but they're cheap.


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## gdog (Sep 13, 2007)

Quote:
Originally Posted by reb8600 View Post
If you want extreme accuracy stay away from PSA that was recommended and Stag.



DallanC said:


> I'm curious why you mentioned Stag? The Model 6 I mentioned comes with a .5MOA guarantee. I found my 6L (lefty version) easily did that right out of the box. Its the 2nd most accurate rifle I've ever owned (Rugar #1 in 22-250 being the most accurate).
> 
> -DallanC


A friend and I have PSA uppers and they flat out shoot. We aren't shooting competition with them...but I'll guarantee you that you don't want to be a p-dog or coyote within a few hundred yards.


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