# BLM proposes shooting ban lake mtn, utah county - My response



## jungle (May 10, 2008)

Here is a copy of an email I sent to BLM and the Utah County Attorney. Feel free to use it as template for your response to BLM. You have til May 16.

The blm comment email address is: [email protected]

http://[email protected]

_Dear BLM and Mr. Buhman, Esq. (Utah County Attorney):

Why is BLM targeting shooters and yet giving preferential treatment to ATV riders? How about "confiscating" or banning half of 5-mile pass from ATV riders and giving half back to shooters? This is federal ground for which I pay taxes to use.

There is a proposed (or completed) land swap for 160 acres with Utah County for a shooting area in a remote location at the southern tip of Lake Mtn for shooters? Really? How many acres has been set apart for ATV riders in 5-mile pass? If we assume that the area closed off to shooters at 5-mile pass is at least 2.7 square miles (which is conservative), that is 1674 acres.

And yet you complain about shooting safety when you shut down safe areas to shoot? This type of hypocrisy does not hold up well in certain public and closed venues. And now you want to shut down more safe shooting areas so you can complain about unsafe shooting? Looks like you are trying to catch the public unaware in a vicious cycle of loss of civil rights in slow incremental steps.

As a shooter I am tired of this prejudice, bigotry and obvious violation of my civil liberties and equal rights.

No, the only acceptable land swap with Utah County for shooters is the entire south half of Lake Mountains with the Utah Dept of Wildlife Resources requisite 600 feet buffer zone south of the southern most point of development as of the date of this email or a conveniently located, road accessed 1674 acres, which ever is greater.

I am available as a Professional Geologist and Range Certified NRA Range Safety Officer if you need someone to patrol the area.

Respectfully, 
_


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## bossloader (Sep 11, 2007)

Can't agree with ya, they wont let me ride my ATV at lee kay center anymore and even the manga shooting range wont let me ride there ether, I too pay tax and also more tax because I ride my ATV (registration) and 100 ATV'S take up more ground then 100 shooters there are plenty ares out there to shoot a gun.


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## LostLouisianian (Oct 11, 2010)

I understand your frustration Jungle but I live out in Saratoga and have seen first hand the fires by stupid shooters. You have to understand what happened out here in the last 3-4 years to understand why they banned shooting. Yes it is frustrating to drive 45+ minutes to Lee Kay when I used to drive 5 minutes to shoot but if knuckleheads would quit using tannerite targets and leaving tv's and other garbage by the truckload we wouldn't have this problem in Utah county on the western side of the lake.


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

There are alot of Utah fires started by OHV's... alot.


-DallanC


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## Dukes_Daddy (Nov 14, 2008)

Sorry BLM is overdue with this. How many fires from idiots shooting rocks or Tannerite?

Now I would fully support the someone building a range in southern Salt Lake or norther Utah County.


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## redleg (Dec 5, 2007)

How many fires from OHVs and a dozen other public uses, that are no more legitimate than shooting?
If the Forest Service hadn't closed access to the rifle range on Mahogany Mountain above Pleasant Grove, people wouldn't be as upset about the other side of the lake.


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## Springville Shooter (Oct 15, 2010)

We need a swanky private shooting range for guys like me who don't mind paying for a nice place to shoot away from the 'public' aspect of public lands. Shooters only have themselves to blame for this. The garbage and lack of regard for safety turns me off.....let alone groups who already have dislike for guns and shooting in general. ------SS


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## gdog (Sep 13, 2007)

The general shooting public who leave trash and have no regard for self policing these areas are to blame. Not sure how you can be at all surprised this is happening. Growth of residential areas is a valid concern. It always amazed me at the amount of crap people haul out to shoot at and don't think twice about leaving it there.


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## wyogoob (Sep 7, 2007)

Springville Shooter said:


> We need a swanky private shooting range for guys like me who don't mind paying for a nice place to shoot away from the 'public' aspect of public lands. Shooters only have themselves to blame for this. The garbage and lack of regard for safety turns me off.....let alone groups who already have dislike for guns and shooting in general. ------SS


I have to agree. I'm willing to pay a fee to use a clean, well maintained range, even help with the maintenance.

Another plus: Our range max target distance is 200 yards, just perfect for half-blind guys with wooden-stocked rifles like myself.

.


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## Catherder (Aug 2, 2008)

The closure will be offset by the county putting in a maintained shooting range out there. A law abiding shooter will still be able to shoot there.

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/...-lands-to-Utah-County-for-shooting-range.html

Considering the ridiculous amounts of trash that gets dumped out there, I think the authorities have been more than tolerant of the situation and putting in a range and closing off the rest will adversely affect only those that seem to feel it necessary to target shoot their trash and run amok.


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## willfish4food (Jul 14, 2009)

I will say though. One of the things I like about shooting outside of a nice range is practicing my field shooting. I like practicing off hand, kneeling, sitting, prone, over a stump/rock, etc. At most ranges I've been to, that's not allowed. I've also never been to a range where I can shoot at angles like I'll need to in the field. 

All that said, I'm certainly not going to say that the BLM was not justified in closing it down to shooting with all the trash that was constantly left out there. Even when the big stuff got picked up, there was so much broken glass, shotgun hulls, plastic/wood fragments, and other small garbage, that the whole area looked like a dump. Truly, we are our worst enemies sometimes.


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## Springville Shooter (Oct 15, 2010)

wyogoob said:


> I have to agree. I'm willing to pay a fee to use a clean, well maintained range, even help with the maintenance.
> 
> Another plus: Our range max target distance is 200 yards, just perfect for half-blind guys with wooden-stocked rifles like myself.
> 
> .


I really miss the clubhouse aspect of the range back home. Always fun to pack a lunch, pop some caps, and see who was hanging out at the club. Especially on bad weather day with nothing else to do.

I also miss sanctioned matches both to shoot and observe. I shot the long-bench contests and loved watching the old-timers shooting the military matches with their Garand's and stuff.

When we were barely-twenty something broke newlyweds, my wife got a great scholarship from the club for being a female shooter. All that for $50.00 per month. I'd pay four times that amount for the same amenities.......without a second thought.------SS


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## Catherder (Aug 2, 2008)

Springville Shooter said:


> I really miss the clubhouse aspect of the range back home. Always fun to pack a lunch, pop some caps, and see who was hanging out at the club. Especially on bad weather day with nothing else to do.
> 
> I also miss sanctioned matches both to shoot and observe. I shot the long-bench contests and loved watching the old-timers shooting the military matches with their Garand's and stuff.
> 
> When we were barely-twenty something broke newlyweds, my wife got a great scholarship from the club for being a female shooter. All that for $50.00 per month. I'd pay four times that amount for the same amenities.......without a second thought.------SS


Do any of you Utah natives remember the old Holladay Gun Club above Wasatch Blvd? Back in the day, when I was a youth, that place was way cool through a teens eyes. Lots of good memories.


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## Critter (Mar 20, 2010)

We used to go to a range up in the mouth of Provo Canyon where the park is now. The last time that I was there was over 30 years ago and the pit at the end of the range was just about full of used appliances.


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

Critter said:


> We used to go to a range up in the mouth of Provo Canyon where the park is now. The last time that I was there was over 30 years ago and the pit at the end of the range was just about full of used appliances.


The current provo range is pretty nice, my boy did his hunters safety shooting there at the pistol / rimfire range.

-DallanC


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## Critter (Mar 20, 2010)

It's always nice to be able to go to a range the is kept up and perhaps a cover over the shooing area so that if it is raining you can still shoot and enjoy the time. 

The area that I shoot at right now is BLM land and if I use a old road I can shoot out to 800 yards but like other areas people like to shoot trash and I usually haul at least a truck load out of there each year. The down side to this area is that I am still waiting for the mud to dry up so that I can get out there and start shooting my .25-06 and get some loads built up for it.


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## LostLouisianian (Oct 11, 2010)

There IS a spot or two on the west side of Utah lake where shooting is legal and the area is easily accessible. I will NOT post those sites in public on here. If you want to know where they are then PM me and I will let you know in private. I have cleared with Law Enforcement that those sites are still legal to shoot at.


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