# UTAH WILDLIFE NETWORK...



## USMARINEhuntinfool (Sep 15, 2007)

So after seeing everything that's going on it's obvious that the people that are getting heard by the DWR are those that have organized/united. Whether that be SFW, RMEF, MDF, etc. Why don't we put together our own board of representatives that would be willing to meet cover issues and show representation before the RAC's, WB and the DWR on "our" behalf. This being a strictly non-profit in the best interest of the Average Joe "group". We could organize conservation projects and provide service and make sure our ideas are atleast getting heard. Represented by "Board Members" that can be removed by a group vote if they don't feel they are adequately representing. I think this has already been started some by the group that met to discuss the EMP. I think the only way we're going to get heard is if we organize/unite. Maybe noone wants to oranize/unite. I don't know just a thought.


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## mikevanwilder (Nov 11, 2008)

Sounds like a great idea! I would be all for it.


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## Iron Bear (Nov 19, 2008)

No doubt organized and active is the way to go.

The only consensus on this site is that things need to change. And that's a recent event. But in what direction?
I believe a UWN group would only be a mini RMEF. Elk Elk Elk. :roll: 

If your talking about the future of hunting you need to think about what game is entry level and would best serve the average Joe? 

What game has the best recruitment potential? 
What was your 1rst big game experiences? 
What got you hooked?

An exceptional Elk herd in Utah will never be the staple hunt that even an average deer herd would provide.


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## USMARINEhuntinfool (Sep 15, 2007)

IRON BEAR, I agree with what most of what your saying. I think the group should be to benefit ALL species of hunting. Not just elk. I think steps should be taken to ensure quality hunting PERIOD for our children and grand children. I think we could accomplish a lot for all species and all individuals concerned. Of course thats all just my opinion.


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## swbuckmaster (Sep 14, 2007)

sounds like a great idea this sight probably has 20,000 people with it as well

it can take polling questions, debate, and do much more. plus it doesn't pimp out the tags.

lets get it rolling



USMARINEhuntinfool said:


> IRON BEAR, I agree with what most of what your saying. I think the group should be to benefit ALL species of hunting. Not just elk. I think steps should be taken to ensure quality hunting PERIOD for our children and grand children. I think we could accomplish a lot for all species and all individuals concerned. Of course thats all just my opinion.


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## Mojo1 (Sep 8, 2007)

swbuckmaster said:


> sounds like a great idea this sight probably has 20,000 people with it as well


3144 registered members according to the memebers tab, Lawmakers won't care about lurkers, only registered members much like they only care about registered voters.


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## swbuckmaster (Sep 14, 2007)

3,144 is more than UBA has I believe. so you could very well have a voice.


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## TopofUtahArcher (Sep 9, 2009)

I'm in. We need a true "for the people" sportsmens association. I feel BOU is that way, but their title kind of limits their area of effect to bowhunting.


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## Guns and Flies (Nov 7, 2007)

I think abou this type of thing all the time, but with three kids, working 50+ hours a week just to get by, it's so hard to find the time, money, energy etc.........


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## ramrod (Apr 15, 2008)

Guns and Flies said:


> I think abou this type of thing all the time, but with three kids, working 50+ hours a week just to get by, it's so hard to find the time, money, energy etc.........


 I think getting to youth involved at an early age is very important, besides who can tell a 14 year old the dont care if he onle draws an elk tag one or mabey two times in his lifetime.


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## Packbasket (Oct 29, 2009)

If you want to be heard you stand alone, together.

500 letters and phone calls always makes more impact than one letter and call representing 500 people.

band together if you want but you must speak with all 500 individual voices if you want to be heard. groups are the easy way out and the current generatiosn thinking that a group and a logo makes it for real. In the 60's it was a business card, if you had a card you were " for real" now its the window decal with the Dot Com that means we are for real, but politicians only know how to add and subtract, 500 calls For something minus the 400 calls against means the one that has 100 more gets the nod.


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

Excellent post Packbasket! 

I went to the Expo on Saturday, even talked with several UWN folks while there. I wanted to talk to a few folks about the elk proposal. I was able to talk to some smart sportsmen at length, one of whom was in the media. He said he isn't going to take sides, but would be glad to give us some coverage if we can get 100+ people to rally together for some sort of meeting or protest. So, if we are serious we need to PROVE IT! 

It doesn't take an organized group with a Board of Directors, it takes a group of passionate like-minded sportsmen uniting and making their collective voice be heard.


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## USMARINEhuntinfool (Sep 15, 2007)

> It doesn't take an organized group with a Board of Directors, it takes a group of passionate like-minded sportsmen uniting and making their collective voice be heard.


This is essentially what I was suggesting.


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

I agree Marine, this place can be used as a medium to get people organized behind issues, educate them of the issues, and be used to make an impact other than just venting behind a screen. 8)


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## elk22hunter (Sep 7, 2007)

swbuckmaster said:


> 3,144 is more than UBA has I believe. so you could very well have a voice.


Your voice however is going to sound like Rich Little or Danny Ganns. To think that you are going to get the same voice out of more than a few of these guys is more than optomistic. Everyone enjoys hunting for different reasons. I am not trying to be a downer but realistic.


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## Petersen (Sep 7, 2007)

elk22hunter said:


> swbuckmaster said:
> 
> 
> > 3,144 is more than UBA has I believe. so you could very well have a voice.
> ...


Agreed, and just for the record...

This forum certainly supports good hunting, good fishing, good wildlife management and citizen participation in wildlife management issues. It's probably accurate to say, however, that there would be a good deal of disagreement between forum members on exactly how to achieve these objectives.

The UWN forum is just that, a forum where ideas can be discussed. As for UWN taking official positions on issues, it doesn't. Any of the opinions expressed in this forum are just the opinions of the forum members. UWN isn't a sportsman's advocacy or lobbying group - it's just a forum.

All this being the case, it's certainly okay to use this forum to discuss wildlife issues and even to round up support for various initiatives, but please remember that the UWN doesn't take official positions on them. Please don't use the UWN name or its membership numbers in ways that might imply to others that it does.


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

elk22hunter said:


> swbuckmaster said:
> 
> 
> > 3,144 is more than UBA has I believe. so you could very well have a voice.
> ...


I doubt anyone is talking about major/radical changes to anything. Call me optimistic if you like, but I see no reason why on hot button issues like the water easement bill(s) going on right now on the hill, the proposed elk plan, are among many that can rally a fairly significant number of people who agree/disagree with an issues basic principles. Can we get consensus on an issue? Highly unlikely, but I think we can get people to agree that what is being done is good/bad.

On the elk issue, I went and made only a couple of tweaks to the proposal that the DWR is wanting to propose. I think the changes keep opportunity, in some units there will be a reduction of opportunity and an increase in others. Overall, under 'my' proposal there would be a net gain of opportunity. Why would something like that be overly 'optimistic' to expect a large amount of support OVER the only option out there right now?


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## MadHunter (Nov 17, 2009)

As I am reading all the opinions posted here I came up with a thought. If we unite and create an organization even if it is 500 strong we have to ensure that the true goal remains a common goal.

Take one of the gorillas for example SFW (Sprortsmen F'ing up Wildlife), if they have 2000 members, How many of them really know what the objectives, projects and ultimate agenda of the organization really are? I doubt that more that 10% can state any of these items. Being informed is key when it comes to lobbying/fighting for a cause.

If we have 500 voices here we need to ensure all 500 are stating 1 message and 1 goal. Uniting in any number is pointless if we are all trying to get 500 different messages accross.

I really believe that most of the people that join SFW and other organization do it because the magazines are included and you get a ball cap and a decal. I used to be a meber of them and I had no clue what went on and what they were pushing at any given time. I was a number to them and that is all we still are. To that 900lbs gorilla we are not hunters, just numbers.

Count me in on this fight. My first grandkid is coming in a few weeks and I want him/her to hunt as I once did.


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## Iron Bear (Nov 19, 2008)

So its settled. We should think of a name.

May I suggest. Screw Elk and Bring Back the Deer Association. SEBBDA :mrgreen:


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

I like, "Screw sPecial Interest Tyranny" S.P.I.T. :shock:


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## hockey (Nov 7, 2007)

The difference between the gorilla/SFW and the many different proposals offered from this forum is that the "gorilla gets out from behind the keyboard and fights for what they believe in rather than spending countless hours and 100's and even 1000's of posts pissing in the wind


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## MadHunter (Nov 17, 2009)

I understand there was a meeting with a few of the members in here about some of the elk issues. Is there another scheduled? Who would head this organization up? Let's talk about meeting first and laying down the foundation work. I have never organized anything like this before but I am willing to do my part or step aside and support minds vastly superior to mine. Let's stop talking and start doing? When and where should we meet?


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

I helped get the folks together last week, and I am not interested in forming an organization. I think the best way to appeal to the masses is to be the masses. Unite for specific causes, I am 100% behind that. I like the idea of a Tea Party type movement in the hunting community much more than adding another group to the mix.

As of today we don't have another meeting date set, but we are in the works of getting one set. 8)


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## jahan (Sep 7, 2007)

hockey said:


> The difference between the gorilla/SFW and the many different proposals offered from this forum is that the "gorilla gets out from behind the keyboard and fights for what they believe in rather than spending countless hours and 100's and even 1000's of posts pissing in the wind


And you act as if they formed overnight. I am sure they started off as a bunch of people all pissed or irritated with the way things were going, formed a group and grew into the giant ugly gorilla. :mrgreen:


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## MadHunter (Nov 17, 2009)

I will try to stay in the loop as much as possible. I agree with you Pro... another organization is not what we need all we need is unity as a mass. However, we do need to have commonality in a goal or objective or the whole thing is pointless.

If we turn into another organization we become exactly what we are fighting.


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## USMARINEhuntinfool (Sep 15, 2007)

I'm in agreeance with most of what has been said. A couple things I would suggest. Let's not delegate a head of an outfit. I think thats where a lot of problems come into play. Give one person to much power the rest lose all power. Maybe a spokesman would be a better idea if thats what you want. Someone who is good with the public and has a fairly quick wit. Nothing worse than bringing up your best proposal and getting bombarded with questions then standing there like a lost puppy dog. Also if its put that way it turns into more this is his idea not their idea. I'd say we get together as a group and discuss things, then show up in force at RAC and before the WB. Thats just my suggestions though.


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## SteepNDeep (Sep 11, 2007)

If you get a group together I have a couple of suggestions which might set the proper tone.

As others have mentioned, the last thing the state needs is another "conservation" group- aka- someone pushing trophy hunting.

In fact, you would need to strive to be the opposite for success.

My two initial thoughts on worthy initiatives would be some age where a person has a statewide deer tag. Like 60 or something. You put in for a draw somewhere and whatever you get counts from that area, but you're statewide. Let's keep the granddads in front of the kids. I think that's a no-brainer that would bring instant cred, garner support, and have little impact on any deer herd. 

Second- propose to glean 5% of the current cash grab nasty evil tags going to the other guys for auction by your group with 100% of the proceeds going to scholarships for young hunters with amazing grades and some kind of application process. Keep some 10 or dozen tags for the kids so they get a tag and a scholarship fund. You could even hold it until they are accepted to a college and then award after having gained a bit of interest for the perpetual fund. This would be awesome for several reasons. First- who will argue with it? I think you would look pretty foolish as an organization to fight it. Second- why not motivate kids with education and the excitement of a OIL hunt? Certainly you could raise some valuable college funding for a group of kids every year. And third- you could kick the other orgs in the balls by taking 5%.

Why take 5%? Because we have limited quantities as is, and the current system should have to pay for some of this irresponsibility. All of them need some face saving wether they admit it or not, and 5% is just as small and tiny as whenever they proposed and asked for it last time around. In their words- not much cost for great benefit. I TOTALLY AGREE WITH THEM. 

So, that's my 2 cents on how we can start with this type of a true sportsmans organization. I guess my third would be to ask our best friends- some of us who have them- for leads, contacts, and members of those who have a bit of land or a tie in to any CWMU. Let's see if we can glean one, or several tags from sponsors who sympathize with what we do - they exist- and we can use those modest funds from auction to arrange our own service initiatives and conservation stuff. 

That's really a better model for how the private sector should contribute to worthy causes like conservation. The division creating a scenario where conservation is forced on sportsmen like it currently is....is very comparable to cap and trade type things. What the division does is a kind of forced charity that Tea Party folks hate. 

I think this would be something people would gravitate to. There are many people who DON'T join SFW for all of the reasons that they irritate us of late. Many of those folks have influence and simply won't align themselves with that kind of racket. There needs to be another alternative.


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## SteepNDeep (Sep 11, 2007)

BTW, when I say old guys hint statewide, I'm meaning statewide general - as we know it today at least. 

And, if I didn't make it clear, if someone wants to work in an org like that I'm all in. Though I have a nasty confession to make - I recently moved to Texas :evil: . Yep, it's true. If you knew me though you know where my heart is. I'm still hunting in Utah every year, and when I get back my boys will hunt in Utah. So it matters quite a bit to me.


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## USMARINEhuntinfool (Sep 15, 2007)

So when and where can we get together again soon?


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

USMARINEhuntinfool said:


> So when and where can we get together again soon?


Working on a few things. I would hope in the next 7-10 days.


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## USMARINEhuntinfool (Sep 15, 2007)

Sounds great, I'll make sure I can make it this time and I'll take charge of posting on the internet while we're in session if need be.


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## USMARINEhuntinfool (Sep 15, 2007)

Unified Sportsman Alliance - USA?


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

My brother was supposed to build a Facebook page for us, but he had some work come up all of a sudden. I ain't smart enough to know how to do it. Does anyone want to take it and get it up and running?


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## USMARINEhuntinfool (Sep 15, 2007)

Like a group page? I could probably get a group page started.


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## Finnegan (Sep 7, 2007)

Here you go. Open to everybody.

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=320110936606


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## Iron Bear (Nov 19, 2008)

I can only hope Deer will be a major priority with this movement. 

If deer were a priority and this group was willing to make the fight for many of the deer management methods that have been discussed many times over here on UWN. And take deer management in a new direction.

I could and would pledge 50 members to the cause. My family alone would give you 31 members.


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## USMARINEhuntinfool (Sep 15, 2007)

IRON BEAR, Everything outdoors will be a priority?

Finn- You just beat me to the punch, wonder if I can delete mine?


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## Iron Bear (Nov 19, 2008)

Well everyone hunts deer?


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## USMARINEhuntinfool (Sep 15, 2007)

That should have read, EVERYTHING WILL BE A PRIORITY! all things hunting and fishing anyways.


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## Finnegan (Sep 7, 2007)

USMARINEhuntinfool said:


> Finn- You just beat me to the punch, wonder if I can delete mine?


Oops..sorry. I misunderstood your post. Help admin?


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## USMARINEhuntinfool (Sep 15, 2007)

It's cool I'm closing mine out and defering them to yours as best I can. I'll help with Admin if you'd like!


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## Finnegan (Sep 7, 2007)

Poof! You're an admin!
Tree, too, since I took the liberty of pilfering one of his photos for the page.


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## USMARINEhuntinfool (Sep 15, 2007)

Sounds good. Guess I'll help get things rolling.


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

I added a spreadsheet and a pdf file on Finns Facebook group : http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=320110936606 
I see he made me an admin., now someone needs to help me figure out what that allows me to do. :shock:


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## .45 (Sep 21, 2007)

proutdoors said:


> I added a spreadsheet and a pdf file on Finns Facebook group : http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=320110936606
> *I see he made me an admin., now someone needs to help me figure out what that allows me to do*. :shock:


A good 'admin' guy knows how to clean up the place.....you know-sweep the floors, clean the toilets, wash the windows. Gotta work your way up, you can't just start at the top !! :roll:


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

I may not be qualified for such responsibilities. -)O(-


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## yak4fish (Nov 16, 2007)

Well you guys are the last straw. i've been dodging the Facebook thing, calling it a time killer to the rest of my family who spend countless hours on it. I will now have to sign up so I can have another web site to talk hunting and fishing.


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## USMARINEhuntinfool (Sep 15, 2007)

Sounds like as good a reason as anyother. It is what you make it.


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## Guns and Flies (Nov 7, 2007)

I'm not sure what the mission statement is or what I am supporting but I joined the facebook page.


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## blownsmok97 (Nov 8, 2009)

Count me in, i just joined up


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

blownsmok97 said:


> Count me in, i just joined up


Thank you! Be sure and introduce your self on there, so we know who you are. 8)


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