# EP vs GSP



## sittingbull (Feb 1, 2008)

I am planning on getting a new pointing dog soon and I was hoping to get some constructive opinions. What do you all like the best and least about EP's and GSP's. I'm hoping for a great bird dog which is also a great family dog. My favorite quarry is chukar. My wife is partial to the EP and I'm more interested in a GSP.


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## TAK (Sep 9, 2007)

6's!!! I do know of a litter in Helper Utah that is ready to go. Owner is Kyle Kolow not sure on his last name spelling. I saw the litter tonight and there is some good looking pups with pretty good blood behind them. 
One male caught my eye. He has a slight white blaze on his forhead and clean body, nice tail and great tail set. 
I am a GSP guy all the way!


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## TEX-O-BOB (Sep 12, 2007)

It's hard to beat a good EP for endurance and ground coverage. A lot of GSP's will do the same as well. But if you ask me, the GSP would be a better choice. They seem to be a little more rugged, less afraid of water, natural retrievers, and a little more gregarious. (that means friendly, TAK) EP's are also friendly, but in a weird stuck-up, aloof, English sort of way... In fact, I think they have all the personality of a pair of pliers.


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## Texscala (Sep 8, 2007)

I am not an expert but I love the way EPs go on point. In my opinion the best looking point there is. Their downside would be that their skin and pads seems to be a bit soft. Though the spirit in the dog will keep it hunting you end up with a dog covered in blood.


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## vdogs (Sep 22, 2007)

Either one would make an excellent chukar dog! Which ever you decide on..just make sure the pup comes from "western" stock and the parents have been hunted extensively on chukar. This will pretty much assure you the pup will have what it takes to accomplish the task.. "chukar hunt'n".

Good luck with your search! That's half the fun!

Rick


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## Gumbo (Sep 22, 2007)

TEX-O-BOB said:


> the GSP would be a better choice.


Tex, how are the wirehairs for chukar? I know they don't range as much as a GSP or EP. Just interested in your view of the diffs, strengths, weaknesses.


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## TEX-O-BOB (Sep 12, 2007)

Gumbo said:


> TEX-O-BOB said:
> 
> 
> > the GSP would be a better choice.
> ...


I have seen some GWP's that do really well on chuckar, others not so good. Most of the problems GWP's have is with the heat. An EP or GSP will always do better and have more stamina in a hot situation. 50 degrees may as well be 150 degrees to a GWP. I know a lot of guys like there dogs out there at 200-500 yards hunting as much country as possible. I don't hunt chukars that way. I find the birds first, then work them with a close working dog. In fact I hunt all birds that way. Close, quiet, with little wasted effort. I'm to old and out of shape to hike all over tarnation looking for one covey of birds. :wink: I also take joy in watching a dog work the birds, something you'll have a hard time doing when he's out there a mile away. The range of most GWP's is limited to under 100 yards, but that's the way I like it. Hunting to me, no matter what form, has always been more about "how close" not "how far". Get to far out there and it loses it's intimate appeal.


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## bwhntr (Sep 12, 2007)

Either breed would be a great choice, my personal preference would be the EP. I prefer the EP because they are all about birds. It seems many of the Germans like to chase fur too much for my taste. I hunt birds not racoons. Don't believe the BS you read above. Most EP are very affectionate with great personalities and make great family dogs. EVERY one I have own have been natural retrievers. I owned one that didn't like water, but he was the first to the retrieve even if it fell in the middle of a lake! Most of the EP I hunt around like the water just fine. They run all day in ANY weather. It doesn't matter if it is 100 or -20 degrees, they will hunt it all. I have seen many GSP with the same run and drive. Like I said, both breeds would be great for any upland game especially Chukar. Remember also a good running dog is your best friend. The more he runs is more ground he covers, and this means less hiking for you!

On a side note, the EP has set the bar by which all other pointing breeds are judged. Now that says alot! Good luck!


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## TAK (Sep 9, 2007)

bwhntr will have some contact information on this, but I know of a GSP male that is for sale. The dog is very well started, I put just over a month on him last summer. He seems to have a good nose, good range. With more birds he will only get better. For the price he is worth a look.....


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## TEX-O-BOB (Sep 12, 2007)

> On a side note, the EP has set the bar by which all other pointing breeds are judged. Now that says alot! Good luck!


 :roll:

They got Point, speed, and range. That's it...


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## sittingbull (Feb 1, 2008)

TAK said:


> I do know of a litter in Helper Utah that is ready to go. Owner is Kyle Kolow


TAK, do you have any more info you could PM me? I am definately interested.

Thanks for all the input everyone. I'm still leaning towards the GSP mainly just because I like the way they look more than an EP. If everything else is 6's, then that's my main deciding factor. By the way, how much can I expect to pay for a dog?


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## 12 Volt Man (Sep 7, 2007)

You are probably looking at 400-600 for a good GSP pup.


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## bwhntr (Sep 12, 2007)

TAK said:


> bwhntr will have some contact information on this, but I know of a GSP male that is for sale. The dog is very well started, I put just over a month on him last summer. He seems to have a good nose, good range. With more birds he will only get better. For the price he is worth a look.....


I do know of a nice GSP for sale. He is about 1 1/2 years old. You don't have to deal with the puppy BS, and he is ready to be hunted now! Great breeding, TAK did the training on him and he has been hunted quite a bit. He even placed at our amatuer trial. He is a deal at $550!


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## Red-Grouse (Sep 22, 2007)

TEX-O-BOB said:


> Gumbo said:
> 
> 
> > [quote="TEX-O-BOB":2r2wkyht]the GSP would be a better choice.
> ...


I have seen some GWP's that do really well on chuckar, others not so good. Most of the problems GWP's have is with the heat. An EP or GSP will always do better and have more stamina in a hot situation. 50 degrees may as well be 150 degrees to a GWP. I know a lot of guys like there dogs out there at 200-500 yards hunting as much country as possible. I don't hunt chukars that way. I find the birds first, then work them with a close working dog. In fact I hunt all birds that way. Close, quiet, with little wasted effort. I'm to old and out of shape to hike all over tarnation looking for one covey of birds. :wink: I also take joy in watching a dog work the birds, something you'll have a hard time doing when he's out there a mile away. The range of most GWP's is limited to under 100 yards, but that's the way I like it. Hunting to me, no matter what form, has always been more about "how close" not "how far". Get to far out there and it loses it's intimate appeal.[/quote:2r2wkyht]

I am going to offer a differing view to Tex I like a dog to stretch its leg and run my GWP has developed into that, but heat is the limitation. She is at her best with 2 inches of snow on the ground. My point is they will range if you pick your lines carefully and encourage it. I didn't even think of range when I got mine and spent the first year reeling her in all the time only to realize at year 3 I would like more range out of her :x I know it was my first bird dog  ...........There are GWP's out there that will range but they are not GSP's or EP's. I have an EP and she can last longer in the heat than even a GSP, but I like the German dogs a bunch they are really intelligent and they are tough as nails.......


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## bwhntr (Sep 12, 2007)

My point exactly Thack...The more they run the less you hike. Especially with Chukar, let them stretch out and cover all the country in front of you. When they slam a point, walk up and kill your birds! They are covering country you will never have to walk through if there are no birds. It took me a while to learn the importance of bigger running dogs, now I find if invaluable! Good post!


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## TAK (Sep 9, 2007)

I am posting this for a friend from Helper Utah. 
AKC registered GSP pups out of Rawhides Clown & Heidi's Cityslicker lines.
5 Females
2 Males

Contact for price, pedigree and I will try and post some pics.

(435) 630-6116 Kyle

This was posted at the Utahbirddogsfourm.

His number is what is above or this 435-650-6116


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## TAK (Sep 9, 2007)

sittingbull said:


> TAK said:
> 
> 
> > I do know of a litter in Helper Utah that is ready to go. Owner is Kyle Kolow
> ...


I posted up his number(s) try it both ways and see if you get ahold of him. If you do look at them look at the male that has a little white blaze on his forhead. If the time was right I would take that little guy right now. He looked like he was wond real tight and was just waiting to let it rip!!!!!!


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## TAK (Sep 9, 2007)

sittingbull said:


> TAK said:
> 
> 
> > I do know of a litter in Helper Utah that is ready to go. Owner is Kyle Kolow
> ...


Also this dog that Bwhtr talks about has some nice lines and has a great desire for birds. I worked him last summer and he is ready to go. He can use some polish and more birds but I think he could be a fine bird dog. He is around the 45 to 50 lb mark and I don't think he will get much more bigger. 
One thing about a started dog you can see what you are getting right from the get go. at this price he is well worth that. You can hunt him today if needed. The owner is kinda a crack head for giving up a GSP for a Pointer..... It must be the water out that way?


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## sittingbull (Feb 1, 2008)

[/quote]
I do know of a nice GSP for sale. He is about 1 1/2 years old. You don't have to deal with the puppy BS, and he is ready to be hunted now! Great breeding, TAK did the training on him and he has been hunted quite a bit. He even placed at our amatuer trial. He is a deal at $550![/quote]

Thanks, bwhntr, but I think I would rather get a pup. I'm looking forward to the training. That's all part of the fun right?

TAK, thanks for the info on your friend in Helper. I'll check it out.


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## bwhntr (Sep 12, 2007)

sittingbull said:


> Thanks, bwhntr, but I think I would rather get a pup. I'm looking forward to the training. That's all part of the fun right?


No problem, the puppy thing isn't for me. I have gone through that a few times and I really don't enjoy it. I would rather buy a finsished dog, or at least one that is through the puppy BS. I just bought a 7 month old pointer and that is a good age too as he is pretty much done with the puppy stuff I hate, but young enough to start on birds.

Good luck I am sure you will find something nice!


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## Western Charm (Sep 8, 2007)

TEX-O-BOB said:


> > On a side note, the EP has set the bar by which all other pointing breeds are judged. Now that says alot! Good luck!
> 
> 
> :roll:
> ...


C'mon Darin. For one thing those three are not trivial and they are a long way ahead of the second place breed. Let's also not forget endurance, heat tolerance, H20 efficiency, Gait efficiency, style and class (subjective I know) mental toughness (perhaps to a fault) independance, intlegent application, early maturity. They are not versitile, so it is not fair to judge them as such.

Now let's discuss the _bar _for deer chasing, fox chasing, **** killing, skunk spray drinking, then rolling in said skunk.....      oh I digress, sorry this thread isn't about GWPs. :lol:

When we gonna meet at Golf In The Round?

Robb


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## DDGuy (Nov 4, 2007)

Western Charm said:


> Now let's discuss the _bar _for deer chasing, fox chasing, **** killing, skunk spray drinking, then rolling in said skunk.....Robb


I don't know about anyone else....but thems all my favorite things cause that's all German dogs are good for. I was just down at Ogden Bay until dark lookin for skunks. I know they're out cause I saw a dead one on the road this morning.........Didn't find any :wink:


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## TAK (Sep 9, 2007)

I sure wish you could get a few more of them... I hit one this AM in Spanish Fork Canyon.... Want to smell my tires! **** Vermin! But they are a step up from Ducks!


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## TEX-O-BOB (Sep 12, 2007)

> When we gonna meet at Golf In The Round?


When my club handles don't feel like rubber ice sickles... :x


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