# Distance



## Utahyounggun (Nov 5, 2014)

Alright maybe I'm pushing it but I honestly think it's a doable shot. I'm wanting to be able to shoot out to 250 yards with my muzzleloader. For where I think my buck is going to show up I may need every yard I can get. I have a Winchester x-150 and I love it. Right now it's sighted in with 100 grains of powder and a 250 grain slug and I put the finishing shot on my antelope at 219 yards free hand lucky ass shot a couple years ago so I know it's capable of longer shots. I'm thinking of switching to triple 7 60 grain pellets and bumping my grains up to 120. What's everyone's opinion on distance and knockdown power with this load? Would you bump it up to 150 grains of powder? What would you do different? What's your opinion on the whole situation? Thanks in advance.


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## utahgolf (Sep 8, 2007)

get closer


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## Utahyounggun (Nov 5, 2014)

Fair enough but I think it's a shot that can be done with enough practice and tuning.


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## 200_or_400 (Jun 25, 2015)

What slug? Whats the velocity of the slug? Do you know how fast your slug is going at 250 yards?Will the slug perform like it should at 250 yards? These are things that YOU need to figure out before even attempting a shot at 250 yards. Just because you can hit something at that distance doesnt mean you should be doing it. Then there is the eithics on IF you can see what your aiming at the distance with a 1x power scope. Muzzy arent high power rifles and you need to understand that. Im not here to be the ethics police but please understand what your talking about is risky at best. You owe it to the animal.


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## Critter (Mar 20, 2010)

Excuse me for being a little bit blunt, but it is a muzzle loader. 

If you want to shoot 250 yards get a center fire rifle. 





















































OK, I'm off my soap box.


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## BigT (Mar 11, 2011)

I agree with the others, try and get closer.


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## kstorrs (Oct 29, 2012)

From the distance I am sighting in my muzzleloader with a 30" barrel using 120 grain loose powder and 240 gr bullet I'll have 14" of bullet drop at 250 yards with substantial loss of both velocity and energy. At 250 yards you will be covering the entire deer with your sights or crosshairs and just be taking a SWAG at what you're aiming at.


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## Utahyounggun (Nov 5, 2014)

Thanks for everyone's feedback and opinions I'm not one to get offended by people's opinions so nothing you guys say is taken to heart and I appreciate your feedback. My uncle is pretty into rifles and shooting and trying out new loads and such and he suggested still using 100 grains of powder but using a heavier slug. That's what he has had the best luck with. Ive got a dedicated hunter tag so I'm actually hunting this buck with my bow right now but not pushing him to hard in hopes of him still being around for the muzzy. Here's a teaser pic just for the heck of it if it loads up. He's the middle buck the one on the bottom right is #2 on the hitlist.


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## torowy (Jun 19, 2008)

Switch to blackhorn 209.


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## derekp1999 (Nov 17, 2011)

The way I see it... it's more about you than the gun. The gun is capable. Are you? If you are capable and comfortable with a shot of that distance
when you look down the scope there isn't a soul on the mountain that will prevent you from pulling the trigger.


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## Utahyounggun (Nov 5, 2014)

I've heard great things about blackthorn 209 and also white hots. I honestly think with a dead rest laying down on my pack I'm very capable of making the shot


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## Critter (Mar 20, 2010)

Utahyounggun said:


> I've heard great things about blackthorn 209 and also white hots. I honestly think with a dead rest laying down on my pack I'm very capable of making the shot


Place a milk jug up at 250 yards and try the shot. When you can hit it 10 times out of 10 then you will know if you are capable of making the shot.


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## Utahyounggun (Nov 5, 2014)

That's the only way to find out is to practice a lot and know your capabilities and your guns


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## Fishracer (Mar 2, 2009)

Anything over 100gr of powder will just fowl your barrel more and kick harder with no added punch, speed, or energy to your bullet, if anything it will decrease your accuracy and consistency. I would not go with a heavier bullet either. I have actually gone down in weight over the years. From a 295 down to a 245 power belt. Some guys like these, others do not. I will also tell you i shoot the cheapest muzzleloader you can buy. I bought it as a starter gun, but have killed a lot of animals with it, and it is what i am comfortable with, so why change. I have shot other muzzleloaders that are 500 dollars more then mine with no real difference in accuracy or consistency. You are going to find all kinds of opinions on here, but the bottom line is, find what works well with your gun, with you! About the only thing that everyone on here will agree with is, 250 yards is to far for a muzzy! Good luck on your hunt.


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## GaryFish (Sep 7, 2007)

Eh. Just hold a little high and you'll be fine.


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## willfish4food (Jul 14, 2009)

GaryFish said:


> Eh. Just hold a little high and you'll be fine.


If you see ptarmigan in your scope, you're holding too high. :grin:


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## Utahyounggun (Nov 5, 2014)

Thanks for everyones feedback again I think I'll try some different powder and maybe a few different slugs


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## muddydogs (Oct 7, 2007)

Fishracer said:


> Anything over 100gr of powder will just fowl your barrel more and kick harder with no added punch, speed, or energy to your bullet, if anything it will decrease your accuracy and consistency. I would not go with a heavier bullet either. I have actually gone down in weight over the years. From a 295 down to a 245 power belt. Some guys like these, others do not. I will also tell you i shoot the cheapest muzzleloader you can buy. I bought it as a starter gun, but have killed a lot of animals with it, and it is what i am comfortable with, so why change. I have shot other muzzleloaders that are 500 dollars more then mine with no real difference in accuracy or consistency. You are going to find all kinds of opinions on here, but the bottom line is, find what works well with your gun, with you! About the only thing that everyone on here will agree with is, 250 yards is to far for a muzzy! Good luck on your hunt.


So have you done any chronograph work to back up this claim of yours? Have you taken your data and ran it through a ballistic calculator to actually see how bullet weights effect trajectory and down range energy? I think not as my finding are totally opposite from yours.


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## muddydogs (Oct 7, 2007)

Utahyounggun said:


> Thanks for everyones feedback again I think I'll try some different powder and maybe a few different slugs


Here is some real life data for you. 110 grains by volume / 77 grains by weight of BH209, CCI 209 M primer, 300 grain .45 cal XTP bullet in a Harvester Crushed Rib sabot out of a Traditions Striker Fire rifle with a 10 foot muzzle velocity of 1930. I will say that this load really thumps ya out of a light weight rifle.

All numbers are adjusted for 8000 feet elevation and 50 degree's. 250 yard drop is 24" and a 10 mile an hour wind drift is 17". 300 yard drop is 42" and a 10 mile an hour wind drift of 25". So at 250 yards one would have to hang 16 inches over a deers back which is doable but not the easiest thing to do with iron sights or a 1X scope.


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## Flyfishn247 (Oct 2, 2007)

I prefer a heavier bullet, you gain much more energy, speed actually surpasses the lighter slug at around 160 yards, and only give up an inch of trajectory at 200 yards. I think 250 yards with open sights or a 1x will be the biggest issue with accuracy, a mouse fart or a slight variance in sight picture could cause a 16" shift in aim. I view muzzy much like bow hunting (this is my first muzzy hunt in 13 years, spent much of the last 2 decades bow hunting), and that is use stealth and primitive skills to get close, save the distance shooting for a rifle hunt. That said, today's inlines are very capable of making the shot. A


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## Utahyounggun (Nov 5, 2014)

I definitely am going to try and keep it under 200 yards and plan on shooting my gun next weekend when the archery hunt is over. I'm going to see if I can't pick up some of the Barnes tez 290s I think that's the slug I've heard a bunch of people talking about. I'm undecided on which powder to try. Has anybody heard anything about the white hot pellets?


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## muddydogs (Oct 7, 2007)

I did a lot of research when I purchased this new rifle as I wanted to get the most I could out of it, previous rifle was an old knight that I shot pyrodex and either XTP's or soft cast Lee 300 grain .452 bullets out of. From what I found and doing my own shooting BH209 is hard to beat if your rifle has the ignition system to shoot it. I have since change to BH209 in my Knight as well since the BH209 pushes the XTP 200fps faster than the same weight of Pyrodex.

Can't say much about muzzy bullets as I refuse to pay the price they want when I can pick up good pistol bullets or cast my own and shoot the sabot that works the best out of my rifle. A lot of guys have went this route shooting Hornady XTP's, Speer Gold Dots as well as a few others. 

Last fall I took the furthest muzzy shot I have ever taken which was a 120 yard off hand shot at a cow elk with the Knight, 100 grains of Pyrodex and 300 grain cast slug with a 1x scope. At this distance the crosshairs covered a lot of the front end of the cow. I put the round on target and the load had plenty of punch to blow through the cow, she went about 40 yards and piled up. Everytime I shoot at the range I shoot a few rounds at the 100 yard steel plate off hand with what ever firearm I'm shooting at the time so I am comfortable shooting off hand with a scope or iron sights. Heck I even do this with my handguns.


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## Fishracer (Mar 2, 2009)

muddydogs said:


> So have you done any chronograph work to back up this claim of yours? Have you taken your data and ran it through a ballistic calculator to actually see how bullet weights effect trajectory and down range energy? I think not as my finding are totally opposite from yours.


I did. I wrote it all down on a napkin. You want to see?


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## bj_utah (Aug 28, 2015)

Cross-hairs on a 1x scope will completely cover a deer at 250 yards. If you hit it will likely not be a kill shot. Not a good shot, get closer and don't risk other ML hunters in full camo. Like rifle hunters who will take a 600 yard shot and end up shooting close to other hunters they never saw even with blaze orange.


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

bj_utah said:


> Cross-hairs on a 1x scope will completely cover a deer at 250 yards. If you hit it will likely not be a kill shot. Not a good shot, get closer and don't risk other ML hunters in full camo. Like rifle hunters who will take a 600 yard shot and end up shooting close to other hunters they never saw even with blaze orange.


Meh, depends on how thick your Crosshairs are, neither of my 1x's will "cover a deer" at that range.

-DallanC


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