# Hardscrabble CWMU



## springerhunter (Apr 17, 2008)

Anyone ever hunt this unit for elk. I just drew and am pretty pumped. I know from the coordinator it is a steep, rugged hunt which is just what I like. Any advice on the area would be appreciated.


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## goofy elk (Dec 16, 2007)

I talked to Fred 3 years ago about the moose, Looked at it and steep almost roadless.
Hores are almost a must, USED to be more of a DIY thing there witched I liked.
Last year they had 5 elk and 1 moose go empty, don't know the details though.
I would like to know how it works out for ya though, Good luck.


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## springerhunter (Apr 17, 2008)

The hunt still is mostly a DIY and roadless which is kind of why I picked it. I have never hunted with horses but I don't mind the hard work of packing one out too much, especially with some willing friends, it makes those tenderloins taste that much sweeter. I may see if I can hire someone if I get one down but we'll see. I'll let you know how it turns out.


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## goofy elk (Dec 16, 2007)

If I were you I would try to go the last two weeks of september you might catch down
in the lower wallows bugling. They might not let you in when there "higher end" guys
are there, In that case I would take the 2nd week of september verses later.


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

goofy elk said:


> *Hores* are almost a must, USED to be more of a DIY thing there witched I liked.
> Last year they had 5 elk and 1 moose go empty, don't know the details though.
> I would like to know how it works out for ya though, Good luck.


Did you mean "whores"? :shock: :wink:

Good luck on your hunt, it sounds like fun.


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## gonelkin (Jan 9, 2008)

I hunted this with a good friend 6yrs ago and only metFred one time and would not care one bit to see him again met his crony at the gate on said time and he told us to stay away from a certain part of the mountain hunted hard for our 4 days we were given and did not see any bulls and saw one cow that looked like she had been running for days. A BIG WASTE OF A TAG IMO.


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## goofy elk (Dec 16, 2007)

Ya PRO, I told you I can't spell worth a dam.
Turn horse into hores, boy I'm good.


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## proutdoors (Sep 24, 2007)

goofy elk said:


> Ya PRO, I told you I can't spell worth a dam.
> *Turn horse into hores, boy I'm good.*


Sounds like a title to a adult film.  :mrgreen:


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## goofy elk (Dec 16, 2007)

Well its either an adult film or a great hunt. how about "Hardscrabble hores'.


I do belief we are off the suject here just a bit.


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## Treehugnhuntr (Sep 7, 2007)

gonelkin said:


> I hunted this with a good friend 6yrs ago and only metFred one time and would not care one bit to see him again met his crony at the gate on said time and he told us to stay away from a certain part of the mountain hunted hard for our 4 days we were given and did not see any bulls and saw one cow that looked like she had been running for days. A BIG WASTE OF A TAG IMO.


This is what I hear more often than not. I have friends that have drawn tags and guided on hardscrabble. Not one of them has a good thing to say.

As far as Fred goes, Well, my mom said if I don't hanything good to say, don't say anything at all.

If you drew it with more than 1 or 2 points, I'd give it back.


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## springerhunter (Apr 17, 2008)

I drew on only one point so I may keep it. How does turning in a tag work?


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## elkfromabove (Apr 20, 2008)

My condolences on your draw! Keep in mind that a public tag in that CWMU puts you at the bottom of the totem pole. My son had a cow moose tag a couple of years ago and Fred put us into late Nov (past the season time frame per the proc), 2 to 5 ft of snow, the majority of the roads impassable, we used chains, had to cut 5 trees off the road. In 3 days of hunting (including hiking) never saw a moose, never saw a deer, never saw an elk, nor any fresh tracks of the above. Three cow elk hunters we met were in our same boat. To top it off, Fred had cat hunters with their barking dogs all 3 days on the roads. We met Fred's son who was very vague about where the animals were, but offered to help us take any dead cow moose out of there, for a $200 fee of course. We wondered why Hardscrabble is the easiest CWMU to draw, and we found out.

Now, having said that, hopefully the elk hunt is different. Before the heavy snow the roads up in there are a bit rough and in places, steep, but a 4 wheel rig would make it ok. There will be some hiking/horseback riding, but nothing an in-shape person couldn't handle. And the animals should be there earlier in the season. Maybe your good experience will restore mankind's faith in Mr. Fred Johns. Let us know what happens.


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## blackdog (Sep 11, 2007)

goofy elk said:


> They might not let you in when there "higher end" guys
> are there,


The exact reason I would never put in for a CWMU hunt even with one point. Not to mention no scouting and them telling you when and where you can hunt.

However, in their defense, it is their property and they have the right to do what ever they want with it.

If I were you I would turn the tag in.


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## Flyfishn247 (Oct 2, 2007)

> However, in their defense, it is their property and they have the right to do what ever they want with it.


While this is true, the only reason CWMUs are given any tags to sell off to hunters is that they agree to treat those who draw tags somewhat equally. If these land owners are abusing the system, report it to the DWR and they just may lose their right to any tags at all.


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## bigpapacow (Nov 15, 2007)

I drew the Hardscrabble Bull Elk tag last year and was given 3 days to hunt on the 8th thru the 10th of October, which was a few days earlier than the other public tag. You won't get in earlier than that with a public tag. We hunted hard on foot for the three days and saw 3 elk. 2 cows one day and 1 bull another day all from a few miles away and on the run. I could see how horses would be helpful. That place was steep! One thing that pissed me off was that he told me that no 4 wheelers were allowed on the unit. However, I bumped into a few local area guys that drew the moose tags and were buzzing around on all the different roads that were closed to me, on 4 wheelers...I guess it is who you know...If you had horses though, you could hunt it far more effectively. The canyons are so deep and steep that it just takes too long on foot to cover country in time to catch up with animals that you spot across a canyon. Hindsight is 20/20 and I definately would have hunted it differently if I had it to do again. By the time my hunt ended, I was just getting comfortable with the place.That is the risk you take though with a CWMU though-you go in cold with no scouting. I went up above the unit by sessions via bountiful canyon on the public land a few times before the hunt and glassed around, but it is a long way to glass from there. I did come up with a great recipe for my tag soup I ate. So, if worse comes to worse, I will share it with ya! :wink: If you want info on where we saw the elk or more about the terrain, PM me and I will go into more detail for you.


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## richardjb (Apr 1, 2008)

This is my rant! Years ago- Late 80's, friend got a cow tag above lost creek, Fred was the man in charge, myself and another went with tag holder to get a cow and these a-holes had other hunters blasting away at anything that moved. Fred and crew come by and tell our tag holder there is a wounded cow for him to shoot on this one hill, talk about fair chase. Never again. This is one outfitter that shouldn't be allowed on the hill. Sounds like this guy must have a connection somewhere!


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