# Well, the hoarding is getting worse...



## toasty (May 15, 2008)

Took inventory of my reloading stuff and ammo last weekend and went out to fill some of the holes yesterday and found the ammo and reloading hoarding to be as bad as it has ever been. No handgun and rimfire ammo. No primers and almost very little powder. Even the shotgun shells were almost cleaned out. Logged onto KSL to see 1lb powder going for $50 and primers going for $80/1000. I think there is a good possibility that the new administration is going to try to tax firearms and ammo and require nationwide background checks for ammo and that is driving the hoarding. Why do you think guys are hoarding?


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## Vanilla (Dec 11, 2009)

toasty said:


> I think there is a good possibility that the new administration is going to try to tax firearms and ammo and require nationwide background checks for ammo and that is driving the hoarding. Why do you think guys are hoarding?


Unfounded (and what some consider unrealistic and maybe even irresponsible) statements like this is why you had your problem finding your supplies.

It's unfortunate that we go into hysteria. The cost of 22 LR never returned to "normal" prices after everyone went nuts for no reason several years ago. The NRA, gun and ammo manufactures, and some others absolutely LOVE democratic presidents. Just their existence make these people mentioned above FILTHY rich.

I hope you all like paying more for guns and ammo. We are the ones that cause it.


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## BPturkeys (Sep 13, 2007)

The hysteria caused by the NRA over the totally unfounded claims of Democrats always trying to "come and get your guns" make me sick. I've been a life member of the NRA for over 50 years...he**, closer to 60 years, and find if so sad that this group takes the low road of lies and miss-information just so people will "send in those checks so we can fight the evil Democrats"...I, like millions of Democrats aren't evil and we ain't just "coming to get your guns"!


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## scattergun (Jul 26, 2013)

AMEN there nilla we the shooting public shoot ourselves in the foot no need for others to do the shootin. We're too stupid to band together and tell the ammo manufacturers to shove their price hicks which happen AFTER we have choked the life out of every ammo store in the nation.


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## Bax* (Dec 14, 2008)

It was interesting to see the hysteria when Obama was elected and ultimately ended up being unfounded. However, I dont believe I recall him making an open statement on what he wanted gun policy to be.

Biden on the other hand has listed his Plan to End Gun Violence here: https://joebiden.com/gunsafety/# and I think this is where the fear-based buying is originating. Especially when the idea that the AR-15 sale and manufacture is a specific deal point he has listed.

Further, his position on ending online ammunition purchases has been perceived as a step toward greater control and would likely be the biggest driver behind ammo purchases right now. There has been talk about requiring background checks for ammo purchases for a while now. And I could see that idea (although unlikely) being a huge point of fear for gun owners.

If the Senate is also controlled by the Democratic party, then the likelihood of some gun control legislation being passed is greater.

I wish cooler, logical heads would prevail here, but I fear they never will.


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

Sorry, I think most of you are wrong. ;-)

Statistics show that the majority of gun purchases from the start of this year, have been to new gun owners. Generally, the BLM stuff, riots, Defund Police, Antifa... civil unrest in general. 

They are buying ammo for the first time and its causing a huge demand. If any of us buys a new gun, we usually either have ammo, or components to reload for it... generally, we wouldn't need to purchase as much ammo as a new gun owner would.

Because of the heavy demand for factory ammo, its squeezing the leftover available components available for reloading causing shortages.

-DallanC


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

Vanilla said:


> The cost of 22 LR never returned to "normal" prices after everyone went nuts for no reason several years ago.


Oh yeah it did... prices CRASHED on 22LR. People just forgot to keep checking up on it. When the run ended, production was still at 110% and caused a flood of ammo there for a while.

When some of the better 22LR ammo was finally available for "normal" prices, I bought a full case of Winchester copper HPs. About 3 weeks later, it was 20% cheaper on clearance sales... so I bought a second case, Federal copper HPs. And thats on top of the 3-4000 rounds I already had.

I have enough my grandkids will be shooting it 20 years from now.

-DallanC


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

PS: I bought Reloading powder off of Cabelas website Friday, its enroute right now being shipped to store. So things do popup from time to time. Gotta jump on it quick through.

-DallanC


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## Vanilla (Dec 11, 2009)

DallanC said:


> I have enough my grandkids will be shooting it 20 years from now.


You and many others. And therein illustrates my point.


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

Vanilla said:


> You and many others. And therein illustrates my point.


/shrug sorry you cant find any. If you need some let me know. But you cant fault people for stocking up when there is a surplus. Its not like we are contributing to the runs on goods. I do sell ammo (at my cost) to friends and co-workers who need it. I've helped people who's kids / spouses etc are taking hunters safety.

For ALOT of stuff... gear, food, prepping stuff... I'm on a 6-8 month "looking a head" schedule. I bought this years ice fishing gear around July. Right now we're buying the garden seeds and pre-buying starts for spring planting. Also getting equipment / parts etc for spring camping lined up and repairs done over winter (last winter i rebuilt 2 atv engines).

If you want, I'll let you know when to buy 22lr on the cheap 8)

-DallanC


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## Ray (May 10, 2018)

If you know where to go, ammo can still be had for normal prices. I’ve been buy American eagle 5.56 every week for $9 a box! Just shop around


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## Vanilla (Dec 11, 2009)

Dallan, to be clear, I'm not intending to be critical of you. Just illustrating the problem at hand as people have been doing the same thing across the board. 

I don't have a need now, but if I ever get in a pinch, I'll know where to go! 

And yes, your way of thinking is how I've tried to do so as well. I bought some stuff at Sportys the other day for spring fishing and my wife rolled her eyes. I reminded her that we were unable to find it this spring when we needed it, and she perked up and stopped rolling her eyes. Definitely smart to be thinking ahead.


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## toasty (May 15, 2008)

DallanC said:


> Sorry, I think most of you are wrong. ;-)
> 
> Statistics show that the majority of gun purchases from the start of this year, have been to new gun owners. Generally, the BLM stuff, riots, Defund Police, Antifa... civil unrest in general.
> 
> ...


This is a good point. I helped several first time handgun owners decide on what to purchase in the last 6 months including some people I thought would never ask for help to buy a gun. Then, of course sold them some ammo on the cheap cause they couldn't find any.


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## taxidermist (Sep 11, 2007)

I agree with Dallan on the idea of new gun owners! I saw this swing of sales and demand 12 ears earlier when Obama was elected. It's happening again now. It will smooth out in a couple years and normalcy will be back. When That happens...…..Go Ape sh!t and start buying up the ammo you need, and then get a couple thousand rounds more. It will happen again in another four years.


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## hondodawg (Mar 13, 2013)

I can tell you it’s worse than when Obama was elected. We still could get expensive self defense ammo and reloading components regularly with him. Now it’s been completely wiped out. Our Vista orders are about 3-4 years out is what we’ve been told. Along with price increases from manufactures and distributers. But every now and then you’ll find an Easter egg. I was able to buy a brick of CCI small rifle primers for $27 at Sportsmans last week. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## wyogoob (Sep 7, 2007)

Hillary Clinton is buying up all the .22 long rifle ammo and storing it in the basement of her summer home in Arkansas. George Soros lent her the money to buy the ammo AND the summer home. 

This is my favorite thread.
.


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## wyogoob (Sep 7, 2007)

wyogoob said:


> Hillary Clinton is buying up all the .22 long rifle ammo and storing it in the basement of her summer home in Arkansas. George Soros lent her the money to buy the ammo AND the summer home.
> 
> This is my favorite thread.
> .


There's a law suit against Cabela's that has gone all the way to the New York State Supreme Court saying Cabela's was negligent for selling ammo to a person that used the ammo to kill someone. If Cabela's loses the ruling could negatively affect ammo sales at big box stores...other stores that sell ammo. Not good.

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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

Saw a youtuber talk about that. I guess it was ammo used in both rifle and pistol, he was of age to buy rifle ammo but not pistol? Its a strange case... but indeed has scary ramifications.


-DallanC


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## Critter (Mar 20, 2010)

DallanC said:


> Saw a youtuber talk about that. I guess it was ammo used in both rifle and pistol, he was of age to buy rifle ammo but not pistol? Its a strange case... but indeed has scary ramifications.
> 
> -DallanC


Many moons ago I used that argument to pick up a box of 22Lr down in Price. We were headed out rabbit hunting and we stopped at a small store and I went in to pick up some 22Lr. They said that I was too young for pistol ammo and I told them that I was using it in a rifle and not a pistol -O,-

They sold me the ammo...Lots of gray area there.


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## Bax* (Dec 14, 2008)

Critter said:


> Many moons ago I used that argument to pick up a box of 22Lr down in Price. We were headed out rabbit hunting and we stopped at a small store and I went in to pick up some 22Lr. They said that I was too young for pistol ammo and I told them that I was using it in a rifle and not a pistol -O,-
> 
> They sold me the ammo...Lots of gray area there.


This happened to me at Walmart as a teen as well. Ridiculous


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## taxidermist (Sep 11, 2007)

Restricting ammo sales is the back door way into gun control. If the Feds catch on, (if they haven't already) You will be limited to the amount of ammo you can buy at one time. No more gun shows, buying a case of waterfowl loads, limit to one box (20 rounds) of rifle cartridge's and I hate to speculate what the limits could be on reloading components.


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## High Desert Elk (Aug 21, 2012)

Vanilla said:


> Unfounded (and what some consider unrealistic and maybe even irresponsible) statements like this is why you had your problem finding your supplies.
> 
> It's unfortunate that we go into hysteria. The cost of 22 LR never returned to "normal" prices after everyone went nuts for no reason several years ago. The NRA, gun and ammo manufactures, and some others absolutely LOVE democratic presidents. Just their existence make these people mentioned above FILTHY rich.
> 
> I hope you all like paying more for guns and ammo. We are the ones that cause it.


As mentioned, mr. biden's agenda publicly states more stringent measures. ms. harris stated the same thing during the primaries she belly-flopped in (and some on this forum actually think those two clowns are the best fit for Executive leadership).

Also as stated, market conditions show an increase in quantity demanded with a status quo supply, and now prices have increased to match that demanded quantity to spread out the availability of supply similar to "price gouging". Econ 101.

The difference between now and during the obama years is there is an emboldened rhetoric that many have not witnessed since the 60's.

My *OPINION* is the tighter measures will be seen more locally as in the state level, not so much the federal level. For those who live in level-headed states, life will be somewhat normal. For those that live behind the iron-curtain states, you may likely see something trickle down with more restrictions, thank you CA. I live in an iron-curtain state. We get to have "red flag laws" now. We get to see a shortage in grocery stores because of an idiotic approach to handling a virus that is in the family of cold viruses. We get to see a run on household items from fear of a retail store closure because of idiotic health emergency management orders. It's a real thing guys, many of you may not see it because many on this forum are living in what we gentiles call "Happy Valley".

How will a more "conservative" SCOTUS interpret a specific firearms and ammunition tax, who knows...


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## BPturkeys (Sep 13, 2007)

Yo Desert, you do know that you're kind of arguing against yourself here. State legislatures pass laws that only apply to their state, it has no relevance to you, living here. The people of each state elect their legislators...oh my heavens, local control...isn't that what conservatives are always screaming they want...so we must assume the "will of the people" is being followed. If the California public want a little more control over their destiny, who are we to stand here and throw stones.

You can expect and will receive no crazy "they're coming after your guns" laws from President elect Biden's incoming administration. Even if they did, it would only be the "will of the people" speaking out. Don't forget, President elect Biden won a huge majority of the popular vote in this last election(as the Democrats have in 7 of the last 8 presidential election) and the electoral college. You can rest assure that this President will try to follow the will of the people AND the Constitution and will make no attempts to subvert either for personal gain. 
Love ya Desert and I am extremely happy that you have the American liberty to speak and believe as you do.


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## Vanilla (Dec 11, 2009)

That’s the beauty of the constitution, we don’t care what the will of the people is. Our constitutional rights are here to not only protect us from our own government, but also from the “tyranny of the majority.”

I am fully confident that there will be pushes for certain aspects of gun control. Some people will like it, some won’t. If any laws pass, they will inevitably be challenged, and we’ll find out if it’s constitutional down the road. I just don’t see a reason to freak out and lose our minds.


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## High Desert Elk (Aug 21, 2012)

BPturkeys said:


> Yo Desert, you do know that you're kind of arguing against yourself here. State legislatures pass laws that only apply to their state, it has no relevance to you, living here. The people of each state elect their legislators...oh my heavens, local control...isn't that what conservatives are always screaming they want...so we must assume the "will of the people" is being followed. If the California public want a little more control over their destiny, who are we to stand here and throw stones.
> 
> You can expect and will receive no crazy "they're coming after your guns" laws from President elect Biden's incoming administration. Even if they did, it would only be the "will of the people" speaking out. Don't forget, President elect Biden won a huge majority of the popular vote in this last election(as the Democrats have in 7 of the last 8 presidential election) and the electoral college. You can rest assure that this President will try to follow the will of the people AND the Constitution and will make no attempts to subvert either for personal gain.
> Love ya Desert and I am extremely happy that you have the American liberty to speak and believe as you do.


Yo, BP. Go back and read the part where I stated the impacts you will see will be more on the state level and not the federal. Just like I stated that blue donkey states get to have things such as red flag laws now. Really, really missing the part where I am arguing with myself. The premise to the thread is what can happen on a federal level. Not much except a tax, just like a health care tax. A state level is an entirely different matter.

Fully well aware of what happens in state elections and the importance of keeping your state level headed. A convention of the states is a very, very powerful thing...

What presumed "president elect biden" can do is anything and everything within the executive branch of government as it pertains to the ATF. FYI, popular vote is irrelevant, the distribution of states won/lost says more.

If the blue donkeys eventually win the Senate, a lot of damage can be done in two years. Pricing is the sure best way to limit sales on both firearms and ammunition. Just like a tobacco tax on chaw and smokes.

You can respond if you want, I won't see it for a few days, if ever - depending on if the thread gets buried. I'm going elk hunting for a few days so it will be for the sakes of conversation with everyone else.

Cheers and Happy Thanksgiving!


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## Daisy (Jan 4, 2010)

Vanilla said:


> That's the beauty of the constitution, we don't care what the will of the people is. Our constitutional rights are here to not only protect us from our own government, but also from the "tyranny of the majority."


Only when it suits a particular POV, correct? If I were an anti-hunter/fishermen, it could be argued that the Utah State constitution could end up failing a segment of the population if Amendment E is codified as the "tyranny of the majority" has voted.


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## Springville Shooter (Oct 15, 2010)

Daisy said:


> Only when it suits a particular POV, correct? If I were an anti-hunter/fishermen, it could be argued that the Utah State constitution could end up failing a segment of the population if Amendment E is codified as the "tyranny of the majority" has voted.


State constitutions are subject to the "tyrannical" will of the people as long as they aren't at odds with the U.S. constitution.

The very few, but specific things that are protected by the U.S. constitution are supposedly above the reproach of the "tyrannical majority".

As I have grown in understanding(age), I have become more and more thankful for the foresight of our founders. A country as great as this should never be subject to the whimsical will of the emotional mob.....even if they represent the majority at the time. This means we all get to be wrong once in a while and we will still have a free country at the end of it all. #GiveThanks.-----SS


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## BPturkeys (Sep 13, 2007)

Aw, but yet, to use terms like "whimsical" ...one mans whimsical... perhaps you are referring to the violent and unruly minority that are always part of public displays of unrest. We must never follow their lead. But the majority must always be listened to and in some cases the minority must yield. 
By definition, cruel and suppressive leadership is tyranny. Being in the majority does not make you tyrannical and in fact tyranny always comes from a minority position. No population has ever and never will knowingly elect a tyrant.
When it comes to government, I will always yield to a viewpoint established by a majority if that viewpoint is within the throttling bounds of our constitution. I will never stop trying to change the level of popularity of any minority viewpoints that I may hold dear, if, here again, they are lawful and constitutional. 
Now, can we get back to the huntin and fishin stuff?


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## backcountry (May 19, 2016)

These corporations will enjoy the surge in fear and demand as long as we indulge it. No doubt a lot of people getting rich off of rhetoric that never pans out.

I've got enough ammunition to hunt a few seasons. But that may be the product of a novice who doesn't get a shot off that often. I do get a laugh out of my liberal friend's reaction when they ask how much ammunition I own. I don't hoard but I pick up a box of shotgun shells whenever I have a coupon and most have no clue how 1000 rounds of 22 LR doesn't even take up a sq ft.


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## BPturkeys (Sep 13, 2007)

I believe many of the people this time around are running out and buying extra ammo and loading components for a different reason than with the NRA perpetuated Obama/Clinton hysteria. I think many thought there would be another shortage because of a similar scare and buying frenzy. I don't think we are seeing people burying ammo in their back yards like the last time. It's kind of a self fulfilling prophecy.
I guess some are buying things because they really believe "they're commin for our guns FOR SURE this time...really, for sure" How does it go, something like "fool me once..."


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

Hmmm... I've had little problem finding primers online as well as my goto powders over the past couple days.

Cabelas is showing some in stock in store right now, H335 (my favorite 5.56 powder), HP-38 ( same as W231) my favorite pistol powder. I have plenty of H4350 atm which we use in 243 and 7mm08.

Only real powder I dont have alot of is IMR7828 which I use in my 7STW.


-DallanC


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## bowgy (Oct 10, 2007)

FWIW

Ran up to Happy Valley for Thanksgiving, wife and daughter had to stop in at the Provo Walmart just of the Parkway exit, just for giggles I walked back to the sporting goods.

They had 4 boxes of .22lr 50 count for $6 something and 2 boxes of 100 count for I think $12 something.

I haven't bought 22 lr for years still have quite a few thousand rounds so I didn't buy any.


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

LOL... Scheels has 7828 in stock. Just bought a bottle for pickup, will swing up tomorrow and get it.


-DallanC


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## taxidermist (Sep 11, 2007)

I'm a "HORDER" and have components that will likely expire before I use them. Unless...… They come for my guns.8)


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## toasty (May 15, 2008)

I made my first post 5 days ago and it is getting worse. I am now seeing $150 for 1000 primers and $500 for an 8lb of Retumbo. At these prices, maybe I should be selling some of my stash...


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## taxidermist (Sep 11, 2007)

toasty said:


> I made my first post 5 days ago and it is getting worse. I am now seeing $150 for 1000 primers and $500 for an 8lb of Retumbo. At these prices, maybe I should be selling some of my stash...


I'll sell a brick (1000) of large rifle primers for $145. Five bucks cheaper.


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