# List of stupid questions



## New2Utah (11 mo ago)

Look, I’m an idiot from Montana who doesn’t understand anything except walk down to the river and shoot the ducks, so cut me a little slack.

i might end up in Utah for medical school, but I would like some advice from the Utah natives.

1) can you ride your bike around hop off and shoot ducks? I watched some guy do it in Farmington bay two years ago, is that even legal?

2) is it frowned upon to crush coots when you see them? My dog would probably love to eat them.

3) I might hunt with one other person, so I was thinking of getting a larger kayak or a small Jon boat, I don’t want to deal with a trailer really.. Seems like a good idea to put a long tail on it? I’ve never owned either, thoughts on load/stability/power? I would either get a nucanoe F12 or a 10-12 flat bottom. I also fish, so factor in summer time fishing as well.

4) can you access the GSL from somewhere without an airboat? I saw videos with airboats, and people walking in with coffin blinds, But no normal boats.

5) should I be a BYU fan or a Utes fan? I’m a Montana griz guy myself.

thanks for any thoughts!


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## New2Utah (11 mo ago)

New2Utah said:


> Look, I’m an idiot from Montana who doesn’t understand anything except walk down to the river and shoot the ducks, so cut me a little slack.
> 
> i might end up in Utah for medical school, but I would like some advice from the Utah natives.
> 
> ...


PS budget is 2-3k. Maybe 3.5 if I’m lucky and my wife doesn’t kill me


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## MooseMeat (Dec 27, 2017)

1. As long as you are on a dike used for hunting and satisfy the distance from the parking lots rule (600 feet I think), swing away
2. Smash every GD coot you can.
3. 3k won’t get you too far in the utah duck boat market, but deals do pop up every now and then. Some great shoots are to be had with a canoe type boat. But walking in somewhere can produce the same success. Scouting and learning areas is what’s key.
4. the GSL isn’t something to be taken lightly. When the water was up 10 years ago, walking in was possible in several areas. I guess you could still do it, but it’s a long ways out there to the old popular spots, and there’s no way you can pack enough decoys to compete with the spreads airboats will throw 100 yards from you. You could be on the ‘X’ with 24 decoys and an airboat 100 yards away will throw out 350+ and suck every bird in to them, not even giving your set up a glance. You could walk in from the causeway by the island. That’s been popular lately, but those birds get tuned up quick. If you were to take a boat out in the gsl, make sure its at least a 16’ and not underpowered. Guys die out there or sink boats more than any one wants to think about. Wind picks up and it gets nasty quick.
5. Stick to ducks on the weekend. Neither team is worth paying any attention to.


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## taxidermist (Sep 11, 2007)

*Neither team is worth paying any attention to.
*
Just when I was beginning to like you, you say something like that. Yup.... Now you've dropped to the bottom of the pile.

Moose is correct about "underpowered" watercraft and the GSL turning into a death trap in a second! My Neighbor and his dad were one of the boats years ago that wound up flipped from waves and spent the night on the lake hanging on to their life before they were rescued the next morning. Not much water to float a boat on the GSL now, and it may not recover. If it does, it will take several years and LOTS of water.


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## johnnycake (Jul 19, 2011)

Look into Saturn Kaboat inflatables. Seriously capable, stable and easily transportable boats that run well in shallow water with or without a motor.


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## New2Utah (11 mo ago)

MooseMeat said:


> 1. As long as you are on a dike used for hunting and satisfy the distance from the parking lots rule (600 feet I think), swing away
> 2. Smash every GD coot you can.
> 3. 3k won’t get you too far in the utah duck boat market, but deals do pop up every now and then. Some great shoots are to be had with a canoe type boat. But walking in somewhere can produce the same success. Scouting and learning areas is what’s key.
> 4. the GSL isn’t something to be taken lightly. When the water was up 10 years ago, walking in was possible in several areas. I guess you could still do it, but it’s a long ways out there to the old popular spots, and there’s no way you can pack enough decoys to compete with the spreads airboats will throw 100 yards from you. You could be on the ‘X’ with 24 decoys and an airboat 100 yards away will throw out 350+ and suck every bird in to them, not even giving your set up a glance. You could walk in from the causeway by the island. That’s been popular lately, but those birds get tuned up quick. If you were to take a boat out in the gsl, make sure its at least a 16’ and not underpowered. Guys die out there or sink boats more than any one wants to think about. Wind picks up and it gets nasty quick.
> 5. Football is as gay as aids. Stick to ducks on the weekend. Neither team is worth paying any attention to.


Thanks!
Your answer to 5 sucks though, football is americas second greatest sport… right behind baseball


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## New2Utah (11 mo ago)

johnnycake said:


> Look into Saturn Kaboat inflatables. Seriously capable, stable and easily transportable boats that run well in shallow water with or without a motor.


How can you rig an inflatable for duck hunting though?


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## paddler (Jul 17, 2009)

I ride a bike and paddle a canoe. For two guys and maybe a dog you might consider an Old Town Discovery 158 or 169. I bought an Old Town Penobscot in 1984 that still serves me well, and will take delivery of a smaller, ligther Discovery 119 next week. No trailer, no maintenance, starts first pull every time.


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## Vanilla (Dec 11, 2009)

New2Utah said:


> Thanks!
> Your answer to 5 sucks though, football is americas second greatest sport… right behind baseball


Only a BYU fan would say something this silly. You should just stick to that side of the isle where you’ll fit in better loving inferior things.

You should also talk to paddler. What you’re describing is right up his isle.


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## 7mm Reloaded (Aug 25, 2015)

New2Utah said:


> Thanks!
> Your answer to 5 sucks though, football is americas second greatest sport… right behind baseball


 Go With Red👊


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## CPAjeff (Dec 20, 2014)

Welcome to the Forum!

For football, just be an Alabama fan. The vast majority of the years, your team will be playing in the final game of the season and . . . they win that final game of the season sometimes too!


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## TheOtherJeff (Oct 7, 2021)

The football matter is fairly cut and dried. The folks I lived around in Oklahoma liked to say that the way to keep Baptists from drinking all your beer when you go fishing is to bring two of them. If that hits close to home, go blue.


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## johnnycake (Jul 19, 2011)

New2Utah said:


> How can you rig an inflatable for duck hunting though?


Very easily. My 15' Kaboat floats motorless in 2" of water. The transom can take a motor up to 25hp as long as it weighs under 130lbs. I haven't settled on what motor I want for it as I plan to use it up here in AK a bit more aggressively than just for duck hunting, but it makes a good duck hunting boat as is, but I'm leaning towards a Tohatsu short shaft 25hp. With that I'll need 4" of water. I can rig grass screens on the sides with the d-rings. I can haul 2200lbs in 8" of water. And the boat weighs 107lbs including the three aluminum benches. I've got beach wheels mounted on the transom that fold up and are easily removable too, and with a wet vac I can pack it down very tightly into about a 2' cube.


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## New2Utah (11 mo ago)

johnnycake said:


> Very easily. My 15' Kaboat floats motorless in 2" of water. The transom can take a motor up to 25hp as long as it weighs under 130lbs. I haven't settled on what motor I want for it as I plan to use it up here in AK a bit more aggressively than just for duck hunting, but it makes a good duck hunting boat as is, but I'm leaning towards a Tohatsu short shaft 25hp. With that I'll need 4" of water. I can rig grass screens on the sides with the d-rings. I can haul 2200lbs in 8" of water. And the boat weighs 107lbs including the three aluminum benches. I've got beach wheels mounted on the transom that fold up and are easily removable too, and with a wet vac I can pack it down very tightly into about a 2' cube.


Do you worry at all about the durability? It kinda seems like one stick pointing the wrong direction could end your whole day


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## New2Utah (11 mo ago)

paddler said:


> I ride a bike and paddle a canoe. For two guys and maybe a dog you might consider an Old Town Discovery 158 or 169. I bought an Old Town Penobscot in 1984 that still serves me well, and will take delivery of a smaller, ligther Discovery 119 next week. No trailer, no maintenance, starts first pull every time.


I’ve only had one experience with a canoe, and that was taking a set of them with the Boy Scouts up to Yellowstone. They were so unstable we lashed fallen trees to turn them into catamarans so we wouldn’t tip. Is that just because they are cheap canoes? Are the old town discoveries more stable?


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## johnnycake (Jul 19, 2011)

New2Utah said:


> Do you worry at all about the durability? It kinda seems like one stick pointing the wrong direction could end your whole day


These aren't your $100 Walmart kiddie raft. 

I run mine in glacier rivers with ragged shale, calmer days near shore in the ocean, and more. Incredibly durable


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## paddler (Jul 17, 2009)

New2Utah said:


> I’ve only had one experience with a canoe, and that was taking a set of them with the Boy Scouts up to Yellowstone. They were so unstable we lashed fallen trees to turn them into catamarans so we wouldn’t tip. Is that just because they are cheap canoes? Are the old town discoveries more stable?


I don't know what kind of canoes you were in so it's impossible to say. Single later polyethylene canoes lack hull rigidity. Think of Coleman, they require aluminum bracing to maintain their shape. The bottoms will ripple as you paddle. Old Town uses the industry standard three layer material, two polyethylene layers outside with a honeycomb core. This yields a much more rigid hull. 

Stability is determined by the cross sectional shape of the hull and varies a bit by the intended use of the boat:









Canoe Hull Shape Defined


Cross-section-Initial and Secondary Stability The cross-sectional shape of the bottom and sides of the canoe will influence its performance, especially its stability. Stability is divided into initial (primary) and final (secondary). Initial stability is what you feel when you first get into the…




paddling.com





We tipped mine running the "A " section of the Green a long time ago, but we also had no idea what we were doing. No white water experience even in a raft. I've never had a problem duck hunting. Well, except for once. I was out on the Spur in deeper water and shot a canvasback. The canoe rolled to the right a bit more than I'd like. I was sitting on one of the seats, it probably wouldn't have happened if I was in the bottom. I didn't take on any water or tip over, it was just a bit of a surprise. You should have no problems whatsoever. I'd be happy to show you the canoes if you like, give you some tips. Most guys like motorboats, I prefer what Roosevelt termed "the strenuous life".


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## JerryH (Jun 17, 2014)

E-bike, trailer and a jetsled.


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## paddler (Jul 17, 2009)

You don't need an ebike to pull a trailer and Jet Sled:









Now, an ebike wpuld help pulling a heavy load, like a canoe filled with gear. I'm considering one for next year:


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## JerryH (Jun 17, 2014)

Google search these last 3 pics. It comes up bat$h!t crazy








2013 before global warming


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## New2Utah (11 mo ago)

paddler said:


> You don't need an ebike to pull a trailer and Jet Sled:
> View attachment 151141
> 
> 
> ...


That looks pretty sweet, where do you get those trailer set ups?


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## paddler (Jul 17, 2009)

The red tow bar is part of something they call the Trailgator:









Amazon.com : Trail Gator Red Trailer Tow Bar : Bike Trailers : Sports & Outdoors


Amazon.com : Trail Gator Red Trailer Tow Bar : Bike Trailers : Sports & Outdoors



www.amazon.com





I designed the metal bar that connects the trailer tongue to the tow bar. I also designed the trailer and fabricated the parts. Friends welded everything up for me as I don't weld. The traiIer tongue for pulling the Jet Sled is a single piece made from a 2x4, I made a 2x4 extention for when I tow the canoe. This photo shows the two piece trailer tongue. However, I have since further modified the setup, adding a padded V-shaped bracket to the tongue extension in which the bow of the canoe rests. Much more secure:








I built the trailer to replace my original Paddleboy from Seattle Sports. It was a royal POS. The cone washers failed because of poor metalurgy, which caused damage to my canoe. They sent me replacement parts which were just as bad. Do not buy!! My current trailer has alloy BMX wheels and is bullet proof. When towing my canoe I'm pulling ~250# so am considering the ebike.

What's crazy about dragging a canoe full of gear out onto the ice?


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## paddler (Jul 17, 2009)

This place sure is quiet. So, back to canoes. My Old Town was made with Royalex, which was made in sheets, then heated and formed in molds. Unfortunately, it was discontinued in 2013. Most new canoes, including Old Towns, are made in rotomolds with polyethylene beads. They are still three layered, but are heavier than those that were made with Royalex. I ordered the Old Town Discovery 119, but them learned that a Canadian company called Esquif has developed a Royalex replacement.

After doing my research I ordered an Esquif Adirondack, which is 12' long and 45#, as opposed to 68# for my Penobscot. Picked it up from REI last week. Being smaller I think it will be easier to handle, tow and hide. Pretty cool little boat:


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

I had a 14ft aluminum Old Town with the flat transom for a motor. I used a Shakespeare 12lb thrust 12v trolling motor on it. That thing would move pretty fast under 12lbs of thrust. I first got it for duck hunting. I ended up using it more fishing with my wife when we got married than before. We put a ton of miles on it at strawberry and scofield. finally sold it, it was just too bulky to store properly.

-DallanC


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## paddler (Jul 17, 2009)

DallanC said:


> I had a 14ft aluminum Old Town with the flat transom for a motor. I used a Shakespeare 12lb thrust 12v trolling motor on it. That thing would move pretty fast under 12lbs of thrust. I first got it for duck hunting. I ended up using it more fishing with my wife when we got married than before. We put a ton of miles on it at strawberry and scofield. finally sold it, it was just too bulky to store properly.
> 
> -DallanC


An aluminum Old Town? I didn't know they ever made them. Could it have been a Grumman? They used to be pretty common.


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

paddler said:


> An aluminum Old Town? I didn't know they ever made them. Could it have been a Grumman? They used to be pretty common.


Hmmmm... my memory is failing me, I dont remember Grumman on it... but I think you are right its not an old towne. It very well could be something else. It was from around 1984. I do remember it was a popular brand. Maybe the mfg doesn't exist anymore.

It was alot of fun. I built a rack out of 2x4's that somewhat resembeled the old chrome roll bars people use to run on trucks.That kept it from hitting the cab of my truck, the other end went on the tailgate. Two ratchet straps to hold it tight and it was gtg, lol

Edit: I think it probably was an Alumacraft.

-DallanC


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

Yup, you are right. I was curious enough to look at some pictures. It was a 17ft square stern Grumman. I shoulda kept it. They are worth about $1000 more today than when I sold it, lol

-DallanC


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## paddler (Jul 17, 2009)

DallanC said:


> Yup, you are right. I was curious enough to look at some pictures. It was a 17ft square stern Grumman. I shoulda kept it. They are worth about $1000 more today than when I sold it, lol
> 
> -DallanC


Aluminum canoes are noisy and prone to dents. If the T Formex used on this new canoe is as good as they say, ie, better than Royalex, it's going to be most excellent. My Penobscot is still great. Neither requires flotation, either.


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## JerryH (Jun 17, 2014)

Jon how are you going store your fleet?
I stumbled upon a company called Maker Pipe. They make and sell all sort of fittings for DIY conduit projects. They had some pics of interesting canoe racks that were very clean.


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## paddler (Jul 17, 2009)

JerryH said:


> Jon how are you going store your fleet?
> I stumbled upon a company called Maker Pipe. They make and sell all sort of fittings for DIY conduit projects. They had some pics of interesting canoe racks that were very clean.


My Penobscot is in my garage on a home-built oak rack. Still thinking about the new one.

Just checked out that website, don't see a canoe rack. Trailer, but no rack.


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## StormyKromerGuy (Dec 25, 2021)

Also new to the area New2Utah--so appreciate you asking the dumb questions that any newbie like us would have! If you see someone out there that looks as green as you in the fall, it's probably me.


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## jlofthouse16 (Oct 18, 2021)

"5. Stick to ducks on the weekend. Neither team is worth paying any attention to. "

I am with you. Never did team sports.


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