# Reed's Ammunition and Research



## 2litl2l8 (Jan 16, 2008)

The following is an email exchange that I had with Reed's Ammunition and Research over a box of obsolete ammunition that I purchased that was manufactured by them.



I purchased this box of ammo from a local retailer about 2 months ago. They are for use in a Remington Model 14 Rifle. Today I decided to just cycle a few rounds through the action. I loaded 3 rounds and cycled them all. When I picked up the rounds I noticed one had the bullet seated completely against the charge. If I had been firing the round my antique gun would have blown apart in my hands. I examined all of the rounds in the box and found that a few did not have a crimp. I decided to cycle all the rounds through the rifle. 5 of the 20 rounds had the bullet set back because of a weak crimp. The worst being set all the way on top of the charge and the least being set to the top of the hash marks on the bullet. The last round (far right) is a normal OACL. I also included a picture of the box and lot #.

Re:
Mr. ****
Please return them to vendor you purchased them from.

Re:
Unfortunately the store that I purchased them from is 2 hours away...is there another way that we could resolve this issue.

Re:
Mr. ****,
I'm sorry no.

I will tell you, that based only on the pictures, it appears your Model 8 or 14 has a feeding issue causing the bullets to hang on the feedramp. That particular lot number is well over 7 years old, and we have not had any issues reported. That does not dismiss the situation, mind you, and my deduction is only based on what I can see in the pictures you sent and not on any measurable data.

Re: 
Reed's Ammunition & Research,

Regardless of how long ago the ammunition was manufactured I purchased it 2 months ago. I have cycled and shot this rifle many times over the last 15 years with no issues. It was recently rebuilt/restored by Remington Arms Restoration out of Illinois (February of 2012.) I assure you that there are no feeding problems. I am extremely disappointed by your lack of concern with this issue. This is an antique firearm, and had I not been an experienced shooter and taken to time to load and cycle these rounds before actually shooting them. I would have been seriously maimed or killed by your poor quality control. In looking at your loaded rounds and the rounds that I have reloaded myself, or purchased from one of your competitors, there is an obvious difference in the crimp. I will NEVER buy ammunition from your company again and I will strongly encourage everyone that I know including those at Remington Society to purchase their ammo elsewhere like Buffalo Arms or OWS ect.


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## 2litl2l8 (Jan 16, 2008)

He replied again. Basically when I go back down to Beaver (who knows when) hopefully they will take the ammo back.


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## Lonetree (Dec 4, 2010)

I'm not saying that the ammo is not the problem, but given this statement: "It was recently rebuilt/restored by Remington Arms Restoration out of Illinois (February of 2012.)" The 15 prior years of trouble free function do not necessarily apply. Might not be the feed ramp itself, there are other things that could affect the angle of the round, in relation to the feed ramp. Do you have any of the rounds, without a crimp, that you did not cycle?


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## 2litl2l8 (Jan 16, 2008)

I have fired about 10 rounds that I loaded with no issues. I think that this happened in loading the rounds into the tube magazine (Pump action rifle.) Because of the weak crimp placed on the rounds the bullet would seat further into the case as the pressure built up in the magazine. This is a CRF action and in reality the feed ramp is not even used. The bolt face grabs the round and positions it right where it needs to be to feed into the chamber. I do not have any non cycled rounds. I do however have another box of ammo from the same lot number that I have had no issues with. I think the lesson learned here is that I will just buy brass and load my own, rather then buy loaded rounds to shoot then reload. When I get home tonight I am going to cycle some other rounds through and see if I can see them hang up anywhere, but I really think that the crimp was so weak that the rounds could not handle the pressure from the spring in the tube magazine.


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## Critter (Mar 20, 2010)

If you have a reloading set up what I would do is to pick up a bullet puller, pull the bullets, put the powder back into the case and reseat the bullets with a heaver crimp. If you reload and don't have a Impact Bullet Puller you should have. I have used them quite often checking out factory loads and fixing my own mistakes.


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## Lonetree (Dec 4, 2010)

Don't cycle them all. If you can demonstrate to the manufacture that the crimps are weak, or not there, then you have a better case with them. They should be able to test the crimp strength. We used to use a spring tester to test crimp strength. An arbor press and scale could be used too. If it is happening in the feed tube, those are really weak crimps, or a really strong spring. An overly strong spring should be noticeable though.


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## Lonetree (Dec 4, 2010)

An impact puller would tell you if the crimp is weak on the uncycled rounds too. You have to really wail on an impact type puller to get a good crimped bullet out. I have broke good ones trying.


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## 2litl2l8 (Jan 16, 2008)

Well the plan for now is.....nothing. I just know that I will no longer by rounds from Reed's Ammo. I will just buy brass and load my own.


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## Critter (Mar 20, 2010)

You are liable to find problems with any ammo manufacture and the only remedy that they will recommend to you is for you to return the ammo to the store where you bought it, they will never take it back from you. Look at all the on line sales of ammo, there is always a yellow box at the bottom of the page that tells you that there is no returns accepted on ammo. Years ago I had some problems with some Winchester rounds that I bought but the store was local and they took them back with no questions asked, shortly thereafter there was a recall on that lot of ammo and the recall said to take the ammo back to where you purchased it at. 

Perhaps that I why I started to reload. I haven't bought a box of factory ammo in over 30 years.


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