# wolf back on the endangered species



## cklspencer

:evil: 

Judge Donald Molloy has put the Northern Rockies wolf back on the endangered species list, ending all legal hunting for them 

Eastmans' Hunting Journals: This decision, rendered today, will significantly set back all responsible, wise wildlife conservation in these areas by decades. Expect significant reductions in hunting opportunities as wildlife populations continue to tumble, along with funds for state game agencies. This is the single biggest travesty in wildlife conservation in recent memory.


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## Bears Butt

SSS! All the way!


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## stillhunterman

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5gvpLOtu1zSieNGU7OAEbSTg-V2vwD9HDKE400

Man this really sucks! I hope Wyoming will be able to get on track...


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## PhoebeMoses

cklspencer said:


> :evil:
> 
> Judge Donald Molloy has put the Northern Rockies wolf back on the endangered species list, ending all *legal* hunting for them


Ending all *"legal"* hunting of them. Small groups can make big changes in this country and if we as hunters band together we can still win this battle. I mean if the Fish and Game officers are on our side and that's the side of the wildlife, then they understand full well the devastation this ruling can bring. I bring this up because my best friend is a police officer and although he is sworn to uphold the law, he doesn't go out and bust every Jay-walker he see's or for that matter every traffic violation, in this sense maybe we can take it upon ourselves to do a little wildlife jay-walking/wolf killing. We get the agency to actively turn a blind eye. I understand that this is a somewhat ridiculous idea but If I come across a wolf in the quite mountains of this state, I will be supplying the ecosystem with as much worm food as I can manage!


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## cklspencer

The reasoning for this is just plane stupid. If you can't unlist in two states and leave one state listed then should you not take into account that there are large numbers of wolve when you take away boarders, so based on that should they not delist them since there is a large number just not in these three states but in Canada a well? 
I sure hope the These three states as well as Utah put up one huge fight and quit letting big goverment push around small goverment.


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## stillhunterman

cklspencer said:


> The reasoning for this is just plane stupid. If you can't unlist in two states and leave one state listed then should you not take into account that there are large numbers of wolve when you take away boarders, so based on that should they not delist them since there is a large number just not in these three states but in Canada a well?
> *I sure hope the These three states as well as Utah put up one huge fight and quit letting big goverment push around small goverment.[/*quote]
> 
> I hope so too! I would also hope the various organizations that are against the wolf escalation will also contribute as much as possible. We also, as hunters, must voice our concerns as well, whether it be via email, snail mail, phone calls, whatever the venue, but we must do it LOUD AND CLEAR, or we won't have the right to complain when the devastation that is surely to happen to our wild game....does. :shock:


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## lunkerhunter2

Federal judge=scum of the earth! Look at what they have over-turned in the last week!


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## gitterdone81

Time for me to sound stupid....SSS....Shoot, Shoot, Shoot.....Shoot Stupid Stuff....???


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## Bowdacious

SSS = SHOOT, SHOVEL, AND SHUT-UP


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## stillhunterman

SSS= kind of an acronym for the deadly disposition of a critter via a projectile moving at high velocity, then the direct planting of said critter, with no afterthought of revealing such an occurrence ever took place....or what Bowdacious said :mrgreen:


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## Bax*

Wow, this came as quite the surprise. I wonder how this will affect the situation here in Utah?


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## mack1950

very simple sounds like a s.s.s solution


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## tuffluckdriller

It seems obvious to be the SSS situation. I wonder, though, how many people see "big coyotes" without the opportunity to even take aim, let alone make a good shot. 

How can we trap/call/bait/etc them to eradicate these "big coyotes"?


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## ramrod

it sucks when pinheads from other states can tell us whats best for our state


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## TEX-O-BOB

> How can we trap/call/bait/etc them to eradicate these "big coyotes"?


Ever heard of Parvo? Deadly to dogs. Well, guess what, it's deadly to wolves and coyotes too! All ya gotta do is take a litter of parvo puppies for a long drive... :twisted:


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## Bax*

TEX-O-BOB said:


> How can we trap/call/bait/etc them to eradicate these "big coyotes"?
> 
> 
> 
> Ever heard of Parvo? Deadly to dogs. Well, guess what, it's deadly to wolves and coyotes too! All ya gotta do is take a litter of parvo puppies for a long drive... :twisted:
Click to expand...

That is one mischeviously good plan right there Tex


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## tuffluckdriller

I like that idea. Also, what about the cyanide guns they used to use to get rid of coyotes in the Book Cliffs? They did that maybe 8-10 years ago...or maybe longer, I can't remember. Does anyone know where one could acquire such a thing? Could a farmer get one (or 20, or 200...)?


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## havnfun

Bax* said:


> [quote="TEX-O-BOB":2raksy89]
> 
> 
> 
> How can we trap/call/bait/etc them to eradicate these "big coyotes"?
> 
> 
> 
> Ever heard of Parvo? Deadly to dogs. Well, guess what, it's deadly to wolves and coyotes too! All ya gotta do is take a litter of parvo puppies for a long drive... :twisted:
Click to expand...

That is one mischeviously good plan right there Tex[/quote:2raksy89]

+1


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## swbuckmaster

if the judge says the wolves are either endangered or not endangered then It has to be a good thing for us. cause Canadian wolves are not endangered :evil:


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## stillhunterman

swbuckmaster said:


> if the judge says the wolves are either endangered or not endangered then It has to be a good thing for us. cause Canadian wolves are not endangered :evil:


Hmmmm. Ok, sometimes you make a lot of sense, sometimes not. To me, this is one of the "not" times....what are you saying???? :shock: :?


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## swbuckmaster

The judge says you CANT HUNT endangered species!

Canadian wolves are not endangered! So shooting everyone of the pos's in the states wont even put them on the endangered species list.

Whats so hard to understand about that and how is that not good for our situation?


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## stillhunterman

Dude, you need to chill out....take yer bow and just look at it for a while, it might help......geeze. Do you have ANY idea what is going on here??????????????????????????????????


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## swbuckmaster

stillhunterman said:


> Dude, you need to chill out....take yer bow and just look at it for a while, it might help......geeze. Do you have ANY idea what is going on here??????????????????????????????????


what are you talking about? you asked and I thought I answered your question. I cant stand wolves or tree huggers who want wolves. How can I make my point any clearer? If it offends you or anyone else that I don't want to see wolves in Utah then sorry I don't want wolves in Utah!


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## Elkoholic8

Does anyone know how the Canadian wolf ever got put on the endangered species list? THEY ARE CANADIAN, there are a bunch in Canada, so how do they become an endangered species? This whole protection thing makes no sence to me. I sure hope this on again off again thing comes to a solid descision real soon and we can convince the powers that be that we need to eradicate them again. Get their mangy asses out of here before all this conservation work over the last 3 decades goes for not. I know I don't want to see my conseravation efforts wasted, and I'll do what I can to help out the decline in wolf populations.


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## gitterdone81

Maybe the DWR can help us all out unofficially. Officially declare again that there are no wolves in Utah. Then officially we can't shoot a wolf, just big yotes.


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## stillhunterman

swbuckmaster said:


> stillhunterman said:
> 
> 
> 
> Dude, you need to chill out....take yer bow and just look at it for a while, it might help......geeze. Do you have ANY idea what is going on here??????????????????????????????????
> 
> 
> 
> what are you talking about? you asked and I thought I answered your question.* I cant stand wolves or tree huggers who want wolves.* How can I make my point any clearer? If it offends you or anyone else that I don't want to see wolves in Utah then sorry I don't want wolves in Utah!
Click to expand...

Agreed. Nope, no offense here. I can't think of any hunter I know who wants wolves in Utah or any other state as well. Just how the hell is there any possible way to shoot every wolf in the state outside the idiotic law thats presently in place? This issue is probably going to go all the way to the S. court, and it will be watched very closely by the non-hunting public I would think. We need to do what will further our chances of getting the States to be able to control these vermin, and not do anything that will hinder the process....just sayin'


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## goofy elk

I've been hearing and reading some things since this ruling that leads me to believe
the sportsmen and game management have about had it with the on going politics
circulating wolves..
Its quickly coming to the point of,," the straw that broke the camels (or wolves) back!
This upcoming fall hunt I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of lead flys at large coyotes.. 

Idaho Fish and Game Statement on Wolf Ruling

We are very disappointed by District Judge Donald Molloy’s ruling, returning gray wolves to endangered species protection.

“This is a major setback for responsible wildlife management in Idaho. We have demonstrated our ability to conduct a hunting season in an orderly fashion,” Idaho Fish and Game Commission Chairman Dr. Wayne Wright. “It’s a shame when legal twists can trump wildlife management. This is not how the Endangered Species Act should work.”

We don’t know yet what this means for the upcoming wolf season. But for the time being we have suspended wolf tag sales until we’ve had a chance to further review the decision.

“We’re frustrated; we’re angry; we’re disappointed,” Idaho Fish and Game Deputy Director Jim Unsworth said. “We’ve played by the rules, but his decision allows procedural technicalities to overcome sound science and common sense.”


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## wyogoob

Looks like Wyoming has messed this thing up. As soon as the wolf was delisted in Idaho and Montana, but not Wyoming, the pro-wolf legal wheels started spinning. Their stand is that, according to the Endangered Species Act, the wolf must be managed cooperatively because they do not recognize political boundaries. Thus the wolf has to be delisted in all three states. All Wyoming had to do was adopt a wolf program like Idaho or Montana.

On the other hand, with increasing numbers of wolves in Utah it would have been just a matter of time before the wolf supporters would use Utah as their case in point.

Minnesota, Wisconsin, and Michigan have 4,000 wolves, and when the wolf was delisted I don't believe they opened up wolf hunting seasons, but allowed killing wolves that were bothering livestock, pets, and people. These three states may be part of the fray, part of the final resolution.


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## stillhunterman

It's definately going to be a huge political/financial battle for sure. The RMEF has taken the first salvo in this area, already calling for Congressional review/reform of the ESA. Hold on to your britches, it could be a wild ride...

http://www.rmef.org/NewsandMedia/NewsReleases/2010/ESAReform.htm

Before it even gets to that point, the 10(j) rule will be pushed in all the states involved, as it rightly should.


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## wyogoob

stillhunterman said:


> It's definately going to be a huge political/financial battle for sure. The RMEF has taken the first salvo in this area, already calling for Congressional review/reform of the ESA. Hold on to your britches, it could be a wild ride...
> 
> http://www.rmef.org/NewsandMedia/NewsReleases/2010/ESAReform.htm
> 
> Before it even gets to that point, the 10(j) rule will be pushed in all the states involved, as it rightly should.


Yep, but can you have a different 10j for each state? The Upper Midwest has a substantial gray wolf population and they are watching closely. They have same concerns as us; States rights or Federal rights? I say Federal rights because the wolves know no boundaries, travel back and forth across state lines.

In the meantime I'll just keep moving my elk camp further south and east. Good grief!!


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## stillhunterman

wyogoob said:


> stillhunterman said:
> 
> 
> 
> It's definately going to be a huge political/financial battle for sure. The RMEF has taken the first salvo in this area, already calling for Congressional review/reform of the ESA. Hold on to your britches, it could be a wild ride...
> 
> http://www.rmef.org/NewsandMedia/NewsReleases/2010/ESAReform.htm
> 
> Before it even gets to that point, the 10(j) rule will be pushed in all the states involved, as it rightly should.
> 
> 
> 
> *Yep, but can you have a different 10j for each state? The Upper Midwest has a substantial gray wolf population and they are watching closely. They have same concerns as us; States rights or Federal rights? I say Federal rights because the wolves know no boundaries, travel back and forth across state lines.*
> In the meantime I'll just keep moving my elk camp further south and east. Good grief!!
Click to expand...

As I understand it, the 10(j) rule was developed for the "re-introduction" of the Rocky Mountain Wolf, and is applied to the tri-states of Idaho, Montana and Wyoming. It was intended for the non essential experimental populations that were introduced. It did/does not apply to areas where the wolves migrated in naturally. It has been amended a couple of times, givings States a bit more lee-way in their control. Once the wolf was placed back on the ESA protection list, the mid-west states lost whatever small control they had once again, I believe.

I have a lot to learn on the subject and will continue in that effort.

I hear ya about moving your camp, the whole thing stinks. :evil:


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## Huge29

I have not read pages 2-3 yet, but as a moderator I must officially state this forum certainly does not condone any illegal activity! However, I just read some and found out that woofs don't even exist in Utah, so what is all of the fuss?! In the meantime, be sure to eradicate all coyotes of all sizes and colors every chance you get!


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## stillhunterman

Huge29 said:


> I have not read pages 2-3 yet, but as a moderator I must officially state this forum certainly does not condone any illegal activity! However, I just read some and found out that *woofs don't even exist in Utah, so what is all of the fuss?! * In the meantime, be sure to eradicate all coyotes of all sizes and colors every chance you get!


That's a rhetorical question there ain't it Huge?  o-||


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## Huge29

stillhunterman said:


> Huge29 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I have not read pages 2-3 yet, but as a moderator I must officially state this forum certainly does not condone any illegal activity! However, I just read some and found out that *woofs don't even exist in Utah, so what is all of the fuss?! * In the meantime, be sure to eradicate all coyotes of all sizes and colors every chance you get!
> 
> 
> 
> That's a rhetorical question there ain't it Huge?  o-||
Click to expand...

Yes, exactly!! :mrgreen:


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## wyogoob

stillhunterman said:


> ......................................................................
> 
> *Yep, but can you have a different 10j for each state? The Upper Midwest has a substantial gray wolf population and they are watching closely. They have same concerns as us; States rights or Federal rights? I say Federal rights because the wolves know no boundaries, travel back and forth across state lines.*
> In the meantime I'll just keep moving my elk camp further south and east. Good grief!!


As I understand it, the 10(j) rule was developed for the "re-introduction" of the Rocky Mountain Wolf, and is applied to the tri-states of Idaho, Montana and Wyoming. It was intended for the non essential experimental populations that were introduced. It did/does not apply to areas where the wolves migrated in naturally. It has been amended a couple of times, givings States a bit more lee-way in their control. Once the wolf was placed back on the ESA protection list, the mid-west states lost whatever small control they had once again, I believe.

I have a lot to learn on the subject and will continue in that effort.

I hear ya about moving your camp, the whole thing stinks. :evil:[/quote]

Very true, 10j is for WY, ID and MT. But Michigans wolf pack on Isle Royale National Park is plagued with wolf losses because of interbreeding. They would like to introduce some "new gene pool" wolves...same scenario as Yellowstone NP. (An attempt was made in the 50s to replenish wolves on Isle Royale. Some say they all died, some claim a few survided.)

Anyway, the Upper Midwest wolf-nuts, sorry, enthusiasts, could hinder closure on the issue here.

Can you say 11j?


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## Huge29

wyogoob said:


> Very true, 10j is for WY, ID and MT. But Michigans wolf pack on Isle Royale National Park is plagued with wolf losses because of interbreeding. They would like to introduce some "new gene pool" wolves...same scenario as Yellowstone NP. (An attempt was made in the 50s to replenish wolves on Isle Royale. Some say they all died, some claim a few survided.)


Splendid idea! Maybe Tex could work on this supply for them! We could market how they need to purify the gene pool and such, when in reality it just eradicates them, much like the elk herds; the tree huggers liked that idea of simply wiping out the old ones and sick ones..., so maybe the woofie lovers would like to have most of the wolves wiped out with Tex's secret parvo laced woofies. :mrgreen:


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## stillhunterman

Huge29 said:


> wyogoob said:
> 
> 
> 
> Very true, 10j is for WY, ID and MT. But Michigans wolf pack on Isle Royale National Park is plagued with wolf losses because of interbreeding. They would like to introduce some "new gene pool" wolves...same scenario as Yellowstone NP. (An attempt was made in the 50s to replenish wolves on Isle Royale. Some say they all died, some claim a few survided.)
> 
> 
> 
> Splendid idea! Maybe Tex could work on this supply for them! We could market how they need to purify the gene pool and such, when in reality it just eradicates them, much like the elk herds; the tree huggers liked that idea of simply wiping out the old ones and sick ones..., so maybe the woofie lovers would like to have most of the wolves wiped out with Tex's secret parvo laced woofies. :mrgreen:
Click to expand...

Dang Huge, a ray of sunshine blazin' through the gloom! I'll give ya "A" for effort! :mrgreen:


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## The Naturalist

TEX-O-BOB said:


> How can we trap/call/bait/etc them to eradicate these "big coyotes"?
> 
> 
> 
> Ever heard of Parvo? Deadly to dogs. Well, guess what, it's deadly to wolves and coyotes too! All ya gotta do is take a litter of parvo puppies for a long drive... :twisted:
Click to expand...

Already been done. I don't remember the exact date- I believe 7-8 years ago parvo did go through a number of packs in the Yellowstone region, and the wolf population dropped quite a bit. They could never prove for a certainty but do suspect it was brought in by an infected animal from some local ranchers.
The problem with this scenario is the wolves that survive have a natural immunity to it that could be passed on to the offspring. So after a few generations it probably wouldn't work so all you've done is created a "super" wolf.
Mange is another one that has been tried.


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## luv2fsh&hnt

Well I think I agree with the either the wolf is endangered or it's not theory. Seeing as they were already delisted and hunted in Montana and Idaho that would indicate to me they are no longer endangered and as thus do not merit protection under ESA.


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## Renegade

If I see a wolf in the wild, it's most definitely endangered.


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## mack1950

amen renagade


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## luv2fsh&hnt

Renegade said:


> If I see a wolf in the wild, it's most definitely endangered.


I agree sir but I would never break the law that would make me a lowlife poacher. :roll:


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## ramrod

The tree huggers say that we need wolves to balance the ecosystem. I don’t see the tree huggers trying to bring back smallpox to control over population of humans.

Utah has plenty of predators and with the deer struggling in our state we don’t need any more predators the coyotes and the lions are doing a fine job and in many places to good of job.

I would not turn in anyone for killing a wolf. I wouldn’t hesitate to turn in someone for poaching anything else


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## MadHunter

I am not sure if this was posted or not but here is what Judge Malloy stated.

*U.S. District Judge Donald Molloy said in his ruling that the entire Rocky Mountain wolf population either must be listed as an endangered species or removed from the list, but the protections for the same population can't be different for each state.*

If you interpret this correctly he is stating we need to take the whole lot off the list. This is where the true unity of the sportsmen, cattle ranchers and other anti wolf supporters will be tested. Now the fight goes back to the courts to remove all wolves from the list.


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## MadHunter

ramrod said:


> Utah has plenty of predators and with the deer struggling in our state we don't need any more predators the coyotes and the lions are doing a fine job and in many places to good of job.


Ramrod... I could sear this is righ out of "BearButt's repertoir of most common posts". Are you two related or do you just share a passionate hatred for all predators?


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## Bax*

luv2fsh&hnt said:


> Renegade said:
> 
> 
> 
> If I see a wolf in the wild, it's most definitely endangered.
> 
> 
> 
> I agree sir but I would never break the law that would make me a lowlife poacher. :roll:
Click to expand...

Larry you make a really interesting point here.

I think that we are all for the most part on the same page regarding this topic and I think that the consensus is pretty much unanimous that we dont want them here and dont think they should be on the endangered species list.

So my rhetorical question here is: _KNOWING_ that the wolf is a protected species, would you risk your hunting rights and family's financial security by shooting one?

The SSS solution is a good one, and I'm not saying that its wrong either. But what if you were caught?


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## Renegade

luv2fsh&hnt said:


> Renegade said:
> 
> 
> 
> If I see a wolf in the wild, it's most definitely endangered.
> 
> 
> 
> I agree sir but I would never break the law that would make me a lowlife poacher. :roll:
Click to expand...

If that's how you choose to see things, that's fine with me. I chose to look hard at stupid laws and make my own call at a particular time.

I've also been a lowlife speeder from time to time. I've been a lowlife by walking into a convenience store in Kaysville after dark with no ID on me. I've even sunk so low to have unmarried sex in Utah.

Please don't judge me too harshly-even though a wolf in my presence in the wild is still very endangered.


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## MadHunter

Renegade... I don't think unmarried sex in Utah is the lowest. Everyone does it. Admitting to having it is the lowest, but I won't judge you on that. BTW is sex with people other thatn the one you are married to considered unmarried sex?

Back to topic, a wolf within 500yds of me is endagered and mostlikely a dead wolf walking. Remeber our declaration of independance.....
*That whenever any form of government becomes destructive to these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their safety and happiness.*


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## luv2fsh&hnt

Renegade said:


> luv2fsh&hnt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Renegade said:
> 
> 
> 
> If I see a wolf in the wild, it's most definitely endangered.
> 
> 
> 
> I agree sir but I would never break the law that would make me a lowlife poacher. :roll:
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> If that's how you choose to see things, that's fine with me. I chose to look hard at stupid laws and make my own call at a particular time.
> 
> I've also been a lowlife speeder from time to time. I've been a lowlife by walking into a convenience store in Kaysville after dark with no ID on me. I've even sunk so low to have unmarried sex in Utah.
> 
> Please don't judge me too harshly-even though a wolf in my presence in the wild is still very endangered.
Click to expand...

I was being facetious that's why I put the rolling eyes and the wink emoticons in the post. I firmly believe there are no wolves here and I shoot all wild dogs on sight especially them great big coyotes.


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## luv2fsh&hnt

Bax* said:


> [quote="luv2fsh&hnt":2vhe2b8y]
> 
> 
> Renegade said:
> 
> 
> 
> If I see a wolf in the wild, it's most definitely endangered.
> 
> 
> 
> I agree sir but I would never break the law that would make me a lowlife poacher. :roll:
Click to expand...

Larry you make a really interesting point here.

I think that we are all for the most part on the same page regarding this topic and I think that the consensus is pretty much unanimous that we dont want them here and dont think they should be on the endangered species list.

So my rhetorical question here is: _KNOWING_ that the wolf is a protected species, would you risk your hunting rights and family's financial security by shooting one?

The SSS solution is a good one, and I'm not saying that its wrong either. But what if you were caught?[/quote:2vhe2b8y]

Judging by the punishment they handed out to that group they caught poaching all those deer off the vernon unit the punishment wouldn't be that bad and worth the risk in my opinion.


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## Treehugnhuntr

No matter how you slice it, intentionally killing a protected species makes you a criminal. No different than someone killing a trophy bull. The only difference is what value each animal presents to the individual.

I value a bull elk more than a wolf, but many others feel contrary, which one of us is right? Doesn't matter.

If someone wants to go out and be a martyr for the wolf hating cause, be my guest, I see it as sheer stupidity. Then again, talking and walking are two different things....


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## Bax*

I brought up the point because I wonder how many of us are willing to risk our reputations, money, and more on shooting a wolf?

I'm not familiar with the story Larry is referencing, so I cant really weigh in on the point he is making. But it just seems that there are a lot of guys that want them gone and keep saying "SSS" but if it boiled down to it, I am not willing to take the risk personally


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## jahan

Treehugnhuntr said:


> No matter how you slice it, intentionally killing a protected species makes you a criminal. No different than someone killing a trophy bull. The only difference is what value each animal presents to the individual.
> 
> I value a bull elk more than a wolf, but many others feel contrary, which one of us is right? Doesn't matter.
> 
> If someone wants to go out and be a martyr for the wolf hating cause, be my guest, I see it as sheer stupidity. Then again, talking and walking are two different things....


Great post, I agree. I disagree with the ruling, but that doesn't mean I am going to go out and shoot wolves. Also Larry, I know those guys on Vernon got a slap on the wrist, but if you got caught shooting a wolf, they would love to make an example out of someone and throw the book at them. There was a gentlemen up in Lewiston that accidentally shot a wolf when I was in college, probably around 2004 to 2006. He thought it was a yote, it was a long shot. When he got to it he realized it was more than a big coyote, it was a wolf, so he turned himself in. They threw the book at this dude, which I think is ridiculous, because next time he will just practice the shovel and shut up portion of SSS.

Plus all of you SSS people aren't very smart, if I shot a wolf illegally, I would never go check to see if it was dead and I definitely wouldn't spend time around it burying it. Plus I know most of you hillbilly's can't help from telling your fish stories. :O•-: :mrgreen:  :lol:


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## Treehugnhuntr

[attachment=0:fd63qb5h]Wolfslayer.jpg[/attachment:fd63qb5h]

:mrgreen: :O•-:


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## Bax*

Lol! Thats what I imagined was going through a poacher's head


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## jahan

Treehugnhuntr said:


> [attachment=0:3quhfqn3]Wolfslayer.jpg[/attachment:3quhfqn3]
> 
> :mrgreen: :O•-:


Hey, I didn't give you permission to use my picture. :mrgreen:  :lol:


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## Bax*

I think that if more people understood that wolves look like this, they would be more apt to want them shot


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## stillhunterman

Treehugnhuntr said:


> No matter how you slice it, intentionally killing a protected species makes you a criminal. No different than someone killing a trophy bull. The only difference is what value each animal presents to the individual.
> 
> I value a bull elk more than a wolf, but many others feel contrary, which one of us is right? Doesn't matter.
> 
> If someone wants to go out and be a martyr for the wolf hating cause, be my guest, I see it as sheer stupidity. Then again, talking and walking are two different things....


Yeah, that pretty much sums it up for me as well. Wolves are here to stay-and expand- and we need to learn to deal with the issue the best way we can. Wolves are being poached in every state they are currently in, and in the upper peninsula of Michigan, it is increasing dramatically. The fines and penalties for poaching an endangered species are not a slap on the wrist like the fines handed down to the idiots who poached all those deer in Utah. We need to be smart about this, but then again... :? :shock: we have a hard enough time just dealing with issues within our own "herd of hunters" let alone dealing with something as complex as the wolf issue, but I think there is hope! -)O(- _(O)_ :mrgreen:


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## wyogoob

jahan said:


> Treehugnhuntr said:
> 
> 
> 
> [attachment=0:352yuqqk]Wolfslayer.jpg[/attachment:352yuqqk]
> 
> :mrgreen: :O•-:
> 
> 
> 
> Hey, I didn't give you permission to use my picture. :mrgreen:  :lol:
Click to expand...

Yeah, what's up with that?


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## luv2fsh&hnt

I thought this was your photo Jahan.


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## wyogoob

Let me say wolves screwed up some fine elk country in Western Wyoming. Screwed it up for me, the guides, and some ranchers. But elk aren't dumb (moose intelligence is debatable though) they've adjusted to wolves by moving away. And I'm right behind them. If the wolves eat all the elk, I'll go deer hunting or chase rabbits, whatever. I'm not going to break any laws and lose my hunting and fish priviledges. Should wolves be hunted? I believe so, but the ethical thing to do is follow the rule of law.


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## Renegade

luv2fsh&hnt said:


> Renegade said:
> 
> 
> 
> [quote="luv2fsh&hnt":3q086k1a]
> 
> 
> Renegade said:
> 
> 
> 
> If I see a wolf in the wild, it's most definitely endangered.
> 
> 
> 
> I agree sir but I would never break the law that would make me a lowlife poacher. :roll:
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> If that's how you choose to see things, that's fine with me. I chose to look hard at stupid laws and make my own call at a particular time.
> 
> I've also been a lowlife speeder from time to time. I've been a lowlife by walking into a convenience store in Kaysville after dark with no ID on me. I've even sunk so low to have unmarried sex in Utah.
> 
> Please don't judge me too harshly-even though a wolf in my presence in the wild is still very endangered.
Click to expand...

I was being facetious that's why I put the rolling eyes and the wink emoticons in the post. I firmly believe there are no wolves here and I shoot all wild dogs on sight especially them great big coyotes.[/quote:3q086k1a]
LIKE!

I'll protect myself against a person too. 8)


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