# Lead line and depth



## Packout (Nov 20, 2007)

I bought some 18lb test leaded line and was wondering how you know the depth? Colors I understand, but the line is angling out so how does it correlate to depth? How much difference is there between 1 or 1 1/2 or 2 mph? Any input will be appreciated.

Or would it be better to use the trolling lead wieghts?


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## FishHound (Sep 27, 2007)

Packout said:


> I bought some 18lb test leaded line and was wondering how you know the depth? Colors I understand, but the line is angling out so how does it correlate to depth? How much difference is there between 1 or 1 1/2 or 2 mph? Any input will be appreciated.
> 
> Or would it be better to use the trolling lead wieghts?


If you check other sources, you will find varied estimates as to the rates of submersion. It is difficult to determine all of the factors and come up with an exact figure for sink rate as every set-up and situation will differ.

Lure depth with lead line is dependant on a number of factors - Speed being the most important. Leader length and composition, lure type, and finally, length of lead line out will change the depth of your presentation as well. By the way, those criteria, with the exception of speed, are not ordered by the amount of effect on depth.

Speed; as speed increases line depth (sink rate) decreases. For any real advantage that lead line offers, speed should not exceed 3 mph. Speeds faster than 3 mph can be more effectively trolled using other methods than lead line as your depth would decrease to the point that even with an entire core out, you would easily be within a depth range of other shallow trolling techniques. There is no minimum speed consideration except that your line could be dragging and subject to snags or mud fouling. For your question of the depth differences between 1 mph and 1.5 mph and 2 mph, you could be looking at 1 to 4 feet of depth difference per color out.

Lure type; If you are trolling with worm harnesses, then you can figure that your lure depth will appoximately equal your lead line depth - the harness will not have sufficient drag or weight to counter the weight of the line itself. With other lures, it is different. A diving lure will start it's estimated diving potential at the depth of the lead line. i.e. a lure that is designed to dive down to 10 feet, will dive at least 10 feet below your lead line.

Leader; braided and/or thin diameter line will help your lure dive deeper. Conversely, heavier line will cause drag and lift of the lure. Length of leader can also cause your lure to drag and lift if it is too long and creates water resistance beyond the capability of the lure to counteract it.

The length of the lead line itself can be a factor as well. The more line out, the more water resistance and the less sink. The maximum effective depth achievable with lead line is the actual distance of the line itself (at a stand still - 0 mph). If you are moving at all, and trolling with a lure that needs some speed for it's action, then count on the maximum trolling depth of your 100 yards of 18 lb lead line to be about 45 feet.

Lead lines come in several test poundages; 12,18,27,36,45 (there may be others with which I am unfamiliar). The line is measured and color changes every 30 feet (10 yards). I have both 18 and 27 lb. test lead line. For most purposes there is little to no difference in the sink rate between those two lines.

I use a 7 foot Okuma Lead Line rod. I have 25 feet of 12 pound test mono leader on my 27 lb lead line. At the end of that leader, I have a medium sized swivel where I connect another leader of flourocarbon that is 10 to 15 feet. On the end of that second leader, I attach my presentation. With this set up, I can usually expect a sink rate of somewhere between 4 - 8 feet down per each color out (depending on those criteria I mentioned). I like to troll my lead line somewhere around .8 to 2.2 mph.

Here's how you figure this stuff all out. Take your set up to a known body of water. Use your electronics to monitor the depth carefully, use a GPS to know the speed, and do not use any lure. Start out at a set depth, let out line, touch the bottom and make note. Next, Start moving at .5 mph and let out line untill you touch the bottom again - make note of the colors out. Now increase to 1.0 mph, and let out line to touch the bottom ... etc. continue until you have gotten a feel for your depth estimations. Next, experiment with your lures in the same way to see the effect they have. It is a bit of work, but in my opinion, well worth the effort.

As far as whether you should use lead line or some other weighting system, only you can make that determination. I use many different trolling methods and technologies, and there is definitely many advantages to using lead line. I say this; learn it well and you will always find a situation where lead line can do somethings better than another methodology.

Sorry that was so long.


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## Packout (Nov 20, 2007)

FishHound- Thanks very much for the response. I do appreciate it! Sounds like you really know what are doing. I am just muddling through this trying get my boy a mac. Keeping my fingers crossed so we can remove that species off the list for him.


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## Pez Gallo (Dec 27, 2007)

there's a book out there that has all that information. It tells you speed, lure, and how many colors for the depth. I have seen it at sportsman's warehouse, but I can't remember the title.


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## .45 (Sep 21, 2007)

> If you check other sources, you will find varied estimates as to the rates of submersion. It is difficult to determine all of the factors and come up with an exact figure for sink rate as every set-up and situation will differ.


Everything to what the FishHound said....I've been messing around with weighted trolling line this last year or so. Only on a high speed pontoon though, so speed really isn't a factor for me. I always figure 7' depth per color, and try to adjust depending on the lure. My problem has been, I haven't watched the depth finder close enough and have lost a few rigs due to shallow water. :|


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## sbdadass (Apr 20, 2008)

The book Is call precision trolling. The one's at sportsman.s are an out of print edition. the only source I've found are at precisiontrolling.com at $39.99 plus shipping. I'm Ordering mine soon.


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## taxidermist (Sep 11, 2007)

The only "down side" to led line, is, after you have so many colors out it wont go deeper....... It will just make a big loop in the line. Ive done well on the "dippsey diver" using a baitcast reel, and 15# test line. The nice thing about these, is that you can turn the dial on them, and it will trail to the side of the boat. That way, if you have a boat full of fishermen, you dont get tangled lines...


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## REPETER (Oct 3, 2007)

FishHound said:


> I use a 7 foot Okuma Lead Line rod. I have 25 feet of 12 pound test mono leader on my 27 lb lead line. At the end of that leader, I have a medium sized swivel where I connect another leader of flourocarbon that is 10 to 15 feet. On the end of that second leader, I attach my presentation.
> 
> [/color]


That's a lot of leader...to a newbie like me could you explain why so much leader. I have only seen 3-4 other guys use trolling set ups and they (I think) almost always tied pop gear straight to their lead line and then about 18" or so with a worm on a hook. I know there are many other ways to troll, but this seems to be a popular way. What you are explaining is very different from this, what advantages do you have with the 35-40 extra feet of leader. Don't you have more tangles? Do you worry about all the extra points of contact-prone to failure? Thanks for you input, I would like to learn as much as possible as I hope to do much more boat fishing down the road.


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## FishHound (Sep 27, 2007)

REPETER said:


> FishHound said:
> 
> 
> > I use a 7 foot Okuma Lead Line rod. I have 25 feet of 12 pound test mono leader on my 27 lb lead line. At the end of that leader, I have a medium sized swivel where I connect another leader of flourocarbon that is 10 to 15 feet. On the end of that second leader, I attach my presentation.
> ...


Actually, the 35-40 (sometimes even more) feet of leader is quite a bit less than that used by many lead line trollers. I've seen upwards of 100 feet of braided line added to that.

Regarding tangles, for me, I would certainly prefer to have tangles in my inexpensive leader material than I would in my lead line. That stuff can be pretty spendy to replace. But the leader itself does not create the tangles nor make my set up more prone to that. I think that tangles are more a result of boat control, or a momentary lapse thereof.

I forgot to mention how my first leader is attached to the lead line. The lead line is a dacron outer line wound around a lead core wire filler. To attach the leader, I pinch the end of the lead line and remove 6 or so inches of the lead filler. Then I insert the leader material in the hollow dacron outer winding. Next I tie 3 over hand knots about 1 or so inches apart in the dacron/mono leader combination. That holds it fast and I have never had that connection fail even when snagged firmly - the leader itself would fail first at the weakest point in the mono (usually an invisible nick of some kind). At the other connection points (swivels, attractors or lures), I try to be carefull with tieing knots (generally palomar but I also use a number of other knots depending on the situation) and test them prior to use. I am also using fairly heavy test lines so that even the week points are still pretty strong for the fish I am targeting.

As far as hooking pop gear to directly to lead, I would avoid that myself as pop gear can spin and twist the lead line - line twist in lead line means kinks and replacement of line. If I use pop gear on lead line, I would definitely have a leader and swivel between them.

One of the main reasons for the what seems to be a longer leader than that with which you are familiar, is that lead line itself has a large presence as it is dragged through the water and it can spook wary fish. The leader removes that presence somewhat from the proximity of the bait or lure that I am presenting. It gives the presentation a little more stealth and finesse. Therefore, in my opinion, I have more opportunity and chance to intice or catch a greater number of line or boat shy fish.


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## Packout (Nov 20, 2007)

Again, some great informational posts. A couple other quick questions:

-Can you use lead line on a large, open face reel? Or does the winding mechanics of an open face reel damage the lead line? 

-Do you guys use snubbers when trolling leaded line? (I use them on mono, but heard lead line is more forgiving.)

FishHound- You have a wealth of knowledge on the subject. Thanks again for sharing and welcome to the forum.


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## FishHound (Sep 27, 2007)

Packout said:


> Again, some great informational posts. A couple other quick questions:





Packout said:


> -Can you use lead line on a large, open face reel? Or does the winding mechanics of an open face reel damage the lead line?


 While there are open faced reels large enough to handle lead line's large diameter, as you imply, the winding mechanism would ultimately damage the line by the unavoidable twisting of it. 



Packout said:


> -Do you guys use snubbers when trolling leaded line? (I use them on mono, but heard lead line is more forgiving.)


If I am trolling for very soft mouthed fish or large hard hitting fish, then yes, I would use a snubber - if I felt I didn't have enough of a mono leader that could help in absorbing the shock. Actually, mono has more stretch than lead line and thus it is more forgiving in that aspect. However, because of the nature of lead line to have a more exaggerated sag in it, the forgiveness of lead line really comes from the action of the sag of the line being eliminated by the weight and/or fight of the fish. In reality lead line has little stretch or "forgiveness" of it's own.



Packout said:


> FishHound- You have a wealth of knowledge on the subject. Thanks again for sharing and welcome to the forum.


Thank you. I have been lurking here since almost day one (that is when I am not out fishing - which according to some I do all too often). I also lurked on the old DWR board regularly but rarely ever posted there.


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## ddancer (Dec 14, 2015)

Packout said:


> I bought some 18lb test leaded line and was wondering how you know the depth? Colors I understand, but the line is angling out so how does it correlate to depth? How much difference is there between 1 or 1 1/2 or 2 mph? Any input will be appreciated.
> 
> Or would it be better to use the trolling lead wieghts?


Hey PACKOut if you still need something this may be helpful. :?

Lead Core Depth Calculator
 Https://play.google.com/store/search?q=fishing%20lead%20core&c=apps


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