# Could this happen if wolves aren't officially ID'd in Utah?



## Watcher (Dec 31, 2008)

United States v. Vernon L. Hoff et al., No. 12-CR-00184 (D. Minn).
On November 15, 2012, a jury convicted Vernon Hoff of violating the Endangered Species Act and of making a false statement to a federal official (16 U.S.C. §1538(a)(1)(G); 18 U.S.C. §1001(a)(1), (a)(2)), stemming from the intentional killing of two gray wolves in February 2010.
The evidence presented at the four-day trial proved that Hoff lied to United States Fish and Wildlife Service officials about speaking on the phone with co-defendant Kyle Jensen about transporting the two wolf carcasses. After the call, Jensen loaded the animals into his vehicle, traveled to Superior National Forest, and buried them with a bulldozer. At the time, the gray wolf was listed as a threatened species under the Endangered Species Act, has since been removed from the list in January 2012 in Minnesota. Jensen pleaded guilty on the eve of trial to two ESA violations.
This case was investigated by the United States Fish and Wildlife Service and the Minnesota Department of Natural Resources.


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## ntrl_brn_rebel (Sep 7, 2007)

*Re: Could this happen if wolves aren't officially ID'd in Ut*

South of I84/I80 Yes.....

North of I84/I80 No.....

Wolves HAVE been officially documented it Utah....They have been killed in Utah......


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## ntrl_brn_rebel (Sep 7, 2007)

*Re: Could this happen if wolves aren't officially ID'd in Ut*

oops....let me explain that a little...Wolves are not an "endangered species" North of I 84 and I 80......so you would not fall under the ESA......


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## MadHunter (Nov 17, 2009)

*Re: Could this happen if wolves aren't officially ID'd in Ut*

I have a bigger concern... He was convicted over a telephone conversation. Phone records can show that you called someone and how long the call was. How on earth do they know what the phone call was about? I sure hope they were not investigated because their phone conversation had flag words in it. We are giving up too much personal liberty.


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## reb8600 (Sep 8, 2007)

*Re: Could this happen if wolves aren't officially ID'd in Ut*



ntrl_brn_rebel said:


> oops....let me explain that a little...Wolves are not an "endangered species" North of I 84 and I 80......so you would not fall under the ESA......


I dont think they have been delisted in Utah so it would still fall under the ESA


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## MadHunter (Nov 17, 2009)

*Re: Could this happen if wolves aren't officially ID'd in Ut*



reb8600 said:


> ntrl_brn_rebel said:
> 
> 
> > oops....let me explain that a little...Wolves are not an "endangered species" North of I 84 and I 80......so you would not fall under the ESA......
> ...


From what I know(someone correct me if I am wrong) They are delisted north of 84/80 and can be shot if they present a threat to your life, property, livestock, etc. Outside of these boundries they are fully protected and cannot be shot for any reason. Although I would shoot one if it presented a threat to me or my family or any other human life.

Again someone correct me if I am wrong.


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## ntrl_brn_rebel (Sep 7, 2007)

*Re: Could this happen if wolves aren't officially ID'd in Ut*

Madhunter is correct...


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## reb8600 (Sep 8, 2007)

*Re: Could this happen if wolves aren't officially ID'd in Ut*

I am sure if you shoot one that is not a threat, you will be cited under the ESA. Shooting in self defense applies to all animals even if they are protected. Wolves could be and were shot to protect livestock before they were delisted unless I am mistaken.


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## stillhunterman (Feb 15, 2009)

*Re: Could this happen if wolves aren't officially ID'd in Ut*

To be clear, a northern portion of Utah was included with the Northern Rocky Mountain delisting of the Gray Wolf. That portion of the state includes north of Interstate 80 and east of I-84; the remainder of the state is under the protection of the ESA for wolves. In that same northern portion, the Utah Wolf Management Plan is in effect.

http://wildlife.utah.gov/pdf/fact_sheets/wolves.pdf

http://wildlife.utah.gov/wolf/wolf_management_plan.pdf

The UDWR is directed by state mandate to keep wolves from becoming established in the delisted area, but as of yet, I don't know what the consequences are for someone to arbitrarily kill a wolf there, though whatever it is, it falls under Utah jurisdiction. Of course as mentioned above, they can be killed if life/property are being threatened, see the wolf plan link above.

The DWR needs to update and inform folks of the various things that are taking place. :shock:


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