# Sleeping pad



## Wasatch Wings (Sep 29, 2015)

The thread from a little while ago about bags vs quilts reminded me of a question I wanted to post here: what is your favorite sleeping pad?

I have never loved sleeping on the ground. Long nights awake from discomfort prompted me into thinking, what are the main reasons I am awake?

For me I think one of the big problems is that I am a side sleeper. I think that maybe if I slept on my back I'd be a little more comfortable. The weight is spread over a larger area on the pad, resulting is more level padding. I always wake up after 30-45 min with my hips and shoulders hurting when on a pad.

I'm 5'11" and thin, so not a lot of natural padding.

Other than training to sleep on my back, what do you think is the most comfortable pad in existence? I like ultralight, but am willing to give up a little weight in my pack for added comfort.


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## Lone_Hunter (Oct 25, 2017)

This winter, I'm rocking a klymit insulated static v, paired with thermorest solite ridge rest, and a sea to summit aeros premium pillow. I'm a side sleeper, 5"10, 170 pounds, and unless I set up on a bad piece of ground, i'm pretty comfortable. I mention pillow cause I find it's part of the whole and just as important as the pads themselves. Come spring/summer, ill probably ditch the thermorest pad, I won't need it then.


edit:
>>what do you think is the most comfortable pad in existence? 



If money is no object, i'd have probably gotten a nemo tensor alpine. I hear they are pretty comfortable with good R value, but your talking at least 200.


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## Jedidiah (Oct 10, 2014)

Shoulders is an interesting one, and may point to a factor that most people overlook: sleeping on any kind of slope with your upper body pointing down the slope. Even a barely perceptible downward slope will screw you up and it gets a lot more noticeable in your thirties.


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## johnrr65 (Nov 7, 2019)

Lone_Hunter said:


> This winter, I'm rocking a klymit insulated static v, paired with thermorest solite ridge rest, and a sea to summit aeros premium pillow. I'm a side sleeper, 5"10, 170 pounds, and unless I set up on a bad piece of ground, i'm pretty comfortable. I mention pillow cause I find it's part of the whole and just as important as the pads themselves. Come spring/summer, ill probably ditch the thermorest pad, I won't need it then.
> 
> edit:
> >>what do you think is the most comfortable pad in existence?
> ...


+1


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## KineKilla (Jan 28, 2011)

I use a thermarest base camp. It's not heavy at all but maybe slightly too heavy for the hardcore backpacker.


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## Al Hansen (Sep 7, 2007)

32.5 ft. Grand Design with a Queen size bed. Thermostat set at 63 deg.:grin:


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## johnnycake (Jul 19, 2011)

Assuming tent camping and the trailer has to stay home, then I still have two different answers depending on what kind of tent camping. 

If the tent camping puts camp pretty close to the vehicles so that weight/bulk isn't an issue my go to option for a pad is to buy a nice 4-6" memory foam mattress topper and use that. It is heavy, bulky, and cumbersome, but you'd swear you were still in your bed at home. 

However, assuming it's the kind of camping you need to carry stuff for a ways, I've been pretty happy with my Therm-a-Rest NeoAir XTherm MAX. It is warm, and provides a good enough cushion that I don't feel it too much on my hips/shoulders (side sleeper here).


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## scartinez (Apr 22, 2008)

I really like my Klymit double V. I'm 5'9'' and 160lbs. It's light and comfortable.


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## rtockstein (Mar 17, 2019)

I used to use a big Agnes qcore that I got on clearance. It was super comfy. Downside is it took forever to blow up and ended up with leaks too quickly. I got a thermarest trailpro for my bday last fall and it's pretty awesome. Very warm, easy to inflate, and decently lightweight considering the durability and foam inside. 

My wife uses a neoair from quite a few years ago and it's still going strong. Durable, light, packable, and warm.


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## Vanilla (Dec 11, 2009)

I bought the Klymit static v (non-insulated version) a couple years ago and I REALLY liked it...until I didn’t. 

I’m also a side sleeper, and it’s the first pad I’ve had where I could actually sleep on my side. I really enjoyed this pad until my backpacking trip this summer. I had three TERRIBLE sleeping night, but two okay nights. Not sure why, but I simply couldn’t get comfortable three of the nights. Like I said, I liked it before, and maybe I’ll like it again.


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## kodoz (Nov 4, 2016)

Get a hammock, it will solve all your problems. Second best solution for me was a Lost Ranger sleeping bag for when I absolutely have to sleep on the ground. Like the quilt concept: no insulation on the bottom, so it's bigger and you can thrash around or side sleep, and you slip your sleeping pad into a sleeve on the bag so it's harder to roll off of it.


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## Kwalk3 (Jun 21, 2012)

kodoz said:


> Get a hammock, it will solve all your problems. Second best solution for me was a Lost Ranger sleeping bag for when I absolutely have to sleep on the ground. Like the quilt concept: no insulation on the bottom, so it's bigger and you can thrash around or side sleep, and you slip your sleeping pad into a sleeve on the bag so it's harder to roll off of it.


I slept in a hammock for an entire season and couldn't have been more ready to sleep on the ground in a tent again. Different strokes I guess, but I sleep much better on a good pad than in a hammock.

To answer the OP. I've used the Klymit Static V and the XPED Downmat. The V shaped Baffles on the Klymit are more comfortable for me(side sleeper), but the XPED's vertical baffles do a reasonable job of giving me a decent night sleep without pressure points on my hips and shoulders.


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## Lone_Hunter (Oct 25, 2017)

I've always wondered about that air convection under a hammock. Seems like you'd just be hanging out in a tree like a quarter strung up to cool.


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## 3arabians (Dec 9, 2014)

Glad I’m not the only one suffering the hip pain issue. I really struggle with that. I’m a side sleeper and at 44 years old I’m wondering how many more years I can handle sleeping on the ground in a backpacking tent for hunting trips. I’ve used the klymit v and it did ok then I bought a kelty discovery that did a little better and I’ve been using it the last couple years but it’s a beast to haul. Not heavy but super bulky compared to a klymit v. I’m in the market for a new pad this year. So far I like the sounds of jonhnny’s therma rest max. I still have a lot of work to do on accepting that price tag though. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## johnnycake (Jul 19, 2011)

3arabians said:


> Glad I'm not the only one suffering the hip pain issue. I really struggle with that. I'm a side sleeper and at 44 years old I'm wondering how many more years I can handle sleeping on the ground in a backpacking tent for hunting trips. I've used the klymit v and it did ok then I bought a kelty discovery that did a little better and I've been using it the last couple years but it's a beast to haul. Not heavy but super bulky compared to a klymit v. I'm in the market for a new pad this year. So far I like the sounds of jonhnny's therma rest max. I still have a lot of work to do on accepting that price tag though.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I'm not gonna tell you it is amazing...it just is the best I've tried by a fair margin, which is enough to justify the price tag. Mine has held up really well too since I bought it in early 2018.

It really helps to pick a nice spot for the tent. In Utah (or places where you can't just find gorgeous mossy pillows growing everywhere) I would go so far as to cut a bunch of fir boughs and cover the ground with them before I set up the tent. Done right, that will increase your insulation and comfort factor almost as much as any pad will. But doing that and then adding the pad on top goes a long way. I've started taking a lot more time to prep the ground where I'm going to be sleeping now that wake up from shoulder/back/hip pain multiple times a night even on a great mattress at home.


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## Wasatch Wings (Sep 29, 2015)

johnnycake said:


> Assuming tent camping and the trailer has to stay home, then I still have two different answers depending on what kind of tent camping.
> 
> If the tent camping puts camp pretty close to the vehicles so that weight/bulk isn't an issue my go to option for a pad is to buy a nice 4-6" memory foam mattress topper and use that. It is heavy, bulky, and cumbersome, but you'd swear you were still in your bed at home.
> 
> However, assuming it's the kind of camping you need to carry stuff for a ways, I've been pretty happy with my Therm-a-Rest NeoAir XTherm MAX. It is warm, and provides a good enough cushion that I don't feel it too much on my hips/shoulders (side sleeper here).


Yes the memory foam mattress topper comes everywhere I can take it. If I didn't have to pack in any other gear or food...I'd just strap that thing to by back and head out!

Sounds like there's some options out there for me at least.


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## Wasatch Wings (Sep 29, 2015)

kodoz said:


> Get a hammock, it will solve all your problems. Second best solution for me was a Lost Ranger sleeping bag for when I absolutely have to sleep on the ground. Like the quilt concept: no insulation on the bottom, so it's bigger and you can thrash around or side sleep, and you slip your sleeping pad into a sleeve on the bag so it's harder to roll off of it.


I can nap in a hammock and maybe it just takes time to get used to a real hammock setup, but again, I roll on my side and the hammock just bends your body slightly in an unnatural sleeping position. I feel like back sleeping in a hammock is better. I just have a hard time staying on by back. Too many years of rolling on my side.

You sleep on your side or back in the hammock?


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## Vanilla (Dec 11, 2009)

What do you do with your hammock when you’re above the tree line?


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## 3arabians (Dec 9, 2014)

johnnycake said:


> I'm not gonna tell you it is amazing...it just is the best I've tried by a fair margin, which is enough to justify the price tag. Mine has held up really well too since I bought it in early 2018.
> 
> It really helps to pick a nice spot for the tent. In Utah (or places where you can't just find gorgeous mossy pillows growing everywhere) I would go so far as to cut a bunch of fir boughs and cover the ground with them before I set up the tent. Done right, that will increase your insulation and comfort factor almost as much as any pad will. But doing that and then adding the pad on top goes a long way. I've started taking a lot more time to prep the ground where I'm going to be sleeping now that wake up from shoulder/back/hip pain multiple times a night even on a great mattress at home.


Yup! That's my struggle. I'm at the point now that just sleeping at all due to hip pain when on the ground is a mind game when it happens at a much lesser degree anyway at home on the pillow top.

Wake up after 15 mins of sleep, hip pain, roll over and pray to baby jesus for a better result on the other side. Nope! Rinse and repeat all night. Last year I took a bag of ibuprofen to help, which failed. Too bad because I love packing in for hunts. I might start packing a 4 inch memory foam. F-it!!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## middlefork (Nov 2, 2008)

I don't think anyone mentioned it but scooping out a divot for your shoulders and hips can help a ton.


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## johnnycake (Jul 19, 2011)

Vanilla said:


> What do you do with your hammock when you're above the tree line?


Use it to wipe your tears while you are up crying all night


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## Vanilla (Dec 11, 2009)

johnnycake said:


> Use it to wipe your tears while you are up crying all night


Haha! Didn't expect that one. Well done, hater.

I've thought about the hammock route. Never tried it. But I do tend to spend time around the tree line and above it while backpacking. That makes it difficult to hammock.

The memory foam pad seems like a great idea, I'm just not tough enough to pack it around.


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## kodoz (Nov 4, 2016)

Lone_Hunter said:


> I've always wondered about that air convection under a hammock. Seems like you'd just be hanging out in a tree like a quarter strung up to cool.


You are. In a hot/humid climate that's what you want. This Xmas I slept in a hammock in the Dominican Republic out on the beach enjoying the breeze and the stars...after covering up with a little bug spray. I needed a blanket to keep comfortable but the wife and kid were sweltering in their room. I have a down uunderquilt for up here. I've slept in temps right around 30F and been warmer than I've been on a sleeping pad.



Wasatch Wings said:


> I feel like back sleeping in a hammock is better. I just have a hard time staying on by back. Too many years of rolling on my side.
> 
> You sleep on your side or back in the hammock?


Side, in a ball. It took a little getting used to b/c your instinct is to lay on your back in the hammock. That is uncomfortable--butt low and head and feet up--I can't sleep like that either. So you just curl up and sleep in the bottom of that bend. It takes a little tinkering to get the tension in the setup right too. I do manage to rollover sometimes, but don't wake with hip/shoulder discomfort like I do when on a sleeping pad. Snoring is also much reduced, and I can get comfy without a pillow.



Vanilla said:


> What do you do with your hammock when you're above the tree line?


Like truly above treeline in the alpine zone/tundra? Never camped there, but everywhere I've been in the Uintas and WY I've been able to find a couple trees. Sometimes it's a PITA, but you can also set up more places because you don't need level or clear ground. Yes, if you're surrounded by saguaros, out in a sage desert, or a boulder field you're screwed. If I was going someplace I didn't know, I'd plan to sleep on the ground. For car camping in the desert one tree and the roof rack works.

I far prefer the hammock to even the car camping air mattress. It takes more planning and adjustment than a tent & sleeping pad, but I've never slept better in the backcountry. The biggest downside for me is that you end up with about the same weight and more setup than with a tent...underquilt, hanging hardware, tarp and tie-down cord all adds up, even all ultralight gear is about as much weight as a 2.5-man tent and sleeping pad. So I keep all that gear for the family hikes, but whenever I'm solo I'll take the hammock.


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## Lone_Hunter (Oct 25, 2017)

3arabians said:


> Glad I'm not the only one suffering the hip pain issue. I really struggle with that. I'm a side sleeper and at 44 years old I'm wondering how many more years I can handle sleeping on the ground in a backpacking tent for hunting trips.


We are pretty close to the same age. I'm 45, going on 46 in a few months. At our age, I find getting a good nights sleep is important. I want to say crucial, but that might be overstating it. However, to put it another way, I think at our age, taking the time to research and money to buy a good sleep system is worth the effort.

You could start base camping / car camping more and dayhike from it at O'Dark 30. That's what I usually do in summer and fall. Sky's the limit on sleeping arrangements in that scenario. That said, like you, when I do sleep on the ground in the tent, I never get a full nights sleep. I usually wake up and roll around at least 3 times during the night.

I have to tell you, the only time I get a good nights sleep on the ground, is when a thick foam mat is involved. I have one of those Kodiak canvas swag tents that I used last year - slept like a baby. But their heavy, you ain't packing one of those up the mountain.


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## 3arabians (Dec 9, 2014)

Lone_Hunter said:


> We are pretty close to the same age. I'm 45, going on 46 in a few months. At our age, I find getting a good nights sleep is important. I want to say crucial, but that might be overstating it. However, to put it another way, I think at our age, taking the time to research and money to buy a good sleep system is worth the effort.
> 
> You could start base camping / car camping more and dayhike from it at O'Dark 30. That's what I usually do in summer and fall. Sky's the limit on sleeping arrangements in that scenario. That said, like you, when I do sleep on the ground in the tent, I never get a full nights sleep. I usually wake up and roll around at least 3 times during the night.
> 
> I have to tell you, the only time I get a good nights sleep on the ground, is when a thick foam mat is involved. I have one of those Kodiak canvas swag tents that I used last year - slept like a baby. But their heavy, you ain't packing one of those up the mountain.


 I've been kicking around car camping for general bulls this year because last year I slept in the back of my beater SUV on a memory foam pad during the archery hunt and slept like a champ! However, during the rifle season I know I would be putting myself at a disadvantage if I did that. It is critical to my success of tagging a bull during the rifle hunt that I pack in and sleep with the elk so to speak. I'm definitely going to be researching and purchasing a better pad and sleeping system as a whole because I'm not ready to call myself too old for that type of hunting for at least 5 more years.

Greats points also about taking extra time to prep the ground. I don't really do that. I just look for as flat and smooth a place as possible and set the tent. Its usually not at all as flat and smooth as it looked once I'm in my bag and laying down and that is probably half my issue.


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## Lone_Hunter (Oct 25, 2017)

3arabians said:


> I've been kicking around car camping for general bulls this year because last year I slept in the back of my beater SUV on a memory foam pad during the archery hunt and slept like a champ! However, during the rifle season I know I would be putting myself at a disadvantage if I did that. It is critical to my success of tagging a bull during the rifle hunt that I pack in and sleep with the elk so to speak..


Yeah that is a good point. I've all but given up on rifle, but you've got a good point. Last year during deer muzzy, I trailer camped with the family, but it really put a wear on me. Getting up at 3AM, hiking uphill 4 to 6 miles, going down the backside, and back again in the evening wore me out. By day 4 or 5 of the hunt, I lost so much weight, even my wife was noticing when I got back to camp. If I hunt that same area this year - I'm base camping it in a saddle, and going back to the trailer every other day.


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## Critter (Mar 20, 2010)

You learn as you get older that you enjoy your comforts when you go to sleep. In my younger days I had no problem hiking into canyons and sleeping with the elk to make sure that I was there at first daylight without spooking them. But with that came discomfort, but it didn't take that long for me to work it out of my muscles and bones. 

Now I want a nice bed to sleep in where when I wake up I don't have to do 30 minutes of stretching to get my body to where it wants to move. That means at least a 4" piece of padding under me on a level area. I also like to be able to light the burner under the coffee and then snuggle back into my sleeping bag for a few more minutes until it starts to perk which also warms up the camper that I am sleeping in before I get up to get dressed. 

I tried a hammock one time and woke up with more sore muscles than I thought that I had. They are great if you can just sleep on your back but that isn't for me..

I guess that it is just the pits to get old, but with that comes knowledge of how much you like your comforts.


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## Chaser (Sep 28, 2007)

This conversation hits close to home. I'm constantly weighing my options of how well I want to sleep versus how much I'd like to kill an elk or deer. Most of the hunting I've done the last few years has been near our family cabin, so its hard to justify not staying there, where warmth, good food, and a hot shower are the norm. But I haven't been able to see any animals, let alone kill one, so I keep weighing my options to backpack in, or drive up an old logging road and camp out of my truck way up high, or hike in even further and sleep uncomfortably on the ground. 

In preparation for the first backpacking trip in just over a decade, I upgraded some of my gear last year. I've gotten into hammock camping, and spent 3 nights in one on a Boulder Mountain trip last August. While I didn't sleep great, I can say that I NEVER woke up sore. I can't say the same for tent camping. Thing with hammock camping is you need a hammock, straps, a rainfly, top quilt, under quilt, and probably a mosquito net. I'm not sure its any lighter than a tent setup.


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## Vanilla (Dec 11, 2009)

Chaser said:


> Thing with hammock camping is you need a hammock, straps, a rainfly, top quilt, under quilt, and probably a mosquito net. I'm not sure its any lighter than a tent setup.


This has been my observation while doing research on this. When all is added up it doesn't seem to be much of a savings on weight.


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## johnnycake (Jul 19, 2011)

Vanilla said:


> This has been my observation while doing research on this. When all is added up it doesn't seem to be much of a savings on weight.


3 man tent, pad, quilt, and pillow combined put me at 61 oz total. I haven't looked into hammocks as I'm usually in the alpine when I'm packing in, but how much weight are we talking for a typical hammock setup?


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## Lone_Hunter (Oct 25, 2017)

middlefork said:


> I don't think anyone mentioned it but scooping out a divot for your shoulders and hips can help a ton.


That is a great idea, and one I'm going to try If I ever find myself tenting it when the ground isn't frozen. :roll:



Chaser said:


> This conversation hits close to home. I'm constantly weighing my options of how well I want to sleep versus how much I'd like to kill an elk or deer. Most of the hunting I've done the last few years has been near our family cabin, so its hard to justify not staying there, where warmth, good food, and a hot shower are the norm. But I haven't been able to see any animals, let alone kill one, so I keep weighing my options to backpack in, or *drive up an old logging road and camp out of my truck way up high,* or hike in even further and sleep uncomfortably on the ground.


I think the operative word here is mobility. During the summer family camping/scouting season, and fall big game hunts, I find myself sleeping out of either a trailer, or an SUV. In either case, I'm sleeping well. The big difference between a trailer and a cabin, is i can drag that trailer to a different area where I think something might be in.

When the family isn't along, I hunt out of my SUV. I have an 2nd gen 4 runner that I call my high speed bass boat of hunting. The beauty with an older SUV like this is it isn't long, and it isn't wide. So it's smaller then a truck, and a spit larger then a side by side. I can squeeze into some places. With the rear seats down, and a $20 4" foam pad from home depot positioned at an angle in the back, I set up my bed and all I have to worry about then is finding a level place to park. Utah has so many roads, that I don't think there is too many places that are not within a couple miles of where I could park it.

However, there are some places where you can't set up a quick camp from an old logging road. If you try what I normally do from those places, your going to find yourself in a situation where it would have been easier to backpack in and tent camp. No "solution" is 100%. In the end, you have to go where the game are.

--------

All said, I just recently purchased a 3 man 4 season hot tent.

https://luxe-hiking-gear.com/collec...ak-xl-pyramid-hot-tent?variant=27874686795859

Stakes, main tent, inner tent, and pole it weighs 87 ounces in it's winter configuration. For summer i could take out the inner liner and I can cut that weight down to 62 ounces. Wish it would get here already. I feel like a kid waiting for Christmas to get here. At some point I'm going to get a wood stove for it.

I think I can squeeze a cot into this thing without the inner winter liner, which would solve a few issues during spring/ summer/fall, and I might be sleeping as good as critter when car camping when I have a wood stove to stoke. Leave the cot at home, and I could still backpack with it. But at that point, I'm back to thinking about digging divets in the ground, and sleeping on pads.


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## Bax* (Dec 14, 2008)

Something to consider for those side sleepers who are experiencing pain:

Unless we are sleeping on a THICK mattress, we aren’t getting great spinal alignment which not only adds a sore back to the mix but it’s also adding a ton of pressure on your hip. 

I’m surprised that nobody has mentioned digging a “hip hole” under their tents. This small divot will allow your hip to sit a little lower and alleviate the pressure and pain being discussed. 

The hip hole only needs to be about 2-3” deep for most people but can make a world of difference when sleeping on a thinner pad like a Klymit pad. 

Also consider the R-value as the thinner pads can sap the heat out of you if they aren’t insulated. 

Hope this helps someone.


Edit: just realized I missed Midflefork’s suggestion. Looks like he was listening in Scouts too ;-)


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## kodoz (Nov 4, 2016)

johnnycake said:


> 3 man tent, pad, quilt, and pillow combined put me at 61 oz total. I haven't looked into hammocks as I'm usually in the alpine when I'm packing in, but how much weight are we talking for a typical hammock setup?


Right about 5 lbs for the hammock with bug net, straps and carabiners, quilt, and a bivy tarp with guy lines. My 3-man tent with a pad is probably 4.5 lbs. I expected the hammock would save a bit of weight, and maybe it would without the quilt, but to be comfortable the quilt is the way to go.


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## johnnycake (Jul 19, 2011)

kodoz said:


> Right about 5 lbs for the hammock with bug net, straps and carabiners, quilt, and a bivy tarp with guy lines. My 3-man tent with a pad is probably 4.5 lbs. I expected the hammock would save a bit of weight, and maybe it would without the quilt, but to be comfortable the quilt is the way to go.


Yep, that seals it I guess. I'll just stick to my ground set up (much to great financial relief of Mrs. Cake)


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## BearLakeFishGuy (Apr 15, 2013)

Thermarest Basecamp size L. Works better than anything else I've slept on while camping and at 3 lbs its worth packing in too.


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## Sallymilr (Apr 22, 2021)

The best pad for sleeping should be that which doesn't cause any inconveniences during the sleep, and keeps your neck in good position, to avoid neck pain during the next day. I've been using a bad pad for a long time, and I have posture issues and neck pains sometimes. I am working on this problem to fix it, and doing better at the moment. Also, my lovely waifu pillow Waifu Pillow | Anime Body Pillow Cover - Waifu For Laifu keeps me in a good position during the sleep, and now I feel way better in the morning and during the entire day.


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## Bax* (Dec 14, 2008)

Sallymilr said:


> The best pad for sleeping should be that which doesn't cause any inconveniences during the sleep, and keeps your neck in good position, to avoid neck pain during the next day.


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## Lone_Hunter (Oct 25, 2017)

I know this is a necro'ed thread, but looking at the dates, i found it interesting. This is precovid, and covid drove all the people into the mountains, and those of us who would have already been in the mountainst, deeper into the mountains. Well, me at least. Where I ended up hammock camping cause flat spots are few and far between.

I have to say, done *correctly*, hammock camping solved my sleeping issues. I sleep about as well hammock camping as I do car camping.


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