# a student of the rifle



## Mr.CheddarNut (Jan 16, 2013)

Ok fellas, I just want to run what i believe is to be my final decision by you before I go and purchase. Looking for feedback from those far more experinced than I am. 
I have been wanting to build up a tack driving rifle that I can shoot groups with tighter than a gnats @@S stretched over a 55 gallon drum, and keep those groups tight as I increase distance to as far as I can. 
I have decided to go with the Remington 700 SPS Varmint in .308, here is why:

The Rifle: Basiclly value! Right now $520.00 and gets great reveiws.
Caliber: .308 Because my boys and wife will be able to shoot it much easier than a 300 win mag or the like. Also I hear tons of load data etc. for .308 vs 243, 22-250 etc.
Optic: Will likely be a SWFA SS 10x42, again due to value and overall cost.
 A new caliber to my arsenal so I will need to aquire dies, brass, powder, projectiles and the like. Plus I would like to leave as much coin in my wallet for trips to the range so I can actually practice and use this new rifle.
Questions? Comments? Emotional outbursts? All welcome.

Cheddar


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## Bo0YaA (Sep 29, 2008)

Just curious why you decided on a .308 over say a 7mm-08 or even .260. Both rounds are superior to the .308. Don't get my wrong, the .308 is a great round and is what my daughter has hunted with since she was 11 but if I had to do it all over again, I would buy her one of the other two calibers mentioned.


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## LostLouisianian (Oct 11, 2010)

The amount of reloading supplies (brass, powder etc) for a .308 is incredible. It's probably one of the most reloaded calibers there is. Is it superior to other calibers, probably not. However I have video's of my neighbor with his .308 in the west desert blowing up milk jugs at 650 yards on every shot. He says he now has it dialed in for 1,000 yards. It is highly used by the US military as a mid range sniper rifle too. I wouldn't hesitate to use it out to 600 yards with extensive practice of course. I have an old military rifle that shoots .308 and have been offered quite a bit for it and won't even think about selling it unless someone offers me an obscene amount of $$$ for it. It isn't as "flat" shooting as some rifles but it does carry a decent punch to it and you can load quite a lot of different weight bullets for it to cover pretty much all your big game hunting needs in North America.


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## Mr.CheddarNut (Jan 16, 2013)

Basically to the availability of reloading supplies. There is always projectiles and brass for .30cal. Even in our fear induced shortages. The other is the caliber offerings in rifles within my budget that fit my criteria.


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## Bo0YaA (Sep 29, 2008)

LostLouisianian said:


> The amount of reloading supplies (brass, powder etc) for a .308 is incredible. It's probably one of the most reloaded calibers there is. Is it superior to other calibers, probably not. However I have video's of my neighbor with his .308 in the west desert blowing up milk jugs at 650 yards on every shot. He says he now has it dialed in for 1,000 yards. It is highly used by the US military as a mid range sniper rifle too. I wouldn't hesitate to use it out to 600 yards with extensive practice of course. I have an old military rifle that shoots .308 and have been offered quite a bit for it and won't even think about selling it unless someone offers me an obscene amount of $$$ for it. It isn't as "flat" shooting as some rifles but it does carry a decent punch to it and you can load quite a lot of different weight bullets for it to cover pretty much all your big game hunting needs in North America.


As I said, the .308 is a great caliber but there is a big difference between a sniper and a hunter.


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## waspocrew (Nov 26, 2011)

A 308 is a great round to start with - and reloading for it is a breeze. 

It's tough to beat the price tag of the SPS varmint - I didn't realize they were that low right now. The few downsides I see with that rifle are: 
- not a very solid stock (You'll want to replace it if you want to really see the accuracy you are wanting)
- not the best trigger (a Timney would be awesome)
- 26 inch heavy barrel makes it a pretty heavy rig

A few years back, I bought the SPS tactical in .308 and left it completely stock. It was an extremely accurate rifle - If you can locate one of those (which Huge29 showed a link a week or so ago), I'd go that route. You get a slightly better stock (not tons better, but I liked the Hogue) and a shorter barrel (20 inch is pretty handy). I sold it so I could fund a lighter hunting rifle - I still wish I would have kept it. 

I definitely understand staying within a budget and think the Varmint will suit you well, but I'd seriously look into upgrading the stock to at least a Bell and Carlson medalist.

There are always "better rifles" and "better calibers", but honestly a .308 is a great place to start. 

I say buy it and get busy having fun with it :grin:


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## LostLouisianian (Oct 11, 2010)

Bo0YaA said:


> As I said, the .308 is a great caliber but there is a big difference between a sniper and a hunter.


Yep sure is. I actually know an ex-sniper who doesn't even own a firearm anymore. I also know several who are hunters now. That's why I added to my comment on the range, with extensive practice. While my neighbor is a great shot with his, I still doubt he is capable of matching even a mediocre sniper, if there is such a thing. Even though I am capable of taking a 600 yard shot, I really get the "willies" about taking any shot longer than 300 yards. I prefer to get as close up and personal as possible. I would much rather take a 50-100 yard shot and feel really good about a humane kill than take a 300-600 yard shot and be a little concerned. I've seen plenty of 500+ yard shots that brought down the game right where they stood but I just am at the stage in life where I don't want to shoot a .300 WinMag or a .338 or some other mule kicker. I sold my .300 WinMag about 3 years ago and have never regretted it for one second. I do have first dibs on my oldest brothers pre '64 Winchester .270 on a custom stock. That baby is a tack driver with not a lot of recoil. I have tried to buy it off of him since he doesn't hunt anymore but he knows the value of it and isn't willing to part with it for less than it's worth so I'll just wait for him to kick the bucket.


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## Bo0YaA (Sep 29, 2008)

I didn't mean to downplay the ability of a LR hunter. In my mind it can be as difficult if not more so to put down an animal with one shot humanly at range. Lets face it, humans are soft and squishy and go down pretty easily. Not taking anything away from our armed forces snipers but if they simply hit their target for the most part that target is neutralized. Simply hitting a big mulie or elk at 500+ yards wont get it done. I'm with ya on the 300 wm, Ive got one that has always been my go to gun but the older I get the less enjoyment I get from shooting it. Ive gotten into the 6.5 stuff for just that reason. I do like the larger holes the 30 cal makes and I own a 30-30, 308, 30-06 & 300wm but when I look at the recoil generated and BC of the bullets selection its easy to be turned onto a smaller, flatter shooting, less recoiling caliber like the 6mm, .257, 6.5 or even .284. Ive loved my daughters .308, its been a absolute fantastic gun but to do it over, I would buy a 7mm-08. Less recoil, reloading components are very plentiful and flatter shooter. I'm sure you will love your .308 as we do ours. I'm just giving ya a little feedback is all.


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## Mr.CheddarNut (Jan 16, 2013)

Love the feedback. That is what it is all about. I think the 6.5 are sexy as can be. As a matter of fact Id likely get a 260 rem or 6.5 something or other if they had it in a heavy barrel rifle that is easy to work with and gets great reveiws for $500. I dont know of any


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## Bo0YaA (Sep 29, 2008)

I dont know of any heavy barreld guns, but a deal out there that is pretty amazing right now is the Savage 111 (6.5x284) or 11 (.260 Rem, 6.5 creed) Trophy Hunter package deal you can get from Buds for $450.00 delivered, mounted with a 3x9 Nikon BDC. Savage currently has a $75.00 mail in rebate on those guns bringing the total down to $375.00. Now take that 3x9 Nikon and list it on Ebay and it will bring at min $110.00 or more. Now you have a brand new rifle for $265.00 or less. Tough to beat if you don't mind going through the effort. Offer good on any 111 or 11 not just the 6.5 stuff lol


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## Rspeters (Apr 4, 2013)

I did something similar to that last year. Found a lefty 7mm Rem mag Savage 111 marked down quite a bit, sold the scope for $125 and was only in the gun a total of about $250.


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## Mr.CheddarNut (Jan 16, 2013)

Bo0YaA said:


> I dont know of any heavy barreld guns, but a deal out there that is pretty amazing right now is the Savage 111 (6.5x284) or 11 (.260 Rem, 6.5 creed) Trophy Hunter package deal you can get from Buds for $450.00 delivered, mounted with a 3x9 Nikon BDC. Savage currently has a $75.00 mail in rebate on those guns bringing the total down to $375.00. Now take that 3x9 Nikon and list it on Ebay and it will bring at min $110.00 or more. Now you have a brand new rifle for $265.00 or less. Tough to beat if you don't mind going through the effort. Offer good on any 111 or 11 not just the 6.5 stuff lol


Holy Crap Batman! That is a good deal


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## Cooky (Apr 25, 2011)

Mr.CheddarNut said:


> Ok fellas, I just want to run what i believe is to be my final decision by you before I go and purchase. Looking for feedback from those far more experinced than I am.
> I have been wanting to build up a tack driving rifle that I can shoot groups with tighter than a gnats @@S stretched over a 55 gallon drum, and keep those groups tight as I increase distance to as far as I can.
> I have decided to go with the Remington 700 SPS Varmint in .308, here is why:
> 
> ...


 After you hear from all us "experts" do exactly that.


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## Mr.CheddarNut (Jan 16, 2013)

Cooky said:


> After you hear from all us "experts" do exactly that.


Do what my current decision is? I am a bit confused Cooky?


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## Cooky (Apr 25, 2011)

Mr.CheddarNut said:


> Do what my current decision is? I am a bit confused Cooky?


Yes, it sounds well thought out. Nothing too pricey but all of known good performance. I see a lot of those SWFA scopes on the line at competitive shoots.
Be sure to try TAC powder during your load testing, my rifle likes it.


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## Mr.CheddarNut (Jan 16, 2013)

Be sure to try TAC powder during your load testing said:


> I will do that. and when all else fails, play dead!


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## Huge29 (Sep 17, 2007)

I think out of the box the Savage has been much more accurate than the Rem in comparable models. I just bought an SPS tactical just for the action that I will be picking up on Thursday, the barrel and stock are now officially for sale, HS stock and 20" heavy barrel; in case you are looking. Nice thing is with the 700 is you can build it into something else later if you choose. There are so many great cartridges. My build is a 6.5 just to having what I think is the best of both worlds with highest BC of bullets along with pretty good velocity. Let us know what you decide.


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## Mr.CheddarNut (Jan 16, 2013)

So I like the idea of a longer heavy barrel to lesson recoil. I am quite sure I can handle the recoil of the .308 and then some, but less is always better in that rhelm. Plus it would just make it that much easier for the boys and wife to enjoy. I also have heard that longer barrel=more burn time for powder? May not be neccesary with todays powders (or so I hear) but all i know is I have two round ball 1/60 inch twist muzzle loaders. one has a 6 inch longer barrel than the other and it is an extremely accurate rifle. Far more consistant and accurate than the other.

Cheddar


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## Springville Shooter (Oct 15, 2010)

Savage seems to be lagging behind Remington. Recently I've notice their prices going up and their quality going down. Just like what Remington did ten years ago. I have rifles built on both and I can't knock the Savage however I still prefer the 700 platform. On the top end of the spectrum Remington compares quite nicely. On the lower end, Savage has the Edge.........get it?:mrgreen:------SS


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## Mr.CheddarNut (Jan 16, 2013)

Well it has been done! I bought the Remington 700 SPS Varmint today! So excited, two fold. One I don't have the stress of pondering what rifle to get anymore. Weighing the pros and cons of every option against the other. Two, I get to move on to a scope and accessories. 8)

Cheddar


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## waspocrew (Nov 26, 2011)

Mr.CheddarNut said:


> Well it has been done! I bought the Remington 700 SPS Varmint today! So excited, two fold. One I don't have the stress of pondering what rifle to get anymore. Weighing the pros and cons of every option against the other. Two, I get to move on to a scope and accessories. 8)
> 
> Cheddar


Nice! Get out and enjoy it!


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