# September 22nd Archery Committee Meeeting



## MEEN (Jan 27, 2009)

Summary of the Utah Archery Committee Meeting

Date: September 22, 2009
Time: 6:00 PM
Location: Utah Division of Wildlife Resources Salt Lake Office 1594 W. North Temple

The purpose of this meeting was to discuss issues of concern that pertain to statewide archery and try to come up with ideas to resolve these issues.

Attendance: Anis Aoude (DWR), Kent Hersey (DWR), Roy Hampton (UBA), Ben Lowder (UBA), Michael Anderson (BOU), Tye Boulter (BOU), Brian Johnson (Southern Region), Russell Peterson (Southern Region), Bill Fenimore (Wildlife Board)

Discussion Items

Archers going to the Southern Region:

Reviewed data provided by DWR on the amount of public land in deer habitat per archer by region and data on residency of archery hunters compared to the region archers choose to hunt. After reviewing the data, the committee agreed that crowding in the Southern Region occurs due to all recreationists using the Forest in August (e.g., families camping, last weekend before school starts, ATV riders, etc.) Additionally, all committee members felt that crowding was not an issue if you got off of a road. The point was made that crowding occurs in “hotspots” in every region. 

Both Southern Region representatives indicated they spoke with numerous hunters who indicated this was only an issue on the opening weekend. Both reps indicated that they would rather see archers come to the Southern Region on the opening weekend and then go home rather than using a quota system which would force archers to hunt the same region for the entire season.

Conclusion: DWR will recommend returning to statewide archery for the entire season in 2010. This recommendation will be made at the November RACs and the December 3, 2009 Wildlife Board Meeting. 

Archery Seasons for General Season Elk and Deer and Limited Entry Elk

Some concern was raised that deer and elk seasons starting on the same date may cause some crowding (real or perceived) issues. Also, concerns regarding LE Elk hunters overlapping with spike hunters and not getting to hunt the rut were raised. DWR reviewed a potential new hunt structure with the committee. The committee agreed that this structure could resolve the issues by starting general season archery on a calendar day (thus avoiding opening on a Saturday every 7 years) and improve LE elk archery hunting by moving it into the rut. This new hunt structure will be taken around as an informational item to the November RACs and the December 3, 2009 Wildlife Board Meeting.

Conclusion: Due to the timing of setting hunt seasons, the DWR’s new hunt structure could not be implemented until 2011. As such, DWR will recommend status quo for season dates for 2010, and after getting public comment on the new hunt structure, will look at recommending the new hunt structure for 2011. 

UBA proposal to give youth unlimited archery tags

UBA raised concern that 1200 youth hunters did not draw a deer permit in the 2008 drawing. To solve this problem, UBA recommending giving unlimited archery tags. The committee discussed the issue and determined that if we gave all youth (12-18) unlimited tags, it could substantially increase the number of people going to the Southern Region in August and cause more crowding issues. The committee decided that the 12-15 year old group could be given unlimited tags without causing further crowding issues, but also recruiting youth hunters. 

Conclusion: DWR will recommend that once all 16,000 archery tags sell out, all youth 12- 15 years old will be able to purchase an archery tag. This will be a completely separate recommendation from statewide archery. 

Future Meetings: The committee felt that the issue has been resolved and at this time, there is no need for any further meetings.


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## jahan (Sep 7, 2007)

I like that they finally realized that the overcrowding wasn't caused by hunters. Hopefully the wildlife board uses common sense and goes back to statewide for the whole season.


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## middlefork (Nov 2, 2008)

Thanks for the update. And thanks to everyone who participated.


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## blazingsaddle (Mar 11, 2008)

My fingers are crossed! But I have my doubts in the WB.


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## Bowdacious (Sep 16, 2007)

blazingsaddle said:


> My fingers are crossed! But I have my doubts in the WB.


It is the DWR we are talking about, of course you have your doubts. You'd be an idiot not to. However, I hope they finally do something right.


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## BugleB (Sep 24, 2008)

I like the idea of going back to statewide. We hunted southern this year, but would have prefered to hunt farther north after the opening week. 

If they don't go back to statewide next year, I'm hanging up my bow after 44 years of archery hunting and going rifle hunting. With two points, I should be able to draw any region. I bought a new 7mm this year and it needs to see some deer action.


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## Yahtahay (Jul 3, 2008)

How about all archery hunts during the rut?! Archery hunts ending just as the rut gets started is a joke. Rifle hunters are cleaning up on post-rutting elk and rutting elk. Seems to me if you want to keep the elk numbers up let the archery hunters target them as we are the least successful. No brainer if you ask me!


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## Treehugnhuntr (Sep 7, 2007)

Keep an eye out, that's on the menu as well.


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## wyoming2utah (Sep 12, 2007)

what other season date changes are being looked at?


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## ktowncamo (Aug 27, 2008)

+1


Yahtahay said:


> How about all archery hunts during the rut?! Archery hunts ending just as the rut gets started is a joke. Rifle hunters are cleaning up on post-rutting elk and rutting elk. Seems to me if you want to keep the elk numbers up let the archery hunters target them as we are the least successful. No brainer if you ask me!


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## wyoming2utah (Sep 12, 2007)

Yahtahay said:


> Seems to me if you want to keep the elk numbers up let the archery hunters target them as we are the least successful. No brainer if you ask me!


just a point of clarification, they don't want to keep the numbers of bull elk up...they are trying to get more harvested.


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## Treehugnhuntr (Sep 7, 2007)

wyoming2utah said:


> what other season date changes are being looked at?


The DWR is recommending revised elk dates for 2011, LE and general season. We actually talked about it quite a bit at the meeting and it seemed that everyone liked what was being proposed. It will be on the table for November RAC meetings.


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## Flyfishn247 (Oct 2, 2007)

A BIG thanks to Tree and all others who have worked to resolve this issue. If only more people would use common sense, these issues wouldn't come up in the first place. Now let's hope the pinheads on the WB get the point and make the appropriate changes.

On a side note, any heard from PRO. Haven't seen him post in a while. I hope everything is OK with his wife.


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## swbuckmaster (Sep 14, 2007)

wyoming2utah said:


> Yahtahay said:
> 
> 
> > Seems to me if you want to keep the elk numbers up let the archery hunters target them as we are the least successful. No brainer if you ask me!
> ...


No they are not trying to get more harvested they are trying to move more people through the bonus point butt plug without killing the cream off the top.


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## wyoming2utah (Sep 12, 2007)

Treehugnhuntr said:


> wyoming2utah said:
> 
> 
> > what other season date changes are being looked at?
> ...


What about the deer hunt? I am hearing that they are going to recommend some big changes to the deer hunt dates as well...


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## wyoming2utah (Sep 12, 2007)

swbuckmaster said:


> No they are not trying to get more harvested they are trying to move more people through the bonus point butt plug without killing the cream off the top.


sorry, but that's bs....the DWR doesn't care a bit about the size of the elk or how many people are applying for LE elk tags. The DWR's big worry is the bull/cow ratios and the harvest age objectives which are too high. The DWR pushed for the spike elk hunts to help lower bull/cow ratios and harvest age objectives...because dumb hunters refused to allow the DWR to simply issue more big bull tags.


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## goofy elk (Dec 16, 2007)

Here's the 2011 proposed dates.

http://s256.photobucket.com/albums/hh17 ... cture2.png

You can click on the "zoom in" and bring it up to 146% to read it.


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## wyoming2utah (Sep 12, 2007)

goofy, I can't look at photobucket because it is blocked on my server....is there any other way you can show me those dates?


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## jahan (Sep 7, 2007)

This is the best I could make quickly, it is a little blurry. Maybe someone else could get a better one.


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## Treehugnhuntr (Sep 7, 2007)

Here it is, as far as elk goes.

*2011-*

LE archery Elk- Sept 5th-17th

LE muzz elk- Sept 20th- Oct. 2nd.

LE early rifle- Sept 24th- Oct. 2nd

LE late rifle elk- Nov. 1-8

GS archery deer/Elk- Aug. 20th- Sept. 13th.

GS rifle deer/elk early- Oct 3rd-11th

GS muzz deer/elk-Oct. 12th-20th

GS muzz any bull late- Nov. 1-8


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## Treehugnhuntr (Sep 7, 2007)

http://bowhuntersofutah.net/index.php/f ... posal.html

Just click on the link in the thread.


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## havnfun (Dec 3, 2007)

Treehugnhuntr said:


> Here it is, as far as elk goes.
> 
> *2011-*
> 
> ...


Is the thought to combine the elk and deer GS for all three weapons?


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## swbuckmaster (Sep 14, 2007)

wyoming2utah said:


> swbuckmaster said:
> 
> 
> > No they are not trying to get more harvested they are trying to move more people through the bonus point butt plug without killing the cream off the top.
> ...


wrong again :mrgreen: 
the division wants to keep the elk numbers under or at objective. The spike tags were imposed to still kill bulls which supposedly need to be killed and still protect the cream or older age bulls. you simply cannot release more rifle tags especially during the rut with a 98% success or the largest bulls will all be wiped out. So the division still wants quality.

but a fool should be able to see that the spike tags are not the way to go either. you cannot kill form both ends and expect the bonus point butt plug to go away.

What Anise is proposing is a laxative for the bonus point butt plug. I just wish they would table the lame spike hunts and learn from Arizona. Arizona elk are like Colorado's deer. they have killed two to three times as many B&C elk in Arizona as Utah and everybody thinks Utah is so good. Well Utah could be twice as good as Arizona cause we have twice as many elk. :mrgreen:


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## Treehugnhuntr (Sep 7, 2007)

I made a mistake with the BOU link. Those are the old dates that they were looking at. My apologies.

The actual recommended dates for general deer are(Which may be similar or the same, I didn't look):

Oct. 4-12, Early rifle.

Oct. 13-21, Muzzy. 

Oct. 22-30, Rifle.


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## utfireman (Sep 7, 2007)

Is there any talk of having the muzzy hunt the last deer hunt? If we get a bad storm the end of Oct. A rifle hunt going to almost November put's a hurt on the mature deer killed that year, for example 2004.


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## Packout (Nov 20, 2007)

Exactly right, Utfireman---


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## swbuckmaster (Sep 14, 2007)

i always thought that the last rifle hunt was going to be on the same day as it is right now. No change except for the added first season. Am i wrong? 

i haven't purchased a rifle tag since the creation of the extended area. I Have taken my kids out with other kids who have tags so I'm not up on the rifle dates.

i would like to see 5,000 to 10,000 rifle tags cut and added to the muzzy hunt. This would restrict the long range weapons more and only allow one shot instead of the boom boom boom boom boom I hear every opening morning of the rifle hunt. :shock:


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## for fun (Sep 13, 2007)

I like the changes..They look great.


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