# Doe taken on private land by Representative



## PBH (Nov 7, 2007)

Something interesting to watch unfold...









Southern Utah state representative accused of shooting doe on private property


ST. GEORGE — Residents of a rural community in Washington County have accused a Southern Utah state representative of shooting a doe as it was walking through the yard of a private residence and then being deceptive about the incident. The residents, who live near New Harmony in the Blackridge...




www.stgeorgeutah.com


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## Critter (Mar 20, 2010)

The bad thing about it is that now that the story is out and all the fanfare about his name and such the rest of the story will be buried or forgotten. There may be a bit here and there but it may never get out just what happens.


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## legacy (Sep 30, 2007)

IDK, maybe he could sell that $80k Yukon? That'd buy few meals. Sounds like a messed up situation. Maybe the guy is indeed desperate (maybe physically AND mentally) and I wish him the best because I don't know his situation. Hopefully the legal side of things takes its course and then he gets the help he needs.


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## Fowlmouth (Oct 4, 2008)

He will get cited with "discharging a weapon within city limits" at the most.


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## backcountry (May 19, 2016)

So many issues.

I hope St George News stays on it.


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## Vanilla (Dec 11, 2009)

Nobody is above the law. If he broke the law, he needs to be held accountable. And with his "special position of trust," he should be held to a higher standard.


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## 2full (Apr 8, 2010)

With all the programs the government has out there giving away money and food, I'm sure if he was that badly off there was better ways to feed the family. 
The Yukon is kind of a dead giveaway to his story is the problem for him .


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## PBH (Nov 7, 2007)

Fowlmouth said:


> He will get cited with "discharging a weapon within city limits" at the most.



I don't really know how the depredation tags work, so forgive my ignorance -- Seegmiller presented two depredation tags. He said the second depredation tag was for his neighbor who “was too sick to hunt today” and that he was new to hunting and “didn’t know all of the rules.” 

So, are depredation tags granted by name? Are you allowed multiple depredation tags? Multiple harvest? 

I don't know all of the rules either -- but I would try to find them out if I were the person with the tag(s).


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## Vanilla (Dec 11, 2009)

PBH said:


> I don't know all of the rules either -- but I would try to find them out if I were the person with the tag(s).


As any tag holder is required to know the rules and follow them, I think that is a good idea!


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## bowgy (Oct 10, 2007)

Sounds like he may learn the rules the hard way.


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## Catherder (Aug 2, 2008)

Is Tom Hatch still around to give the dude some legal advice?


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## Daisy (Jan 4, 2010)

Catherder said:


> Is Tom Hatch still around to give the dude some legal advice?


I will raise your Tom Hatch reference by a Dixie Leavitt reference.


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## MooseMeat (Dec 27, 2017)

PBH said:


> I don't really know how the depredation tags work, so forgive my ignorance -- Seegmiller presented two depredation tags. He said the second depredation tag was for his neighbor who “was too sick to hunt today” and that he was new to hunting and “didn’t know all of the rules.”
> 
> So, are depredation tags granted by name? Are you allowed multiple depredation tags? Multiple harvest?
> 
> I don't know all of the rules either -- but I would try to find them out if I were the person with the tag(s).


Depredation tags are like normal tags, only those whose names are printed on them can fill them. However, sometimes multiple animals may be killed on a single tag. The letter of authorization given with the depredation tags will state the specifics of what can be done during the hunt and where the hunt takes place. If the dude was trying to fill a tag for his neighbor, that’s illegal. No way out around that one.


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## ns450f (Aug 28, 2018)

Fowlmouth said:


> He will get cited with "discharging a weapon within city limits" at the most.


I may be wrong but I think the area he was in is actually not in city limits.

It will be interesting to see this unfold. I have a feeling we are only getting one side of a lopsided story so far.


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## backcountry (May 19, 2016)

No shooting within 600 feet of a building still applies either way, correct?



> *Effective 5/14/2019
> 76-10-508. Discharge of firearm from a vehicle, near a highway, or in direction of specified items -- Penalties.*
> 
> (1)
> ...





https://le.utah.gov/xcode/Title76/Chapter10/76-10-S508.html


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## CHIEF_10_BEERS (Mar 24, 2021)

All of the Depredation/Mitigation tags I have ever had where really specific about what properties the tag was good for. All of the property boundaries and the specifics of the hunt where laid out on the voucher the Landowner gave me. I then had to take the voucher to the DWR region office and pay for the tag. They again went over the specifics of the "hunt" when I received the actual tag. I've had 10 or so Mitigation tags myself and this has always been the case albeit they've always been for the same Landowner.


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## MooseMeat (Dec 27, 2017)

backcountry said:


> No shooting within 600 feet of a building still applies either way, correct?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Unless you have permission from the building owner


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## backcountry (May 19, 2016)

The reporting states Dr Reber denied such permission. The other neighbors are less obvious from the reporting but it seems like "Sean" probably didn't provide permission. The layout of many "residential neighborhoods" make it difficult to discharge a firearm in accordance with the cited law.



> When confronted about going onto private property to retrieve the carcass, Sean said Seegmiller told him he obtained permission from the property owner beforehand.
> 
> The property where the doe died is owned by Dr. Kelly Reber.....
> 
> Reber said he had never met the man before and told him that he could not shoot any deer in his yard. Seegmiller then allegedly told Reber he had actually shot the deer in the yard across the street, but the animal ran into Reber’s yard and he was just retrieving it from the property. Reber said the area where the deer was shot is clearly marked with several “no hunting” signs.


Suppose time will tell if the reporting tells the full story or the accused's perspective is vastly different. The article does state "the property where the doe died" which leaves room for the claim that where it was shot was a different property. Everyone deserves due process and I guess all we can hope for is that justice is done for all the stakeholder's sake.


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## MooseMeat (Dec 27, 2017)

backcountry said:


> The layout of many "residential neighborhoods" make it difficult to discharge a firearm in accordance with the cited law.


It doesn’t mean it’s impossible. There are several hunts that have hunt boundaries that are within the town or city limits.

Assuming the firearm was discharged in a safe direction and the handler was responsible, I honestly don’t see what the big issue is. I have RARELY encountered home owners or land owners that enjoyed the deer living in their space IF they didn’t benefit from them being hunted, like selling land owner tags for example, or in some other way. People like to see deer, turkeys, moose or elk every once in awhile around their house, but they don’t want to deal with them on a daily basis. Obviously there’s a deer problem in town if depredation tags are being issued. It’s one less doe that could potentially be involved in a collision with a car, that could possibly result in a human fatality or injury. It’s one less doe to be wounded by a vehicle that will suffer long term from the incident. It wasn’t a trophy sized buck killed only for its antlers. It’s one less doe to eat Mrs. Smiths garden. It’s one less doe the DWR has to put their resources in to, to deal with the complaints. And if the guy was/is hurting to feed his family, then I have even less problems with it. Yeah the SUV would imply times aren’t that hard for him, but that’s not our decision or judgement to make. The party hunting thing I do have a problem with, but again, it doesn’t sound like he did fill his neighbors tag, so really nothing to do with that… other than the intent was there. But that’s a whole separate discussion


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## 2full (Apr 8, 2010)

The landowner clearly said that he had not given permission. That is a big issue.
And, I agree on the party hunting. He can't shoot his buddies doe.


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## backcountry (May 19, 2016)

Definitely not impossible but given the reporting it's fair to be skeptical on my part.

And he's a public figure. It's fair game to be skeptical of him driving up an upscale SUV while squaring the claim about needing the deer meat due to unemployment. I believe this is his employment record filed with the state. Was he laid off from Dixie despite being tenure tracked? Does Night Sky Law no longer exist?









Rep. Seegmiller, Travis M. - Utah House of Representatives


Utah House Member Bio and Profile information. View Committees and Conflict of Interest forms as well as contact info for each member of the House.




house.utah.gov





His personal account will truly matter. If we assume he's innocent then we can hope to hear what the boundaries/limits of his depredation tags were and an explanation of his encounters with the local residents. That could help quell my skepticism. But the recorded statements so far don't paint a pretty picture. Hence the skepticism.


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## PBH (Nov 7, 2007)

From KUTV:

Seegmiller’s latest conflict of interest form listed his current employer as “Self.” He reported his specific employment as a management strategy and leadership consultant, entrepreneur, and attorney. He also listed a role as a “Member-Manager” in The Copper Cabin, LLC, which was registered in July 2020 and just renewed in June. A search of the company showed it’s involved in “activities related to real estate.”

Seegmiller previously taught at Dixie State University.


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## backcountry (May 19, 2016)

Rep. Travis Seegmiller's employment record only goes to 2020 on the transparent Utah site but he made (salary + benefits) $109k+ at Dixie that year AND $31k+ as a state representative. And that doesn't include the income from the aforementioned law firm.

Edit: Looks like he no longer works at Dixie according to KSL, though it's still listed on his Rep. Site.


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## MooseMeat (Dec 27, 2017)

2full said:


> The landowner clearly said that he had not given permission. That is a big issue.
> And, I agree on the party hunting. He can't shoot his buddies doe.


A lot of that can depend on if his property was properly posted though. Sure he can say he didn’t give permission, and that’s what the news will report on. And yes there may he been a few no trespassing signs, but it if was properly posted according to the states definition, he may not have had permission, but he may also might not be guilty of trespassing. Sounds like he was contacted by the land owner after the fact. That might not count in favor of the land owner or state, in court.


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## provider (Jan 17, 2011)

That area is basically a 5-ac residential lot area. It is not in city limits. You can get 200 yds away from buildings - barely. Sounds like he didn't. Not a good place to go if you don't know anyone there. It's low density residential and there is no lack of people and stay at home retirees.. There is an ex California law enforcement guy that lives there and hates hunters. Sounds like they met. I don't know how you get a depredation tag in an area where you don't have land. There is a 2-doe hunt archery/muzz/shotgun hunt there, but almost all of it is on private.


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## Catherder (Aug 2, 2008)

FWIW, the landowner was interviewed by news outlets and did not give permission for him to hunt there and the land is posted. Not a good look for the distinguished Rep. 









Utah lawmaker under investigation for allegedly shooting doe in residential area


A southern Utah lawmaker is being investigated for an incident allegedly involving shooting a deer in a residential area. Rep. Travis Seegmiller (R-St. George), who has served in the Utah House of Representatives since 2018, is accused of shooting a doe August 13 as it walked through a...




kutv.com


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## MooseMeat (Dec 27, 2017)

Catherder said:


> FWIW, the landowner was interviewed by news outlets and did not give permission for him to hunt there and the land is posted. Not a good look for the distinguished Rep.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Is it posted PROPERLY though…. That’s the catch.

and if it was shot in the front yard and that isn’t posted, technically he’s not trespassing then either


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## Catherder (Aug 2, 2008)

MooseMeat said:


> Is it posted PROPERLY though…. That’s the catch.
> 
> and if it was shot in the front yard and that isn’t posted, technically he’s not trespassing then either


The footage may not have shown every inch of the property, but what they did show looked pretty convincingly posted. I suppose those "to the millimeter" rulings on proper posting will come out in court.


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## Vanilla (Dec 11, 2009)

Trespassing on private property, in city limits no less, to kill an animal is not understandable. Under any circumstances.

And not all land has to be posted at all to give notice of private property status. Sharpen up on those trespassing laws, Moose!


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## ns450f (Aug 28, 2018)

Was it in city limits?


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## Vanilla (Dec 11, 2009)

ns450f said:


> Was it in city limits?


I assumed so based upon the reporting, but that may not be the case. Doesn’t change the trespassing or discharging a firearm within 600 feet of a structure provisions either way.


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## MooseMeat (Dec 27, 2017)

Vanilla said:


> Trespassing on private property, in city limits no less, to kill an animal is not understandable. Under any circumstances.
> 
> And not all land has to be posted at all to give notice of private property status. Sharpen up on those trespassing laws, Moose!


You are correct! I’m well aware of the laws. I was playing the devils advocate is all.


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## PBH (Nov 7, 2007)

This didn't happen in "city limits", as pointed out by Provider. It is a rural county area. It has some BLM land that it borders -- in fact, the Reber land is bordered by BLM. But, as the reporting notes: this is a neighborhood.

Ironically, my aunt and uncle own the lot directly across the street from the Rebers.


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## backcountry (May 19, 2016)

What is the chance we ever find out about the full situation and resolution? Do we think Seegmiller will actually make a full public statement about the limits/boundaries of his depredation tags and actions? Will the DWR seek the full weight of potential prosecution IF they discover the deer was taken illegally? Would they do the same if it wasn't a high profile politician (ran unopposed = potential political fallout, well known player in the culture war over the Dixie name change, etc)?


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## Critter (Mar 20, 2010)

It may never even get to court. 

The DWR may just issue a ticket and he'll pay it.


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## ns450f (Aug 28, 2018)

I have shot turkeys and doves in basically the same area lol. There are always people hunting this area.

But there are also a bunch of California 💩 dicks that live in new harmony now and I had a lady yell at me for hunting doves two years ago at this location. I was highly confident that I was legal so I told Karen to call the sheriff or DNR. She said she would but nobody ever showed up.

This is why I have only hunt doe in Enterprise.....


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## Vanilla (Dec 11, 2009)

MooseMeat said:


> You are correct! I’m well aware of the laws. I was playing the devils advocate is all.


If well aware, why purposefully misstate the law? That doesn’t make a ton of sense, even to play devil’s advocate.

It will be interesting to see this play out. I’ll reiterate, if he trespassed to kill an animal, I hope they hammer him. Then you’ll see him or one of his buddies run a bill to change the trespass laws in the next legislative session!


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## backcountry (May 19, 2016)

That was my next question: will Seegmiller recuse himself from any legislation regarding the DWR in the future? Hence the political fallout potential IF the law was broken AND they decide to prosecute.

It's a tenuous path for the DWR either way.


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## Catherder (Aug 2, 2008)

Well, if Seegmiller's political career gets derailed by this, he can always get a gig on the Wildlife Board in a couple of years. 

There is precedent for that.


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## MooseMeat (Dec 27, 2017)

Vanilla said:


> If well aware, why purposefully misstate the law? That doesn’t make a ton of sense, even to play devil’s advocate.
> 
> It will be interesting to see this play out. I’ll reiterate, if he trespassed to kill an animal, I hope they hammer him. Then you’ll see him or one of his buddies run a bill to change the trespass laws in the next legislative session!


I don’t think I misstated the law… “properly posted” can fall under the other requirements the land can also meet to be off limits to trespassing without needing to be obviously posted with a ‘no trespassing’ sign


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## Vanilla (Dec 11, 2009)

MooseMeat said:


> I don’t think I misstated the law… “properly posted” can fall under the other requirements the land can also meet to be off limits to trespassing without needing to be obviously posted with a ‘no trespassing’ sign


There is an “or” in the statute. That has meaning. That is all for now.


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## Vanilla (Dec 11, 2009)

backcountry said:


> That was my next question: will Seegmiller recuse himself from any legislation regarding the DWR in the future? Hence the political fallout potential IF the law was broken AND they decide to prosecute.
> 
> It's a tenuous path for the DWR either way.


A lawmaker recusing himself….ha!

That will never happen. (Even if it should)


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## MooseMeat (Dec 27, 2017)

Vanilla said:


> There is an “or” in the statute. That has meaning. That is all for now.


You are correct, my bad. I assumed it was implied. We both know what assuming gets


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## 2full (Apr 8, 2010)

The property looks PLENTY cultivated to me.....
Which makes it properly posted to begin with. 
Lawn, barn, white picket fence, etc......

Anyone that hunts should be able to figure that out. Somewhere along the line at least some common sense should kick in.


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## Irish Lad (Jun 3, 2008)

ns450f said:


> I have shot turkeys and doves in basically the same area lol. There are always people hunting this area.
> 
> But there are also a bunch of California 💩 dicks that live in new harmony now and I had a lady yell at me for hunting doves two years ago at this location. I was highly confident that I was legal so I told Karen to call the sheriff or DNR. She said she would but nobody ever showed up.
> 
> This is why I have only hunt doe in Enterprise.....


I duck hunted a few times on Ash Creek reservoir down there. You are correct, the folks there are challenging.


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## PBH (Nov 7, 2007)

2full said:


> The property looks PLENTY cultivated to me.....
> Which makes it properly posted to begin with.
> Lawn, barn, white picket fence, etc......
> 
> Anyone that hunts should be able to figure that out. Somewhere along the line at least some common sense should kick in.



He mentioned he shot it on the neighbors property, and it ran across to this property. Even so, the neighbors properties are all cultivated, and have buildings within 600 feet. If he didn't have permission (written?) I don't think he has a legitimate argument from a "not posted properly" perspective.

I'm still intrigued by him having his neighbor's tag. I don't know how that get's handled. Did he use that tag? Or was he planning to use it, but didn't because he got caught trespassing first?


This is the most fun we've had all week!


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## colorcountrygunner (Oct 6, 2009)

How can someone be such a smooth brain to do something like this, yet still achieve the positions of prominence and prestige he has? This is more along the lines of something your would expect from Bubba and Cletus. Between the location he shot it in, the private property issues, the party hunting, etc.. Wow! What a numbskull! I hunted doves in this area many years ago, but I'm sure it was far less Californicated back then.


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## Vanilla (Dec 11, 2009)

Being voted into the legislature requires no brains at all. I promise you that!


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## colorcountrygunner (Oct 6, 2009)

Vanilla said:


> Being voted into the legislature requires no brains at all. I promise you that!


Or morals, or integrity, or... But hey, we vote for these people.


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## PBH (Nov 7, 2007)

Vanilla said:


> Being voted into the legislature requires no brains at all. I promise you that!


What about passing the Bar?


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## colorcountrygunner (Oct 6, 2009)

PBH said:


> What about passing the Bar?


There's many different types of intelligence. I find some people are in good shape with some types and very deficient in others. My grandfather in law is a perfect example. He was intelligent enough to earn a doctorate, start a very successful and lucrative company that has allowed him to hunt the world and accomplish just about anything a Safari Club International member can set out to accomplish. Yet there's times we will find him cranking away on a propane tank valve with a pipe wrench complaining he can't get it open only to discover he is turning the valve the wrong way. I could go on 🤣


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## High Desert Elk (Aug 21, 2012)

Vanilla said:


> Nobody is above the law.


Depends on who the politician is. I can name a few that are...


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## bowgy (Oct 10, 2007)

*ST. GEORGE —* Misdemeanor charges have been filed against a Southern Utah state representative accused of shooting a doe as it was walking through the yard of a private residence. 








Charges filed against Southern Utah state Rep. Travis Seegmiller for alleged poaching incident


ST. GEORGE — Misdemeanor charges have been filed against a Southern Utah state representative accused of shooting a doe as it was walking through the yard of a private residence. On Thursday, the Millard County Attorney’s Office filed three misdemeanor charges against Rep. Travis Seegmiller, a...




www.stgeorgeutah.com


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## MooseMeat (Dec 27, 2017)

I love how it took 3 counties before 1 would take the case. If he was your average guy, they’d hang him. He’ll get off with a “warning”, just like all the DWR employees do when they get in trouble


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## colorcountrygunner (Oct 6, 2009)

MooseMeat said:


> I love how it took 3 counties before 1 would take the case. If he was your average guy, they’d hang him. He’ll get off with a “warning”, just like all the DWR employees do when they get in trouble


Rules for thee, not for me


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## Vanilla (Dec 11, 2009)

These type of conflict screens are pretty basic operating procedure. I would have expected this at the outset.


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## PBH (Nov 7, 2007)

MooseMeat said:


> ... If he was your average guy, they’d hang him. He’ll get off with a “warning”, just like all the DWR employees do when they get in trouble



???

Please do tell.


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## MooseMeat (Dec 27, 2017)

PBH said:


> ???
> 
> Please do tell.


It’s public record, look it up. You’d be surprised some of the stuff their employees have done and nothing but a lil pee pee slappin is all they got. It certainly didn’t make the news, ever see a court room, fines were never issued and hunting privileges were never lost.

I personally know a guy who accidentally shot a hen and a tom with one shot, years ago on the spring hunt. The whole thing is on video. Hen was in the oak brush behind the Tom and you couldn’t see her at all until she started flipping. The hunter instantly realized his mistake, and call himself in right there on video to report the problem. They raked that dude over the coals on that. 3 year hunting suspension for a complete accident and fines. Rewind the clock a couple years and one of their officers shoots a doe deer during the rifle deer hunt. According to his story, he immediately turned himself in. The story I was told by another couple guys that supposedly watched the whole thing said that wasn’t what happened and they called him in and another officer contacted him on his way out… anyways, he got absolutely 0 punishment. Nothing. There is no such thing as any hunting crime committed by a citizen, knowingly or unknowingly, that is treated that way. 

it happens a lot more than you’d ever know. And that’s just the hunting aspect of looking the other way. If you only knew what some of their internal employees have done and gotten away with and still have a job… 😬


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## wyogoob (Sep 7, 2007)

backcountry said:


> No shooting within 600 feet of a building still applies either way, correct?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Dangit, yer killin me. I was gonna ask the guy to spend a couple day at my place.


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## Catherder (Aug 2, 2008)

And here is the resolution. 









Utah lawmaker pleads no contest in poaching incident


A Utah lawmaker has pleaded no contest to charges in connection to an incident last year in which he was accused of shooting a deer in a residential area. Rep. Travis Seegmiller (R-St. George) entered the plea Friday in Washington County Justice Court, according to online court records. He was...




kutv.com





Not a particularly heavy sentence but no hunting for 3 years. It also sounds like the (R) convention voters are not overjoyed with the distinguished reps conduct, as evinced by the results. Good on them.


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## MooseMeat (Dec 27, 2017)

That’s a bull**** sentence. $400 fine? Come on. He got a light tap on the wrist compared to what someone in his position should have got


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## bowgy (Oct 10, 2007)

Interesting?








Rep. Travis Seegmiller announces resignation from Utah House


ST. GEORGE — Rep. Travis Seegmiller has notified the speaker of the Utah House of Representatives that he is resigning his seat effective July 1 and is also withdrawing from the fall elections. According to a press release from the Utah House, Seegmiller notified Speaker Brad Wilson on Tuesday...




www.stgeorgeutah.com


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## Catherder (Aug 2, 2008)

bowgy said:


> Interesting?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


He probably knew he would lose his primary. His (R) convention results were not positive for him. 

I'm sure his poaching exploits didn't help him any. Can't say I feel a lot of sympathy for his plight.


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## provider (Jan 17, 2011)

He did some good as a legislator. Sad to see him go down over something so stupid.


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