# Cougars or coyote tracks



## swbuckmaster (Sep 14, 2007)

I dont know what is wrong with my first link. This one should take you to the right link.


----------



## Bears Butt (Sep 12, 2007)

That site doesn't get me anywhere near any tracks.


----------



## ntrl_brn_rebel (Sep 7, 2007)

:_O=: 
:?: 
What does this mean or prove...hell for all I know that could be one or two lions tracks filmed at five times....I am guessing by your tone of voice and dialogue you have something to prove but it really means nothing...there are lions in Utah congratulations you found one  

My dad can beat up your dad


----------



## Bowdacious (Sep 16, 2007)

ntrl_brn_rebel said:


> :_O=:
> :?:
> What does this mean or prove...hell for all I know that could be one or two lions tracks filmed at five times....I am guessing by your tone of voice and dialogue you have something to prove but it really means nothing...there are lions in Utah congratulations you found one
> 
> My dad can beat up your dad


I'M CONFUSED! THAT LINK WENT NOWHERE!


----------



## Mrad (Mar 25, 2011)

The hardcore lion guys don't like stuff like this. They don't like all the trail camera pictures of lions. They don't like all the lion sightings being posted on the web. They want you to believe that there aren't many lions in the state.

Which is BS. 

Now, treeing a big mature Tom every trip out might be tough. Maybe there aren't a lot of big trophy toms running around. But most any lion worth his salt can tree a lion almost any day of the week under the right snow conditions.

Let's face it, lion guys like lions.


----------



## swbuckmaster (Sep 14, 2007)

I dont know what the heck is wrong with youtube but my original link is now fixed so you should be able to view it Bowdacious.

The only reason I even posted this is because I was challenged on this site or another site to find a track. This houndsmen said there are no tracks to be found. When I called bs he said if I found a track he would run his dogs on it or buy me a steak dinner but he guaranteed me all I was seeing was coyote or dog tracks. Its not hard to find cougar tracks in Utah. It might be hard to find a big tom track but there are no shortages of cats.

This video I put together was taken miles apart. I found three different cat tracks in one canyon alone. I then went to another location and found two more different sets. I always run into cat tracks this time of year.

The first track next to my boot is a pretty good cat track if you ask me. Id even say its as good as any big 4 point buck track. This year I also filmed a cat next to the road. The area I shed hunted was littered with bucks from years past who had dropped there sheds to only be pulled up under a cliff or stuffed into a bush and eaten by a cat.

I know its not all the cats fault why the deer in this area are disappearing but Im not also blind to the fact there not helping the situation either. I believe a lot of the problem is bowhunters shooting does late in the year. Coyotes take there share of fawns. Bears are also on the rise in this area. I cant remember when I didn't see bear scat with deer hair in it. Elk are also out competing mule deer for feed in the winter by eating the brush to the ground. Then throw in the cars collisions and you do have a recipe for declining deer numbers.

So all you can do is fix one thing at a time. Fences are being put up along the major roads. Coyotes will die this winter or spring by my guns. Im looking into snares for the cats tomorrow. I still have to see if its legal to snare them or not. If it is this might give me something else to do to pass the time this winter.

Ntrbrnreble your dad might be able to beat up my dad but you cant beat yourself out of a paper bag unless someone tosses you a bottle of lotion. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dJ_wh12g ... re=related  :lol: Take it easy Ntbr its a "joke"


----------



## Kevin D (Sep 15, 2007)

No houndsman that I know has ever said there are no lions in Utah, only that the cougar population is in decline. Sorry SW, but your video proves nothing. You are attacking a fictional straw man in your video. The only thing your video demonstrates to me is some anger issues on your part. 

Tell you what SW, I'll take a page out of your book of logic and shoot video of some deer tracks from 2 different canyons and post the link. In it I'll conclude that all you deer hunters are full of bullpickles, that Utah is crawling with deer! That all you cry baby deer hunters are too incompetent to find them. That'd make just as much sense wouldn't it??


----------



## swbuckmaster (Sep 14, 2007)

My video proves to the one person that challenged me to find a track that I do in fact know what a lion track looks like. I not only found one I found multiple tracks. I could care less what anyone else thinks unless you are one of those houndsman that say you cant find cats. There is no sense in having a B&C population of cats when people are complaining that the deer numbers are in the tank. The cats need to be thinned. I also believe this is happening. I also believe the females need to be culled not just chased. When the deer numbers go up the cat tags need to be cut. Its simple management. Im sorry you don't understand the principle of management. 

A cougar is the same to deer as a wolf is to elk!


----------



## Kevin D (Sep 15, 2007)

Fair enough SW.

I'll help you on your research too. It is illegal to take a cougar in the state of Utah with a snare. It is also illegal in Utah to take a female cougar that is accompanied by young. And finally, it is unlawful to take any cougar in Utah that is accompanied by an adult (though this wording was meant to protect kittens, it has been interpreted by some in law enforcement to apply even to adult cougars. An example would be a trophy tom travelling with a female in estrus would also be protected). Consequently, most of the lions making tracks in your video are protected by state law from being trapped, killed, or pursued.


----------



## Mrad (Mar 25, 2011)

Love the video. 

I didn't take a camera this morning, but didn't have any trouble finding lion tracks. Granted most of them were old, and likely the same cat. But it really doesn't take much looking.

Lion hunting is hard work. I understand that. It's especially hard if you have to sift through a bunch of females and young lions to find a mature Tom, but I'm tired of lion lovers saying there aren't any. 

I think every deer hunter in the state should have the option to put their tag on a lion or a bear. I believe Idaho does this.


----------



## swbuckmaster (Sep 14, 2007)

Id pay an extra if I could exchange my deer or elk tag for a bear or cat. Like Idaho.


----------



## KattTraxx (Sep 10, 2007)

Hey Mrad,
I like this game.. I think then, following your same logic, that all lion hunters who have a tag should be able to put it on a trophy mule deer buck or bull elk if we see one while hunting lions during the winter.. Let's just blur the line between hunts so much that it is basically legal to use any tag on any trophy we see.. I am pretty sure Idaho doesn't do this. 

It is the same thing every year. Ungulate guys turn into lion and bear experts, even though we can go 4 months and never see one of them on the mountain (unless it is a few of those late season antlerless hunts that go nearly year round). If it has 4 hooves, it has more right to be managed for trophy quality than if it has 4 paws.. 

Be careful there Mrad, you might just start enjoying the sport of finding tracks and buy yourself a couple hounds.. Geez, that is a short leap, and then you'd be just like KevinD.. Wouldn't wish that on anyone.. (not even Kevin)..


----------



## Dannyboy (Oct 27, 2010)

You may want hounds until you camp next to someone with hounds and then you hate them until you need a buddy to help you get a cat!!


----------



## Riverrat77 (Sep 7, 2007)

Buddy of mine saw a cat up City Creek last night... he was way in the hell back in but saw one. Also found a pretty hefty five point elk shed. Makes me wish I'd called in and gone with him.


----------



## Riverrat77 (Sep 7, 2007)

Pretty **** cool.... he was holding his camera up to his binoculars and thought he missed it... turns out, he got a great shot where you can clearly see the cat when you zoom in on the picture. Its a cool picture.


----------



## bullsnot (Aug 10, 2010)

The RAC's and WB recently passed a new addition to the cougar management plan. One of the best indicators of the cats impact on deer, or the need to reduce cats to help deer, is by measuring adult deer mortality. If the mortality rate becomes too high this tells us either A) cats are having a negative impact on deer populations and cats need to be reduced or B) deer are facing some other challenge and the impact that cats have needs to be reduced. Utah has recently collared a bunch of deer around the state and is measuring adult mortality rates. Tags and quotas will be adjusted based on those results.

Personally I want to see a good balance between the two species and not an over reaction on killing cats. With this new tool we have science on our side to tell us whether or not cats are having a detrimental effect on deer. It will take some time for data to really paint a clear picture but we are headed in a positive direction. If adult deer mortality is low, then arguing that cats are really hurting deer herds will hold no water. Coyotes target fawns and is a much bigger problem on most units although there are a couple of units that likely have some cat issues.


----------

