# Deer caliber youth



## Mr.CheddarNut (Jan 16, 2013)

So all things being equal; rifle weight, barrel length and distance (200 yards) etc. Between these three mainstream cartridges 243win, 25-06rem, and 7mm-08. Which would you choose for a youth hunter for hunting Western Mule deer out to 200 yards. Most importantly, why? I bought a 25-06 a few years ago for this reason and I love the caliber but I wonder if it is a bit on the higher end of recoil for youth and if necessary for deer?

Cheddar


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

7mm08 w/ 120gr Ballistic Tips (hunting version, not the varmint). Unnoticeable difference in recoil over the 243, packs alot more punch on target.

243 works great too, I like 100grn Nosler Partitions for hunting. My wife's killed a ton of deer and antelope with that load... and even a Caribou!


I dislike the 2506 for youth simply due to the long action, youngsters seem to forget to completely cycle the action to clear the spent brass and jam things up. Stick with SA calibers until they get older.


-DallanC


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## Mr.CheddarNut (Jan 16, 2013)

DallanC said:


> I dislike the 2506 for youth simply due to the long action, youngsters seem to forget to completely cycle the action to clear the spent brass and jam things up. Stick with SA calibers until they get older.
> 
> -DallanC


Interesting and a good point.

Cheddar


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## cklspencer (Jun 25, 2009)

7mm-08. More behind the bullet. And you can get reduced recoil loads if the recoil is a problem.


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## Springville Shooter (Oct 15, 2010)

I third the 7-08 for kids. 25-06 is for old guys with lots of class!------SS


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## waspocrew (Nov 26, 2011)

I don't think you could go wrong with the .243 or the 7-08. Since I like 7mm's, I vote for the 7-08.


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## Bo0YaA (Sep 29, 2008)

I would take the .243 over the 7-08 any day of the week. The recoil of my 7mm-08 was equal to my daughters .308 whereas my .243 is as gentle as them come. IMHO if you want something better than the .243 and still mainstream, go with the 6.5 creedmore or .260 (little less mainstream). Both are superior to the .243 and if ya ask me, better than the 7-08 as well for a youth caliber. I was extremely disappointed with the 7-08 which is why I sold it. Then again, I'm willing to admit it could have been the fact that it was a Remington 700. I should have known better than to buy anything other than a Savage.


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## Springville Shooter (Oct 15, 2010)

Booya has a good point. If you're worried about the recoil of the 25-06, I would go with the 243 over the 7-08. My kids all came up on a 308 and never had problems. I was able to create loads that kept the recoil manageable as they grew starting with super light 125 grain bullets and working up to hot 150's. My kid gun is a customized 788 with a short stock and an 18.5" barrel. ------SS


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

I cannot tell the difference between either of our two 243's and my boys 7mm08 using 120gr bullets.

-DallanC


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## scott_rn (Sep 11, 2007)

I've actually heard stories about 243 recoil being excessive in the rossi, but I assume it is because the gun is so lightweight.

I bought a 7mm-08 savage youth model. My son started shooting it at eight years old (weighing 55 lbs) with 120 grain sierra bullets, but the recoil was a bit much. Now he is almost 11 (closer to 75 lbs) and he is able to shoot anything reduced recoil (h4895) without much problem. I am planning to have him shoot nosler 140's for the november moose hunt. 

In some regards I regret not buying him a 308, or even an .06. Now that I am reloading, I have to buy every bullet in .284 and .308. I could have worked up reduced recoil loads with 308 or 30.06 and had all my bullets be the same caliber. I'm sure some guys like have a wide variety of calibers and cartridges, I would rather keep things simple.


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## KineKilla (Jan 28, 2011)

.243 Win. Perfect youth caliber.
.270 Win shooting reduced recoil loads is also an interesting possibility if you want to be able to move to heavier projectiles as the youth gets older.


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## massmanute (Apr 23, 2012)

How about .243 for now. When the child gets a little older have the barrel re-bored to 7mm-08 or .308.


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## CPAjeff (Dec 20, 2014)

Another vote for the .243! I grew up shooting one and recently purchased one to use strictly as a deer/antelope gun. I also would have zero problem shooting an elk with it, at the appropriate ranges. I personally would rather shoot a smaller caliber gun and not worry about the recoil instead of shooting a bigger caliber and worrying about the recoil.


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## MarkM (Sep 7, 2007)

My 13 year old daughter is shooting a 7-08 this year for here first deer hunt. She is a bit recoil shy but I worked up a good reduced load with H4895 and 120gr BT's. She lived shooting it and it has almost no recoil.


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## Springville Shooter (Oct 15, 2010)

If you hand load it really doesn't matter as you can make age-appropriate loads for almost any cartridge. I still think that the 7-08/308 are tough to beat. My oldest graduated from the kids 308 to a full sized Remington 270. She will likely shoot it for the rest of her life. After cleanly taking an 800+ pound animal with it this year it will be hard to convince her that she needs anything else. She loves shooting it and has no problem with top end 130 grain loads. My 14 year old is still shooting the kid gun but I suspect that she is nearly ready for an upgrade. Don't miss out on letting your kids be involved in shopping for guns. It has been a really neat experience for myself and my kids. ----SS


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## Bo0YaA (Sep 29, 2008)

I just bumped my daughter from her .308 shooting 130gr TTSX up to the 6.5x284 shooting 130gr Accubonds. Both going about 3000 fps but the 6.5 has noticeably less recoil than the .308 and it will allow her to be far more accurate at longer ranges than she was able to be with a 130gr in a .308.


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## Springville Shooter (Oct 15, 2010)

Barrel length is the reason that I avoid overbore cartridges for youth guns. I have found that barrel length and weight are some of the biggest hinderances to youth being able to correctly hold and fire a rifle, especially offhand. I prefer a barrel no longer than 20" for smaller kids. High performance overbore cartridges usually need at least 24" of barrel to operate correctly or with any efficiency. Cartridges like the 7-08/.308 work just fine with a 20" or even shorter barrel. My kids could swing their youth rifle well even at 9-10 years old. The same was not true for my bigger rifles which had to be shot strictly prone due to weight. ------SS


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## Bo0YaA (Sep 29, 2008)

I agree, however there are exceptions. I built her a prohunter and put a 26" barrel on it. Due to the fact there is no action, the OAL of her new gun is almost exactly the same as her 20" barreled .308 and the weight is very similar as well.


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## Springville Shooter (Oct 15, 2010)

Great idea! The Pro hunter is a great idea for several reasons. Foremost is barrel length, secondary would be the ability to change barrels an keep the stock, cheek fit, and trigger the same. The Pro Hunter could be a 223 all summer long, then magically become a 6.5 284 before hunting season. Heck, it could even be a muzzy for a few weeks since the kids can hunt all three seasons. You might be on to something Booya, I don't have one of these......yet.--------SS


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## Bo0YaA (Sep 29, 2008)

That is exactly why I put her one together. I will tell you though, you will find it tough to get a stock just the right LOP. I should have just gotten one a little longer from Boyds and cut it down and put on my own recoil pad. Instead, I ordered one online that showed up all kinds of jacked up and unfinished. Took me about 3 weeks of sanding and dremel tooling to get it to fit right, then I had to sand and seal it. As of right now the barrels we have are 26" 300wm, 28" 7mm mag, 24" 338 Federal, 26" 6.5x284, 26" .243, 26" .50 cal muzzy, and yes after selling the 20" Remington 700 7mm-08 we bought a 24" 7mm-08 barrel we have yet to try. I put a 1" limb saver recoil pad which is so much nicer than the one she has on her Mossberg .308 which will helps a ton for the heavier recoiling loads. I had put together a load for her to muzzy hunt with but I doubt we will be able to make it out before it ends this year. But yes, a simple barrel change and we go back from muzzy to 6.5 and ready for the rifle hunt to start. Oh and If you keep your eyes pealed on Ebay, you can get amazing deals on barrels.


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## Huge29 (Sep 17, 2007)

IF those are our only choices definitely the 08 especially knowing that you are becoming an expert handloader. Be sure to start out with teh H4895 reduced recoil recipe and use double ear plugs. That is the cartridge I got for my 12 year old and son and eh downed a buck from about 250 yards with a 120 TTSX. 
However, if I had to do it over I would very possibly go with one of teh 6.5's like the 6.5x47 or the Creedmor. The only problem with those is that you can't really get them so much in a youth size, which I think is important like SS says, gotta keep them short and lightweight unless you want a custom build. There certainly is nothing wrong with teh 08, I know guys say it isnt just a youth cartridge, but great overall for long range.


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## massmanute (Apr 23, 2012)

Bo0YaA said:


> ...338 Federal....


How do you like the .338 Federal, not as a youth gun but for yourself?


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## Bo0YaA (Sep 29, 2008)

Honestly, its still in the package lol My shooting season starts when hunting season ends unless its a caliber used for hunting. We have brass and bullets to load but I just haven't had time to start messing with it. I will give ya my opinion once we run it over the chrono and see how accurate we can get it with the bullets we have selected.


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## whitepd01 (Aug 26, 2014)

Not that I'm adding anything but my vote is 7mm-08 for sure. Great caliber for a gun. My 15 year-old has shot 2 elk, 2 antelope and 1 deer with his.
My 12 year-old is headed out to shoot a cow elk this Friday.
Huge range of bullet options. Great gun!
It's what I will be getting my younger 2 sons also.


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

Recovered 1 of my boys 7mm 140gr Accubonds from his elk, it weighted 77gr and was expanded to .565" diameter. It was found on the far side against the hide. His other shot passed clean through. If you are getting that much penetration on a elk, its certainly good enough for deer.


-DallanC


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## Mr.CheddarNut (Jan 16, 2013)

A lot of good info here. So it is clear that the 7mm-08 is a very popular choice for youth. It seems kinda heavy by way of comparison if looking strictly at recoil. According to this table: http://www.chuckhawks.com/recoil_table.htm

7mm-08 is around 12 on the chart
25-06 is around 12
243 is about 75% of the other two at around 9
I totally understand the versatility in projectile size from the -08 however. SS is right, you really need one of each and this problem goes away.

Cheddar


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## DallanC (Jan 13, 2009)

Mr.CheddarNut said:


> 7mm-08 is around 12 on the chart
> 25-06 is around 12
> 243 is about 75% of the other two at around 9


I wish he compared the recoil of a 20GA shotgun with these other guns. I really cant tell the difference of 7mm08 and .243, probably due to my boys Axis in 7mm08 having a softer recoil pad than the Rem700's plastic plate.

-DallanC


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## Mr.CheddarNut (Jan 16, 2013)

DallanC said:


> I wish he compared the recoil of a 20GA shotgun with these other guns. I really cant tell the difference of 7mm08 and .243, probably due to my boys Axis in 7mm08 having a softer recoil pad than the Rem700's plastic plate.
> 
> -DallanC


 Good point Dallan. I suppose the recoil can be fairly easily offset by things like recoil pad, muzzle break, reduced charge etc.

Chedder


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## LostLouisianian (Oct 11, 2010)

Mr.CheddarNut said:


> A lot of good info here. So it is clear that the 7mm-08 is a very popular choice for youth. It seems kinda heavy by way of comparison if looking strictly at recoil. According to this table: http://www.chuckhawks.com/recoil_table.htm
> 
> 7mm-08 is around 12 on the chart
> 25-06 is around 12
> ...


Cheddar, I am just curious if you have the recoil numbers on a .270?


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## Mr.CheddarNut (Jan 16, 2013)

LostLouisianian said:


> Cheddar, I am just curious if you have the recoil numbers on a .270?


 about 17

Cheddar


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## Bo0YaA (Sep 29, 2008)

Here is a good site to get a rough idea of recoil on handloads as well. http://www.handloads.com/calc/recoil.asp
According to that site, my daughters new gun has 10.82 ftlbs of recoil with the 120gr bullet.


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## Mr.CheddarNut (Jan 16, 2013)

Went to the range yesterday after work. My buddy brought his 7mm-08 youth gun and his 11yr old daughter. We had loaded some 140gr. Accubond with H414. She as getting walloped by the recoil of that gun. It didn't feel like much to me at all but it was definitely throwing her around. Were going to try some 120's and a reduced charge of H4895

Cheddar


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## Bo0YaA (Sep 29, 2008)

Make sure the LOP is correct. A LOP longer than it should be means the butt of the gun is not sitting where it should be, thereby making the recoil feel a lot worse that it would if the gun was properly fit.


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