# UTES- versus- AIR FORCE



## coyoteslayer (Sep 10, 2007)

The Utes will be tested this Saturday, but it's time for the Utes to blow the roof off this place and show the sportsworld that they are the real deal.


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## gitterdone81 (Sep 3, 2009)

Air Force will really do that for you...or not. 

It won't be until the TCU game that we now if they are truly a great team, or just a good MWC team.


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## stablebuck (Nov 22, 2007)

AIR FORCE!!!


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## Riverrat77 (Sep 7, 2007)

I hope Air Force gives em a reality check.... the Utes right now are overrated, and I'm sick of hearing from all my die hard Ute fan friends that we're something special. Ummmm no, at this point, we've beat a bunch of teams that anybody would own. We've still got a lot of proving to do.... we're about on par with Boise State's season schedule as far as difficulty goes so far. :?


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## jahan (Sep 7, 2007)

Riverrat77 said:


> I hope Air Force gives em a reality check.... the Utes right now are overrated, and I'm sick of hearing from all my die hard Ute fan friends that we're something special. Ummmm no, at this point, we've beat a bunch of teams that anybody would own. We've still got a lot of proving to do.... we're about on par with Boise State's season schedule as far as difficulty goes so far. :?


In all fairness, I would give Boise State a nod for a tougher non conference schedule. The Utes are the real deal, I think am pretty confident they beat TCU this year. I watched them play against CSU last weekend and they are that good. They put up over 600 yards of offense, without much effort. It should have been 59 to 0, but a botched return by Shaky gave them excellent field position, which the Utes held them to a field goal and one drive with an awful call that put them in field goal range again. Air Force is going to be tough, they always give the Utes a run for the money but the Utes will come out on top, but I don't think they will cover the spread.

As far as their schedule, they beat Pitt, which could still win their conference. They spanked Iowa State, who just beat Texas and they are manhandling teams they should manhandle. So RR why didn't Texas own Iowa State? Why is Pitt beating basically everyone else they are playing? I am not going to sit here and say they have a really tough schedule because they haven't, but they are getting into their meaty part of their schedule and if they beat Air Force, TCU, and Notre Dame they will more than likely jump Boise State. Now just try and refrain from rushing the field. 8)


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## Riverrat77 (Sep 7, 2007)

No field rushing... thats for sure. Here's the reason I am not real impressed with the ISU or the Pitt win. Utah escaped with a win vs Pitt. It wasn't like they just flat out killed Pitt. They were lucky they didn't lose that game... period. Against ISU... ok so Utah lights them up and then ISU goes and beats Texas. Does it mean ISU is a tough team? No... anyone that has watched Texas play or even listened to Mack Brown talk about his team knows Texas is basically the Utah State of that conference this year. They are terrible.... Knowing these things from having been at one game and paying attention to the other, I can tell you that Utah is not that good. There are plenty of things that both Air Force and especially TCU's defense can exploit against Utah and I am certainly not at all confident that they'll beat TCU, even playing here. I just don't buy the hype about Utah this year... because the one "tough" team (I guess) that they've played in Pitt almost beat them anyway. They haven't played anyone else that is even close to good. 

Just checked out Pitt's schedule and at 4-3, they're hardly good. They got absolutely manhandled by Miami and even lost to ND. No offense to Orvis... but Notre Dame isn't any good either. Pitt's basically the best of the worst at this point.


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## dkhntrdstn (Sep 7, 2007)

o-||


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## jahan (Sep 7, 2007)

Riverrat77 said:


> No field rushing... thats for sure. Here's the reason I am not real impressed with the ISU or the Pitt win. Utah escaped with a win vs Pitt. It wasn't like they just flat out killed Pitt. They were lucky they didn't lose that game... period. Against ISU... ok so Utah lights them up and then ISU goes and beats Texas. Does it mean ISU is a tough team? No... anyone that has watched Texas play or even listened to Mack Brown talk about his team knows Texas is basically the Utah State of that conference this year. They are terrible.... Knowing these things from having been at one game and paying attention to the other, I can tell you that Utah is not that good. There are plenty of things that both Air Force and especially TCU's defense can exploit against Utah and I am certainly not at all confident that they'll beat TCU, even playing here. I just don't buy the hype about Utah this year... because the one "tough" team (I guess) that they've played in Pitt almost beat them anyway. They haven't played anyone else that is even close to good.


Time will tell my friend. You make some very good points, a bit dramatized and exaggerated, but good points nonetheless. :lol: :mrgreen: I would like to comment on Texas, they IMO have always been over rated and they were this year when they were in the top 25, but they are no USU. They are way better than that, and I know in fairness you said they were the USU of the Big 12, but I still think they are better than that. I agree with you that TCU and even Air Force will exploit a few things against the Utes, but the same can be said the other way around. So exactly who has TCU played that would be considered good? Oregon State? Baylor? I ain't buying that kool aid either. Who the hell is Tennessee Tech? :O•-: What has TCU proven to make you think they are THAT much better than Utah? Don't get me wrong TCU is an excellent team, if it was at there home they would get the win, but I give the Utes the slight edge do to playing at home. Any way we look at it I think it will be a hell of a game.


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## coyoteslayer (Sep 10, 2007)

TCU has had basically the same schedule as the Utes. The Utes have always had close games against Air Force but Whitt will have his guys prepared for the game. TCU also has a lot of talent, but they can be beaten. The days are getting closer until people will either say" See I told you the Utes aren't as good" Or they will SHUT UP and recognize GREATNESS. :mrgreen:

Now if the Utes win both Air Force and TCU then the non-believers will have to walk out on the field or in their rooms and bend over and kiss their own arses.


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## Riverrat77 (Sep 7, 2007)

Dramatized and exaggerated.... if I put it any other way, you guys would think I was just stirring the pot. :lol: I wasn't aware Tennessee Tech even had a football team till TCU played them. TCU has one of the best defenses in the country... somebody (I think I remember seeing this) said that TCU hasn't put up as many points as Utah has. Well, they haven't had to. Their D is shutting EVERYONE down. Jordan Wynn won't be throwing for 300 yards and three touchdowns in that game guaranteed. The points won't be anywhere close to 50... in fact, I'd be suprised if Utah gets three touchdowns in any way in the game. Oregon State and Baylor have good records (Baylor is leading the Big 12 south) and are decent teams. OSU is just average this year but Baylor is actually pretty good this year. Not bad for the usual Big 12 doormat. 8) I just think that all the hype about Utah is a bit premature. Are they good? Yeah, sure they're good. Are they great and deserving of even being in the national championship discussion? Definitely not... at least not yet. If they just blow up AF and TCU, then maybe they'd have a point. Beating CSU 59-6 doesn't mean you're a great team... it means you beat up on the junior college level team in your conference like you were supposed to.  Most folks would be surprised if they hadn't won some of these games by such large margins.


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## jahan (Sep 7, 2007)

Riverrat77 said:


> Dramatized and exaggerated.... if I put it any other way, you guys would think I was just stirring the pot. :lol: I wasn't aware Tennessee Tech even had a football team till TCU played them. TCU has one of the best defenses in the country... somebody (I think I remember seeing this) said that TCU hasn't put up as many points as Utah has. Well, they haven't had to. Their D is shutting EVERYONE down. Jordan Wynn won't be throwing for 300 yards and three touchdowns in that game guaranteed. The points won't be anywhere close to 50... in fact, I'd be suprised if Utah gets three touchdowns in any way in the game. Oregon State and Baylor have good records (Baylor is leading the Big 12 south) and are decent teams. OSU is just average this year but Baylor is actually pretty good this year. Not bad for the usual Big 12 doormat. 8) I just think that all the hype about Utah is a bit premature. Are they good? Yeah, sure they're good. Are they great and deserving of even being in the national championship discussion? Definitely not... at least not yet. If they just blow up AF and TCU, then maybe they'd have a point. Beating CSU 59-6 doesn't mean you're a great team... it means you beat up on the junior college level team in your conference like you were supposed to.  Most folks would be surprised if they hadn't won some of these games by such large margins.


So lets look at the defense for a second. TCU is 1st in the country for points allowed at 9 per game, the Utes are 3rd in the country with 12.9 per game. Pretty even if you ask me. Lets look at the offense side TCU is 7th in the country with 39.9 per game and the Utes are 3rd with 47.7 per game once again pretty close to even. I just wanted to put numbers to your statements and show that their defense and offenses are very on par with each other.


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## Riverrat77 (Sep 7, 2007)

Well, because I was curious about your numbers... I went to ESPN and crunched them on the season. The highest ranked offense that the Utes have faced was Pitt, ranked 47th. The next closest was ISU, ranked 81st. Everyone else was ranked over 100 in the nation. Not very stiff competition.... so they're ranked third in the country. TCU has faced much stiffer competition... only three of their games have been against teams ranked over 100 in offense... and they shut out two of those. Their stiffest competition was ranked 20th and everyone except Wyoming, BYU and CSU were under 65th in the country. Utah has yet to put up a shutout against anyone... and they've played weaker teams. Thats why I think TCU's D is better... they've been tested and held up fantastically. Utah faces one semi decent offense and had to go to overtime to get the job done. 

Just for shiz and giggles, I compared their opponents defenses too. TCU has played against stiffer defenses as well. All but CSU and OSU (93rd) had defenses ranked below 90. Utahs opponents other than Wyoming (86th) and Pitt (42nd) are all 96 or higher in defense. *edited for redundancy because I'm freakin tired*. For TCU, on paper, its just simple facts.... TCU is just a better team so far against better competition. 

If Utah keeps up the 40-50 point spread against the rest of their opponents who are arguably better than the first half, I'll change my tune... otherwise, I still think they're a bit overrated at this point being number 8 in the nation. I think Ohio State, Stanford, and Nebraska at the very least are better teams than the Utes and I also think that Oklahoma and LSU are as overrated as the Utes right now. Ok... I'm off to bed. My Giants won game one of the Series so thats all that matters for now.


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## orvis1 (Sep 7, 2007)

Riverrat77 said:


> They got absolutely manhandled by Miami and even lost to ND. No offense to Orvis... but Notre Dame isn't any good either. Pitt's basically the best of the worst at this point.


No offense taken it is a tough year for me right now our cowboys stink (hopefully we get cower next year as a coach) the Irish are improved but the losses have come to top competition. Look at Michigan state it took a trick play in overtime and for them to win the loss to Michigan was a last second TD as well. Both Stanford and Navy kicked our butts. I am curious to see what the do against the Utes and USC this year. I think things are looking up for the Irish but they need defense in the worse way more athletes please!


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## gitterdone81 (Sep 3, 2009)

This might be the first time ever - I have seen two utah fans have a logical conversation between themselves. Most of the time a Utah convo (since they became relevant) consists of we rock! BCS Baby! and the other Utah fan says We are awesome and BYU Sucks!

Kudos to you two! Notice coyoteslayer doesn't know how to participate in this conversation as it isn't trashing BYU.


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## jahan (Sep 7, 2007)

gitterdone81 said:


> This might be the first time ever - I have seen two utah fans have a logical conversation between themselves. Most of the time a Utah convo (since they became relevant) consists of we rock! BCS Baby! and the other Utah fan says We are awesome and BYU Sucks!
> 
> Kudos to you two! Notice coyoteslayer doesn't know how to participate in this conversation as it isn't trashing BYU.


I like to discuss with RR, he sometimes throws out some crazy comments, but he usually does his homework. I am not a fan of bashing a team while they are down, I guess that comes from having my team (USU) always being down.  :mrgreen: :lol:


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## coyoteslayer (Sep 10, 2007)

> Kudos to you two! Notice coyoteslayer doesn't know how to participate in this conversation as it isn't trashing BYU.


I have been busy my friend, but if you would learn to read then I have already posted my thoughts on this thread. I also started the thread


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## Riverrat77 (Sep 7, 2007)

orvis1 said:


> No offense taken it is a tough year for me right now our cowboys stink (hopefully we get cower next year as a coach) the Irish are improved but the losses have come to top competition. Look at Michigan state it took a trick play in overtime and for them to win the loss to Michigan was a last second TD as well. Both Stanford and Navy kicked our butts. I am curious to see what the do against the Utes and USC this year. I think things are looking up for the Irish but they need defense in the worse way more athletes please!


The only saving grace for my Huskies is the win over USC. Thats almost like Utah or BYU hinging their season on beating the other team. I agree about the Cowboys... and I can't figure out what the problem is. The tools are there. :?

ND against Utah is going to be a good game, sure wish I had the time and funds to go... it would have been awesome, although word is that the seats of my friends are top third of the stadium, way in the corner. :roll:


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## dkhntrdstn (Sep 7, 2007)

Riverrat77 said:


> I agree about the Cowboys... and I can't figure out what the problem is. The tools are there. :?


It the coaching my friend. Riley Got a question for you. if you don't think Utah is that great and so on why did you buy season seat then ? To me if you don't like the team and that I sure in hell would not buy season seats there.


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## jahan (Sep 7, 2007)

dkhntrdstn said:


> Riverrat77 said:
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> > I agree about the Cowboys... and I can't figure out what the problem is. The tools are there. :?
> ...


How else is he going to rush the field when Utah beat TCU. 8) :lol:


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## Riverrat77 (Sep 7, 2007)

dkhntrdstn said:


> Riverrat77 said:
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> > I agree about the Cowboys... and I can't figure out what the problem is. The tools are there. :?
> ...


You'll have to go to a game with me to understand.... its getting cold and Wendy is going to stop going so I'll have an extra ticket. My buddies (Brad, John, and the ladies we hang with) are all Ute fans and they got me to a couple games last year. They go up and tailgate all day before games and honestly, I don't think there is any more "fun" atmosphere than a college football game and the tailgate lot, regardless of who is playing. I love... LOVE college football, almost more than anything else sportswise, so for me, U of U is the best place I can go and watch it. I just don't like BYU, at all, otherwise I'd probably have gotten season tickets there if I hung out with BYU people. Its hard to explain why you go until you get the full tailgating experience and the game, along with hanging out watching late games and drinking beer afterwards. Its just a **** good time... which is why my wife and I have season tickets. If Washington was here all season, I'd get tickets there instead of for Utah but the U is the best here locally (in my opinion) and they do get some good teams here to play. Its more about the experience for me than it is the team I go to watch on Saturdays.

I've been in Utah for 13 years now.... and it took me until the last year or two to even begin going to Utah games. The reason I'm there is not because I'm a diehard Utah fan.


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## dkhntrdstn (Sep 7, 2007)

jahan said:


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That funny


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## dkhntrdstn (Sep 7, 2007)

Riverrat77 said:


> dkhntrdstn said:
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I understand the tailgate parting. I was just wondering.


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## jahan (Sep 7, 2007)

Riverrat77 said:


> dkhntrdstn said:
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I completely agree with you on the atmosphere thing, it is one of a kind. Also you will never go away hungry or thirsty if you go to the tail gating parking lot. We walked through an area that had some tailgating last weekend, not the main lot, and we had people trying to give us food and drinks, people are just generally cool in those lots.


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## Riverrat77 (Sep 7, 2007)

jahan said:


> How else is he going to rush the field when Utah beat TCU. 8) :lol:


And somehow... I just don't think it'd go as well if I go climb the goalpost after Utah gets blown out. :lol:


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## orvis1 (Sep 7, 2007)

dkhntrdstn said:


> Riverrat77 said:
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> > I agree about the Cowboys... and I can't figure out what the problem is. The tools are there. :?
> ...


Dam straight.. Lets home Jerry Jones backs up the brinks truck to Bill Cower this year he is the type of coach the cowboys need. They have all the pieces in place for a run next year but there is no way they sniff the playoffs this year. I think the utes get their first real test this weekend lets see how the measure up. They could be a great team or just a high school kid beating up on 6th graders... o-|| o-|| o-||


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## coyoteslayer (Sep 10, 2007)

8-0 woohoooo. *()* *()* *()* *()* :-|O|-: :-|O|-: :-|O|-: :-|O|-: :-|O|-: -()/- -()/>- -()/>- *-band-* *-band-* *-band-* It was an exciting game to watch and like always it was a close game. The Utes played a pretty good game without a lot of errors. 

Bring on TCU!!!


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## Huge29 (Sep 17, 2007)

Fun game to watch! Pretty scary to think about what "would have happened" with only 3 turnovers, the Utes certainly created every one of them I believe, but you certainly cant count on that sort of a D performance this week. All eyes will be on this game with serious national implications.


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## Riverrat77 (Sep 7, 2007)

Huge29 said:


> Fun game to watch! Pretty scary to think about what "would have happened" with only 3 turnovers, the Utes certainly created every one of them I believe, but you certainly cant count on that sort of a D performance this week. All eyes will be on this game with serious national implications.


Huge... the Utes will need that sort of "gift" from TCU to have any chance. Like I said in another post, take away some of the turnovers and Utah is now ranked number 18 or so. They weren't impressive... at all and its a huge step up this week. Hope they can pull it off but I have a feeling its going to be a long day for the Utes on Saturday.


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## GaryFish (Sep 7, 2007)

After watching both the utah-AFA and TCU-UNLV games, and knowing what TCU did to utahutes last year, I think TCU is going to come out on top. utes forced 5 turn-overs against Air Force, and still only won by 5? Either Air Force is much better than most are giving credit, or utah isn't as good as they've appeared against previous competition. Or maybe a little of both. 

One thing Air Force exposed again, that Pitt also exposed - utah's secondary is not nearly as good as their front 7. The front 7 are as good as any team out there - among the best in the country, and that has been enough to shut down everyone they've played to date. But giving up what they did in the air to Air Force, that has inferior athletes, leaves the ute secondary in question. If Pitt had a QB that could throw worth a darn, Pitt would have won that game. I think TCU has a QB that can and will exploit the ute secondary. THAT is where the game will be won/lost by either team IMO. 

Either way, I think the MWC has tremendous respect nationally when two of the top 5 teams are from the MWC. That is impressive, no matter how you look at it. It should be a fun game.


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## HighNDry (Dec 26, 2007)

Ouch! You bring up the MWC thingy again. That is fodder for TCU. I'm pretty sure they have talked about the Utes and Cougs bailing out after this year. That's some pretty good motivational material. It's only Monday and I have to wait until Saturday---spittle is spewing from the sides of my silly smile! :lol:


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## mikevanwilder (Nov 11, 2008)

HighNDry said:


> Ouch! You bring up the MWC thingy again. That is fodder for TCU. I'm pretty sure they have talked about the Utes and Cougs bailing out after this year. That's some pretty good motivational material. It's only Monday and I have to wait until Saturday---spittle is spewing from the sides of my silly smile! :lol:


Could you imagine though if BYU and Utah stayed in the MWC? With the edition of BSU and then Nevada and Fresno st in 2012. That would of made the MWC one of the best conferences in college football. Certainly better than the pac 10, big east, ACC.
Oh well, would of been nice.


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## jahan (Sep 7, 2007)

MWC is already better than the Big East and ACC, but they still don't have respect. I still don't think they would have got the respect even with the addition of those teams. Oh well we will never know.


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## HighNDry (Dec 26, 2007)

I don't think they will get the respect in the PAC12 or as Independent either. BYU may play some tough teams but I think there program is going to go downhill. I think Utah will get tossed around in the PAC 12 like a ragdoll eventually. Hopefully, they can maintain the rivalry. A couple of 500 teams playing themselves for state bragging rights might be all we have to look forward to.


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## mikevanwilder (Nov 11, 2008)

I think Utah will hold its own in the Pac 12, I mean really who is there that is going to beat them consistantly? Oregon and USC when they get back. 
The other teams I think Utah can hang with and probably beat most of the time. Sure they will have up years where they contend for a conference championship, and down years where they fight for a bowl bid.


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## Riverrat77 (Sep 7, 2007)

Anyone got Photobucket? I have an idea I'll need to use on one of the demotivational posters if the game goes the way I suspect it will.


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## GaryFish (Sep 7, 2007)

The thing with the Pac12 that is very different than the MWC, that has been dominated by the same three teams for the last 6-7 years. Aside from the USC dominance there for a few years, teams seem to rotate among who is great. This year Stanford is a good example. Cal has been up and down. UW has had their up years with some 
Rose Bowls and national titles in there. My point is, in the Pac-12, there are always 3-4 teams at any given time that will have an up year and will contend. Those same teams will also find themselves sitting on 6-6 and 7-5 or worse every few years as well. But the MWC hasn't had that for a very long time.


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