# 553 million acres



## Kingfisher (Jul 25, 2008)

some figures floating about the internet, source of all truth and knowledge.. saying that President Obama in his 8 years in office has designated 553 million acres as national monuments and or/other protections from multiple use such as mining, oil, fishing, etc. more than any other president and constitutes more than 20% of all total designations in the history of the antiquities act. about 865,000 square miles. 

1) anyone know if those figures are true?
2) any one know how much federal land was granted oil and gas leases over that same period of time?

just curious. but if true... I believe that much unilateral power in the hands of one person is an abuse of public land policy. I am certainly not against wilderness or national monuments and in fact very much support them but believe they should all go through a public designation process.


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## middlefork (Nov 2, 2008)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:National_Monuments_designated_by_Barack_Obama
Here is a list of monuments.
I agree it should go through a public designation process however with the obstructionist mindset in government now and a law already in place to allow it, a guy is going to do what a guy can do.


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## High Desert Elk (Aug 21, 2012)

2) above is irrelevant as it does go through a public process, everytime.


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## LostLouisianian (Oct 11, 2010)

High Desert Elk said:


> 2) above is irrelevant as it does go through a public process, everytime.


Public review processes are meaningless and pointless when one person makes the decision.


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## Kingfisher (Jul 25, 2008)

if the area is true, and it appears that it is - that is an area 6.3 times bigger than the entire state of Utah whose management is determined by one person. about 3 times the area of texas. seems to me to be quite a bit of land and ocean protected.


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## Kingfisher (Jul 25, 2008)

by the way, obstructionism is the way the government was set up. to have opposing sides debate, negotiate and compromise to derive the outcome best suited for the people... and it takes time and patience, a price I am willing to pay.


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## wyogoob (Sep 7, 2007)

*G W Bush rapes 'Merica for 216.8 million acres*



Kingfisher said:


> some figures floating about the internet, source of all truth and knowledge.. saying that President Obama in his 8 years in office has designated 553 million acres as national monuments and or/other protections from multiple use such as mining, oil, fishing, etc. more than any other president and constitutes more than 20% of all total designations in the history of the antiquities act. about 865,000 square miles.
> 
> 1) anyone know if those figures are true?
> 2) any one know how much federal land was granted oil and gas leases over that same period of time?
> ...


The 553 million acres is a little low. After hosing you fellas in Utah the Dept of Interior says it's 554.6 million acres. :smile: That's a lot more than George W. Bush's 214.8 acres. Bush has about 40% of total acres and Obama has around 49% of the total acres designated as monuments under the Antiquities Act. August 2016 figures:
http://www.andykerr.net/kerr-public...-and-national-monuments-mostly-by-the-numbers. cool

Almost all of the acres Bush and Obama protected are out in the ocean. see: http://news.nationalgeographic.com/...lands-marine-monument-expansion-conservation/

Here's a US Interior Dept list of National Monument acres designated by Presidents back to Teddy Roosevelt:



The list above is National Monument acres designated only, not National Parks or National Forest acres.

Hey, there's still 7 days left to protect some more land. :mrgreen:

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## Bax* (Dec 14, 2008)

That's an interesting chart Goob. Looks like Jimmy Carter went nuts with his use of the Antiquities Act on land protection.

I have always been torn by this act as its origins really were put into place with the best of intentions. But over time it has become muddied with lobbying and political pressures as well as possible personal agendas.


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## wyogoob (Sep 7, 2007)

*isn't that great*



Kingfisher said:


> if the area is true, and it appears that it is - that is an area 6.3 times bigger than the entire state of Utah whose management is determined by one person. about 3 times the area of texas. seems to me to be quite a bit of land and ocean protected.


Yeah, cool huh.

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## wyogoob (Sep 7, 2007)

Bax* said:


> .....................................................But over time it has become muddied with lobbying and political pressures as well as possible personal agendas.


Yeah, cool huh.

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## Critter (Mar 20, 2010)

I'd have to do some looking but wasn't it during Carters administration that the big push for "wilderness" area came into being?




T
O
P


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## wyogoob (Sep 7, 2007)

Critter said:


> I'd have to do some looking but wasn't it during Carters administration that the big push for "wilderness" area came into being?
> 
> T
> O
> P


Yes, cool huh.

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## wyogoob (Sep 7, 2007)

wyogoob said:


> The 553 million acres is a little low. After hosing you fellas in Utah the Dept of Interior says it's 554.6 million acres. :smile: That's a lot more than George W. Bush's 214.8 acres. Bush has about 40% of total acres and Obama has around 49% of the total acres designated as monuments under the Antiquities Act. August 2016 figures:
> http://www.andykerr.net/kerr-public...-and-national-monuments-mostly-by-the-numbers. cool
> 
> Almost all of the acres Bush and Obama protected are out in the ocean. see: http://news.nationalgeographic.com/...lands-marine-monument-expansion-conservation/
> ...


This is a political/land grab thread where no one goes back and reads the other pages of the threads. So I gotta bump this to the most recent page/view.

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## Kingfisher (Jul 25, 2008)

the carter administration did have the wilderness area focus, rare 1 and 2 were just completed in 72 as I recall which was the basis for consideration stemming from the wilderness act of 64. interesting on the wilderness issue, its not the conservatives stringing the process rather the environmental groups... for those politically motivated. conservative groups have long wanted to move the process along and designate or not to get some finality on the issue - for them, less is better. much of that opposition has been in the thinking form of - the longer the process goes, the more wilderness is likely to be designated from the RARE analysis.
is what it is. however, it seems like the antiquities act started to become a tool of choice at that time as well.


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## wyogoob (Sep 7, 2007)

*delightful*



Kingfisher said:


> the carter administration did have the wilderness area focus, rare 1 and 2 were just completed in 72 as I recall which was the basis for consideration stemming from the wilderness act of 64. interesting on the wilderness issue, its not the conservatives stringing the process rather the environmental groups... for those politically motivated. conservative groups have long wanted to move the process along and designate or not to get some finality on the issue - for them, less is better. much of that opposition has been in the thinking form of - the longer the process goes, the more wilderness is likely to be designated from the RARE analysis.
> is what it is. however, it seems like the antiquities act started to become a tool of choice at that time as well.


Yeah, it's just delightful.

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## #1DEER 1-I (Sep 10, 2007)

As wyogoob said, much of Obamas declarations were made in water not land. He did not create 554 million acres in land monuments. Many will likely be cut back, including Bears Ears. Did Obama overuse the act? Probably. Will t be repealed or significantly changed in the coming congress? Yes, but not all due to Obama. Many republicans have been salivating at the mouth to repeal the antiquities act for years now and they have their chance. I hope it is not repealed, but if it is at least it has been used to protect acreage important to our nation and it's history during its time. I hope they work out most of these monuments by managment rather than full repeal. There is no precedent for overturning a monument in the history of our country, but the next administration is like no other. One things for sure, they'll have a fight on their hands with lawsuits and battles in court as many groups have already promised so.


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## Catherder (Aug 2, 2008)

wyogoob said:


> Almost all of the acres Bush and Obama protected are out in the ocean. see: http://news.nationalgeographic.com/...lands-marine-monument-expansion-conservation/


D#*& liburls, how on earth can I graze cattle, make new ATV trails, hold militia exercises, and live my way of life with all that designation?!


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## wyogoob (Sep 7, 2007)

Catherder said:


> D#*& liburls, how on earth can I graze cattle, make new ATV trails, hold militia exercises, and live my way of life with all that designation?!


I don't make da rules, I just follow them. Ask #1Deer 1I

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## LostLouisianian (Oct 11, 2010)

#1DEER 1-I said:


> As wyogoob said, much of Obamas declarations were made in water not land. He did not create 554 million acres in land monuments. Many will likely be cut back, including Bears Ears. Did Obama overuse the act? Probably. Will t be repealed or significantly changed in the coming congress? Yes, but not all due to Obama. Many republicans have been salivating at the mouth to repeal the antiquities act for years now and they have their chance. I hope it is not repealed, but if it is at least it has been used to protect acreage important to our nation and it's history during its time. I hope they work out most of these monuments by managment rather than full repeal. There is no precedent for overturning a monument in the history of our country, but the next administration is like no other. One things for sure, they'll have a fight on their hands with lawsuits and battles in court as many groups have already promised so.


So where was the water designations? I'm assuming it was to lock out oil exploration.


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## #1DEER 1-I (Sep 10, 2007)

LostLouisianian said:


> So where was the water designations? I'm assuming it was to lock out oil exploration.


Northeast Canyons and Seamounts Marine National Monument was one and is 4,193 square miles off the coast of New England.

Another is Papahanaumokuakea Marine National Monument which was created by George W. Bush and expanded by Obama. Obama expanded it from 442,781 square miles designated by Bush to 582,578 square miles and is Northwest of the Hawaii islands.


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## High Desert Elk (Aug 21, 2012)

LostLouisianian said:


> Public review processes are meaningless and pointless when one person makes the decision.


My point was supposed to be that BLM and USFS have different management plans that require public input, even when a lease sale or APD is being processed.


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## wyogoob (Sep 7, 2007)

*look it up yerself*



LostLouisianian said:


> So where was the water designations? I'm assuming it was to lock out oil exploration.


Click on the link in my post or get a computer with a search thingie.

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