# Don't apply for big game permit in chalk creek, DWR closed the only public access.



## Outdoorchrisb (Jun 11, 2018)

I was up shed hunting on the only small fraction of public land up in the chalk creek area ea1026 unit this past weekend. This is an area surrounded by large swaths of private where the landowners are also able to purchase landowner antlerless permits. The remaining public land here is low enough that the deer and elk only go to the public land after being pushed down by deep snow on the private areas. Unfortunately, it is pretty much always January when the snow is deep enough to push them down to the relatively small public lands. This year, on Jan 13th...the last day of the hunt, there was still not enough snow to push big game onto this public area. Again, private landowners benefited because, by the time their hunt ended at the end of January, the animals were down.

Antlerless permits for the chalk creek units public lands are good till the 2nd week in January, a decision which is reasonable since there are no animals in there till then and the upper powers at be decided is ok; however, in my recent visit, at the trailhead entrance, the DWR has put up a new sign that says that annually, from Jan 1st through the second week in April, no public access is permitted. The result is that the DWR is selling antlerless permits for the same area they are closing off to the public, preventing the actual use of the permit. 

Effectively, the chalk creek ea 1036 unit has no public area one can hunt because there are never any animals in this public area when it's open. Ironically (not) as noted above, the landowner permits in the same area are good till the end of January, something I ran into and the DWR confirmed when I had a tag in the area this past year and private landowners kept hunting after the public was done. So private landowners can still hunt till the end of Jan but the public can't. At least in this unit, the effect is that Utah is clearly becoming a little England where only the rich can hunt.

I don't know about you but if anyone else did this the state would cry fraud and would sue the seller of the tag.

If the DWR said ok, no one hunts after Jan 1, that would be more equitable, except that it will still remain that there's no huntable public property in the unit and only the rich can hunt in the unit. Public access for the unit needs to remain open through the hunt and the public & landowner permits should expire at the same time or the unit needs to be eliminated as part of the draw due to no public access for hunting. If not, the DWR needs to stop selling public permits for an area they are fully aware that the public cant actually hunt.

Don't know if you're into this kind of thing, but I think the DWR needs a bunch of phone calls on this to get public access back for the permits they sell. The area is the only public part at the west side of the chalk creek unit.

Be forewarned....unless this changes...don't apply for a big game permit in chalk creek, DWR closed the public access.

I was up shed hunting on the only small fraction of public land up in the chalk creek area ea1026 unit this past weekend. This is an area surrounded by large swaths of private where the landowners are also able to purchase landowner antlerless permits and the public land is low enough that the deer and elk only go to the public land after being pushed down by deep snow on the private areas. Unfortunately, it's pretty much always mid to late January when the snow is deep enough to push them down to the relatively small public lands.

Antlerless permits for the units public lands are good till the 2nd week in January, a decision which is reasonable since there are no animals in there till then and the upper powers at be decided is ok; however, in my recent visit, at the trailhead entrance, the DWR has put up a new sign that says that annually, from Jan 1st through the second week in April, no public access is permitted. The result is that the DWR is selling antlerless permits for the same area they are closing off to the public, preventing the actual use of the permit. 

Effectively, the chalk creek ea 1036 unit has no public area one can hunt because there are never any animals in the public area when it's open. Ironically (not) landowner permits in the same area are good till the end of January, something I ran into and the DWR confirmed when I had a tag in the area this past year. So private landowners can still hunt till the end of Jan but the public can't. At least in this unit, the effect is that Utah is clearly becoming a little England where only the rich can hunt.

I don't know about you but if anyone else did this the state would cry fraud and would sue the seller.

If the DWR said ok, no one hunts after Jan 1, that would be more equitable, except that it will still remain that there's no huntable public property in the unit and only the rich can hunt in the unit. Public access for the unit needs to remain open through the hunt and the public & landowner permits should expire at the same time or the unit needs to be eliminated as part of the draw due to no public access for hunting and the DWR needs to stop selling public permits for an area they are fully aware that the public cant actually use.

Don't know if you're into this kind of thing, but I think the DWR needs a bunch of phone calls on this to get public access back for the permits they sell. The area is the only public part at the west side of the chalk creek unit.


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## Kwalk3 (Jun 21, 2012)

Outdoorchrisb said:


> I was up shed hunting on the only small fraction of public land up in the chalk creek area ea1026 unit this past weekend. This is an area surrounded by large swaths of private where the landowners are also able to purchase landowner antlerless permits. The remaining public land here is low enough that the deer and elk only go to the public land after being pushed down by deep snow on the private areas. Unfortunately, it is pretty much always January when the snow is deep enough to push them down to the relatively small public lands. This year, on Jan 13th...the last day of the hunt, there was still not enough snow to push big game onto this public area. Again, private landowners benefited because, by the time their hunt ended at the end of January, the animals were down.
> 
> Antlerless permits for the chalk creek units public lands are good till the 2nd week in January, a decision which is reasonable since there are no animals in there till then and the upper powers at be decided is ok; however, in my recent visit, at the trailhead entrance, the DWR has put up a new sign that says that annually, from Jan 1st through the second week in April, no public access is permitted. The result is that the DWR is selling antlerless permits for the same area they are closing off to the public, preventing the actual use of the permit.
> 
> ...


Haven't had the time to check this hunt specifically, but I do know the DWR's proposed seasons eliminated the January portion of the season for several of the antlerless hunts. May be part of a concerted effort to reduce stress on wintering animals. Not saying I agree or disagree, but that may be the reasoning behind it....


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## mtnrunner260 (Feb 15, 2010)

Same WMA divided by i80. 
Technically it's always been closed on chalk creek side but looks like they finally posted or at least reposted it in an effort to reduce trespass. 
Nearly all northern UT WMAs all closed to access from January 1st to second Saturday in April in an effort to provide a small sanctuary for wintering wildlife. 
I also shed hunted up there the Friday after opener. Lots of boot tracks but I scored a killer deadhead. 
I'll provide approximate coordinates if you want them.


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## DanSaldivar1 (Sep 12, 2016)

Funny thing about Chalk Creek.... my friend told me that a cousin reported that a wolf might have made it onto a trailcam up on the property last year. I asked him about it this last weekend and he said that nobody reported a sighting in the fall when they were all up there, and nothing has been said through the winter, but that the elk were a lot less vocal up there than in years past. 
Interesting to see if it's all coincidence/lone rover/misidentified coyote, or a preview to a future issue.


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## Outdoorchrisb (Jun 11, 2018)

mtnrunner260 said:


> View attachment 135777
> 
> Same WMA divided by i80.
> Technically it's always been closed on chalk creek side but looks like they finally posted or at least reposted it in an effort to reduce trespass.
> ...


I put in a call to DWR and got a call back from the area manager about this issue. It was good to see the DWR put in a bit of more concerted effort to address this, which was obviously appreciated. This is what was reported to me on what the dealio is:
This past season the public permits were good until Jan 13th so they could go in there with a helicopter in the last 2 weeks and do a head count of the animals. They shortened the dates so that they weren't trying to fly over hunters and disrupting hunts. They don't like to do this in February after the normal hunt at the animals get too stressed then. They anticipate that the hunts will be extended back to the end of January for future public hunts. (This did short my success this year as the elk had come down in the last 2 weeks of January, but what do you do.)

They reported that they are going to work/coordinate with law enforcement (sheriff & highway patrol) so that if they receive any calls in the January time frame of permit holders about people hunting in there despite the posted sign, they will treat the licensed hunters with an exception to let them in to fill their permit. So, licensed hunters can ignore the closed signs if they have a permit for the area.

In terms of private landowner permits. The DWR stated that this past year the only reason the dates were longer for them compared to the public was due to the helicopter counting issue not affecting the owners lands; however, they noted that some private landowners are misunderstanding their landowner permits. Apparently, landowners are not supposed to go into neighboring or adjacent public lands to fill their tags. Landowner tags are good for only their own land, otherwise they have to get a regular draw permit if they want to hunt outside their own land and are restricted to the normal hunting dates. So landowners who were hunting on the public tracts of land with landowner permits were technically hunting illegally and poaching if they harvested. The manager also noted that due to these landowner practices that sometimes occur the DWR is interested in learning from the public about them so they can have conversations with the respective landowners to end this practice. In all, they will be working more in the northern areas to ensure that landowner vs public use of public lands are treated more fairly and equitable for the hunts. --Good to see the proactivity here from the DWR.


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## Vanilla (Dec 11, 2009)

Outdoorchrisb said:


> however, they noted that some private landowners are misunderstanding their landowner permits. Apparently, landowners are not supposed to go into neighboring or adjacent public lands to fill their tags. Landowner tags are good for only their own land, otherwise they have to get a regular draw permit if they want to hunt outside their own land and are restricted to the normal hunting dates. So landowners who were hunting on the public tracts of land with landowner permits were technically hunting illegally and poaching if they harvested. The manager also noted that due to these landowner practices that sometimes occur the DWR is interested in learning from the public about them so they can have conversations with the respective landowners to end this practice. In all, they will be working more in the northern areas to ensure that landowner vs public use of public lands are treated more fairly and equitable for the hunts. --Good to see the proactivity here from the DWR.


I have hunted on a landowner voucher in Chalk Creek in the past. It says right on the voucher that the landowners get from the DWR and use or sell to others that you are ONLY allowed to hunt on the specific property listed on the voucher, and that it is not valid for adjacent public or private lands. It could not be more clear on that topic than it was on the voucher I had. That is the voucher you take to the DWR to purchase your permit. My guess is this is much less of a "misunderstanding" issue and much more of a "I don't care what the law is" issue. Hopefully these "conversations" are actually citations being issued. I would certainly get a citation if I went up on a regular permit and hunted on their land illegally (and rightfully so), so hopefully if folks are found doing the opposite illegally, that the law is enforced.


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## PBH (Nov 7, 2007)

Outdoorchrisb said:


> I put in a call to DWR and got a call back from the area manager about this issue.


Funny how that works.



Outdoorchrisb said:


> It was good to see the DWR put in a bit of more concerted effort to address this,...
> 
> --Good to see the proactivity here from the DWR.


Wait......what? did someone just use "proactivity" and "DWR" in the same sentence? Anticipatory, change-oriented and self-initiated behavior on the part of the DWR? Acting in advance of a future situation, rather than just reacting?

I know I'm sleep deprived, so maybe I'm just reading things that really aren't there. Or, maybe our DWR isn't as bad as we all thought....


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## RandomElk16 (Sep 17, 2013)

PBH said:


> I know I'm sleep deprived, so maybe I'm just reading things that really aren't there. Or, maybe our DWR isn't as bad as we all thought....


I mean.. I'm not anti-DWR or anything, and maybe I will sound like a bad guy here but read what the DWR told him. It sounds a lot like a sales pitch. "they will be working more in the northern areas to ensure that landowner vs public use of public lands are treated more fairly and equitable for the hunts" - shouldn't they have already been doing that?

This is reactive also. The landowners were doing the behavior (for years) and now they are reacting.


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## Kup6 (Apr 9, 2018)

Speaking of this unit....Im new to hunting northern utah (grew up in Southern Utah). I am planning on hunting the muzzleloader chalk creek. Any tips are public areas to hunt? I live in bountiful. I'll be trying to get out and scout as much as work allows before the hunt.

Thanks in advance!


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## RandomElk16 (Sep 17, 2013)

Kup6 said:


> Speaking of this unit....Im new to hunting northern utah (grew up in Southern Utah). I am planning on hunting the muzzleloader chalk creek. Any tips are public areas to hunt? I live in bountiful. I'll be trying to get out and scout as much as work allows before the hunt.
> 
> Thanks in advance!


Buy a trespass permit from a landowner, or buy land.

OnX is pretty useful for knowing what's public, but on that unit isn't gonna help you much.


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## elkfromabove (Apr 20, 2008)

RandomElk16 said:


> I mean.. I'm not anti-DWR or anything, and maybe I will sound like a bad guy here but read what the DWR told him. It sounds a lot like a sales pitch. "they will be working more in the northern areas to ensure that landowner vs public use of public lands are treated more fairly and equitable for the hunts" - shouldn't they have already been doing that?
> 
> This is reactive also. The landowners were doing the behavior (for years) and now they are reacting.


I'm certainly glad you told us you're not anti-DWR or ANYTHING! Otherwise, we would never have known by the rest of your post. :grin:


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## RandomElk16 (Sep 17, 2013)

elkfromabove said:


> I'm certainly glad you told us you're not anti-DWR or ANYTHING! Otherwise, we would never have known by the rest of your post. :grin:


Lol. I appreciate the divisions efforts, and I do appreciate conservation officers.

I will also call out fluff or wishful thinking when I see it :grin:

Just like I appreciate the wildlife board... despite a bunch of gripes lol.


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