# 3/4 Vizsla 1/4 Lab



## Josh (Oct 27, 2008)

I have the opportunity to get a 3/4 Vizsla 1/4 Lab pup in the spring from a local bird ranch that uses that breed and prefers the mix. I have always been a fan of a purebred dog but only for the fact that I could say its a purebred. If the mix gives me a better dog I'll try something new. Anyone have an opinion on this mix? Like most dogs it will be a family dog 80% of the time and a hunting dog 20%. What are your thoughts?


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## TEX-O-BOB (Sep 12, 2007)

> Anyone have an opinion on this mix?


I've owned a couple mixed breed dogs over the years... None of them ever worth a ****.

It seems like I always got the worst of both breeds. Had a Lab/shorthair once, she hated the water and wouldn't point. :? Birdy as all hell but that's about all.

My advice, Don't do it. It's a crap shoot at best. Besides, a Lab/Visla! Geeze! :roll: Could you possibly pic any two dogs that would make a worse cross... Lab/Brittany? :x


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## TEX-O-BOB (Sep 12, 2007)

OK sorry, that last post wasn't very nice...  

May be a Lab/Golden retriever... Or Lab/Poodle... Or Lab/Weimeraner... Or Lab/Elglish Poiner...

See a pattern here?


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## Ryfly (Sep 13, 2007)

The biggest problem with a mix is that you increase the genetic diversity which means you have a greater range of outcomes. You might get lucky and get a great dog that is the best of both parents but you're just as likely to get one Like Tex had. Especially when it's two dogs with greatly differing traits like a Lab/Vizsla. If you crossed a pointer/GSP or a Setter/pointer your chances are better because at least the dogs have similar performance traits. The whole point of a purebred is more predictability in the offspring.


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## Ironman (Sep 7, 2007)

Get a purebred so if you ever decide to play any Retriever games like Hunt tests or Field trials you'll be able to.


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## xxxxxxBirdDogger (Mar 7, 2008)

On the other hand, the hybrid vigor will usually give you a healthier dog. Most mixed breeds excel in the first generation, but successive generations suck rocks. I see nothing wrong with a neutered or fixed mutt. I buy purebred myself. If I wanted a dog that would play the pointing game on land and that would hit the water hard after waterfowl I'd just buy a wirehair. Oh wait, I already did that :wink: .


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## TAK (Sep 9, 2007)

Well I have hunted with dogs of this same cross years ago. Hatts Ranch in Green River is were this all started. Not sure just why though.
Some very good points have been made in the firsts posts. My question is how do you get 3/4 V and 1/4 lab? You would have to have either the sire or dam a half breed dog in the first place. And there would have to be a pure V in the mix. 
Back then I was not impressed with the cross and now I am sure I would have the same opinion.


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## xxxxxxBirdDogger (Mar 7, 2008)

> My question is how do you get 3/4 V and 1/4 lab? You would have to have either the sire or dam a half breed dog in the first place. And there would have to be a pure V in the mix.


That's a good point, TAK. This would be a 2nd generation cross. You'd have no idea what could be crossed up here from a genetics standpoint. Mutts left to breed more mutts is not a good idea, IMO.


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## The Naturalist (Oct 13, 2007)

Josh said:


> I have the opportunity to get a 3/4 Vizsla 1/4 Lab pup in the spring from a local bird ranch that uses that breed and prefers the mix.... If the mix gives me a better dog I'll try something new. Anyone have an opinion on this mix? Like most dogs it will be a family dog 80% of the time and a hunting dog 20%. What are your thoughts?


Not sure about that particular mix, but if the bird ranch likes 'em it might be worth a shot. Contrary to most on here I prefer lab mixes. All the purebreds I have ever had have been high strung and dumb as rocks. The best field dog I ever had was a lab mix (old Mo), currently the best retriever I have ever had is mostly Lab with a little Newfoundland, and a little German Shepherd.
Anyway that has been my experience.


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## bwhntr (Sep 12, 2007)

Bad idea...buying the dog is the cheap part. Start out your bird dogging right from the beginning.


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## TEX-O-BOB (Sep 12, 2007)

> The best field dog I ever had was a lab mix


The best compared to what? :?


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## Ironman (Sep 7, 2007)

The Naturalist said:


> ......All the purebreds I have ever had have been high strung and dumb as rocks.....


What were the lines on these purebred Labs? Any well known ones? Let me know so I can avoid them!


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## The Naturalist (Oct 13, 2007)

Ironman said:


> The Naturalist said:
> 
> 
> > ......All the purebreds I have ever had have been high strung and dumb as rocks.....
> ...


They weren't Labs - that may have been the problem! :wink: 
I read an article many years ago in Field and Stream about how Gordon Setters made fantastic pheasant dogs, so I had to try it. Beautiful dog, but couldn't tell the difference between birds and dirty diapers. I probably tapped into a *show* line instead of a *hunting* line.
Another one was an English Pointer, also disappointing. So, I've gone back to Lab mixes, been lucky I guess.


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## TAK (Sep 9, 2007)

The Naturalist said:


> Ironman said:
> 
> 
> > [quote="The Naturalist":139p59io]......All the purebreds I have ever had have been high strung and dumb as rocks.....
> ...


They weren't Labs - that may have been the problem! :wink: 
I read an article many years ago in Field and Stream about how Gordon Setters made fantastic pheasant dogs, so I had to try it. Beautiful dog, but couldn't tell the difference between birds and dirty diapers. I probably tapped into a *show* line instead of a *hunting* line.
Another one was an English Pointer, also disappointing. So, I've gone back to Lab mixes, been lucky I guess.[/quote:139p59io]

Well your talking about a total different type a dog from POINTER types to FLUSHING types.

Sad part no matter what breed or how pure not every one of them are going to be that SUPER DOG. But with a dog breed for that important reason you lessen the odds of getting a dud!

Another type 2 dog I have hunted with was half Brit and Half Border Collie. She was a fine animal in her day. I was so young back then I was not sure if she pointed or herded the birds to us. And to boot there was more birds in them days!


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## RynoUT (Feb 16, 2008)

TEX-O-BOB said:


> > Anyone have an opinion on this mix?
> 
> 
> I've owned a couple mixed breed dogs over the years... None of them ever worth a ****.
> ...


This is my "worst cross ever" Dakota. Visla/lab.
















Loves the water, points and retrieves. She may not be field champ quality, but she is a great dog.


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## Josh (Oct 27, 2008)

Ok now were getting somewhere. I hunted with the 3/4 1/4 on thanksgiving and was impressed with the hard points and the relentless searching for downed birds. The "bitch is the full viszla and the stud is 50/50 visla lab. For those of you that run viszlas what good/bad traits do these dogs have?


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## vdogs (Sep 22, 2007)

Like others have said..you could end up with a great dog. You could also end up with a flusher (Lab) with the run of a shorthair! :shock: You couldn't buy enough batteries fer the e-collar! :lol:


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## TAK (Sep 9, 2007)

Josh said:


> Ok now were getting somewhere. I hunted with the 3/4 1/4 on thanksgiving and was impressed with the hard points and the relentless searching for downed birds. The "**** is the full viszla and the stud is 50/50 visla lab. For those of you that run viszlas what good/bad traits do these dogs have?


Do you really want an opionion? You sound as if you have made up your mind.....

I don't own V's but have trained many for clients. They seem to be a softer type dog. I also noticed that weather played an effect on them more than say a GSP. The ones I trained did not like the cold as much. I also found that you can get a good one or a REALLLLLLLYYYYY BAD one. Again the softness was about the worst trait. I can recall two of them coming to me gun shy and was over 2 years old most of the time, not only that any sort of training had to be very gentle. 
Another down fall for them is they are pretty! **** fine looking dogs so every person that has some sort of hankerin to have a dog gets one... Like the Chocolate Lab and the Wymmy, then little effort goes into hunting and more laying around.

Sonny Mortenson made a great name in the V world. Guessing is dad is from Utah chances are they came from his line. Very nice dogs but breed to be go getters. I know of another breeder in Utah and have trained 3 dogs from the kennel, this is why I have the bad image.........


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## SFWG (Sep 8, 2007)

I would just buy a pure bred. Josh McPherson is the man to talk to about Vizsla's in this state. My brother had the same mix your are talking about. The dog had the range of a V and flushed like a lab!! Horrible combination.


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## TEX-O-BOB (Sep 12, 2007)

Hell, if yer a gambling man, role the dice and get one. You may get what you want, you may get what you deserve...


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## Josh (Oct 27, 2008)

No I'm interested in the different points of view. I really am interested in what others have to say. But I dont want to base my opinion on someone that crossed a Brit&Lab and had a bad experience. I want to base my decision on someone that has run the breed and knows from experience like Ryno.


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## Ryfly (Sep 13, 2007)

Josh said:


> I want to base my decision on someone that has run the breed and knows from experience like Ryno.


That's just it, it's not a "breed". Many breeds have been created by crossing to get the desired traits but it takes many generations to get them to breed true. It would be cool to have a dog that has the retrieve and coat of a Lab and the run and point of a Vizsla but there is no guarantee that that's what you'll get. You might get a fat, short coated dog that hates the water, doesn't retrieve and won't point. It's a roll of the dice as to which traits the individual pups will have. Like I said before the whole point of buying a purebred dog is to put the probabilities in your favor.


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## vdogs (Sep 22, 2007)

Josh, I don't think anyone here is going to recommend getting a mixed breed. But, if your heart's set on it, by all means give it a try. You just might get lucky. On the other hand, if the dog turns out to be worthless in the field..are ya going to be prepared to keep that dog and provide it a good home for the rest of it's life? If your answer to that is yes, then I'd say go for it. FWIW...one of the best companion dogs I ever had was a Lab/ G. Shepard cross. **** fine dog! Hunted some too!

Best,

Rick


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## TAK (Sep 9, 2007)

Josh said:


> No I'm interested in the different points of view. I really am interested in what others have to say. But I dont want to base my opinion on someone that crossed a Brit&Lab and had a bad experience. I want to base my decision on someone that has run the breed and knows from experience like Ryno.


That is what I am saying. I first heard of this cross many years ago and most all the people around Haitts Ranch in Greenriver was big on it. I was with a young brit at the time and felt that he out did the half bred much older dog hands down. The problem I see with the cross is not in the dogs used but you just don't know what you will get? You could take the best of both worlds and not get much and you could take the drags and get the best out of it..... That is the problem with crossing dogs/breeds you just don't know.... 
GSPman is right, if having a pet is just fine also then go for it. But if you want a dog that you lessen the odds of having a dud then go with something bred just for it.


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## Springer (Dec 17, 2008)

I think a good place to start is, what is the dog going to be used for: "Hunting, Family Dog" It sounds like you have already seen some of the siblings and accordingly they have been breeding these mix breeds for quite some time, and they continue to use them with great succcess. So I say go for it. If Hatt's didn't get what they wanted out of the pups they wouldn't keep breeding them, and people wouldn't want them! Just my two cents


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## DR_DEATH (Sep 10, 2007)

I hunt at Hatt's Ranch 4 or 5 times every year and as an owner of V's I have a discussion with them all the time on who's dog is better. My pure bred V or their lab v mix. I have seen the mix dogs work and have my opinion on who's dog is better. No way would I trade my V for their best dog.
If I were in your shoes Josh I would go hunt with Hatt's Ranch and see what their dogs will do. Remember these will be probably be the best of the best dogs as they get more bird exposure in a month that most dogs do in a lifetime. 

After I did that, I would attend a NSTRA and/ or retriever trial and get a look at several different breeds that compete in hunting situations with the same type of birds. ( pen raised) Doing this will open your mind to all breeds of dogs and help you decide what dog is best for you. You might discover a breed you like best that you never new existed.

Good luck,

Jesse


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## Red-Grouse (Sep 22, 2007)

DR_DEATH said:


> I hunt at Hatt's Ranch 4 or 5 times every year and as an owner of V's I have a discussion with them all the time on who's dog is better. My pure bred V or their lab v mix. I have seen the mix dogs work and have my opinion on who's dog is better. No way would I trade my V for their best dog.
> If I were in your shoes Josh I would go hunt with Hatt's Ranch and see what their dogs will do. Remember these will be probably be the best of the best dogs as they get more bird exposure in a month that most dogs do in a lifetime.
> 
> After I did that, I would attend a NSTRA and/ or retriever trial and get a look at several different breeds that compete in hunting situations with the same type of birds. ( pen raised) Doing this will open your mind to all breeds of dogs and help you decide what dog is best for you. You might discover a breed you like best that you never new existed.
> ...


That is some good advice right there!

The thing I find most interesting about this is what advantage do you gain by crossing a lab and a vis????
Like my Momma used to say 2 wrongs don't make a right

There are several breeds available that would feel any niche they may be trying to promote by crossing these two dogs. The other thing that needs to be considered is that the initial cost of the dog is a minor cost when you look at the cost to care for a dog over the course of its life so if you are ding this in an attempt to save money (the mixed dog is cheap) then you should really re-think it... Lastly I don't think a phez farm is the best place to really evaluate a bird dog....That is like telling everyone you bowl a 300 with bumper lanes


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## InvaderZim (Sep 7, 2007)

Red-Grouse said:


> Like my Momma used to say 2 wrongs don't make a right


Best quote ever...and funny as hell when used here! :mrgreen:


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