Looking for a little advise/ insight...
As I am getting ready for my first backcountry elk hunt I have been doing a lot of hiking around the Wasatch. I am wondering if there a areas around Guardsman's, Big Cottonwood, Millcreek Canyon, Lamb's Canyon, East Canyon that I could bring the shotgun with me & maybe get into some grouse while I get in shape for the upcoming elk hunt???
I understand I am allowed to have a shotgun in those areas, very aware of dog laws in the watershed... just wondering where I might stir up some birds while I'm out there?
Absolutely. I've killed grouse on the south side of Mill Creek canyon right at the mouth, and can see the spot from my front porch. I've run into them all along the Wasatch, in Bear Trap Fork in Big Cottonwood, Mill Creek, City Creek, Mountain Dell, etc. In fact, all up and down the entire range.
Paddler, thank you for letting me know that they are indeed out there... Given elevation is it mostly blue grouse out there? Or are ruffed grouse out there as well?
Early in the year, I've jumped dusky grouse at 6300' on the ridge between Immigration and Mountain Dell (archery deer), and at the same elevation on the face of Grandeur Peak. More typically I jump the ruffies in the thick stuff and the blues on more open slopes. I think you should take a shotgun with you every time out, and take a dog everywhere it's legal. You'll see more when you're actually hunting elk. Of course. I'd be surprised if you didn't see grouse at 40 38' 45" x 111 36' 04". That's on the ridge between Bear Trap Fork and Willow Heights, ~9700'. If dogs were legal there, I'd be hunting it.
I dunno that I would trust a feller with a signature of Obama 2012
From what I understand in SL County there is no discharge of a firearm unless on private ground... It seem's to be a gray area and from what I've heard can boil right on down to the officer investigating whether your cited or not. I think you tempt a lot of attention to yourself anyways in SL County due to the high volume of non-consumptive recreation user's. Me personally I would tip toe lightly if you take on this venture
Even if SL County did have a no shooting rule, it is trumped by state law. It is not legally enforceable unless specifically authorized by the state. You can read 53-5a-102 of the Utah State code for clarification on that one. The only rules that apply are those made by the state, for instance, being 600 feet away from houses, animals....etc. So all those silly little city ordinances that ban hunting are null and void if you can meet the state rules.
Not talking about hunting, more shooting. Have you ever dealt with a Unified Authority Law Dog looking for a charge? I have and eventually they will find one... Point being, I don't think it's worth it
The Utah premption law affects other agencies making laws regarding possession of a firearm, Not the discharge of a gun. ANY town/city/incorporation etc can make laws and enforce laws that pertain the discharge of a weapon.
Thank you to all concerned for me regarding local gun & dog laws... I understand them clearly following conversations with Salt Lake Unified Police. If you feel like contributing by recommending any near by locations I might get into some birds (grouse) while hiking in the mountains as I work on physical conditioning prior to the elk hunt it is much appreciated. And just so you know I will be out there without a dog... My lab is on his last legs and just can't do it anymore.
You are going to find birds in pretty much all areas of the mountains here in Utah. If you are looking for someone to give you specific locations, good luck with that one.
Not looking for honey holes, just general areas... I'm out there hiking all over the place anyway, just don't want to tote the shotgun around areas I don't need to be...
I've seen grouse in about all of those areas, not in huge numbers but mind you it's just me hiking around archery hunting without a dog. I'd say around 35 to 40% of my trips I have grouse by me I could shoot with a bow under 20 yards if I was willing to spare an arrow.
That doesn't really help you much but my point is I think about any hike in those areas is worth taking because they are around often enough you will eventually bump into them.
I've seen quite a few Ruffs up towards the summit of East Canyon and Little Dell, right close to the pavement. Sorry if I gave away a Honeyhole. Sheesh, they're just chikins'.
NoShot, I have to respectfully disagree, unless otherwise authorized, this code states
" (4) All authority to regulate firearms is reserved to the state except where the Legislature specifically delegates responsibility to local authorities or state entities. (5) Unless specifically authorized by the Legislature by statute, a local authority or state entity may not enact, establish, or enforce any ordinance, regulation, rule, or policy pertaining to firearms that in any way inhibits or restricts the possession or use of firearms on either public or private property."
Rule 4 is plain as day.
Rule 5 says "use." Using a firearm means pulling the trigger.
Now if you find a more current rule delegating authority by the legislature to any entity it would be a valid point as noted in Rule 2.
The ground you're talking about is National Forest. Local municipalities don't have jurisdiction. Just take your shotgun on all your walks. It's a lot more fun with a dog, though, and I wouldn't hunt grouse without one.
If you like to kill birds without a dog I can assure you I have no interest in giving you advice or help of any kind. Actually about the only thing that comes to mind is un-ethical hunting. A subject I will not understand or support
Pretty sure I would kill more with a dog. I guess that makes me more ethical for giving those poor birds a better chance by not having a dog.
Also, some people may not have the space or funds to keep a dog. Should they just stay home and wish they had a dog so they wouldn't feel " un-ethical"?
I will be willing to say that he will say something like not being able to find all of the downed birds.
I have to admit that after hunting grouse for over 40 years without a dog that I have only lost one, and that one was lost because I thought that he was down and went for the second bird and lost sight of the first one.
Judging from other recent posts, damiani thinks that anyone who helps someone find chukar, hunts birds without a dog, or shoots a grouse with anything but a shotgun while they are flying, should be shot themselves. (Exaggeration, yes, but read the last few posts.) This kind of attitude puts more people off than actually changes or helps them. If you believe things should only be done one way, good for you. Don't belittle others who legally and ethically do it a different way. I have shot grouse with and without a dog, and prefer to hunt with one. I have never lost one without a dog either though. Aaand, I shoot them with my bow, sitting on the ground from time to time.........and guess what? I like it, and they taste just as good.
Let me make this clear, if I had my way you would have to prove and register your dog that it does indeed know how to locate game & retrieve it. No ground pound or limb shot's, the bird must be taken on the wing with a knowledgeable dog to retrieve the game. It's called "sport," not belittling at all. Give your quarry a sporting chance, in the end you'll enjoy the meal that much more. Otherwise the grocery store is on the corner.
Don't worry, amigo, I give those birds one hell of a sporting chance while hunting without a dog. Spent four hours in the rain last weekend humping my shotgun up, over, and around a mountain only to flush a three-bird covey and miss every shot.
If you're more concerned about unrecovered birds, then I think Critter makes an excellent point. Just because you're dogless doesn't mean you're careless.
Seems like any more if a guy asks for help on here he gets 1 or 2 people that want to belittle him.How were you guys taught?Did you just go out by yourself and learn every little thing there was to know?I was brought up feeling like if I could help someone to do it and feel good about it.I dont know much about grouse hunting,and dam sure not going to ask on this forum,I dont have a dog so I guess I will be another unethical hunter out there.Lighten up you diehards-O,-
Thing about this comment is, it hasn't really changed at all except we are a little older, these same discussions were here when the DWR had the site!!!, there was then ( and I bet always will be) elitest/purists ( ie. Quiill... Good guy, but a bit of a purest) and that's fine..... All I care about now days is keeping my 10 yr old son excited and on birds, I have asked on ocassion, and while many are tight lipped (which is fine) I have met many more that are willing to offer suggestions and advice! That said... Having people give likely spots is a challenge. Myself I am more then happy to help where and when I can, although I will NEVER give a spot learned of from anyone else!
Learning on your own? I call that re-inventing the wheel!!
You never asked anyone anything? You just went all on your own and learned everything in your life by trial and error? I say that is pretty stupid when you could just learn from others and then advance and learn even more, I thought that is what school is all about lol....
Brother you need to understand that it aint your way or the highway. If you like to hunt over a dog, go for it! I like to hunt without a dog, I like the peace and quite. I like to hunt Grouse with a bow also. So, how about this, since I like to hunt them with a bow I think you should have to hunt them with a bow!! Pretty stupid world we'd be living in if we all had to do things the same way.
I hunt Grouse for meat period and why go to the grocery store and buy chemical infected meat when God put it in the woods and gave me the ability to harvest it.
Lighten up man, we all do it a little different!!
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